List Mgmt. 2014 Draft + DFA Talk Part II

[Calcium Man]

on AFL website there's a list assessment story for each Club, C.Twomey, who has been the one mostly linking us toi Ellis had this to say at the end of our part = Cal Twomey says: Liam Duggan, Lachie Weller, Paul Ahern are in the mix at pick 12 as classy midfielders, but the Tigers will look closely at Corey Ellis, a talented, smooth-moving midfielder.
think ellis is the guarenteed pick for us if our other options are gone at #12

Everyone will hate Ellis until they watch him play. I've managed to get some tape of him and he is a smooth mover (the dom tyson comparisons are not wrong) and has a very developed contested game and I think he will become a favourite. I probably have him ahead of Weller now because i think he has more scope for improvement.

 

[richoatthedisco]

Question Tigers fans

If you had chance again 2013 draft would you keep Ben Lennon over Patrick Cripps?

I think Tigers need more of a Cripps type mid and Blues need Lennon type utility

Doing a 2013 draft in terms of talent feel lots of upside in both players but Cripps would be extractor type mid Tigers would benefit from and Lennon perfect for Blues

Of course we would keep Lennon, he's all class, which is what we need as much as anything.

The more pertinent question is whether Carlton fans would keep Cripps over the superior Luke Dunstan. Another first round blue (pun fully intended).

 

[tigs2010]

Of course we would keep Lennon, he's all class, which is what we need as much as anything.

The more pertinent question is whether Carlton fans would keep Cripps over the superior Luke Dunstan. Another first round blue (pun fully intended).

They'll say Cripps but deep down we know the answer...

 

[JR82]

Everyone will hate Ellis until they watch him play. I've managed to get some tape of him and he is a smooth mover (the dom tyson comparisons are not wrong) and has a very developed contested game and I think he will become a favourite. I probably have him ahead of Weller now because i think he has more scope for improvement.

i am curious as some media ppl rate him & i don't know all that much about him, how would he compare to Dunstan? similar type, skills etc? i wish Players highlights vids showed clearance work & not only the ones where they get the ball & sprint clear of the pack.

 

[tigs2010]

i am curious as some media ppl rate him & i don't know all that much about him, how would he compare to Dunstan? similar type, skills etc? i wish Players highlights vids showed clearance work & not only the ones where they get the ball & sprint clear of the pack.

Nah he's more of a classy inside mid rather than a brute type.

 

[bc27]

Lever is a more safer pick then Ellis and has better potential. I'd be pissed off if we took Ellis of Lever. It would be a classic Richmond move though.

 

[SteveRFC]

Everyone needs to go back and watch Ben Lennons pick me video. He will be a solid unit for us next season. Lids Dusty Lennon will be our main rotating mid/forwards

 

[gillo94]

They'll say Cripps but deep down we know the answer...

Personally I rate Cripps higher than Dunstan only reason ATM is because of better inside and clearance skills, in the long term. Keep jn mind Cripps injured last year

I rate Lennon better all round but Cripps better mid

 

[Richo83]

Weller for speed, address inside grunt later in the draft, game has evolved from one paced midfielders.

You do realise that Matt Priddis just won the brownlow right?

 

[bc27]

You do realise that Matt Priddis just won the brownlow right?

Didn't win his teams best and fairest funnily enough.

 

[Toadvine]

Didn't win his teams best and fairest funnily enough.

I don't think he'll lose much sleep over it. He won it in 2013.

 

[_RT_]

Lever is a more safer pick then Ellis and has better potential. I'd be pissed off if we took Ellis of Lever. It would be a classic Richmond move though.

How much of the kids have you watched? I mean if you've watched them for 2-3 years like our recruiters have then fair enough being pissed off, but if you're going of the rankings of others and watching a few pick me/youtube clips then I don't understand the pissed off mentality. Be disappointed sure but not pissed off

 

[bc27]

How much of the kids have you watched? I mean if you've watched them for 2-3 years like our recruiters have then fair enough being pissed off, but if you're going of the rankings of others and watching a few pick me/youtube clips then I don't understand the pissed off mentality. Be disappointed sure but not pissed off

Have seen both live.
And yes I will be pissed off. Since this an Internet forum where people come to post opinions on AFL matters, I am having my opinion. Whether it be as informed or more informed then yours or a recruiters, I am still having my opinion. And in my opinion from what I've seen live and thru footage I would be pissed off of Lever is available and we take Ellis.

 

[_RT_]

Have seen both live.
And yes I will be pissed off. Since this an Internet forum where people come to post opinions on AFL matters, I am having my opinion. Whether it be as informed or more informed then yours or a recruiters, I am still having my opinion. And in my opinion from what I've seen live and thru footage I would be pissed off of Lever is available and we take Ellis.

Not saying you can't have an opinion, just wanting to understand the level of information you're basing it on.

 

[bc27]

Not saying you can't have an opinion, just wanting to understand the level of information you're basing it on.

No worries. Lets not make out these recruiters are recruiting genius' either.
If you have decent bit of footballing knowledge, sometimes with some players all you need is a 4-5 minute bit of footage to see strengths and weaknesses. At the end of the day it's all a bit of a crapshoot and luck that dictates a quality footballer. Christian Petrecca is commonly thought of as the best footballer in this draft. But how many times has Petrecca played in front of 80,000 fans? Or how many afl standard pre seasons has Petracca done? How many times in Petraccas career so far has he had to deal with constant media? How many times has Petracca been recognized out and having the world at his feet. All this goes into making a quality footballer. Let's be honest, 90% of these kids have only just finished high school this month! Some of them have never driving a car!
Who knows what can happen. As a recruiter, All you go off is watching them 6-7 times and then having a chat with them for a couple of hours. After that it's just hope for the best.

 

[TheAnt]

Who knows what can happen. As a recruiter, All you go off is watching them 6-7 times and then having a chat with them for a couple of hours. After that it's just hope for the best.

Sorry, but disagree. Clubs invest so much time, energy and money into the draft these days and so I don't see that being the case.

 

[Richo83]

If you have decent bit of footballing knowledge, sometimes with some players all you need is a 4-5 minute bit of footage to see strengths and weaknesses.

Nope. You can edit 4-5 minutes of footage to make any of these players look like a superstar or a dud. This is why you've got to watch them regularly.

 

[bc27]

Nope. You can edit 4-5 minutes of footage to make any of these players look like a superstar or a dud. This is why you've got to watch them regularly.

Like I said. With a decent bit of footballing knowledge you can see a lot of little things even when thier heavily edited.

 

[tigs2010]

Sorry, but disagree. Clubs invest so much time, energy and money into the draft these days and so I don't see that being the case.

Someone watches them play each game.

 

[_RT_]

No worries. Lets not make out these recruiters are recruiting genius' either.
If you have decent bit of footballing knowledge, sometimes with some players all you need is a 4-5 minute bit of footage to see strengths and weaknesses. At the end of the day it's all a bit of a crapshoot and luck that dictates a quality footballer. Christian Petrecca is commonly thought of as the best footballer in this draft. But how many times has Petrecca played in front of 80,000 fans? Or how many afl standard pre seasons has Petracca done? How many times in Petraccas career so far has he had to deal with constant media? How many times has Petracca been recognized out and having the world at his feet. All this goes into making a quality footballer. Let's be honest, 90% of these kids have only just finished high school this month! Some of them have never driving a car!
Who knows what can happen. As a recruiter, All you go off is watching them 6-7 times and then having a chat with them for a couple of hours. After that it's just hope for the best.

Disagree, recruiters watch these kids for up to 3 years before their draft year. From the U16's these kids are being watched by recruiters as they represent their states and are brought into TAC Cup development sides. Then once they are playing in the U18's they are looked at every week as recruiters head out and watch the teams play. To suggest it's just a crapshoot is rather ignorant.

As I've said repeatedly, I don't get the chance to watch the kids outside their 2 televised games in the champs and whatever pick me/youtube clips are available. Outside that it is a shitload of reading about the kids and like everyone I find my preferred options, but I'd never be pissed off if the club doesn't recruit the kids I'd like them to, because I understand that their knowledge of these kids is far greater than anything I can garner by a few hours of watching clips.

It's not only watching the kids that the recruiters do, it's the background stuff that we don't get to read/hear about. The informal chats after games, the psych testing, the formal chats, the interviews with coaches. All of that stuff helps clubs ensure that the kids that they get have the best chance of making it. If recruiting was simply about watching youtube clips and making calls based off of that then everyone would be doing it and we all know that isn't how it works.

 

[Richo83]

Like I said. With a decent bit of footballing knowledge you can see a lot of little things even when thier heavily edited.

What if I merely highlight the bad parts, or merely analyse one game? If you looked at Swan or Watson's early years, you wouldn't have thought these guys would make it, or at least win a brownlow or two and that's over seasons, not minutes. What makes you think you can really have a grasp on how good a player is from five minutes of vision? Heck, I could make a clip highlighting everytime Petracca scrubbed a kick to make him look like a dud. Doesn't make it accurate. And while it isn't true that there are hacks who deliberately try to ruin someone's prospects, or boost them, it is often the case that footage is only from one game, where the player had a poor or average game. Youtube recruiting isn't done by recruiters because it doesn't work.

 

[Stylo]

Some talk that Lamb may be available at 33. I'd be all over that, guy's a freak.

 

[Richo83]

Take Reece McKenzie, I could edit a video of all his games where he's bagged lots of goals while dominating up forward. Or I could make a clip of him playing ruck and not exactly dominating, or make a clip of him struggling against elite defenses. All these clips will say one thing, but it wont be the full picture. I could make a clip of Cale Morton running hard and placing kicks superbly, ignoring the fact that he was a Morton and couldn't get the hard ball. I could also make a clip of a balanced gun midfielder, only highlight his outside work, and make him look like a seagull. I could also make a clip of an inside midfielder and only show the miskicks and make him out to be a turnover merchant.

 

[Richo83]

Another thing, are people not liking the Ellis pick because he's not a bigfooty favourite? Chris25 likes him, Quayle had some very nice things to say about him as well and put him at pick 19 from memory in her power rankings. Ellis is a genuine midfielder who has decent midfield stats at tac cup level this year, he's a lovely kick and can play inside. The only knock is pace but there are plenty of good midfielders who aren't fast. In today's football, foot skills and decision making are really important, Ellis has that.

 

[THE_GUN]

Some talk that Lamb may be available at 33. I'd be all over that, guy's a freak.

Nooooooooooooooooooooo Chanceeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee