Player Watch #15: Dylan Stephens

[tazaa]

Really great assessment. I blame Heath Shaw at GWS for feeding intel to Rhys Shaw and the recruiting team about the amazing talent at GWS we could pursue. 2 horrible Aidans and Ahern to show for it. The CCJ deal really does my head in. It’s like they thought this guy was going to be the next Luke Jackson.

The clean out of our list management we did a few years ago has not resolved the incompetence presently being observed looking at the Stephens and Fisher contracts.

I have no issue going after Stephens and Fisher. High reward if they make it.
But the 4 year contracts kill you. Maximum they should have been offered was 2 and then you know within 18 months if they will make it or not. But if theyre no good theyre easily replaced and the money can be spent elsewhere.
We now have to carry 2 massive question marks for another 3 and a half years.

Its just terrible poor list management.

And if they decided not to come its no big loss. Both Sydney and Carlton also maxed out at 2 year offers, because they did the proper risk assessment.
I think this clubs own goals and decision making is going to drive me insane.

 

[Lomas]

I have no issue going after Stephens and Fisher. High reward if they make it.
But the 4 year contracts kill you. Maximum they should have been offered was 2 and then you know within 18 months if they will make it or not. But if theyre no good theyre easily replaced and the money can be spent elsewhere.
We now have to carry 2 massive question marks for another 3 and a half years.

Its just terrible poor list management.

And if they decided not to come its no big loss. Both Sydney and Carlton also maxed out at 2 year offers, because they did the proper risk assessment.
I think this clubs own goals and decision making is going to drive me insane.

Only silver lining would be that they should be heavily front loaded and we needed to pay someone before the kids get into their third and fourth years.

 

[Only Forwards]

Should have been subbed out in the first quarter as soon as he turned it over under no pressure kicking it directly to a Lions player.

F*** him off to the twos.

 

[hellas_johnny]

Wtf has happened to him over 5 weeks. Collingwood and saints pre season looked good now absolute trash

 

[Harris 10]

Should have been subbed out in the first quarter as soon as he turned it over under no pressure kicking it directly to a Lions player.

F*** him off to the twos.

Could you imagine if the criteria for getting subbed was turning it over.

 

[DuckYeah]

Would like to see Stephen’s hiss at Dangermouse next week, then scuttle off the ground.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

He’s out.

 

[Merlin007]

I have no issue going after Stephens and Fisher. High reward if they make it.
But the 4 year contracts kill you. Maximum they should have been offered was 2 and then you know within 18 months if they will make it or not. But if theyre no good theyre easily replaced and the money can be spent elsewhere.
We now have to carry 2 massive question marks for another 3 and a half years.

Its just terrible poor list management.

And if they decided not to come its no big loss. Both Sydney and Carlton also maxed out at 2 year offers, because they did the proper risk assessment.
I think this clubs own goals and decision making is going to drive me insane.

So a couple things, the first being after 4 rounds it might be a bit early to make a call on either Stephens or Fisher (but for FWIW, IMO stephens should be dropped this week)

but back to the trades. The bit that needs to be remembered is context - Stephens was recruited to use one of the draft concession picks which might otherwise have been subject to "review" - ie, lost.

Stephens also came with pick 25 and going the other way were one of the 2024 priority picks and pick 44 - valuing stephens at pick 34.

25 was then packaged up with 21 for Fisher and pick 17 - valuing Fisher at pick 31

So in terms of draft capital, Stephens and Fisher were bargains, and filled a list need (ie, blokes who can run)

And then to your point about contract length, 4 years might very well be generous, and a millstone around our necks if Stephens and Fisher prove to be busts, but the problem is that players won't move for contracts that are no longer in duration than what they are on or offered. That's not North Melbourne's fault - it's just the reality of the industry.

So in the context of list holes, and the need to shift out priority picks that might otherwise be lost, both Stephens and Fisher were reasonable trades, especially when you consider the overall draft outcome from last year, where we were able to trade up to Will Dawson and Hardemann

 

[Psychic Roo]

So a couple things, the first being after 4 rounds it might be a bit early to make a call on either Stephens or Fisher (but for FWIW, IMO stephens should be dropped this week)

but back to the trades. The bit that needs to be remembered is context - Stephens was recruited to use one of the draft concession picks which might otherwise have been subject to "review" - ie, lost.

Stephens also came with pick 25 and going the other way were one of the 2024 priority picks and pick 44 - valuing stephens at pick 34.

25 was then packaged up with 21 for Fisher and pick 17 - valuing Fisher at pick 31

So in terms of draft capital, Stephens and Fisher were bargains, and filled a list need (ie, blokes who can run)

And then to your point about contract length, 4 years might very well be generous, and a millstone around our necks if Stephens and Fisher prove to be busts, but the problem is that players won't move for contracts that are no longer in duration than what they are on or offered. That's not North Melbourne's fault - it's just the reality of the industry.

So in the context of list holes, and the need to shift out priority picks that might otherwise be lost, both Stephens and Fisher were reasonable trades, especially when you consider the overall draft outcome from last year, where we were able to trade up to Will Dawson and Hardemann

Good info

 

[Epictetus]

So a couple things, the first being after 4 rounds it might be a bit early to make a call on either Stephens or Fisher (but for FWIW, IMO stephens should be dropped this week)

but back to the trades. The bit that needs to be remembered is context - Stephens was recruited to use one of the draft concession picks which might otherwise have been subject to "review" - ie, lost.

Stephens also came with pick 25 and going the other way were one of the 2024 priority picks and pick 44 - valuing stephens at pick 34.

25 was then packaged up with 21 for Fisher and pick 17 - valuing Fisher at pick 31

So in terms of draft capital, Stephens and Fisher were bargains, and filled a list need (ie, blokes who can run)

And then to your point about contract length, 4 years might very well be generous, and a millstone around our necks if Stephens and Fisher prove to be busts, but the problem is that players won't move for contracts that are no longer in duration than what they are on or offered. That's not North Melbourne's fault - it's just the reality of the industry.

So in the context of list holes, and the need to shift out priority picks that might otherwise be lost, both Stephens and Fisher were reasonable trades, especially when you consider the overall draft outcome from last year, where we were able to trade up to Will Dawson and Hardemann

Nah. Absolutely not.

Fisher has some talent. There is some hope. I'm sceptical, because he's tiny.

But how anyone can attempt to justify the Stephens pick 34 value and 4 years is baffling to me. There'd be 100 blokes you could get for that.

 

[rm3504]

Reckon he wasnt suited to a ground with no wings to be honest, but still disappointing so far.

Way too many on bf prone to excuses
this 4 yr deal a bad as polecs
Opposition duds and their managers must answer the phone real quick when north rings

 

[chubbspeterson]

Prepared to at least give him a season. Oh and the Swans pick up the same spuds just like us. They had Ryan Clarke

4

Ryan Clarke

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26

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186cm

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83kg

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18.8

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9.1

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9.7

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3.4

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2.2

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0.2

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18.5

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8.8

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9.8

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1.8

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2.5

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19.6

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7.0

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12.6

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2.4

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2.2

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0.0

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on their list for many years!!! Dees traded for many cast offs from other teams until they hit on a few that worked out. Blues the same.
We are buying time until the Goater's and Hardemann's are ready to run out full games at AFL level.
Ideally the type of one we attract is more your Toby Bedford

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Toby Bedford

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23

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179cm

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75kg

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8.0

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2.0

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6.0

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1.0

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2.0

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0.0

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8.0

2star

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2.0

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6.0

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1.0

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2.0

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0.0

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8.0

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2.0

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6.0

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1.0

1star

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2.0

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0.0

1star

type of talent but it's easier said than done being a bottom side.

 

[Merlin007]

Nah. Absolutely not.

Fisher has some talent. There is some hope. I'm sceptical, because he's tiny.

But how anyone can attempt to justify the Stephens pick 34 value and 4 years is baffling to me. There'd be 100 blokes you could get for that.

sure, all you have to do is go and find them - or even nominate say just 10% of the 100 you reckon were available.

 

[giantsully]

Just a terrible decision to recruit on so many levels.

What’s the point of priority picks of the club keeps burning them on players like this.

I must admit I never was a huge watcher of Sydney and he didn’t play a lot last year at AFL level, but has he always been this s**t frightened of contact?

I can only imagine as a teammate how disheartening it would be to play with a guy like this who gives up on a contest because he is scared of contact.

Sadly yes. They can't all be Glenn Archer but this bloke has never shown any appetite for the contest. Was flabbergasted when NM offered him 4 years - on what possible basis?

If it makes you feel any better, we passed on Caleb Serong to pick him. Sigh.

 

[Billy Not Really]

Great, another handover of crap players from other clubs we've inherited.

 

[Roosurgence]

Sadly yes. They can't all be Glenn Archer but this bloke has never shown any appetite for the contest. Was flabbergasted when NM offered him 4 years - on what possible basis?

If it makes you feel any better, we passed on Caleb Serong to pick him. Sigh.

I don’t expect Glenn Archer but this bloke is visibly frightened of contact and either avoids it or absolutely shits himself at the thought of it fumbles an easy possession.

I’m not sure in which world anyone saw a guy who is too frightened to compete was worth 4 years on what I would assume is good money?

Another one to add to the CCJ decision which was also another abject disaster.

 

[roos_fanatic08]

Sadly yes. They can't all be Glenn Archer but this bloke has never shown any appetite for the contest. Was flabbergasted when NM offered him 4 years - on what possible basis?

If it makes you feel any better, we passed on Caleb Serong to pick him. Sigh.

It absolutely does not make us feel any better because we traded out the pick Caleb Serong was taken at, then we proceeded to pick Jack Mahony and Flynn Perez at pick 34 & 35, when in the lead up to the draft we had been strongly linked to Chad Warner, and now we've added Stephens on an overpriced 4 year deal.

That's 4 heck ups for the price of one.

 

[Liam Boy]

It absolutely does not make us feel any better because we traded out the pick Caleb Serong was taken at, then we proceeded to pick Jack Mahony and Flynn Perez at pick 34 & 35, when in the lead up to the draft we had been strongly linked to Chad Warner, and now we've added Stephens on an overpriced 4 year deal.

That's 4 * ups for the price of one.

This is kind of incoherent. What point are you trying to make? Our 2019 draft hand was not involved in the acquisition of Dylan Stephens at all. Picking Mahony and Perez had nothing to do with the first round pick swap, the actual fruit of which ended up being Tom Powell, feels like you're just bringing them up to elicit an anger response without thinking about the actual relevance. You're also just skipping over Charlie Comben for no reason, as well as the fact that we flipped that pick with Essendon for a free future 2nd when we wanted Chom to begin with anyway. It would've been nice to have Chad Warner but every club skipped him and there's no guarantee he would've developed into the player he is now at another club, especially not ours.

 

[DocSholl]

This is kind of incoherent. What point are you trying to make? Our 2019 draft hand was not involved in the acquisition of Dylan Stephens at all. Picking Mahony and Perez had nothing to do with the first round pick swap, the actual fruit of which ended up being Tom Powell, feels like you're just bringing them up to elicit an anger response without thinking about the actual relevance. You're also just skipping over Charlie Comben for no reason, as well as the fact that we flipped that pick with Essendon for a free future 2nd when we wanted Chom to begin with anyway. It would've been nice to have Chad Warner but every club skipped him and there's no guarantee he would've developed into the player he is now at another club, especially not ours.

He's just outlining how cursed the 2019 draft was for us as a whole, which it was. The only way it would have been worse is if we'd somehow lured McAsey home too.

 

[big_e]

So a couple things, the first being after 4 rounds it might be a bit early to make a call on either Stephens or Fisher (but for FWIW, IMO stephens should be dropped this week)

but back to the trades. The bit that needs to be remembered is context - Stephens was recruited to use one of the draft concession picks which might otherwise have been subject to "review" - ie, lost.

Stephens also came with pick 25 and going the other way were one of the 2024 priority picks and pick 44 - valuing stephens at pick 34.

25 was then packaged up with 21 for Fisher and pick 17 - valuing Fisher at pick 31

So in terms of draft capital, Stephens and Fisher were bargains, and filled a list need (ie, blokes who can run)

And then to your point about contract length, 4 years might very well be generous, and a millstone around our necks if Stephens and Fisher prove to be busts, but the problem is that players won't move for contracts that are no longer in duration than what they are on or offered. That's not North Melbourne's fault - it's just the reality of the industry.

So in the context of list holes, and the need to shift out priority picks that might otherwise be lost, both Stephens and Fisher were reasonable trades, especially when you consider the overall draft outcome from last year, where we were able to trade up to Will Dawson and Hardemann

Sorry, I’m not buying this at all.

We had to use the future PPs, but we didn’t have to use them on Dylan Stephens. We traded one of them to the Gold Coast for another 2023 pick, we could have done the same for another pick, or packaged the two together to get even further up the order.

And we didn’t have to offer Dylan Stephens a four-year deal – we could easily have said it’s two years or you can try your luck elsewhere. I don’t recall there being many suitors. Long deals on unproven players become a millstone far more often than they are a win. Sometimes it’s injuries (Aidan Corr missing 20 games in his first season), sometimes it’s a lack of development (CCJ), sometimes it’s a change in direction (Polec), but the risk is significant.

Fun fact: the only players on our list with longer contracts are Jy Simpkin (2 x B & F, club captain), Nick Larkey (All-Australian, 3 x leading goalkicker), and Harry Sheezel (B & F, Rising Star). There is a ******* Grand Canyon in class between him and those three.

As for filling a need, well, is there anything we don’t need? And is “run” really the sort of thing that deserves that kind of deal? Are there other ways to attract “run”? Was there anyone in the draft that had those attributes? Someone who might have been a trade or FA target in 2024, perhaps?

I agree that it’s too early to make a judgement, and I honestly, sincerely hope he plays 200 games for the club and wins a flag. But it’s going to take a very big turnaround for this deal to not look like an absolute stinker.

 

[Colby Cheer Squad]

Could you imagine if the criteria for getting subbed was turning it over.

Yes Tommy Powell would have had a very early afternoon shower, sadly.

 

[Sticksphat]

Well said.

Logue - I rate with the pick we were forced to trade. Hard to judge post knee but so far no issues
Fisher - Too early to call but 4 years on exposed form - this is 50-50
Greenwood - has filled a role since Cunners went down with illness. Cost us nothing. Isn't holding anyone back. Good for the VFL team
Shiels - Played some good footy last year and did well with onfield leadership and tagging Merrett

Stephenson - His 2021 feels like a long time ago and even his form last year feels way off. Its heading toward a major bust as his body seems to have fallen off a cliff this year. 5 year deal that expires in 2025
Corr - Terrible contract. Also end of 2025. This has been a miserable pick up overall
Tucker - his 2023 season was so so but he has until 2025 as well on his 3 year deal. F***
CCJ - Probably the worst deal considering what we gave up in Tarrant and the 2nd rounder and the contract terms. A sackable offence with his deal again until 2025
Stephens - A 4 year f***ing deal. 4! Jesus Christ we don't deserve success
Bigoa Nyuon - low risk free hit but not expected to make it
Toby Pink -Another low risk free hit. Not up to AFL standard

Bonar - Amazing he lasted 4 years to be honest but was low risk
Lachie Young - Another low risk type who lasted 3 seasons
Howe - I genuinely cannot believe we signed this campaigner last year
Ahern - Body seemed cooked. Didn't have the drive to make it
Josh Walker - Filled a role but wasn't AFL standard. Big reason why our playing group has embraced this loser mentality
Atu - Bet we thought we had pulled a swifty on the Pies here. They went on to play in prelims and win a flag and both the boys we picked up as steals yet its the Pies who are laughing in retrospect

What is the exact opposite of Moneyball????? This s**t

 

[roos_fanatic08]

This is kind of incoherent. What point are you trying to make? Our 2019 draft hand was not involved in the acquisition of Dylan Stephens at all. Picking Mahony and Perez had nothing to do with the first round pick swap, the actual fruit of which ended up being Tom Powell, feels like you're just bringing them up to elicit an anger response without thinking about the actual relevance. You're also just skipping over Charlie Comben for no reason, as well as the fact that we flipped that pick with Essendon for a free future 2nd when we wanted Chom to begin with anyway. It would've been nice to have Chad Warner but every club skipped him and there's no guarantee he would've developed into the player he is now at another club, especially not ours.

It was more of a pisstake at our drafting after old mate highlighted Sydney missing out on Serong.

 

[Liam Boy]

It was more of a pisstake at our drafting after old mate highlighted Sydney missing out on Serong.

Everyone knows our drafting has been subpar. I'm kind of over hearing about it every day, especially when it's a carefully curated extra s**t version of what actually happened. I swear we've got some serious misery addicts around here

 

[Lomas]

Everyone knows our drafting has been subpar. I'm kind of over hearing about it every day, especially when it's a carefully curated extra s**t version of what actually happened. I swear we've got some serious misery addicts around here

That’s the good s**t, spiral a little more.

 

[roos_fanatic08]

Everyone knows our drafting has been subpar. I'm kind of over hearing about it every day, especially when it's a carefully curated extra s**t version of what actually happened. I swear we've got some serious misery addicts around here

I’m not going to lie, the last 3 years years have made me far more pessimistic than usual.