Unofficial Preview The way too early Round 1, 2015 discussion thread

[Heeney2Franklin]

McVeigh getting dropped for a unproven player is just ludicrous, same with Jones for Bird the coaches brought Bird straight into the side after a PCL which tells how much their value him.

 

[bedford]

Exactly, even I wouldn't drop McVeigh, he just needs to be removed as Captain.Bird should have stayed on in the GF when Jetta finally lost the last bit of his heart muscle

 

[M F JONES]

Take this game as an easy win at your own peril, Hird is a lock in to coach now, you don't think they'll be primed to kick off with a huge start for him!!
Our history in these types of games isn't flash!
On the other hand given the above smack em hard & we can send a very clear message....

 

[bungee]

Bird should have played the entire GF. He's never lacked heart and he's a damn good midfielder who would be a shoe in week in week out for any other team. As much as I like Mitchell I wouldn't swap him for Bird. Craig is still building to the best of his career and will have a blinder this year with an injury free run. More likely the midfield will be shuffled around to allow Macca to play Malceski's role (which he can do well). An injection of a bit more grunt off half back will probably come from Jones who may step up more into Shaw's role. Understudies needed for Goodes, Shaw and Ted this year. Whoever fills those roles well will see a future lock in for best 22. The rest will probably bit play to cover for injuries. The only other 'experiment' is likely to be in the ruck department. Though Mike is a young 30 yrs old he is taking on a huge work load. Whether or not the combination of Reid and Tippet can continue to adequately cover 2nd ruck is a big question.

Just back on Bird, I would have liked to have seen more shut down type players in the GF team. Once the Hawks got their game plan running we just didn't have the personnel to shut it down. We were all about selecting a team to suit our game plan and for the first five minutes we looked like that would be enough. Problem was we didn't have any brakes and when the juggernaut started rolling backwards we had nothing to stop it. I wouldn't be surprised to see Longmire focus on this weakness this year. Good old 'ugly' Swans of old type play incorporated into our team, just in case. Finding that balance will be critical.

 

[Punts]

Mitchell has far more upside than Bird as an inside mid etc imo , there might be a spot there anyway for Mitchell IF Macca goes back but I still think we would have to many of the same type mids with Macca out of there. Think we need some class in that midfield that's were Heeney/Hewett come to mind but have shown nothing at the elite level yet but imo both will.

Bird had an injury free Pre season and best part of the year , Mitchell didn't.

Weather there fighting for the same spot is another thing.

Out of Hanners , JPK , Jack , etc Bird is the I can see making way for Heeney/Hewett if there form warrants it and they are capable of making an impact a the top level .

In saying all the mids should be under pressure

 

[Tuco]

Bird, Hannas and McGlynn getting injured went a long way to ending our season. We just never noticed it at the time. None were the same player upon return.

 

[hairy biker]

Just back on Bird, I would have liked to have seen more shut down type players in the GF team. Once the Hawks got their game plan running we just didn't have the personnel to shut it down. We were all about selecting a team to suit our game plan and for the first five minutes we looked like that would be enough. Problem was we didn't have any brakes and when the juggernaut started rolling backwards we had nothing to stop it. I wouldn't be surprised to see Longmire focus on this weakness this year. Good old 'ugly' Swans of old type play incorporated into our team, just in case. Finding that balance will be critical.

Probably the wrong thread for it, but I believe our problem against Hawthorn is less personnel driven and more an exposure of our tactics.

Very simplistically;
We tend to send more players to and around the contest.
They send fewer players to the contest and have outliers ready to use the ball in space, should Hawthorn win the ball.

We win the ball in congestion and use the ball in close to break away from the contest.
If they win the ball they move it to the outliers who are in more space and under less pressure.
Plus the foot skills of Hawthorn are, in general, superior to ours and they make the point of having their better ball users as the outliers.
It means we have to dominate the stoppages or they can make better use of fewer opportunities.

Teams that beat us generally do so on the spread, because of our focus of men at and around the contest.
It's fine having a tactic that wins us more games than not, but Longmire is a coach that IMO generally seems unable or unwilling to substantially change the game plan during a match.

I'm sure there are probably more, but TBH off the top of my head the Launceston Nick Smith sub game and the 'Dangerfield' game at the SCG were the only times I can recall when we substantially changed tactics at HT, other than Buddy up the ground and Reid loose back.

Given Longmire's win/loss ratio it may seem churlish, but I want more than;

win; "I was happy with our contested effort"
loss "we didn't bring our contested game".

 

[SilentHunter_]

Probably the wrong thread for it, but I believe our problem against Hawthorn is less personnel driven and more an exposure of our tactics.

Very simplistically;
We tend to send more players to and around the contest.
They send fewer players to the contest and have outliers ready to use the ball in space, should Hawthorn win the ball.

We win the ball in congestion and use the ball in close to break away from the contest.
If they win the ball they move it to the outliers who are in more space and under less pressure.
Plus the foot skills of Hawthorn are, in general, superior to ours and they make the point of having their better ball users as the outliers.
It means we have to dominate the stoppages or they can make better use of fewer opportunities.

Teams that beat us generally do so on the spread, because of our focus of men at and around the contest.
It's fine having a tactic that wins us more games than not, but Longmire is a coach that IMO generally seems unable or unwilling to substantially change the game plan during a match.

I'm sure there are probably more, but TBH off the top of my head the Launceston Nick Smith sub game and the 'Dangerfield' game at the SCG were the only times I can recall when we substantially changed tactics at HT, other than Buddy up the ground and Reid loose back.

Given Longmire's win/loss ratio it may seem churlish, but I want more than;

win; "I was happy with our contested effort"
loss "we didn't bring our contested game".

Pretty much, I mean if he just added one more dimension to our game plan, I am pretty confident that we would win 90% of our games.

 

[Number37]

McVeigh getting dropped for a unproven player is just ludicrous, same with Jones for Bird the coaches brought Bird straight into the side after a PCL which tells how much their value him.

We need skilled midfielders to complement JPK and Parker and Mitchell. McVeigh IMO is past it, and Bird is too one paced.
If Heeney, Hewett and Jones get given a go and they are up to it we will be much better than having McVeigh, Bird and McGlynn in the team.
Those 3 kids IMO can provide exactly what the other 3 can with the icing being that they are much more skilled.

Our skills (or lack thereof) will continue to cost us big games if we take the soft option. We have kids in the 2's that have shown enough to get an opportunity. We only need to look at the ROK decision, take out the sentiment and 99.9% of people will agree the right decision was made.

 

[bedford]

Bird, Hannas and McGlynn getting injured went a long way to ending our season. We just never noticed it at the time. None were the same player upon return.

Easy to use that crap

 

[bungee]

We need skilled midfielders to complement JPK and Parker and Mitchell. McVeigh IMO is past it, and Bird is too one paced.
If Heeney, Hewett and Jones get given a go and they are up to it we will be much better than having McVeigh, Bird and McGlynn in the team.
Those 3 kids IMO can provide exactly what the other 3 can with the icing being that they are much more skilled.

Our skills (or lack thereof) will continue to cost us big games if we take the soft option. We have kids in the 2's that have shown enough to get an opportunity. We only need to look at the ROK decision, take out the sentiment and 99.9% of people will agree the right decision was made.

Loony. Utter raving loony. Are you completely mad ? Are you insane ? Have you lost your marbles and replaced them with dogs testicles ? Eaten from the tree of wisdom and vomited it all back up ? Spilt the nectar of wisdom down the front of your trousers ? You demonstrate all the lunkhead wit of a complete and rabid goon.

Happy f..ing big mad, time to head off to the asylum, birthday. Mr Nuts*.

Of all the nimcompooted, lummoxing, clodhopperish gibberish on this board this post takes the cake. Then it ices the cake, fills it with cream (non-dairy), sprinkles it with fairy dust, lights the candles, throws petrol on it, grins hysterically and throws great flaming chunks of it at terrified children while spitting froth through its teeth.

You are a disgrace to your Number 37 guernsey. You should burn it...while still wearing it. ^



^Always be safe with matches. Keep them away from children and loonies.

*Please forward all fan mail (or complaints) to Bedford c/o Swans bored, Bigfooty.

 

[bungee]

Pretty much, I mean if he just added one more dimension to our game plan, I am pretty confident that we would win 90% of our games.

From Rd 5 onwards we pretty much did win 90% of our games

Every year same stuff...Longmire is a goose. Team are has beens, replace them with newbies.

 

[Tuco]

Easy to use that crap

It's not an excuse. There are no excuses. It's just the way things panned out.

 

[Punts]

Well we had our best 22 on GF ( now have lost an All Aus HBF ) and got done by 10 goals and the best Team in the comp have had the wood on us since 2012.

Not major changes but things need to change if we are to challenge simple as that and if it means some minor personal changes so be it.

How much upside is there in Ted 32 number 1 defender , Pyke 31 num 1 ruck , Shaw 33 now with Mal gone is he suppose to be our num 1 rebounder and can Macca go back to the HBF and capture his 2013 form , Goodes 35 who knows.

Things could turn pear shape very quickly if the likes of Ted , Pyke drop off , see ROK. Shaw will be covered.

I would blood as many kids as possible next year IF form warrants it without being stupid and have a red hot crack in 2016 while Buddy/Tippett will be 29 and the some of the young guys have seen some time at AFL level.
The team that ran out on GF I cant see them winning the flag in 2015 that's why I thought I likes of Shaw etc should have pulled the pin , just don't see the advantage of them going around next year and maybe holding back the likes of Jones etc.

 

[gillo94]

Hi Swans fans I couldn't find proper thread so tried finding most appropriate

Question I have is; 2013 Anzac Day Game in Wellington... Saints v Swans

Did anyone attend it? Blues are playing Saints in 2015, wondering what experience was like and if you believe the event has potential to grow and poss rival other Anzac Day games in the future, still needs to grow in New Zealand of course

Last one, do you wish Swans still have an involvement in the event?

 

[bedford]

No way, it took a game away from the Vic based members. St Scum can play there every year but we don't want to be part of it

 

[MickyG]

Well we had our best 22 on GF ( now have lost an All Aus HBF ) and got done by 10 goals and the best Team in the comp have had the wood on us since 2012.

Not major changes but things need to change if we are to challenge simple as that and if it means some minor personal changes so be it.

How much upside is there in Ted 32 number 1 defender , Pyke 31 num 1 ruck , Shaw 33 now with Mal gone is he suppose to be our num 1 rebounder and can Macca go back to the HBF and capture his 2013 form , Goodes 35 who knows.

Things could turn pear shape very quickly if the likes of Ted , Pyke drop off , see ROK. Shaw will be covered.

I would blood as many kids as possible next year IF form warrants it without being stupid and have a red hot crack in 2016 while Buddy/Tippett will be 29 and the some of the young guys have seen some time at AFL level.
The team that ran out on GF I cant see them winning the flag in 2015 that's why I thought I likes of Shaw etc should have pulled the pin , just don't see the advantage of them going around next year and maybe holding back the likes of Jones etc.

In 2012 GF every Swan played to their best and despite injuries to Teddy, Mumford, Bolton and Goodes we won. The team was focused and exerted high pressure. In 2014 it was the Hawks that bought the intensity (and some dirty play). The Swans were overwhelmed just as the Hawks had been to a lesser extent in 2012.

Remember that we were minor premiers and had the lowest points against for the year. We ran over the top of Geelong in round 11 and North in a PF.

Sam Mitchell, Luke Hodge, Burgoyne, Gibson and Lake are all over thirty. How much upside is there in those players? Who will come in to take them higher. I'm worried about being able to beat the Hawks next year but also the other top 8 contenders. The coaches box will be the biggest factor in that IMO.

I see us having a red hot crack at it in 2015.

 

[MickyG]

Probably the wrong thread for it, but I believe our problem against Hawthorn is less personnel driven and more an exposure of our tactics.

Very simplistically;
We tend to send more players to and around the contest.
They send fewer players to the contest and have outliers ready to use the ball in space, should Hawthorn win the ball.

We win the ball in congestion and use the ball in close to break away from the contest.
If they win the ball they move it to the outliers who are in more space and under less pressure.
Plus the foot skills of Hawthorn are, in general, superior to ours and they make the point of having their better ball users as the outliers.
It means we have to dominate the stoppages or they can make better use of fewer opportunities.

Teams that beat us generally do so on the spread, because of our focus of men at and around the contest.
It's fine having a tactic that wins us more games than not, but Longmire is a coach that IMO generally seems unable or unwilling to substantially change the game plan during a match.

I'm sure there are probably more, but TBH off the top of my head the Launceston Nick Smith sub game and the 'Dangerfield' game at the SCG were the only times I can recall when we substantially changed tactics at HT, other than Buddy up the ground and Reid loose back.

Given Longmire's win/loss ratio it may seem churlish, but I want more than;

win; "I was happy with our contested effort"
loss "we didn't bring our contested game".

I read this and remember the GF, sitting there watching clearance after clearance coming out to a player in too much space. AHHHHHHHHH. I think the coaches will determine outcomes a lot next year.

 

[Tuco]

Hi Swans fans I couldn't find proper thread so tried finding most appropriate

Question I have is; 2013 Anzac Day Game in Wellington... Saints v Swans

Did anyone attend it? Blues are playing Saints in 2015, wondering what experience was like and if you believe the event has potential to grow and poss rival other Anzac Day games in the future, still needs to grow in New Zealand of course

Last one, do you wish Swans still have an involvement in the event?

I went. Had a great time. Made a real getaway out of the trip.

If it was an annual thing that would be fine for me personally. But we have Vic members to think of so it's just not an option to deny them that local away game. So I'd be against it on that basis.

 

[bungee]

Well we had our best 22 on GF ( now have lost an All Aus HBF ) and got done by 10 goals and the best Team in the comp have had the wood on us since 2012.

Not major changes but things need to change if we are to challenge simple as that and if it means some minor personal changes so be it.

How much upside is there in Ted 32 number 1 defender , Pyke 31 num 1 ruck , Shaw 33 now with Mal gone is he suppose to be our num 1 rebounder and can Macca go back to the HBF and capture his 2013 form , Goodes 35 who knows.

Things could turn pear shape very quickly if the likes of Ted , Pyke drop off , see ROK. Shaw will be covered.

I would blood as many kids as possible next year IF form warrants it without being stupid and have a red hot crack in 2016 while Buddy/Tippett will be 29 and the some of the young guys have seen some time at AFL level.
The team that ran out on GF I cant see them winning the flag in 2015 that's why I thought I likes of Shaw etc should have pulled the pin , just don't see the advantage of them going around next year and maybe holding back the likes of Jones etc.

So you've given up 2015 before we've fired a shot. We're already forbidden from trading, so let's chop away half our list, put all the babies up to play seniors and in a few games they'll all be stars of the calibre of Ted, Goodes, Pyke, Shaw & Macca and ready to win a GF, because every BF fan worth the bullshit in their trousers knows that each 'get-aboard-the-bandwagon' recruit turns into a star, because that's what happens in freakin' banana brain fan fairy land right ?

(Pauses for breath....)

Let's have a little reality check here Punts.

More so than any players, losing the GF in 2014 will be the single biggest factor to help us win the GF in 2015. That loss, and how it felt, was an expensive and emotional lesson for those 22. It cost us that GF to remind the players and the coaching group just how hard you have to play and how much you have to be prepared to sacrifice to win. That 2012 GF team was (on paper) probably the best team the Swans have put on the park in living memory (*Bedford's memory excepted). It wasn't a lack of talent that cost us.

Look at the team that ran out for the Hawks in 2012, lost the GF and came back hard enough to win B2B. Look at the Eagles after 2005. Look at Geelong after 2008.

The best guys to win us a GF are emotionally scarred, pissed off, revenge driven, battle hardened talented players with a serious axe to grind. Losing by so much makes the motivation to regain some face all the more compelling.

Do you seriously want to defenestrate half the team and then slam closed our premiership window ?

Have half of BF been on the piss during the off-season ?

Did you know that killing and eating a swan is considered treason in the UK ?

Bloody loonies*.

*Complain to Bedford as usual.

 

[bungee]

See what happens when we start a preview thread 6 months before the game.

Nature abhors a vacuum, so it fills it with horse piss.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

So you've given up 2015 before we've fired a shot. We're already forbidden from trading, so let's chop away half our list, put all the babies up to play seniors and in a few games they'll all be stars of the calibre of Ted, Goodes, Pyke, Shaw & Macca and ready to win a GF, because every BF fan worth the bullshit in their trousers knows that each 'get-aboard-the-bandwagon' recruit turns into a star, because that's what happens in freakin' banana brain fan fairy land right ?

(Pauses for breath....)

Let's have a little reality check here Punts.

More so than any players, losing the GF in 2014 will be the single biggest factor to help us win the GF in 2015. That loss, and how it felt, was an expensive and emotional lesson for those 22. It cost us that GF to remind the players and the coaching group just how hard you have to play and how much you have to be prepared to sacrifice to win. That 2012 GF team was (on paper) probably the best team the Swans have put on the park in living memory (*Bedford's memory excepted). It wasn't a lack of talent that cost us.

Look at the team that ran out for the Hawks in 2012, lost the GF and came back hard enough to win B2B. Look at the Eagles after 2005. Look at Geelong after 2008.

The best guys to win us a GF are emotionally scarred, pissed off, revenge driven, battle hardened talented players with a serious axe to grind. Losing by so much makes the motivation to regain some face all the more compelling.

Do you seriously want to defenestrate half the team and then slam closed our premiership window ?

Have half of BF been on the piss during the off-season ?

Did you know that killing and eating a swan is considered treason in the UK ?

Bloody loonies*.

*Complain to Bedford as usual.

I wouldn't put our loss in the same category as Hawthorn in 2012 GF as they at least had a red hot crack as did Eagles in 2005 and Geelong in 2008.

I put our loss in the same category as the Geelong and Collingwood prelim in 2010 a weird match where one team is completely out of the game by the first quarter nobody expected Geelong to be blown away both teams finished on 17 wins for 2010.

Do we bounce back like Geelong? or do we fall away? up to the players now how badly do they want it.

 

[Punts]

So you've given up 2015 before we've fired a shot. We're already forbidden from trading, so let's chop away half our list, put all the babies up to play seniors and in a few games they'll all be stars of the calibre of Ted, Goodes, Pyke, Shaw & Macca and ready to win a GF, because every BF fan worth the bullshit in their trousers knows that each 'get-aboard-the-bandwagon' recruit turns into a star, because that's what happens in freakin' banana brain fan fairy land right ?

(Pauses for breath....)

Let's have a little reality check here Punts.

More so than any players, losing the GF in 2014 will be the single biggest factor to help us win the GF in 2015. That loss, and how it felt, was an expensive and emotional lesson for those 22. It cost us that GF to remind the players and the coaching group just how hard you have to play and how much you have to be prepared to sacrifice to win. That 2012 GF team was (on paper) probably the best team the Swans have put on the park in living memory (*Bedford's memory excepted). It wasn't a lack of talent that cost us.

Look at the team that ran out for the Hawks in 2012, lost the GF and came back hard enough to win B2B. Look at the Eagles after 2005. Look at Geelong after 2008.

The best guys to win us a GF are emotionally scarred, pissed off, revenge driven, battle hardened talented players with a serious axe to grind. Losing by so much makes the motivation to regain some face all the more compelling.

Do you seriously want to defenestrate half the team and then slam closed our premiership window ?

Have half of BF been on the piss during the off-season ?

Did you know that killing and eating a swan is considered treason in the UK ?

Bloody loonies*.

*Complain to Bedford as usual.

Never did I say that.

All I said if form warrants it I would blood some kids without being stupid. The team that ran out on GF will not win the 2015 GF but that's totally my opinion

Shaw a star ( never been a star ), spare me the bloke is finished but been a fantastic pick up. And Pyke isn't a star but a solid ruck.

Drop probably our best ball user in Macca , I think not.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Anyways Essendon always seem to start the season on fire and we look like snails, obviously the major talking point in the offseason will be ASADA etc.. havent been up to date with it but last i heard they can take a deal in the offseason? and be available for 2015?

 

[swansfan51]

More so than any players, losing the GF in 2014 will be the single biggest factor to help us win the GF in 2015.

So they'll be more motivated - IE playing in a Grand Final wasn't enough motivation for the players? That's utterly terrifying.