Is there another team with a worse recent first round draft history than the Swans?

[Doss]

Having Ryder as a flat out 'no' is absolutely laughable. 50/50 I could at least understand.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

Having Ryder as a flat out 'no' is absolutely laughable. 50/50 I could at least understand.

I would of thought he would be considered a win or am i overrating Ryder?

 

[Doss]

I would of thought he would be considered a win or am i overrating Ryder?

I would rate him a win personally.

But, he can be inconsistent so I can at least understand how some could argue for a 50/50 rating. 'No' on the other hand- que?

 

[Donakebab]

Let me try...

I'm not sure you understand the concept of the thread. For your own team you're naming trades and late picks, which is completely irrelevant, then for Essendon you're naming second+ picks and making judgments about players you've never seen in your life.

Try again.

 

[Donakebab]

I would rate him a win personally.

But, he can be inconsistent so I can at least understand how some could argue for a 50/50 rating. 'No' on the other hand- que?

150 games, comfortably in our best 22 and still only 26 years old. Definitely a win.

 

[Crafted]

It isn't too early, I can already tell you, that kid is a star.
It is a disservice to Salem to mention him in the same sentence as Toumpas.
Salem has a very big future in the AFL, Toumpas doesn't.

Trust me, nothing is certain when you're at the Melbourne Football Club, although he does look like a gun from what he's done in the VFL. 34 touches with a miracle goal from what I heard.

 

[Doss]

Very early to be writing off Toumpas.

 

[Crafted]

Very early to be writing off Toumpas.

I'm not but I'm definitely disappointed with what I've seen. Wines and Macrae already playing like superstars doesn't help his cause either.

 

[bulldoggies]

Bulldogs- Tim Walsh, Jordan McMahon, Sam Power, Ayce Cordy, Andrejs Everitt

 

[Bard]

I'm not but I'm definitely disappointed with what I've seen. Wines and Macrae already playing like superstars doesn't help his cause either.

Wines and Macrae are playing with good support. The Bulldog's might not be far ahead of Melbourne in terms of ability (both are comfortably bottom 6 you'd assume) but they have an experienced midfield to play and learn off. Not much needs to be said about Port Adelaide's midfield. Melbourne's on the other hand? Who will be supporting Toumpas and who does he have to learn off other than Jones? That's half of the clubs problem...

 

[sammy_mac]

2002: the infamous Carey trade that saw us ship #2 and #18 to get him after we got them from Richmond for Kane Johnson
2003: #14 Fergus Watts traded after two years for "homesickness", died in the arse at the Saints
2004: #8 John Meesen traded after like two games in four years, traded pick became Myke Cook (who was a dud)
2005: #16 Richard Douglas , #17 Darren Pfeiffer Pfeiffer has been on three or four lists by now and I think was delisted by Port
2006: #14 James Sellar
2007: #10 Patrick Dangerfield
2008: #10 Phil Davis chased GWS' money, injury prone but has the talent to be a premier CHB, compo pick eventually became Brad Crouch and Luke Brown
2009: #13 Daniel Talia won the Rising Star
2010: #14 Brodie Smith
2011: #27 Sam Kerridge
2012: :v
2013: #23 Matt Crouch, off to a good start

First half is diabolical and littered with shocking picks in the early rounds. We also traded a bit and picked up some fairly serviceable players in that period like Scott Stevens, and had decent luck with later picks as well. Pretty good run in the second half of the last decade of drafting, thanks for letting Vlad force Rendell out Triggy! He found some gems in the later rounds ie. Sloane. You can't really complain too much as a Crows fans with our drafting.

 

[Freomaniac]

For first round picks Freo would be up there lucky they have made up for it through later picks and rookie draft.

2006 - Pick 8 traded for Tarrant (went back to Collingwood),
2007 - Pick 7 Palmer (one decent season, traded to GWS)
2008 - Pick 3 Hill
2009 - Pick 4 Morabito (3 knee recons)
2010 - Pick 20 Pitt (retired)
2011 - Pick 16 Sheridan
2012 - Pick 17 Simpson (already questions about commitment)
2013 - Pick 17 Apeness

Hill the only regular top 22 player.

Im glad you brough this up...

2006 - Pick 8 traded for Tarrant (went back to Collingwood)
Freo traded Tarrant and I think pick 43 for 2 picks in the 43 and 55 which turned out to be Michie and Mellington

2007 - Pick 7 Palmer (one decent season, traded to GWS)
That GWS compo pick was traded back for pick 20 which turned out to be Hayden Crozier.

2008 - Pick 3 Hill
Good player.

2009 - Pick 4 Morabito (3 knee recons)
Like Palmer, had a good 1st season and has struggled ever since.

2010 - Pick 20 Pitt (retired)
Bad luck for freo on that one. Guy sadly retired with a heart condition.

2011 - Pick 16 Sheridan
Solid guy and Fringe 22 player.

2012 - Pick 17 Simpson (already questions about commitment)
Promising player

2013 - Pick 17 Apeness
Think of him as a Kurt Tippet type player. Ruckman/Half forward.

Fortunately Freo have made up with some of these with getting at least 1 decent player in the rookie list like Spurr, Duffield, Deboer, Barlow and Clancee Pearce etc.

 

[Magma]

2001 - reilly

2002 - traded for wayne carey

2003 - fergus watts

2004 - john meesen

2005 - richie douglas darren pfieffer

2006 - james sellar

2007 - dangerfield

2008 - phil davis

2009 - daniel talia

2010 - brodie smith

2011 - brad crouch (through mini draft)

2012 -

2013 - didn't have one.

really did well 2007 onwards after some shockers before. davis would be if he stayed.

 

[etsal1]

Carlton have no young talent apparently, so it has to be Carlton.

 

[Air_Chester]

I'm not but I'm definitely disappointed with what I've seen. Wines and Macrae already playing like superstars doesn't help his cause either.

He's only been there one season. You can't judge a 19 year old kid based off how good a couple of other 19 year olds are, you have to let him mature and judge him on his merits.

 

[Schulzenfest]

You want to see how much difference good first round drafting makes, just look at Port.

2006: Travis Boak (5): Captain, All-Australian, reliably steps up in big moment after big moment. Huge win.
2007: Matthew Lobbe (16): Took his time coming on but has been carrying our ruck division single-handedly for 12 months and hanging with the best rucks in the competition. Win.
2008: Hamish Hartlett (4): Still struggles with tags occasionally but for the most part is an incredibly damaging player. Win.
2009: John Butcher (8), Andrew Moore (9), Jasper Pittard (16). Jury still out on all of these three, but too early to call any of them a bust at this stage. N/A.
2010: Ben Jacobs (16): Massive spud, although at least he's provided us with lols by stinking it up at North Melbourne. Loss (but we made up for it in 2013).
2011: Chad Wingard (6): All-Australian in his second year, 'nuff said. Huge win.
2012: Ollie Wines (7): Far better than a 19 year old has any right to be. Huge win.
2013: Jared Polec & Jarman Impey (14): Too early to call Impey, although he's showing signs, but Impey could retire tomorrow and we'd still be coming out ahead because Polec is already killing it and made up for the fact that we took Jacobs in his draft. Win, could be a huge win if Impey develops as hoped.

And we've traded in Brad Ebert (13), Jay Schulz (12) and Angus Monfries (12) for late picks. With a few notable exceptions (Gray, Westhoff, Trengove, Carlile, Jonas, Broadbent) this is the group of players which is largely responsible for our rapid rise up the ladder.

People constantly complain about this only happening as a 'reward' for being s**t. Well, the highest draft pick in that group of players is 4. Carlton have Murphy (1), Gibbs (1), Kreuzer (1), Walker (2), Thomas (2) and Judd (3) on their list. Melbourne have Hogan (mini-draft), Watts (1), Trengove (2), Tyson (3) and Toumpas (4), and they wasted picks on Scully (1) and Morton (4). Those two sides are bottom 4. We're not just here because we were down the bottom. We're here because we drafted and traded excellently.

 

[MightyPies1]

Carlton have no young talent apparently, so it has to be Carlton.

I'll help you out.

2003: Walker (2) Weak draft and this is a win.
2004: Russell (10) Loss
2005: Murphy (1) Kennedy (4) Win and Win although see 2007.
2006: Gibbs (1) Hampson (17) Grigg (19) Gibbs has been good but there were better players. Hampson and Grigg are fails. I'd say disappointing and a loss.
2007: Kreuzer (1) pick (3) and pick (4 - Kennedy) in the 2005 draft traded for Judd. Massive fail
2008: Yarran (6) Jury is out but the jury is in with others that went after him. Looks like a loss. Traded a number of picks for Warnock.
2009: Lucas (12) Fail although were massive winners in the Fevola trade. Traded pick 11 for Mclean.
2010: Watson (18) Fail
2011: Bootsma (22) Fail
2012: Menzel (11) Jury is out.
2013: Cripps (13) Jury is out.

 

[Kickit2brown]

It's a pretty bad record. It does show how important drafting your 2nd/3rd round picks are combined with good trading.

I always felt the fan/media hype around Carlton for a number of years was based around their no 1 picks when it was obvious their mid table picks had been poor. If they had picked up a few gems in the middle there they could have had a great young list. Just needed to pick a few diamonds in the rough, it seems like they went all out on nailing their 1st rounder without giving enough regard to the rest of the list.

Probably doesn't matter where you get your good players from, as long as you are getting a couple each year and developing them well.

 

[blaze036]

Collingwood's has been very good IMO under Derek Hine.

2005 Dale Thomas (2) Scott Pendlebury (5) Massive Win

2006 Ben Reid (8) Nathan Brown (10) Massive Win

2007 Traded first rounder for Wood, Jon McCarthy (31) Loss.

2008 Steele Sidebottom (11) Win.

2009 Traded first and third rounder for Jolly Luke Ball (30) Ben Sinclair (62) Josh Thomas (75) Won the flag massive win.

2010 Alex Fasolo (45) As good as many top ten picks, has all the attributes of an A grader Win. Trading for Krak and Ceglar with pick 25 was a loss though.

2011 Elliott and Clarke traded for pick (25) Then Jackson Paine at pick 50. I'd say a win based on Elliott at 25.

2012 Brodie Grundy (18) Massive win it seems.

2013 Matthew Scharenberg (6) Have to wait for him to get on the park but it seems like he is a certainty to make it based on his junior footy.

Going pretty well if you ask me,

You left out Freeman

 

[yodellinhank]

Lot of teams making claims for poor drafting, says a bit about the quality of recent drafts for mine and why the status quo has remained.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Richmond and Collingwood generally nail their first rounders every year.

Richard Tambling
Danny Meyer
Jarrad Oakley-Nichols

Aaron Fiora, for a blast from the past.

 

[MiloStedman]

I think every club has been guilty of stuffing up first round picks .in fairness there is not a science to it. Most of it comes down to luck.

99% of people who get drafted can play. Having played fairly high junior footy , you see guys that make it to afl and they are clearly better than everyone else on the park . But that's is against kids their own age. Once they are drafted, it is a whole new ball game.

You really can't tell if a player has the drive to succeed at the highest level. You have no idea what sort of mentality they have. Some players can out get their head around the fact that natural talent will not get you far in the afl without hard work. That's why you see guys picked up late in the draft exceed the output of more talented high picks.

For some people it all clicks together once they get to the top level, other not so much. Obviously you need talent to make it, but the type of person You bring to the club outweighs talent

The way you develop them is big news too. Culture is nearly everything for these young kids. It's no mistake certain clubs seem to keep having their draft picks not turn out.

 

[PumpyChowdown]

I recently went through all clubs draft selections from 2004 - 2010 excluding father/sons and I was really surprised at how poor Sydney's drafting was. Just about the worst along with Melbourne and St. Kilda.

Sydney's success is mostly from great trading. Also, when they get a draft pick right, they get it really right.

Another interesting team is Freo who have totally blown a lot of drafts, however they absolutely nailed the 2008 draft and that is essentially the core of their current team, so it goes to show you only need one or two good years to build a quality squad.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

Lot of teams making claims for poor drafting, says a bit about the quality of recent drafts for mine and why the status quo has remained.

Yep, and further proof that the talent is spread way too thin. Too many players being drafted who are simply not good enough.

 

[Pykie]

2008: Jack Ziebell #9
2009: Ben Cunnington #5
2010: Shaun Atley #17
2011: Brad McKenzie #18
2012: Taylor Garner #15
2013: Luke McDonald #8

Bryce Lewis has had 6 drafts since taking over from Neville Stibbard, he's done a pretty solid job so far, without having any really high picks, Cunnington being the highest one, and that definitely looks like a win at this stage. Garner has been injured but would of featured alot more, and I definitely have more confidence in him making it than McKenzie, long term. Ziebell, Atley, Cunnington and McDonald look like 200 gamers, 4/6 is a pretty good return imo for those picks.