Preview Round 6: Collingwood vs Essendon - Anzac Day Clash - Tuesday 25th April 3:20pm - Preview, Changes and Thoughts

[boncer34]

Nothing wrong with having our youth develop in the VFL, you only have to look at Van Rooyen at Melbourne who finally got his chance and looks to be grasping it.

The difference is that the good sides have really strong VFL programs to allow that kind of development and it looks like we’re finally catching on to that.

Been calling for Jones to go back for a couple of weeks now. His development gets stalled if he keeps playing AFL without getting his hands on the pill.

We also bought in Davey with (presumably) another youngster in Caldwell to take Zerrett's midfield minutes.

 

[Megabattimus]

Nothing wrong with having our youth develop in the VFL, you only have to look at Van Rooyen at Melbourne who finally got his chance and looks to be grasping it.

The difference is that the good sides have really strong VFL programs to allow that kind of development and it looks like we’re finally catching on to that.

Yeah exactly.

While I did enjoy us playing Cox and Jones pretty much all season in 2021, I do wonder if it hurt 'em in the long run. Particularly with Cox having a bad run with injuries post that season. If we had started investing in our VFL team back then, they probably could've got cycled through and less worn down.

 

[Petrify]

At least Scotts selection policy is clear. Let players have a run at it at AFL level and don't bounce them out. Davey didn't get dropped, he was injured so him getting his spot back is justified.

Its unfortunate for Hobbs but that our list is so healthy in the mids right now but he will get his chance soon.

 

[Megabattimus]

Davey wasn't injured, they just rested him a week.

 

[Albertross]

Nothing wrong with having our youth develop in the VFL, you only have to look at Van Rooyen at Melbourne who finally got his chance and looks to be grasping it.

The difference is that the good sides have really strong VFL programs to allow that kind of development and it looks like we’re finally catching on to that.

We finished 4th at the end of 2019 in the VFL. It was a false dawn, COVID or not, the AFL team were nowhere near it.

We feel that we have depth this year, and I think we do in certain areas, but it depends on what players miss out on playing VFL as to how well they do.

Hobbs, Hind, Tippa, Mass all held over this weekend. It can make a difference between a win and a loss. Add in that Jones didn't play AFL nor VFL.

Having depth does not always equate to VFL ladder position, see above. So as good as it looks online, I don't necessarily think one correlates to the other, it goes beyond that.

To put it in focus, Geelong won the AFL last year, yet finished 14th in the VFL, only ahead of us by 1%, who finished 15th.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Based on what though? Not picking Hobbs?

That we are really only running with Menzie and Davey as rawish prospects that you might not be confident in executing their role every week. Which is a similar amount to recent flag teams and certainly a lot of competitive finalists over recent times.

 

[andleanback]

Based on what though? Not picking Hobbs?

Yes by picking an even younger player in Davey. Apparently not playing young talent though

 

[andleanback]

We finished 4th at the end of 2019 in the VFL. It was a false dawn, COVID or not, the AFL team were nowhere near it.

We feel that we have depth this year, and I think we do in certain areas, but it depends on what players miss out on playing VFL as to how well they do.

Hobbs, Hind, Tippa, Mass all held over this weekend. It can make a difference between a win and a loss. Add in that Jones didn't play AFL nor VFL.

Having depth does not always equate to VFL ladder position, see above. So as good as it looks online, I don't necessarily think one correlates to the other, it goes beyond that.

To put it in focus, Geelong won the AFL last year, yet finished 14th in the VFL, only ahead of us by 1%, who finished 15th.

It depends who you’ve got performing for you in the vfl. If you’ve got a bunch of good young kids 23 and under pushing your vfl side up the ladder you’re in a good spot. If you’ve got a bunch of mature list cloggers who aren’t good enough for an afl game but go back to vfl and dominate it can be a false economy.

 

[Megabattimus]

That we are really only running with Menzie and Davey as rawish prospects that you might not be confident in executing their role every week. Which is a similar amount to recent flag teams and certainly a lot of competitive finalists over recent times.

That number will increase when guys like Hayes, Montgomerie, Bryan, Hobbs, Reid and potentially Voss and Lord (though I have no clue where he fits into our team after McGrath's successful move to the backline) get more VFL games under their belt. Add in Tsastas, Cox and Guelfi when they recover from injury and are also able to start playing VFL, and suddenly we've got a lot more young guys cycling through the team.

 

[andleanback]

Been calling for Jones to go back for a couple of weeks now. His development gets stalled if he keeps playing AFL without getting his hands on the pill.

We also bought in Davey with (presumably) another youngster in Caldwell to take Zerrett's midfield minutes.

At the same time young key forwards should be given a chance as long as they’re competing and bringing the ball to ground as a starting point. Last week JVR had 7 touches and didn’t take a mark, at 3qt he would’ve been close to being subbed out after having not much impact. Then bang, changes a game in 1 qtr.

 

[andleanback]

That we are really only running with Menzie and Davey as rawish prospects that you might not be confident in executing their role every week. Which is a similar amount to recent flag teams and certainly a lot of competitive finalists over recent times.

It doesn’t help when 3 of your top 10 picks are on the injury list. Kinda skewers what’s available to you. If the team is winning games you aren’t just going to make changes for the sake of it, it’s hard to get a spot in a side that is winning. We’ll got through stages this year when we lose a few in a row and changes will come, heck that could be the situation in the next month.

Jones is a raw prospect and was getting games. Massimo has got games. Martin, Durham, bzt are still relatively raw. Perkins is only in his 3rd season. Davey and menzie that you mentioned. Not sure what else you want, yes hobbs could’ve played but that takes out Davey who is another young kid, so doesn’t really change the amount of kids running out there tomorrow.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

It doesn’t help when 3 of your top 10 picks are on the injury list. Kinda skewers what’s available to you. If the team is winning games you aren’t just going to make changes for the sake of it, it’s hard to get a spot in a side that is winning. We’ll got through stages this year when we lose a few in a row and changes will come, heck that could be the situation in the next month.

Jones is a raw prospect and was getting games. Massimo has got games. Martin, Durham, bzt are still relatively raw. Perkins is only in his 3rd season. Davey and menzie that you mentioned. Not sure what else you want, yes hobbs could’ve played but that takes out Davey who is another young kid, so doesn’t really change the amount of kids running out there tomorrow.

I don't want us to change selection policy, I don't understand why we are referring to our team as a young or developing one when we are selecting every single fit senior player and not sacrificing a single spot for development purposes. Why we are creating pre-emptive excuses for performance that doesn't reflect the state of the side?

 

[Call Me Cake]

Bit of a stretch to shift away from the developing tag just because we've won a few - considering we've got Perko, Caldwell, Jones, A.Davey, Durham and Martin working to keep the engine running.

Then you've got players we envision as future position owners in Reid, Cox, Tsatas, Hobbs and J.Davey on the sidelines.

To usher them in for the next 7+ years you've got those in the blooming 24/25 mark in McGrath, Draper, Zerk, Parish, Weideman, Ridley, Setterfield, Redman, Guelfi and Snelling - all of whom are yet to hit their premier stride.

21 of the senior list right there - 52% of that being under 22.

Wright, Langford and Merrett in the 26/27 bracket forming as the glue.

No matter how many games we win this year, the fact of the matter is, we must be self-aware and realize how fresh and raw our ideal core really is and keep that in perspective to whatever comes our way.

 

[andleanback]

I don't want us to change selection policy, I don't understand why we are referring to our team as a young or developing one when we are selecting every single fit senior player and not sacrificing a single spot for development purposes. Why we are creating pre-emptive excuses for performance that doesn't reflect the state of the side?

Is Davey and menzie not a spot for developing purposes?
Are Durham and Martin not for developing purposes both playing crucial wing roles
Is bzt not for developing purposes playing as our key back
Is Jones not for developing purposes being given games sometimes as our only key tall
Is Perkins not developing with the games he’s playing?

Meanwhile tsatas, Cox and Reid have all been on the injury list, they would be selection frame if fit, most within the club thought tsatas would’ve played r1 if he didn’t get injured. Bryan has also been injured, so unable to push his case to be our 2nd ruck. Not sure what else you want. Sounds like you’re just having a crack because hobbs didn’t get picked. Our team is one of the youngest and most inexperienced in the comp, plenty of young talent in the side and plenty on the sidelines injured.

 

[jdstorm]

Not hard to figure out caldwell takes merretts spot, Davey takes caldwells spot in the forward line. We want lots of speed for the counter attack which is when collingwood are vulnerable when they push up high and the likes of Daicos don’t defend.

Might be even simpler then that.

Sheil takes Merretts on ball spot and Davey is the next best winger.

 

[ghostdog]

Still unsure about the Weid for Jones swap. Weid is more capable of sticking a mark and having shots on goal, but in the absence of that Jones runs non-stop and wears out a good defender and is more crafty in bringing the ball to ground/passing to advantage. Pros and cons.

Reckon since it isn't wet and they're a little short down back, you'd take the marking/shots option and back in the smaller forwards to make do with what they've got, so can see the rationale behind it. The trick is Weid's following through and making good on his part.

They'll be very wary of Langford after his form so far this year. He's a decent leap, size and tank. Wouldn't surprise me to see him take on Jones' role. He could even alternate with Weid in this.

Off to the dawn service. My daughter is reading poetry today.

 

[boncer34]

That we are really only running with Menzie and Davey as rawish prospects that you might not be confident in executing their role every week. Which is a similar amount to recent flag teams and certainly a lot of competitive finalists over recent times.

Fair enough. I strongly disagree but I see your point.

 

[eth-dog]

Might be even simpler then that.

Sheil takes Merretts on ball spot and Davey is the next best winger.

Except Shiel has been playing on ball all year.

 

[Lore]

Except Shiel has been playing on ball all year.

We’ve had four on-ball plus ruck so it’s possible they all increase their minutes and leave Caldwell and Perkins with negligible opportunities.

Then Hobbs as sub takes almost full time minutes in the last quarter

 

[Bombers36]

They have some serious quality on the field - Sidebum, Elliot, Daicos X 2, DeGoey, Pendles etc… BUT… so do we…!! Parish, McGrath, Stringer, Shiel, Draper…
If Draper & Phillips can dominate rucks and kick another 5 between them then we are a HUUUUGE chance…!! I’m backing big Draper for the Anzac day medal.

 

[raskolnikov]

I just did the ladder predictor and came up with this.



I had us losing today too. So never mind if we lose today. We still finish top 4!

 

[JT_the_Man]

I just did the ladder predictor and came up with this.

View attachment 1669575

I had us losing today too. So never mind if we lose today. We still finish top 4!

I laughed reacted because you have us losing today, not due to the top 4 prediction.

 

[raskolnikov]

I laughed reacted because you have us losing today, not due to the top 4 prediction.

I hope I'm wrong. I would have felt more confident with Zach in our side but Collingwood (and the umpires) always seem to have our measure on Anzac Day.

 

[Kettles]

Have to say with Hobbs not being selected, we have missed out on the grunt he provides in the centre. He was the automatic selection for Merrett based on his VFL form and centre play credentials. In Davey, we have rawness with flair. As our opponent is Collingwood, it’s Hobbs every time for me.

Still hoping for a late change. Hobbs in, Hind Super-Sub.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Is Davey and menzie not a spot for developing purposes?
Are Durham and Martin not for developing purposes both playing crucial wing roles
Is bzt not for developing purposes playing as our key back
Is Jones not for developing purposes being given games sometimes as our only key tall
Is Perkins not developing with the games he’s playing?

Meanwhile tsatas, Cox and Reid have all been on the injury list, they would be selection frame if fit, most within the club thought tsatas would’ve played r1 if he didn’t get injured. Bryan has also been injured, so unable to push his case to be our 2nd ruck. Not sure what else you want. Sounds like you’re just having a crack because hobbs didn’t get picked. Our team is one of the youngest and most inexperienced in the comp, plenty of young talent in the side and plenty on the sidelines injured.

Most of these guys are playing to a better standard currently than previous premiership players. BZT, Perkins, Martin and Durham are at least as good as Sparrow, Townsend, Jackson, Petty, Fletcher Roberts, O'Connor, Cripps, Parfitt, Miers. While they may get better, if these guys played at the exact same level for the next ten years youd say they had good afl careers.

Personally I have Durham and Martin as some of the more influential wingers in the comp right now.

Only Menzie and Davey have significant strides to make in becoming premiership standard.