Luke Hodge v Chris Judd

[Mateyman]

ITT Hodge>Judd due to the performances of the people around him

 

[MinerBoy]

chris judd as a player by a huge amount, hodge is great at playing against no direct opponent

Lol

 

[MinerBoy]

Judd isn't really a leader at heart. He was pressured into captaincy roles. Its a ridiculous poll if you are comparing skill levels.

Well if we're comparing skill levels Hodge wins easily but as players, Judd has had the slightly better individual playing career.

Who really cares though? Hawks love Hodge and wouldn't trade him for anyone. Anyone who doubts he's an all time great is just delusional.

 

[Bardo State]

What are we comparing here? Who we'd have in our team now? Who would we rather have in our team with respect to their whole careers? In their prime? Who we'd draft as 18 year olds?

 

[EagleCanival]

Well if we're comparing skill levels Hodge wins easily but as players, Judd has had the slightly better individual playing career.

Who really cares though? Hawks love Hodge and wouldn't trade him for anyone. Anyone who doubts he's an all time great is just delusional.

Please put the bias aside. Hodge has obviously had greater team success but if you are talking simply on their playing career it's really not close. Just taking a glance at their individual awards will solidify this.

Hodge- 2 time Norm Smith medallist
3 Time All Australian
2 Time Best and Fairest Winner

Judd- 2 time Brownlow medallist
2 time AFLPA MVP
6 time All Australian
Norm Smith Medalist

 

[MinerBoy]

Please put the bias aside. Hodge has obviously had greater team success but if you are talking simply on their playing career it's really not close. Just taking a glance at their individual awards will solidify this.

Hodge- 2 time Norm Smith medallist
3 Time All Australian
2 Time Best and Fairest Winner

Judd- 2 time Brownlow medallist
2 time AFLPA MVP
6 time All Australian
Norm Smith Medalist

Add AA captain to Hodge too. No matter how good Judds record is, hodges record is that good that he's not a long way behind anyone.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Judd's second Brownlow was a farce.

How he wasn't suspended for his dirty elbow on Pavlich's face, when Pav was under him on the ground and couldn't protect himself was simply unbelievable.

But it's OK, it wasn't forceful contact............... It only meant he required 6 stitches is all, no biggy.

 

[Vindicater]

What are we comparing here? Who we'd have in our team now? Who would we rather have in our team with respect to their whole careers? In their prime? Who we'd draft as 18 year olds?

The answer to all those questions is Judd.

Hodge is a very good player and damn fine captain. However Judd's best is amongst the best the sport has ever seen. Hodge at his very best did not measure up to Judd's 4th or 5th best season.

 

[EagleCanival]

Add AA captain to Hodge too. No matter how good Judds record is, hodges record is that good that he's not a long way behind anyone.

If you want to include All Australian Captaincies then Judd was in 2008. I'm not denying Hodges record is good, it is. But Judds is great, and Hodges is well and truly behind.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Forget about Brownlows, MVP's, AA's. Clubs pick players on the belief that they'll help them win flags.

You'd pick the bloke who was to lead your club to 3 flags and play over 250 games, I reckon.

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Judd- 5 X best and fairest, 6 X All Australian, 2 X Brownlow medalist and Norm Smith medalist.
Hodge - 3 X best and fairest, 3 X All Australian, 2 X Norm Smith medalist.
Judd > Hodge.

 

[Jugada]

Forget about Brownlows, MVP's, AA's. Clubs pick players on the belief that they'll help them win flags.

You'd pick the bloke who was to lead your club to 3 flags and play over 250 games, I reckon.

So forget about the players and base your opinion on the other good players around them? Lol

But pretty much the best argument a Hodge voter could come up with I guess

 

[Vindicater]

Forget about Brownlows, MVP's, AA's. Clubs pick players on the belief that they'll help them win flags.

You'd pick the bloke who was to lead your club to 3 flags and play over 250 games, I reckon.

Oh please

Compare the teammates both guys have had in their careers, not to mention who has been their coach.

If you had to make a team from scratch to win a flag and you had the choice of Judd or Hodge you would take Judd every day of the week.

 

[MinerBoy]

Oh please

Compare the teammates both guys have had in their careers, not to mention who has been their coach.

If you had to make a team from scratch to win a flag and you had the choice of Judd or Hodge you would take Judd every day of the week.

Cousins, Kerr, Cox.........to name a few from WCE (not so much Carlton)

Malthouse, Worsfold......

Champion players. Premiership coaches.

Judd hit his straps earlier and his best was great. Hodge had injuries early so took longer to get going but is reaping the benefits of that now as Judd is now struggling with his body.

No point saying Hodge has played with better players though. Hodge had injuries and poor teams in his early career and less injuries and a better team later. Judd had a gun team and no injuries early but has struggled with both later. Overall they've both had their share of injuries, good teams and poor teams.

Judd has been better as the individual player but as I've already said Hodge is in the upper echelon of players to have played the game since he has been involved at AFL level.

So sure, take Judd, but no one (perhaps GAJ) is as far in front of Hodge as a player as some in here would like to believe.

 

[Mateyman]

I would take Nick Maxwell before Robert Harvey because he captained a Premiership and played in a lot of games, and played quite well in big games
/Hodge supporter logic

 

[MinerBoy]

I would take Nick Maxwell before Robert Harvey because he captained a Premiership and played in a lot of games, and played quite well in big games
/Hodge supporter logic

That's just a petulant way to respond to people with different opinions to you.

You'd think Hodge was lucky to play 50 VFL games the way that post reads. You know, he really is quite good. Some might say an absolute champion. You know, with all those awards that recognise how well he's played....

AAs, B&Fs, NORM SMITHS.

But yeah, it's like comparing Maxwell to Harvey.

 

[Vindicater]

That's just a petulant way to respond to people with different opinions to you.

You'd think Hodge was lucky to play 50 VFL games the way that post reads. You know, he really is quite good. Some might say an absolute champion. You know, with all those awards that recognise how well he's played....

AAs, B&Fs, NORM SMITHS.

But yeah, it's like comparing Maxwell to Harvey.

You can't find a comparison that works. The poster's above is horrible.

What you can do though is look at the individual accolades of the two players and see that coaches, players and umpires all feel that Judd has been better than Hodge over the journey.

You say that the people saying Judd is better treat Hodge like he is a 50 game VFL player. That is not it at all.

Hodge is a 250 game star of the competition. He is a brilliant leader and a big game player.

However...

Judd is a 250 game superstar of the competition who at one point in his career was the undisputed best player in the land and was also a good captain (though not the leader Hodge is)

Hodge is a great player who raises his level to elite when the game counts.
Judd is an elite player who maintains that level when the game counts.

 

[Vindicater]

On a side note.

Judd at his very best was a freak. In my 25 years of watching football I have never seen a guy who bursts from packs as hard as he did. His leg speed and torso strength were out of this world.

 

[MinerBoy]

You say that the people saying Judd is better treat Hodge like he is a 50 game VFL player. That is not it at all..

Nope, I didn't say that. I said Mateyman's specific post reads like that.

Re-read my posts. I've clearly said, more than once, that Judd's individual career has been better - as evidenced by his accolades. What I've also said though is that Hodge's individual career also puts him in the absolute upper echelon of players of his era and thus no one, outside of perhaps GAJ, has been as far in front of Hodge as some are trying to make out here.

As for Hawthorn supporters, and many others too who value the entire package that is Hodge, we still wouldn't pick differently if we had the choice again knowing full well how good each player would be.

 

[Mateyman]

That's just a petulant way to respond to people with different opinions to you.

You'd think Hodge was lucky to play 50 VFL games the way that post reads. You know, he really is quite good. Some might say an absolute champion. You know, with all those awards that recognise how well he's played....

AAs, B&Fs, NORM SMITHS.

But yeah, it's like comparing Maxwell to Harvey.

The point I'm making is that team success has nothing to do with a player's ability. Norm Smiths=Big game performance=factor to be considered
Premierships won by 21 other players = irrelevant
Hodge is a great player and clearly rises to the occasion in big games. Judd doesn't/didn't need to as he was probably the no. 1 player in the AFL for an extended period there before GAJ really emerged. I just don't see how you could rate Hodge above Judd if you're not including Premierships, which are irrelevant for an individual rating.

 

[Vindicater]

As for Hawthorn supporters, and many others too who value the entire package that is Hodge, we still wouldn't pick differently if we had the choice again knowing full well how good each player would be.

Fair enough, it has worked out well for you. Hodge fit the mold your coach put around him and you have gone on to great success with that. I don't think West Coast would change their draft either because Judd helped them win a flag too.

Here is another question then.

Knowing what you know about both players and the skills they bring to the table.

If you were St Kilda and both guys were in the draft this year.

Who would you take?

 

[MinerBoy]

Knowing what you know about both players and the skills they bring to the table.

If you were St Kilda and both guys were in the draft this year.

Who would you take?

If I was St.Kilda I might answer differently but I'm not so having said what I said in my last post my answer doesn't change. I'm sure Saints supporters would vote in large %s for Judd though and I fully understand their choice. However, I'm also sure there would be enough supporters from every fan base who would still select Hodge.

What isn't disputable is that Ball would not get selected in the top 2 if the top 3 were re-selected.

 

[Engimal]

Judd has been a lot better than Hodge in terms of skill. May as well be comparing Ablett Jnr to me if you're going to make such comparisons.

 

[MinerBoy]

Judd has been a lot better than Hodge in terms of skill. May as well be comparing Ablett Jnr to me if you're going to make such comparisons.

Judd has been the better player but your wording is wrong. Hodge has him for skill. Much better user of the footy. Judd more dynamic with his running and ability to burst from congestion.

 

[Unfinished]

How is Hodge even close in this poll? I mean really, he's a good big game performer, but so is Judd. One was in the conversation as being the best in the AFL for about 5 years, the other has probably never been in the top 10-20 players in the game. As players, don't understand how you wouldn't choose Judd (and I dislike Judd).

You have been sprouting around lately about how Hodge has 'probably never been in the top 10-20 players in the game.'

Just interested to hear if you've been watching footy for that long? Hodge was a top 10 player in the game from 2007-10, and in 2010 was one of the best players in the AFL, (top 5 at least that year) it's a real shame his 2009 was crippled by injury because i personally believe that could have almost been his best year if fit (personally not team wise as Hawthorn were wrecked with injury just like Hodgey)

But overall your claim about Hodge never being in the top 10-20 players in the game is quite frankly laughable.