Strategy Forward Line Potential

[Old_Man_James]

How the team performs through the midfield will have a huge bearing on the goal tallies of our forwards. Only Hawkins i would feel comfortable in saying will be able to plug 40+ regardless, since he is such a monster for opposition defense to stop. Forwards such as McCarthy and Kersten are such unknowns at this point, with sufficient service they could contribute greatly or they could have limited impact at all.

Either way I would love to see a wide spread of goalkickers in 2015, so much harder for the opposition to stop. With some assistance for Tommy up forward I would be happy for him to score less if it meant Clark, Vardy etc. are kicking goals. I felt that sometimes being to Hawkins centric, has been a bit of a downfall in many games over the last couple of years.

 

[catswhiskers]

Great effort Eddie. It could be pretty close to the forward line for next year, ultimately we just won't know until March how it's likely to pan out.

I'll be a lot more conservative with goal tallies. Like possessions with midfielders, we always overrate how good each player is likely to be:

Hawkins - 60 goals
Clark - 20 goals
Motlop - 30 goals
McCarthy - 15 goals
Kersten - 20 goals
Murdoch - 25 goals

If Clark is only going to snag 20 why not Walker? 11 from 7 = 33 from 21. And that is from about 40% time at half forward in his 7 games in 2014.

More likely if Clark is fit he will crack the 40 or better. Anything less is a worry.

 

[catswhiskers]

I wouldn't be writing off Bartel. In the Qualifying Final he was amazing in a team getting thumped. Nothing there suggested he was slowing down.

Agree.

Bartel of all the vets has a pile to offer in 2015 and 2016. Think Mitchell, Hodge and co. We just need to get the roles for others organised properly so Jimmey can finish the job.

 

[catswhiskers]

another McCarthy overrating thread.

Interesting. All the kids are overrated until they produce- that has to be the case.

McCarthy has shown glimpses (and at AFL level - unlike Hamling). I hope he knows what is on offer here , he is a key player. If he hits his straps at AFL level GFC will have a much more potent forward line and he will have a ten year career.

 

[catswhiskers]

I will shut up now.

 

[Vdubs]

Thankyou.

I am quiet curious at why only 20 for Clark? I know his history, but with the service that the Cats midfield will produce (in comparison to Melb), I believe he will have a big year.

Namely?
This is really the critical area of concern for me. Too often this year, we were under so much pressure with the ball that delivery into our fwds was below par.

 

[Lana]

speaking of which, be nice to see Kersten and McCarthy start to play through the midfield more often but I suspect Kersten is one of those individuals that will still continue to grow into his body for another season or two. At this point in time, he looks closer to a key position forward than that of a roaming forward flanker capable of bringing others into the game further up the field.
He could very well fill out to roughly the same dimensions as Podsiadly at about 192/100kg, but Podsiadly was able to play a fairly different role for Geelong and Adelaide these last two seasons.

I'd don't see kersten going anywhere near the midfield, I'm not even convinced that he can play as a third tall.

 

[Jimmy Yamazaki]

Going to be interesting to see, as I've said from the start, Clark at his best is a huge addition, an upgrade on Pods the last couple of years with us. (Although I never thought he was the same after the 2011 GF)

I can actually see Vardy getting the 3rd tall role, but I'm guessing first up it will be given to Stanley as 3rd tall/Ruck.

 

[Bobby_]

I'm not even convinced that he can play as a third tall.

2.6 goals & 1 contested mark per game in 33 VFL matches suggests otherwise.
Keep in mind Kersten returned to footy after a long layoff because of minor knee surgery. I reckon a few of you will change your mind once he gets another pre season under the belt and hits round 1 in full swing.
He's a wonderful talent and one of the most promising forwards we've had in quite a while.

 

[Lana]

2.6 goals & 1 contested mark per game in 33 VFL matches suggests otherwise.
Keep in mind Kersten returned to footy after a long layoff because of minor knee surgery. I reckon a few of you will change your mind once he gets another pre season under the belt and hits round 1 in full swing.
He's a wonderful talent and one of the most promising forwards we've had in quite a while.

I am sure sure why you think this suggests anything about his ability to play as a third tall. Whenever I have seen him play at VFL level, he playing the role of a key forward. I don't think he has shown either sufficient mobility( I am not taking about his 20 metre sprint time) or being clean enough below his knees at AFL level to be a third tall. I think he looks great at VFL level but he has a long way to go before he's ready for AFL footy and given the players we just brought in I don't see any opportunity for him.

 

[Bobby_]

contested marks as a forward target are a key stat to determining their ability in one-on-one contests. The fact he takes 1 every game suggests he's able to play that third tall target around goals. More than 2 goals every game is another sure sign he has the mobility and the agility to worry the opposition's defence.
Again, I think we should give Kersten a full season unhindered by injury before we begin asking questions about his abilities. He's shown he can do it at VFL level and for a month, he showed he could do it in the AFL before completely stagnating then succumbing to injury (again).

 

[Eddie1994]

Namely?
This is really the critical area of concern for me. Too often this year, we were under so much pressure with the ball that delivery into our fwds was below par.

Even so, you can't tell me our delivery into the 50 was worse then Melbourne? The delivery may have looked worse due to the fact that Hawkins had 2 or 3 guys to contend with in the air at times, whereas with a more potent forward line and more players to worry about, the defence won't cut it off as easily.

 

[Eddie1994]

Interesting. All the kids are overrated until they produce- that has to be the case.

McCarthy has shown glimpses (and at AFL level - unlike Hamling). I hope he knows what is on offer here , he is a key player. If he hits his straps at AFL level GFC will have a much more potent forward line and he will have a ten year career.

From limited game time, it must be said, with the confidence and support of the coaching staff in consistantly pumping games into him, I think we could have a genuine small forward.

 

[Eddie1994]

2.6 goals & 1 contested mark per game in 33 VFL matches suggests otherwise.
Keep in mind Kersten returned to footy after a long layoff because of minor knee surgery. I reckon a few of you will change your mind once he gets another pre season under the belt and hits round 1 in full swing.
He's a wonderful talent and one of the most promising forwards we've had in quite a while.

Finally! Someone else can actually see potential. The kid has had a hard time with his body, and it is a hard position to grow into, but I can see him being a more than handy 3rd tall with Clark and Hawkins.

 

[Partridge]

If Clark is only going to snag 20 why not Walker? 11 from 7 = 33 from 21. And that is from about 40% time at half forward in his 7 games in 2014.

More likely if Clark is fit he will crack the 40 or better. Anything less is a worry.

Because they can't all play, and unfortunately I don't think Walker is a certain starter with the new additions. I will be very, very surprised if Vardy and Clark aren't in the senior side before Walker. Rightly or wrongly.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Because they can't all play, and unfortunately I don't think Walker is a certain starter with the new additions. I will be very, very surprised if Vardy and Clark aren't in the senior side before Walker. Rightly or wrongly.

I'd be pretty flat if Vardy leapfrogged Walker on what; reputation? alone .. not saying it's not a possibility, but would send a poor message imo.

Walker still has a long way to go and indeed may not ultimately prove good enough to hold down CHF, but he went ok in his finals appearances (imo) and deserves a decent crack at locking down his spot in the side.

Who knows what the MC have in mind though, perhaps both will be kicking the dew for a while yet ..

 

[ChookNorris]

My only issue is he's rarely played there at VFL level, never at senior level, and to me is far more likely as a forward.

Used to want him as a kamikaze backman since his kicking for goal was so poor.

 

[Zouz Kitty]

also, there's no way Vardy won't be pushing his way into the line up early in the season. He's a massive body who is very quick and super agile. Once he gets the tank upto full speed, he'll be slotting bags of 4's & 5's in the magoo's on weekly basis before reemerging back into the seniors.

Geez, wouldn't that be fantastic, I really hope you're right Bobby, how good would it be for Vardy to return from injury + play a full season? He'll be 24 in June 2015 + has played 21 games. Sadly, my head says he is done + I hope I am wrong.

 

[Turbocat]

I agree he isn't like Christensen or Byrnes back in the day who will fight for every scrap, he is a lot like how Varcoe was when he was a small forward, he has burst of pace and a bag of tricks which in my opinion is the most important ingredient in a small forward.

From all I have read about and seen of Daniel (his highlight clips and a half of a game in the U18 championships vs vic metro I think) he's more a midfielder than small forward. Reminds me of Stokes(as a midfielder) with less aerial ability.

10L , it just gets back to what one really wants from a FP I suppose. From what Ive seen Daniel could play the role and gradually transend into a mid role , which is exactly what I want from a young FP. In the mean time he could add class and cleverness. But he is not alone , my guess is we could find a few that may be able to the role , who know maybe Bate could do it but he was drafted as a BP I think.
We really do need someone at thats capable and happy at the big mans feet , to me Motlop is at his best with room to move and create , not waiting for a ball spilled to the bottom of a pack.


Stokes hasn't been my faourite over the journey , but if we could get another Stokes at P60 , Id take it in a heartbeat. Would be close to our best value pick in Wells era.

 

[poeyonline]

Please correct me if im wrong, but i seem to remember clark playing some great footy up the ground marking on the wing for melbourne, perhaps we could see him do the same if vardy, stanley, kersten, walker e.t.c become genuine inside 50 targets.

 

[Eddie1994]

Please correct me if im wrong, but i seem to remember clark playing some great footy up the ground marking on the wing for melbourne, perhaps we could see him do the same if vardy, stanley, kersten, walker e.t.c become genuine inside 50 targets.

I think Clark is a better kick for Goal than the mentioned, I think Stanley or Walker would be the better option to play up the ground, as both can take a grab, and have quiet penetrating kicks (Stanley can hit a 60m ball), so right tactics, just possibly a question of personel.

 

[poeyonline]

I agree in principle, with my cup half full i see a lot of versatility with our foward setup next year. Yes, we need a crumber to stand up but i like what i see. I really thought burbury was worth keeping with our lack of small forwards, but the club must have thought he wasnt getting any better. Question: who are the players on our list we think can become the ultimate goal sneak?

 

[Zouz Kitty]

Bartel will be in the forward line next year.r

+ what about SJ? Do peeps think he had a stand out year?







http://australianfootball.com/players/playerseason/jimmy+bartel/14407

http://australianfootball.com/players/playerseason/steve+johnson/14412

http://australianfootball.com/players/playerseason/james+kelly/14413

 

[poeyonline]

The tackle count decrease really stands out for kelly...

 

[Zouz Kitty]

No, they both had pretty good years respectively in the back and forward lines, why move them?

I'm unsure why people are giving Kelly such a hard time?

Career Stats from 2002 - 2014
2014 Stats
- Kicks 312 - second
- Marks 113 - first
- Handballs 176 - eighth
- Disposals 488 - third
- Tackles 88 - fifth