Mega Thread Trade and List Management discussion

[_M_16_]

Love to hear GWS interested in Coons. Come on down pick 4.

Will GWS even use all of their picks? They tend to use the earlier ones and that is it. Could they be a more reasonable option to trade up with than Melbourne? We could give up a little less for a couple of pick upgrade, and ask for a third round pick in return?

 

[paul scholes]

Blimey I'm a bit on the fence re. Lonergan
Sounds like a coach who has been told " he needs a few more wins next season"

 

[JTCWBFC]

Blimey I'm a bit on the fence re. Lonergan
Sounds like a coach who has been told " he needs a few more wins next season"

I'm the same. As stupid as it sounds, because the end result is the same, I want the club to do it if it is for the right reasons.

If the reason is to allow Rough to move into the Ruck and help Will, while providing our young defenders with another mentor and an opportunity to play as the 2nd and 3rd string while they learn in the AFL then I am all for it.

If it is purely to try win a few more games and will be at the expense of Roberts or Talia, no thanks.

 

[_M_16_]

I don't want to turn this into another ASADA thread (Igloo got cranky the last time I did this) - but I agree. Essendon have created this situation by their own doing. Now they'll profit from it by getting a better deal than they otherwise would have.... **** that....

Surprised they can't even remember what they took/did wrong. Yet the somehow came up with this loophole which gets them rewarded double than what they would have gotten in the first place. Guess they are smarter than we think. They got twice as much as they would have gotten for Ryder in the first place. I hope Carlisle enforces the same next year

 

[fronkalicious]

Adelaide are pursuing Talia aggressively. No idea if he's interested or if we'd consider a trade, but they are chasing hard.

 

[Roscoe_au]

Think we all need to take a chill pill on Lonergan. Here's a few truths...
a. His contract is actually 2 years with a trigger clause for a third;
b. The club said it would get a mature defender to help out our back line. It is doing that;
c. We would have won more games last year with an experienced KPD, rather than having to rely on Morris who plays on blokes twice his size because we simply don't have any other options;
d. It's cruel to continually embarrass the kids in our back line who are still learning. We need experience and size down there and someone to teach the young blokes;
e. The deal isn't done. We may still end the trade period with no experienced KPD and half the posters on here will be screaming "play Wright...play Lever" when they'll be young and inexperienced at senior level as well. When they fail because Buddy kicks 12 on them, we'll all be saying how the club recruited poorly.

 

[Roscoe_au]

Adelaide are pursuing Talia aggressively. No idea if he's interested or if we'd consider a trade, but they are chasing hard.

Just the "brother factor"?

 

[fronkalicious]

Just the "brother factor"?

No, they need to replace rutten and have identified him as the best target. No doubt they will be leaning on Daniel but the interest is genuine and they're not mucking around.

 

[Roscoe_au]

No, they need to replace rutten and have identified him as the best target. No doubt they will be leaning on Daniel but the interest is genuine and they're not mucking around.

Be a third round at best, I reckon. Hardly any senior experience and didn't finish very high in the reserves B&F.

 

[Roscoe_au]

Our team will be totally different next year. New jumper and a bunch of senior players who have never played together. Could be more than 10 changes...

 

[Roscoe_au]

Just the "brother factor"?

Actually their back line is in the same shape as ours. Lots of younger blokes. Am surprised they're not looking for a mature defender as well. Although in saying that, their back line gets a hell of a lot more support from their mids than ours does...

 

[igloo dweller]

No, they need to replace rutten and have identified him as the best target. No doubt they will be leaning on Daniel but the interest is genuine and they're not mucking around.

any luck evesdropping yesterday on andrew mackay, fronk? or is it classified?

would truck talia outta here if adelaide put a halfway decent offer out there. don't think the club would though.

 

[yebiga]

no way

 

[threenewpadlocks]

All this talk of "you can't throw young defenders to the wolves" talk is rubbish.
Brisbane did it this year with first year players like Gardiner, McStay who at many times took the better forwards than Patfull. Their development hasn't been negatively impacted, in fact it's the opposite when you compare Gardiner now to 10 months ago.

I'm not against getting Lonergan because I rate him as a player full stop regardless of his age or the other players we have in his position, but I would love it if people could have a bit more critical thinking about the players that we are linked with (Membrey will be a good fit, Lonergan is good to protect Talia/Roberts, O'Rourke is the solution to our outside midfielder problems etc.) rather than jumping at any and all reasons why a particular player is 100% positively good in our team.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

any luck evesdropping yesterday on andrew mackay, fronk? or is it classified?
Adelaide have a couple of impresssive young backs like Hartigan who I rate, don't think they'll need to be desperately chasing a contracted-to-2016 M. Talia
would truck talia outta here if adelaide put a halfway decent offer out there. don't think the club would though.

 

[Libba39]

Lake was on the way out we had to get what compensation we could get with. We got Hrovat + stevens no great lose at all. Need lonergan now to fill our defensive issues.

He won't be around when we next challenge so I still don't see the point.

 

[doggies ftw]

Shipping Talia to Adelaide for a 3rd rounder would be a ******* disaster and not a chance we would do that. He's shown a lot at AFL level for a young KPD, if they want him he's under contract so they can pay overs for him. Workout a deal with Jones and Talia for Jenkins and bring in Lonergan and Lever.

 

[fronkalicious]

any luck evesdropping yesterday on andrew mackay, fronk? or is it classified?

would truck talia outta here if adelaide put a halfway decent offer out there. don't think the club would though.

Ha, nah. He wasn't talking trades unfortunately.

We should be telling Adelaide to GAGF re Talia. Seriously required player.

 

[igloo dweller]

Ha, nah. He wasn't talking trades unfortunately.

We should be telling Adelaide to GAGF re Talia. Seriously required player.

appreciate that most feel talia is still a long term CHB - i'm far from convinced. he does have some impressive traits. happy to be proven wrong.

if the club feel he is the KPD of the future, they'll tell adelaide rightly where to stick it.

i've got doubts on talia's ability full stop. this is a guy who played in the VFL all year and reportedly didn't poll top 10 in his side's B&F. he's not skinny or underdeveloped. he's not late to the sport. he hasn't been battling OP or any other some such. it just says to me that he ain't that great.

he's fit, and when he's at the contest, he defends well. he's a good reader of the ball in the air. but he's slower than a wet week. he can't kick. but most of all, he doesn't seem to have a fire in him to overcome his deficits (like morris has, like picken has).

i appreciate i'm in the minority on talia, and would love to be proven wrong. we're waifer thin down back in key posts - we need him to stand up.

 

[Gmod23]

Ha, nah. He wasn't talking trades unfortunately.

We should be telling Adelaide to GAGF re Talia. Seriously required player.

I think the answer should be:
WB: You want our third round pick for Talia? Ok, lets do it.

Much later at the Adelaide board meeting interviews a new candidate for coach:
Candidate: You traded Talia, who was your best young defender for a 3rd round pick. Are we tanking this year?

 

[doggies ftw]

appreciate that most feel talia is still a long term CHB - i'm far from convinced. he does have some impressive traits. happy to be proven wrong.

if the club feel he is the KPD of the future, they'll tell adelaide rightly where to stick it.

Literally every time I saw him play at VFL level he was fantastic, especially in the finals. He has a heap to work with, like I've been saying you can go around to just about every team and find a player whose been labelled an absolute spud that has turned themselves into a top quality defender in their mid 20s. Alex Rance is now an AA FFS! Defenders take time and when you've got one that's performed the way Talia has at his age, in the AFL, you hold onto them.

 

[Mutt]

I'm not against getting Lonergan because I rate him as a player full stop regardless of his age or the other players we have in his position, but I would love it if people could have a bit more critical thinking about the players that we are linked with (Membrey will be a good fit, Lonergan is good to protect Talia/Roberts, O'Rourke is the solution to our outside midfielder problems etc.) rather than jumping at any and all reasons why a particular player is 100% positively good in our team.

I'm not sure that anybody on here is 100% in favour of, and completely uncritical of every player that is in any way linked to us.

I, for example, would be 100% in favour of Lonergan and/or Carlisle; ambivalent about Greenwood unless it is to facilitate the moving on of another player in an upgrade of picks; not at all sold on Sam Reid; pretty much against Membrey.

I think you'd find that almost everybody on here would have a similar range of opinions...but unlike some, not all LOSE THEIR s**t at every suggestion or think that THE COACH IS DESPERATE AND ONLY TRYING TO SAVE HIS JOB whenever we disagree with a suggested trade.

Not all of us take the latest media or Facebook rumors about deals and about contracts and treat them as gospel, followed BY AN IMMEDIATE RANT that they've had enough because we didn't keep Brian Lake and he was only 30 and an AA (or some equally inane revisionist rationale for hating the current administration or some of it's past decisions.)

I'm also sure that most of us on here appreciate that we have about 50% or less of the information we need to make a truly informed decision about any of the trade proposals - just as we only have some of the information you'd like to have about potential draftees.

Most are prepared to accept that our club has professional and competent list management and recruiting staff who have made pretty good decisions on behalf of our club, particularly over the past three years. So, if those staff are interested in a trade or in drafting a kid there are probably some decent reasons for doing so. And if we are not in the hunt for a desirable player, there are also pretty good reasons that are beyond the control of our club and it's staff.

Our club staff are not complete morons hellbent on driving the club back into the stone-age through their stupidity and their lack of perspective with player contracts.

None of the above means that any of us blindly agree that every potential trade is a good one, or that every draftee of ours will be "the future". Balance and perspective is in short supply sometimes....but we are not sheep.

 

[TempleKelvington]

All this talk of "you can't throw young defenders to the wolves" talk is rubbish.
Brisbane did it this year with first year players like Gardiner, McStay who at many times took the better forwards than Patfull. Their development hasn't been negatively impacted, in fact it's the opposite when you compare Gardiner now to 10 months ago.

I'm not against getting Lonergan because I rate him as a player full stop regardless of his age or the other players we have in his position, but I would love it if people could have a bit more critical thinking about the players that we are linked with (Membrey will be a good fit, Lonergan is good to protect Talia/Roberts, O'Rourke is the solution to our outside midfielder problems etc.) rather than jumping at any and all reasons why a particular player is 100% positively good in our team.

Great post. Like you I have nothing against Lonergan, no doubt he would boost our defense. My issue is when are we going to expose Talia and Roberts to rigors of AFL. Why are we reluctant to back in our young talls? I really thought the whole plan last year was to play them at Footscray, get them playing together, learning, playing week in week out with the view to bringing them into the AFL at some stage.

I understand we may have a need for a mature bodied defenders to provide a chop out, but Lonergan will surely cost us a decent draft pick or 2 and a 3 year deal for a guy his age his risky business indeed.

If we were smack in the window, then I would understand it. This is what happens when clubs get spooked by supporters and media instead of just sticking to their knitting and building sustainably. I'm disappointed with this approach, I think it's short term.

 

[cammo78]

Backline gets slaughtered all season with flogs like Austin playing key back. Supporters bay for coach's blood.

Coach/club try to bring in outstanding mature backman to take pressure of the backline and help the kids progress. Supporters bay for coach's blood.

There are some fair dinkum knobs supporting this club.

I've been glued to this thread for nigh on 1,000 pages, but it's beginning to hurt my head.

 

[Dry Rot]

Be a third round at best, I reckon. Hardly any senior experience and didn't finish very high in the reserves B&F.

He is still under contract, but some here claim he wants to leave and from the limited senior time he got this season, perhaps he is not wanted as much as we think.