Review R5: Port v Adelaide Review

[FromTheHartland]

Guys whenever in doubt, just remember how good Jenkins and walker are

View attachment 130715

I wanna go find that and lurk like it so bad.

 

[Northalives]

All things being equal for the next Showdown I would like to see the Krak on Betts
see how the insufferable little smart arse goes then. The fumbles from both sides a product of pressure
imagined or real that come with these games. As for some bounces by running players not working
was wondering if it had anything to do with the Adelaide v Brisbane game on Friday night.
Normally the AO surface is predictable but less so yesterday.
Nathan Krakouer and Paddy Ryder add so much class to our team. Its WONDERFUL

Paddy Ryder? He's just a tall Wanganeen I reckon. Its WONDERFUL

 

[Shaucob_Burjan]

I wanna go find that and lurk like it so bad.

All yours.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/port-are-missing-walshs-tactical-nous.1093252/page-2

 

[diegodcg]

For someone quite new to the game you probably already take in more and have a greater knowledge than a very large percentage of Australians who have grown up with it. Kudos to you.

Thanks. Obviously not all of my observations are based on watching the game only, but also reading a lot of what's said here, which naturally influences the way I see what's going on in the game. But in some cases I think I'd have the same opinion simply watching by myself - like the appreciation for Pittard. He has a style that reminds me of some of my favorite soccer defenders. In soccer, as in football, I really like defenders who are efficient off the ball but also brave when they have possession.

 

[Dave Omsby]

Don't the players coming off the back of the square love it when they look up and see Paddy lurking around , put a good straight kick in quick and he can mark the ball with his height and athleticism against at least one defender in front or behind .

 

[diegodcg]

Was definitely noticeable in the first half. I think the first bounce of the game had about 2-3 consecutive stoppages. Like others have said the Crows are trying to use a tactic similar to Freo/Sydney high press or 'flooding'. The Crows have relied on stoppages a lot due to the fact that Sam Jacobs is quite a dominant ruckmen and they can use that to their advantage. Despite their average seasons in 2013/14 their clearance work is actually one of their strengths.

Jonas isn't the ideal match up on Betts, he's not as nimble or quick as Betts, but aerially he should have had his measure. Jonas is ideally suited for match ups against mid sized opponents (183-190cm). I don't think our team has a decent match up for forwards like Betts, Lindsay Thomas or Michael Walters who are quick and adept both in the air and on the ground. Impey can defend them on the ground, but is exposed in the air. Wouldn't mind seeing Krakouer matched up on them for a game.

Good call on that AFL R5 top 10 plays. He hit 1 out of 4 attempts from that pocket, but they'll only show the one that worked.

His laconic look and nature gives him a 'cool' vibe when he and the team are doing well. But there were periods when he and the team's form was down, where his laconic nature made the fans think he wasn't trying on the field.

Thanks. I really have to work on the terminology - "stoppages" to begin with. Also, the "pocket" is the area from where Betts kicked that goal, right?

As for Westhoff, it reminds me a bit of Berbatov, who also has that air of coolness/laziness - there's a fine line between both. When he's scoring for fun, he's cool and classy; when he's not, you see more and more people complaining about his demeanor. Have to say Hoff seems to be much more of a hard worker despite the look on his face.

Haha you have picked up this game pretty quickly in 4 weeks. I know people who have watched the game for a decade or two and wouldn't get it as clearly as you have.

And your Westhoff comment

Westhoff

A couple things for ya,

The one thing here you've gotten a little mixed probably comes from a soccer background. In AFL, when we refer to our 50, we are talking about our forward 50 where we kick goals. A lot of other sports class the end they are defending as their end, but it is the opposite in the AFL. Mind you because we have a different 'no offside' structure to NFL, soccer, etc, we generally just refer to them as our defensive 50 or our forward 50.

This is exactly what drove supporters mad about Westy over his first few years. We've all come to appreciate his ability now though and he is thorougly loved amongst the supporters I feel. Honestly though Westy has had a poor to average start to the year and hopefully he can regain form as we play some lesser ranked sides in the next few weeks and then show you what he can really do.

Thanks. The terminology really is a bit different and I'm still getting used to it. One of the next steps for me is to better understand the statistics of the game. I have an idea of what are "disposals", for example, or the inside 50 count, but I have to read a bit more carefully about this and the other broadly used statistics to have a better grasp of what is normally seen as valuable/important for a team.

 

[diegodcg]

Excellent post. You're already more knowledgeable talking about football than 85% of people that I talk to.

One thing, I'm not sure if anyone's mentioned this, but it's just about always 'best on ground' or BOG, rather than pitch!

Haha cheers. Just the other day I used "referee" instead of "umpire" but I'm getting there.

 

[Kickpuncher]

Best laugh of the night. As Adelaide kicked a behind Hoff followed the ball and as it bounced it came straight up and knocked a couple of Crows supporters beers right off the fence. The smirk Hoff had on his face when he looked at the cheer squad was priceless. Also as he's looking at the cheer squad he throws the ball to the goal square and hits the goal umpire in the back of the head with the

 

[tribey]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-05-04/aflca-votes-round-five

Adelaide v Port Adelaide
6 Dangerfield (Adel)

 

[Coobk001]

Thanks. I really have to work on the terminology - "stoppages" to begin with. Also, the "pocket" is the area from where Betts kicked that goal, right?

As for Westhoff, it reminds me a bit of Berbatov, who also has that air of coolness/laziness - there's a fine line between both. When he's scoring for fun, he's cool and classy; when he's not, you see more and more people complaining about his demeanor. Have to say Hoff seems to be much more of a hard worker despite the look on his face.



Westhoff



Thanks. The terminology really is a bit different and I'm still getting used to it. One of the next steps for me is to better understand the statistics of the game. I have an idea of what are "disposals", for example, or the inside 50 count, but I have to read a bit more carefully about this and the other broadly used statistics to have a better grasp of what is normally seen as valuable/important for a team.

Just drew this terrible pic for you, it might help With ground position terminology.

Don't worry too much about the stats. The key to stats is knowing how the stats reflect what you are seeing. Some teams can be great in some areas but they may Suck in others, they may not have the personnel to cash in on their statistical advantage in an area or their strategy doesn't utilize the stats they won.

On the weekend there was a couple key stats That affected what you saw. The crows won the clearances easily, it meant the ball spent a lot of time in their half because their strategy is based on winning the clearances and locking the ball in their forward half. This in turn affected the next Stat, inside 50s, which for them were huge 60 in a game used to be considered a match winning number.

These stats meant little though because we flooded like crazy and forced them into bad shots which they missed. This isn't reflected as a stat other than on the scoreboard. The other item that doesn't really show in the stats, other than the score, is that our 3 tall forwards kicked 10 goals out of 18 and this exploited their very small back line.

 

[TheFVK]

How the **** did Dangerfield get more votes than Betts?

Every time Betts got the ball I was shitting myself. Every time Dangerfield got it I sat back, relaxed and waited for the rebound 50.

You guys must have missed his explosiveness

 

[Ant Bear]

Thanks. I really have to work on the terminology - "stoppages" to begin with. Also, the "pocket" is the area from where Betts kicked that goal, right?

As for Westhoff, it reminds me a bit of Berbatov, who also has that air of coolness/laziness - there's a fine line between both. When he's scoring for fun, he's cool and classy; when he's not, you see more and more people complaining about his demeanor. Have to say Hoff seems to be much more of a hard worker despite the look on his face.



Westhoff



Thanks. The terminology really is a bit different and I'm still getting used to it. One of the next steps for me is to better understand the statistics of the game. I have an idea of what are "disposals", for example, or the inside 50 count, but I have to read a bit more carefully about this and the other broadly used statistics to have a better grasp of what is normally seen as valuable/important for a team.

It doesn't help when commentators and "experts" mangle the terminology. They often talk about "possessions" when in fact they mean "disposals". You can be credited with a disposal without taking possession (e.g. a kick off the ground), and can gather a possession without getting a disposal(e.g. holding the ball free against you, or held to you for a ball-up)

 

[edgie]

The point is: it's not the number of forward 50 entries that wins games, it's the quality of those entries.

Pursuing this 'really should have' ideology is pointless. Are you saying the Crows 'really should have' won yesterday?
No damn way, mate. We had them covered, they knew it, and their forward entries were mass crap as a result.

PS: Sydney won in 2012 by 10 points.

PPS: Geelong 'really should have' won the GF in 2008. We could go on forever, right ?

No, because:

Hawthorn still manufactured chances in probable positions. We forced Adelaide in to taking rushed, low percentage shots.
Hawthorn were still making good chances well in to the last quarter. We won the last quarter in the showdown convincingly, as Hawthorn and Stuart Dew did in 2008.

I know they won by 10, but one of those was kicked with like 30 seconds left, so I forget.

That gamestyle only works when you can "break" the opponent, like we did this week. Absorbed everything they chucked at us in quarters 2 and 3, then cruised to the finish. I just don't think using 2012 GF as an example is a great example.

 

[Power freak 2008]

All yours.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/port-are-missing-walshs-tactical-nous.1093252/page-2

Holy cow!! Talking about trolling!!

 

[RossFC]

Paddy Ryder is the man. (Nice goal assist by Jasper )


RussellEbertHandball at 35 seconds "He(Paddy) was their PERFECT recruit over the summer" - Mark Ricciuto

 

[Power freak 2008]

While the showdown wasn't easy by any stretch of the imagination. It was the least intense of our wins. We were spent against Freo, North, and Hawthorne.

Probably hard to keep the same intensity up for so many weeks in a row. Now we get a chance to refine our game against weaker opposition. Not that we'll take teams lightly but we could do with a few big wins to get our confidence up

 

[RossFC]

While the showdown wasn't easy by any stretch of the imagination. It was the least intense of our wins. We were spent against Freo, North, and Hawthorne.

Probably because we played the game in a library. #Shhhhhh

 

[Fade to Gray]

Thanks. I really have to work on the terminology - "stoppages" to begin with. Also, the "pocket" is the area from where Betts kicked that goal, right?

As for Westhoff, it reminds me a bit of Berbatov, who also has that air of coolness/laziness - there's a fine line between both. When he's scoring for fun, he's cool and classy; when he's not, you see more and more people complaining about his demeanor. Have to say Hoff seems to be much more of a hard worker despite the look on his face.



Westhoff



Thanks. The terminology really is a bit different and I'm still getting used to it. One of the next steps for me is to better understand the statistics of the game. I have an idea of what are "disposals", for example, or the inside 50 count, but I have to read a bit more carefully about this and the other broadly used statistics to have a better grasp of what is normally seen as valuable/important for a team.

Westhoff, always has a bit of a casual demeanour but he works extremely hard. He covers huge distances, there are very few players of his height that also have his running ability. He came into the side halfway through 2007 and was super impressive from the get go and had a great debut season, then came the Grand Final that can not be mentioned, he had an very bad day and it seemed to knock his confidence (and a few other team mates). A few dark years followed and his form fluctuated wildly, his best was excellent, his worst was putrid. When Ken joined the club in 2013 we saw a new Westhoff, his better games are more regular, and while he still has a few shockers, they are not to regular.

A few terms

Stoppages - When there is a ruck contest, either through an umpire bounce/through up or boundary umpire through in. It's good to win, but what matters more is the quality of the "clearance". Clearances are the result of stoppages.

Contested Possession/Disposal - If there is competition for a ball then it's a contested possession.

Uncontested Possession/Disposal - Pretty obviously if there is no completion for the possession.

Ground Ball Gets - Apparently the most important stat in the game, Almost unheard of before this year. It is now many possessions are gathered while the ball is on the ground (ie. not from Marks).

Disposal Efficiency - Does your possession result in your team getting the next possession? It can be a bit misleading, as a player who takes the game on and runs and kicks it long to a contest but the opposition wins it then it counts as not efficient, but if you don't take a risk and chip it across defence, then it will be effective. It's a bit like soccer where pass completion can be misleading, as a defender who takes no risks and back passes will complete many passes but the midfielder who creates a lot of chances but has some balls intercepted will be less efficient (stats wise).

To me the most important stat is Goal Kicking Accuracy, you just need to take your chances when you can. One criticism some outsiders have is that you are "rewarded" for missing. (1 point vs 6 points for a goal). However it is not really a reward. I view it as an opportunity missed, and you give possession of the ball to the opposition. Many games are decided by scores like 15.10 100 vs 10.15 75.

 

[tribey]

All yours.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/port-are-missing-walshs-tactical-nous.1093252/page-2

lol

what's worse is subscribers to that nonsense are a lot of their measured regulars, not the usual trolling dipshits.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Thanks. I really have to work on the terminology - "stoppages" to begin with. Also, the "pocket" is the area from where Betts kicked that goal, right?

As for Westhoff, it reminds me a bit of Berbatov, who also has that air of coolness/laziness - there's a fine line between both. When he's scoring for fun, he's cool and classy; when he's not, you see more and more people complaining about his demeanor. Have to say Hoff seems to be much more of a hard worker despite the look on his face.


Westhoff

Thanks. The terminology really is a bit different and I'm still getting used to it. One of the next steps for me is to better understand the statistics of the game. I have an idea of what are "disposals", for example, or the inside 50 count, but I have to read a bit more carefully about this and the other broadly used statistics to have a better grasp of what is normally seen as valuable/important for a team.

Diego, we should have sent you here first. This is the AFL's Rules Laws of the Game 2015 page. There are 13 videos embedded in this page and there is a link so you can download the Laws of Australian Football booklet which is 40 odd pages but has a diagram of the field with the position and tells you how wide the goal posts are and the goal posts to point posts, the size of the goal square and centre square and centre circle etc.

http://www.afl.com.au/laws

Justin Westhoff has many nicknames
The Hoff - is the most common after Baywatch actor David Hasselhoff - dont hassle the Hoff. The fans call him that but the coaches and players use it

Westy - he prefers that and Hinkley tends to call him Westy. Its part of the great Australian tradition of putting y or an o at the end of words. Boak and Schulz become Boaky and Shulzy. If your surname is Thompson or Thomson you get Tommo, Davidson - Davo, Johnston or Johnson - Johno. But other things get o's at the end, registration for your car is rego, if you get aid compensation for an accident or court settlement its compo, lesbian is leso, ambulance is ambo, ambulance workers are ambos etc

Humphrey - This was when he got to the club and he was very quiet and didnt speak much. apparently still doesnt. Humprey B. Bear was a childrens TV character basically a bloke dresses up in a Bear costume and doesnt talk. It was a character invented on Adelaide TV in the 1960's and went around Oz for the next 40 years. He was about 2 metres tall, didnt talk and was big cuddly character. Fitted the Hoff perfectly. The media ocassionally does stories on him and uses a picture of Humprey Bear to go with the story.

This video might be of interest is about 5 years old and shows how the official stats company Champion Data collect the stats. In the 1990's Aussie commentators used to use the word turnover a lot when mistakes were made and the ball turned over. There was a lot whinging about using an American basketball term but it was a perfect way to describe what happened. But Champion Data invented the Clanger stat to replace turnover - basically a clanger is when an individual makes a bad error and turns the ball over to the opposition, or an individual makes an error.

 

[PAFC04]

Thanks. Obviously not all of my observations are based on watching the game only, but also reading a lot of what's said here, which naturally influences the way I see what's going on in the game. But in some cases I think I'd have the same opinion simply watching by myself - like the appreciation for Pittard. He has a style that reminds me of some of my favorite soccer defenders. In soccer, as in football, I really like defenders who are efficient off the ball but also brave when they have possession.

Hey, you speaka my language.... I come from the same background with regards to the round ball game, having played it for many years. But that was many moons ago and since then dropped of the round ball and started to back the black and white in a different code when Port were carving it up in the 70's and 80's, Ebert was the man than caught my attention.....

Roberto Carlos was the best at doing that....

 

[diegodcg]

(Nice goal assist by Jasper )

People don't talk much about "assists" in Aussie Rules, do they? I couldn't even find that stat in the AFL website. I would think that's an important stat - a pass (be it a kick or a handball) leading to a goal.

Ah, nevermind. I was writing that post when I went again to the AFL website and found "goal assists" in the "advanced options" stats page. I think some may find it interesting to know that Kane Mitchell leads PAFC in number of assists, with 6. Two Hawthorn players lead the league with 9.

 

[ZingerB]

All yours.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/port-are-missing-walshs-tactical-nous.1093252/page-2

Geez, I don't understand why you would get so wound up so early. After all their rubbish over the last 2 years, firing a shot in round 2 is *ed even for them. As much as it looks like they have improved, so have everyone else, and they could still miss the 8. Freo/Port/Syd/Hawthorn likely top 4, then Essendon/GWS/North/West Coast/ Dogs/ Collingwood/ Adelaide/ Richmond all fighting it out for the other 4 spots. They've gone earlier than Richmond supporters. Pity the thread is locked so we can't all go troll those smart arse little campaigners.

 

[Chad WinGOAT]

People don't talk much about "assists" in Aussie Rules, do they? I couldn't even find that stat in the AFL website. I would think that's an important stat - a pass (be it a kick or a handball) leading to a goal.

Ah, nevermind. I was writing that post when I went again to the AFL website and found "goal assists" in the "advanced options" stats page. I think some may find it interesting to know that Kane Mitchell leads PAFC in number of assists, with 6. Two Hawthorn players lead the league with 9.

Assists are slowly being discussed more frequently in AFL. I'm not sure why it took so long to come on. It really is important in noticing and recognising the creative players.

Not surprised Kane Mitchell is leading our assists. His bursting runs are really important to our game plan. I'm surprised they it's only 6 though.

 

[PJ Power]

What are the odds he scored a five from Walsh?