Oppo Camp Non-Essendon Thread X

[Maddogm]

No

 

[Jesse Custer]

No

 

[Childish Gambino]

I think by saying no to some sort of reprimand people are in fact advocating violence. This is a man with form. Yes, he was provoked but it doesn't give him the right to slap someone in the face. I can understand if he pushed him away but this is different.

I've been in similar situations before and it is just best to keep your head down and keep walking.

 

[Mercurial89]

Collingwood winning 17 games? Nah.

More shocked we are that high tbh...

 

[Doss]

I should clarify. I wouldn't have a problem with a reprimand of some sort.

But I do not think he should be losing his job over it.

 

[Despair]

Reckless Impact, High Contact, Head(throat). Bad prior record, should be gone for 3-4 weeks.

 

[Pweter]

I thought it was more a push than a punch. I have absolutely no issue of him pushing someone out of his personal space, especially if he's been taunted for a while.

If Clarkson did punch him, put him in front of the media, make him solemnly apologise, make him promote "1 punch" and have him say how lucky he is that nothing came from it, move on.

Seriously, this person goads someone for a few minutes to get a reaction, records it in the hope he gets the reaction, then bleats to the media and the cops. Nope, Clarkson was set up and doesn't deserve to be sacked and I don't think needs to be suspended either. To be honest the dickhead deserved a punch in the teeth but that's not what the thread is asking.

 

[Harlequin]

I think without knowing all the facts we are prematurely passing judgement.
The person was clearly in his face and by all accounts intoxicated. I wonder what others may have done as I'm sure I would have pushed the person away too.
Whilst Clarkson may have crossed the line with undue force I believe the investigative process needs to occur prior to making judgement

Clarkson's prior history is what makes this a bigger issue

 

[Doss]

I will say one thing, yes it is important to send a message about violence and how it is not the answer, but equally, I don't want to see a message being sent that goading someone enough that they snap at you is okay either.

It's about striking a balance.

 

[Mercurial89]

I will say one thing, yes it is important to send a message about violence and how it is not the answer, but equally, I don't want to see a message that goading someone enough that they snap at you is okay either.

It's about striking a balance.

A small fine and measures put in place to prevent it from happening again, ie someone with the coach at all times.

id say taking the absolutely opposite tactic of painting Clarkson as a victim is why some people are upset.

I dont want the guy hanged, but i want it to be admitted that he was in the wrong, and not justifications for why its ok that he lashed out and him painted as a victim. That's where we have the disconnect between people.

This thread however, over reaction.

 

[Jade]

Shouldn't lose his job, should definitely receive a not insignificant penalty. You can't just whack someone because they are in your face.

 

[Lord Nicholson]

More shocked we are that high tbh...

I have a feeling that if I just say "I got a feeling we're gonna be aaaaaaall right" after each game we can accomplish anything.

 

[Maddogm]

Reckless Impact, High Contact, Head(throat). Bad prior record, should be gone for 3-4 weeks.

Insufficient force

Just because Clarko is a personality doesn't mean he loses his rights.

You'll note that in the video that Clarko angles away from the pillock until he's up against the wall which is when he shoves him

 

[The Dustbin]

No.

Clarkson simply reacted accordingly to being provoked and agitated.

/close thread.

So it's okay to assault someone because you are provoked?

I understand his reaction and I don't blame him for reacting to pissed bogans. However, it was wrong. Especially when he has been a type of ambassador for those respect ads.

 

[daffo]

Hell no.

Personally I think there should be a small fine or something like that just to ensure that the AFL set the right look. Just imagine if he king hit him.

 

[Lord Nicholson]

Shouldn't lose his job, should definitely receive a not insignificant penalty. You can't just whack someone because they are in your face.

If someone has completely invaded your personal space after repeated dialogue, and sticks their head right next to yours and you're not entirely sure what their endgame is I think you're more than entitled to pre-empt.

 

[Jade]

If someone has completely invaded your personal space after repeated dialogue, and sticks their head right next to yours and you're not entirely sure what their endgame is I think you're more than entitled to pre-empt.

Nah I don't think you can mate. Well at least not and expect to not have a consequence.

Yes, I'm aware that you potentially endanger yourself by NOT acting, but thats the price of making sure we aren't all violent thugs.

Now thats not to say the fan in question should also not be penalised. What he was doing to Clarkson was unacceptable, personally I think that if he's a member Port should look at some sort of penalty for him.

It only became a guaranteed physical altercation when Clarkson made it one.

 

[Mercurial89]

If someone has completely invaded your personal space after repeated dialogue, and sticks their head right next to yours and you're not entirely sure what their endgame is I think you're more than entitled to pre-empt.

They appeared to just be goading him because of the loss, they werent violent, they may have been "too close" but he pushed him away once to give himself space, he didnt need to resort to the force he did. He could then have made a complaint to Port and im sure they would have punished this guy in some way.

Its an unfortuante situation because then we have comments like this-
Leigh Matthews said Clarkson had suffered extreme provocation and “the guy was lucky he did not get knocked into next week”.

The provocation didnt seem that extreme, he wasnt being attacked, and he wasnt being threatened with violence. Go back and watch Fevola at the Brownlow, thats what these guys were doing. No one was going to be hurt except Clarko's pride.

He made it physical, and a punishment of some kind (like a fine) needs to be done to show this isnt an acceptable way to deal with these situations. The portraying of him as some kind of Victim is over the top (just as are calls for his head)

 

[scottmclaren]

IMO this personal space / provocation argument is pathetic, They are both at fault and each are responsible for their own actions.

The open hand "shove" claim, the harassment claim, the very intoxicated claim, the fear for safety claim, the cannot walk home anymore while interstate claim

Come on, If he really did fear for his safety he would not escalate the situation into a physical one

Typical blame everybody but yourself rubbish. The supporter was an idiot, but Clarkson needs account for his own actions and stop blaming everyone else.

 

[Maddogm]

They appeared to just be goading him because of the loss, they werent violent, they may have been "too close" but he pushed him away once to give himself space, he didnt need to resort to the force he did. He could then have made a complaint to Port and im sure they would have punished this guy in some way.

Its an unfortuante situation because then we have comments like this-
Leigh Matthews said Clarkson had suffered extreme provocation and “the guy was lucky he did not get knocked into next week”.

The provocation didnt seem that extreme, he wasnt being attacked, and he wasnt being threatened with violence. Go back and watch Fevola at the Brownlow, thats what these guys were doing. No one was going to be hurt except Clarko's pride.

He made it physical, and a punishment of some kind (like a fine) needs to be done to show this isnt an acceptable way to deal with these situations. The portraying of him as some kind of Victim is over the top (just as are calls for his head)

No. At the point of the shove he the only way he could continue to avoid it being physical was to walk into the wall

 

[scottmclaren]

Hell no.

Personally I think there should be a small fine or something like that just to ensure that the AFL set the right look. Just imagine if he king hit him.

Clarkson's record speaks for itself. A small fine would be pathetic.

Look at what Hird did after making the comment "Scott McLaren is not our favourite umpire".

He Came out and apologised unreservedly and offered a $20,000 fine (which AFL accepted) to football umpire development. This would have cost him $40K in pre tax dollars.

 

[Doss]

At the end of the day, most people can get pissed without resorting to being obnoxious buffoons. I think we need to be careful that we don't set a precedent where heroes think they can get in people's faces in the manner that guy did and then complain when they cop something for their trouble.

I am not condoning what Clarkson did, but I have not an ounce of sympathy for the fan.

Ask yourself this; would you do what that idiot did? No, you wouldn't, because frankly it makes you look like a dickhead. I know Clarkson isn't the most liked or likeable guy, but most manage to keep that opinion to themselves. Maybe idiot fan should learn to do the same.

Clarkson clearly has a problem controlling his emotions, but I absolutely understand how his reaction came about, although that does not condone it. Understanding and condoning are two separate things.

 

[scottmclaren]

I actually don't think he should be suspended, (unless they have lied to cover things up)— I think he needs to take responsibility for his actions.

People in the media commenting that the supporter was lucky not be knocked into next week show how deep the violence problem is in society.

 

[Despair]

This kind of stuff is nothing new. Welcome to the phone-camera generation.

Can't imagine the amount of times celebs get heckled at bars by heroes looking for reactions.

 

[Lord Nicholson]

Nah I don't think you can mate. Well at least not and expect to not have a consequence.

Yes, I'm aware that you potentially endanger yourself by NOT acting, but thats the price of making sure we aren't all violent thugs.

Now thats not to say the fan in question should also not be penalised. What he was doing to Clarkson was unacceptable, personally I think that if he's a member Port should look at some sort of penalty for him.

It only became a guaranteed physical altercation when Clarkson made it one.

If you remove the ability to pre-empt then you're already removing a consequence - you're removing the consequence for the dickhead fan. If we all say that this is unacceptable under any circumstance then we open the door for the behaviour of the fan and we demand that they absolutely be able to do that and get away with it and that's... OK?

How does that guy get penalised if Clarkson just lets him push up against him and film that and behave like an out-and-out dickhead? What structure or framework does the guy exist in where a consequence is levied upon him? There isn't, he just gets to keep going and he thinks "Yeah, I'll do that again next time."

Conflict is ugly but natural.