List Mgmt. 2015 general list discussion and speculation - PLEASE START NEW THREAD ON BREAKING NEWS

[Pivo]

A quorum is around 500 I think on BigFooty 497 to go..

Can that include aliases?

 

[year of the cat]

Can that include aliases?

Well that probably brings it down to about 50 genuine accounts then..!

 

[year of the cat]

What are peoples feelings now that the dust has settled a little from the Semi-Final?

Having viewed the prelims, I think we are further away from being a legitimate challenger than I thought last week. Aside from an ageing backline which will largely need replacing over the next couple of years, I think our midfield really lacks class. I'd say that Selwood, Caddy (based on his finals performances), Motlop (based on what we know he can put out when fit) and Duncan are currently our only top quality mids that we have to work with that are likely to be hopefully be around for another crack at a flag. Guthrie could and probably should make it but I tend to think he may be better suited to a move back into defence where he performed so well last year.

We really need to either land a gun FA in the midfield like Dangerfield and/or hope to develop via the draft another 2-3 players that can be elite. That can take a little time or we could be lucky like Port and draft a Wines/Wingard over a couple of years. Having access to earlier picks clearly helped in this regard.

What do you do first? Do you hopefully land Frawley and then target the best mid in the draft with our first pick? Or do you continue to rebuild our defence knowing that we will lose both Lonergan, Rivers and Mackie in the next year or so and take someone like Goddard or Marchbank if they are available? There used to be an adage in football that successful teams are built from the defence. If that still holds then you would look at tall defenders. But I'm not so sure that necessarily applies these days - the best teams I believe have the deepest midfields. Perhaps we should contiunue to draft elite, young mids and use our latter picks to take talls?

What we do know is that with our first pick likely to now be around 14, we will have access to a very good kid, either tall or mid.

Which way do we go?

 

[_Me_]

What are peoples feelings now that the dust has settled a little from the Semi-Final?

Having viewed the prelims, I think we are further away from being a legitimate challenger than I thought last week. Aside from and ageing backline which will largely need replacing over the next couple of years, I think our midfield really lacks class. I'd say that Selwood, Caddy (based on his finals performances), Motlop (based on what we know he can put out when fit) and Duncan are currently our only top quality mids that we have to work with that are likely to be hopefully be around for another crack at a flag. Guthrie could and probably should make it but I tend to think he may be better suited to a move back into defence where he performed so well last year.

We really need to either land a gun FA in the midfield like Dangerfield and/or hope to develop via the draft another 2-3 players that can be elite. That can take a little time or we could be lucky like Port and draft a Wines/Wingard over a couple of years. Having access to earlier picks clearly helped in this regard.

What do you do first? Do you hopefully land Frawley and then target the best mid in the draft with our first pick? Or do you continue to rebuild our defence knowing that we will lose both Lonergan, Rivers and Mackie in the next year or so and take someone like Goddard or Marchbank if they are available? There used to be an adage in football that successful teams are built from the defence. If that still holds then you would look at tall defenders. But I'm not so sure that necessarily applies these days - the best teams I believe have the deepest midfields. Perhaps we should contiunue to draft elite, young mids and use our latter picks to take talls?

What we do know is that with our first pick likely to now be around 14, we will have access to a very good kid, either tall or mid.

Which way do we go?

we need mids, and a mongrel mid like langford
everyone thought port was gone 2 years ago

we will either exceed expectations, because menzel vardy or lang etc will jump out or continue to rebuild

 

[year of the cat]

we need mids, and a mongrel mid like langford
everyone thought port was gone 2 years ago

we will either exceed expectations, because menzel vardy or lang etc will jump out or continue to rebuild

Midfielders that may be around come pick 14 include DeGoey, Weller, Blakeley, Menadue, Ellis, and Neal-Bullen. Blakeley is probably the best of the tough, inside types of that lot. Weller possibly the classiest.

 

[_Me_]

Midfielders that may be around come pick 14 are DeGoey, Weller, Blakeley, Menadue, Ellis, and Neal-Bullen. Blakeley is probably the best of the tough, inside types of that lot. Weller possibly the classiest.

we need some mongrel, its joel then no-one, lang thurlow etc are pretty not mongrel types

 

[Catastic82]

Get a good ruck, one more good inside mid and adress the backline and we should be ok.

 

[_Me_]

Get a good ruck, one more good inside mid and adress the backline and we should be ok.

backline is fine, if they ply guthrie and thurlow
ruck is a lock that we need two (one a rookie)
think we need two mids that are ready to go

 

[Bobby_]

backline is fine, if they ply guthrie and thurlow

how will that happen when Enright and Kelly are playing in those positions?

 

[_Me_]

how will that happen when Enright and Kelly are playing in those positions?

kelly plays as a mid / sub
enright has 8 weeks off, mackie has 6 weeks off

 

[Claude Balls]

Yep desperately need some mongrel in the midfield. I for one am hoping that Hartman achieves the same improvement between years 2 and 3 as he did between years 1 and 2. And I'm hoping also that Jansen - that's JAnsen - has a huge preseason and is fit enough to play as many games as his talent warrants.

As for the draft, I will probably be a bit deflated if Wells does his usual in the first round: goes for an underweight, versatile type who needs at least 3 preseasons to be able to win a contested possession.

 

[Moneypenny]

This weekend has been illuminating, hasn't it? I guess it suggested that the team has a lot of improvement from 17-5 and a semi final loss if key areas get addressed. I'm not saying that's going to happen, but the opportunity is definitely there. Just off the top of my head these are some of the glaringly obvious areas that set us back from the prelim teams.

Forward

• A CHF (Vards, pending recovery?/Walker's natural growth in the role) to occupy the opposition more
• A small forward or two that can slip defences, pull goals out of nowhere and generally cause havoc
• Defensive pressure to lock the ball in - 2013 we were sooo much better at this, I have recurring nightmares about anonymous teams streaming out the forward 50 to score goal after goal.
• More marking options

Midfield

• Tackles need to stick
• Two way running needs to improve
• A competent ruckman that can be a contributing member of the team for at least the finals
• Help for Joel - I hope Caddy uses the SF as ammunition for a big 2015, Bundy gets a full preseason and can stay in the side, GHS, Cam and Murdoch work on their fitness so they can stay in the game for longer, Mitch takes on more on field leadership responsibilities etc.
• Jansen and Hartman getting seniors time - I like the cut of their jib, so to speak
• Better bloody entries into the forward line

Defence

• Leg speed
• Youth/succession planning. At the moment I think it could be Boris-Cam G, Mackie-Thurlow, Rivers-JK??? Need more obvious replacements for Doms and HT, we have Brown, Hamling etc but they seem more Mackie-like, from what I've read
• Bews to stay the side not because he needs game time but because we desperately need a small defender. I guess the limiting factor is his form and whether he deserves a spot in the 22 over others playing better
• Improved kicking skills, esp on kick ins

 

[Lana]

I love your tables, 10lana! Great work!
The only problem is that they spoil a good argument!

I love a argument as much as the next person but after a while they can turn into this

 

[Teriyakicat]

I love a argument as much as the next person but after a while they can turn into this

Hahaha! Very very true!!
Sometimes I think the participants could do with a few "Being Hit On The Head" lessons!

 

[Teriyakicat]

This weekend has been illuminating, hasn't it? I guess it suggested that the team has a lot of improvement from 17-5 and a semi final loss if key areas get addressed. I'm not saying that's going to happen, but the opportunity is definitely there. Just off the top of my head these are some of the glaringly obvious areas that set us back from the prelim teams.

Forward

• A CHF (Vards, pending recovery?/Walker's natural growth in the role) to occupy the opposition more
• A small forward or two that can slip defences, pull goals out of nowhere and generally cause havoc
• Defensive pressure to lock the ball in - 2013 we were sooo much better at this, I have recurring nightmares about anonymous teams streaming out the forward 50 to score goal after goal.
• More marking options

Midfield

• Tackles need to stick
• Two way running needs to improve
• A competent ruckman that can be a contributing member of the team for at least the finals
• Help for Joel - I hope Caddy uses the SF as ammunition for a big 2015, Bundy gets a full preseason and can stay in the side, GHS, Cam and Murdoch work on their fitness so they can stay in the game for longer, Mitch takes on more on field leadership responsibilities etc.
• Jansen and Hartman getting seniors time - I like the cut of their jib, so to speak
• Better bloody entries into the forward line

Defence

• Leg speed
• Youth/succession planning. At the moment I think it could be Boris-Cam G, Mackie-Thurlow, Rivers-JK??? Need more obvious replacements for Doms and HT, we have Brown, Hamling etc but they seem more Mackie-like, from what I've read
• Bews to stay the side not because he needs game time but because we desperately need a small defender. I guess the limiting factor is his form and whether he deserves a spot in the 22 over others playing better
• Improved kicking skills, esp on kick ins

Excellent summary, Moneypenny!!! You have it all there- now please email that to C Scott!

 

[thejester]

Which way do we go?

If we land Frawley I think we definitely go for a midfielder with the first pick. If not, I'd still be inclined to pick a midfielder. As CS sort of alluded to at the last presser and has through the year, they've transitioned to a first choice midfield of Selwood/Caddy/GHS/Guthrie with Duncan, Stokes and Motlop on the outside. GHS and Guthrie look like they ran out of puff by the end but I'm confident they'll be better next year. But you need depth in midfield and if we're in a position in a few years where we can push Guthrie back onto half back (and even Selwood forward for periods - how long is he going to hold up?) thanks to the emergence of Hartman, Lang, Jansen and whoever we take early then we'd look a lot more competitive.

 

[Supercats]

What are peoples feelings now that the dust has settled a little from the Semi-Final?

Having viewed the prelims, I think we are further away from being a legitimate challenger than I thought last week. Aside from an ageing backline which will largely need replacing over the next couple of years, I think our midfield really lacks class. I'd say that Selwood, Caddy (based on his finals performances), Motlop (based on what we know he can put out when fit) and Duncan are currently our only top quality mids that we have to work with that are likely to be hopefully be around for another crack at a flag. Guthrie could and probably should make it but I tend to think he may be better suited to a move back into defence where he performed so well last year.

We really need to either land a gun FA in the midfield like Dangerfield and/or hope to develop via the draft another 2-3 players that can be elite. That can take a little time or we could be lucky like Port and draft a Wines/Wingard over a couple of years. Having access to earlier picks clearly helped in this regard.

What do you do first? Do you hopefully land Frawley and then target the best mid in the draft with our first pick? Or do you continue to rebuild our defence knowing that we will lose both Lonergan, Rivers and Mackie in the next year or so and take someone like Goddard or Marchbank if they are available? There used to be an adage in football that successful teams are built from the defence. If that still holds then you would look at tall defenders. But I'm not so sure that necessarily applies these days - the best teams I believe have the deepest midfields. Perhaps we should contiunue to draft elite, young mids and use our latter picks to take talls?

What we do know is that with our first pick likely to now be around 14, we will have access to a very good kid, either tall or mid.

Which way do we go?

You forgetting Bundy, I would place him as our second best mid, only behind selwood. He was a huge loss this year for us. Hopefully he comes back bigger and better next year. He will be elite if he comes back from his back issues.

 

[year of the cat]

If we land Frawley I think we definitely go for a midfielder with the first pick. If not, I'd still be inclined to pick a midfielder. As CS sort of alluded to at the last presser and has through the year, they've transitioned to a first choice midfield of Selwood/Caddy/GHS/Guthrie with Duncan, Stokes and Motlop on the outside. GHS and Guthrie look like they ran out of puff by the end but I'm confident they'll be better next year. But you need depth in midfield and if we're in a position in a few years where we can push Guthrie back onto half back (and even Selwood forward for periods - how long is he going to hold up?) thanks to the emergence of Hartman, Lang, Jansen and whoever we take early then we'd look a lot more competitive.

I'm thinking that if Freo lands Frawley then they're unlikely to draft Goddard with their first pick in the ND. Similarly, we won't either if we grab Frawley. So my strategy really would depend on whether we get him or not.

We get Frawley: I'd take the best rated mid from the draft. I'm leaning towards Weller. Looks like he has class in spades. But he is a couple of years away from having an AFL ready body.

We don't get Frawley: I'd take Goddard if he's free - with JK we would have 2/3 tall back positions covered with a bit of luck for the next 10 years. I'd love to trade into a pick in the early 20's to grab another highly rated mid but I reckon we still should be able to grab a handy one with our second pick.

You forgetting Bundy, I would place him as our second best mid, only behind selwood. He was a huge loss this year for us. Hopefully he comes back bigger and better next year. He will be elite if he comes back from his back issues.

Yes, knew I'd forget one. Christensen was a massive loss for us at the end of the year and definitely one we need fit and firing next year.

 

[thejester]

Sre you

Can't say I'd thought of it that way

 

[year of the cat]

Can't say I'd thought of it that way

Don't you hate it when you're half way through editing a mistake but someone has beaten you to the punch! It was probably more profound before the edit anyway...

 

[Turbocat]

kelly plays as a mid / sub
enright has 8 weeks off, mackie has 6 weeks off

What , do you think Boris will be injured. If he is fit they will play him to the 300.

I do agree on the mongrel element but we lack classy speed as well.

I guess what we really must do is have an honest assessment of what we think we can do with the players we will have. I have a feeling they will try to prep for one more run at it with the mature group , and if we fall short again there will be a big changeover. We need to add a ruck of some sort , add extra depth in the midfield and small that can add scorboard pressure. It was obvious to most of us 12 month ago , that we would only win it if most things went our way , and when it hasn't , we have fallen short.

My gut feel is we a short of top end talent , how we add it add how quick is the question.

 

[BigCat1]

VFL GF. Young Tom Campbell is belting Lowden at the minute. Gives plenty around the ground as well. Good set of hands.Liam Jones looking very mobile. He'd be decent across half forward with Kersten with Hawkins deep. Strikes be as a really good second forward. Could get him for the right price.

 

[Whit3y]

VFL GF. Young Tom Campbell is belting Lowden at the minute. Gives plenty around the ground as well. Good set of hands.Liam Jones looking very mobile. He'd be decent across half forward with Kersten with Hawkins deep. Strikes be as a really good second forward. Could get him for the right price.

wasnt lowden the man to solve all of our problems?

 

[_Me_]

wasnt lowden the man to solve all of our problems?

Low den looks ok

 

[Art Vandelay_]

wasnt lowden the man to solve all of our problems?

I'm conscious not to answer a question with a question. So if you could elaborate on the point you are trying to make with your post it would be appreciated.