Bluemour Discussion Thread XVI - Facts Not Welcome

[The Bighouse]

Also Bonar is built strongly and would not be pushed aside like too many of our onballers are.......see Fish & Dow. He could play on ball and up forward so his versatility would be just what we are lacking right now.......someone who is both physical and athletic would be very handy at the club next season imo.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing...be handy now.

 

[Wickzki]

Maybe it’s Bomber Thompson

Didn't think our team was located out of Barwon.

 

[La Dispute]

Also Bonar is built strongly and would not be pushed aside like too many of our onballers are.......see Fish & Dow. He could play on ball and up forward so his versatility would be just what we are lacking right now.......someone who is both physical and athletic would be very handy at the club next season imo.

Plus the long-term prospects make him an increasingly attractive proposition.

He comes to the club with a few pre-seasons under his belt, as far as I’m aware he’s been relatively injury free while at GWS, and he has the combined talent and athletic profile to be a very good player.

While we would love to add an experienced gun into the team, we’re still tethered to the bottom and won’t land anyone half-way decent until we are making regular strides up the ladder, which is why we have to continue mining draft picks and bringing guys with less than 20 games of senior footy to be immediate starters. They’re effectively first year players with slightly more conditioning.

Need to keep leveraging this relationship with GWS while we’re still getting good deals, partly due to being shambolic and posing no threat on field to them.

 

[KohPhi]

IMO we will not be taking Cows pick to the draft.
Expect it will be part of trade deal currency.

Agree. I think the deal was done with that exact reason in mind.
We have enough talented kids, we need talented experience now

 

[Mr_Plow]

As you said previously, we have enough talented kids...can't see why we'd be interested in any of those players, including Bonar.

Like Setterfield he's also had ACL injuries, he hasn't played many AFL games. He'd likely need time just like Setterfield.
We just dropped Setterfield and LOB, we don't need another young mid...

Whilst I agree with those points, if we are forced into recruiting a 20 year old (21 at the start of 2020 season) because nobody else wants to come across, he's a solid candidate.

Kid is strongly built and physically bullied our lads in his debut game. It was fun to watch. If he is stuck in the reserves and stays healthy through the season, it is worth being in his ear, particularly if Papley won't make the move.

 

[La Dispute]

Wonder if we could get Bonar and GWS’ 1st this year (say 16) for our future 1st (say 5). Looks like a good draft for small forwards/flankers and all-purpose defenders, both of which are major needs, so we can bring in a couple more players in the first round.

Surely we’re not in the same predicament next year?

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Wonder if we could get Bonar and GWS’ 1st this year (say 16) for our future 1st (say 5). Looks like a good draft for small forwards/flankers and all-purpose defenders, both of which are major needs, so we can bring in a couple more players in the first round.

Surely we’re not in the same predicament next year?

All will depend on our recruiting this year and players such as Dow, LOB, SPS, Setterfield, Kennedy, Fisher, Kerr, Deluca, Gibbons taking a big step forward.

I have us for bottom 4 again in 2020 unless we really do luck out with a FA or 2 this off season.

I wouldnt trade off another future if I was us.

 

[La Dispute]

All will depend on our recruiting this year and players such as Dow, LOB, SPS, Setterfield, Kennedy, Fisher, Kerr, Deluca, Gibbons taking a big step forward.

I have us for bottom 4 again in 2020 unless we really do luck out with a FA or 2 this off season.

I wouldnt trade off another future if I was us.

We just need to make smart changes, and bring in AFL quality players without having to give up draft picks for them, or giving up very little. That will determine how we will finish in 2020 IMO.

Give decent front-ended contracts to Ellis, Cuningham etc, go hard at Papley and Bonar and we’d finally have a side with a bit of depth and enough experience to compete. Add some natural development in our younger players, and some tactical adjustments over the off-season, plus serious personnel changes with our assistant coaches and I could see us launching.

The same factors that were impeding us last year are still present, namely too little experience, no cohesion and a confusing game plan, which is compounded with little consistency in the overall structure of the team. Did anyone think Casboult would be playing as much senior footy as he is? And why is Setterfield not a midfield mainstay when he spent the entire pre-season being groomed to play there. He’s spending far too much time playing as an extra forward, and it’s no surprise he’s not excelling and being expected to do things outside his current capability like pinpoint a pass inside 50, which isn’t really his go.

The mind boggles, and I don’t think we will have a realistic gauge on where we’re at until we fix these increasingly obvious blind spots we’re currently nonchalantly ignoring.

 

[Wickzki]

I'm not opposed to trading a future first round selection (again!).

I am opposed to doing it without getting a ready made player in return (this has nothing to do with Stocker who has been quick to win me over).

We have enough talented kids. We really need the supporting pieces put around them. I'd be targeting a similar age profile to the captains. Get that right and we'll be much improved.

Bonar seems like the type of player who is in a fantastic buy low position. Too good to be sitting in the NEAFL but not quite good enough now to help GWS win games of football. I'd suggest that a suitable trade for Bonar would be our 2020 second round pick and Adelaide's 2019 third round selection for Bonar and their third. It's a four or five pick upgrade immediately for them and what they'd hope is a likely early second round pick (likely 19-23).

 

[HereComesJuddy]

We just need to make smart changes, and bring in AFL quality players without having to give up draft picks for them, or giving up very little. That will determine how we will finish in 2020 IMO.

Give decent front-ended contracts to Ellis, Cuningham etc, go hard at Papley and Bonar and we’d finally have a side with a bit of depth and enough experience to compete. Add some natural development in our younger players, and some tactical adjustments over the off-season, plus serious personnel changes with our assistant coaches and I could see us launching.

The same factors that were impeding us last year are still present, namely too little experience, no cohesion and a confusing game plan, which is compounded with little consistency in the overall structure of the team. Did anyone think Casboult would be playing as much senior footy as he is? And why is Setterfield not a midfield mainstay when he spent the entire pre-season being groomed to play there. He’s spending far too much time playing as an extra forward, and it’s no surprise he’s not excelling and being expected to do things outside his current capability like pinpoint a pass inside 50, which isn’t really his go.

The mind boggles, and I don’t think we will have a realistic gauge on where we’re at until we fix these increasingly obvious blind spots we’re currently nonchalantly ignoring.

Papley and Bonar would be great additions to our club. And both still quite young.

Setterfield for me is a 1st year player. He needed to transform his body and usually the 1st year after an acl, the player needs to find his feet again. He needs another pre season.

We really need to bring in coniglio and Ellis imo and need to go hard as no picks would be required.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

I'm not opposed to trading a future first round selection (again!).

I am opposed to doing it without getting a ready made player in return (this has nothing to do with Stocker who has been quick to win me over).

We have enough talented kids. We really need the supporting pieces put around them. I'd be targeting a similar age profile to the captains. Get that right and we'll be much improved.

Bonar seems like the type of player who is in a fantastic buy low position. Too good to be sitting in the NEAFL but not quite good enough now to help GWS win games of football. I'd suggest that a suitable trade for Bonar would be our 2020 second round pick and Adelaide's 2019 third round selection for Bonar and their third. It's a four or five pick upgrade immediately for them and what they'd hope is a likely early second round pick (likely 19-23).

I agree with your value on Bonar. Think he would add lots to our team.

I dont think we need to trade our 2020 1st. I think we again will receive a PP at the end of the 1st round so we will have adelaides pick along with the PP: 12 &19.

If we somehow got Coniglio and Ellis (yep i know its a dream scenario) as FAs, i would send pick 12 to sydney for Papley, 19 to Freo for Ed Langdon and trade our adelaide 3rd and our 2020 2nd to gws for bonar and change.

Even if we exclude the FAs, thats what i would be doing while holding onto our 2020 1st. Think those 3 would add a lot to our list in 2020

 

[RedFury]

Bonar seems like a Setterfield to me. Great athlete, limited footballer

That's our official verdict on a young, inexperienced player who's had a long-term injury - after a whopping 6 games back playing AFL, is it?

Rightio.

 

[djw1952]

Agree. I think the deal was done with that exact reason in mind.
We have enough talented kids, we need talented experience now

I suppose Carlton are still into Martin (G.C.) at seasons end, so the Crows pick could come into play there or SOS might have to use next years first rounder in that deal and try something else for Bonar...........the other thing is that Carlton want another player that is already with a club in Vic........as was mentioned by one of the more reliable rumour guys on here a while back (cannot remember which) so that all sounds complicated if it happens!!! It was supposed to be two from interstate (Coniglio/Martin) and one from Melb, but not sure who that one would be?

 

[Malifice]

I'm not opposed to trading a future first round selection (again!).

I am opposed to doing it without getting a ready made player in return (this has nothing to do with Stocker who has been quick to win me over).

We can trade out of this year, next year and the year after if we have to (we used 2 x 1sts last year so we can go this year and the next 2 years without using a 1st at the draft).

I want every single one of those picks over the next 3 years used on mature (24-28 year old) players.

 

[Wickzki]

We can trade out of this year, next year and the year after if we have to (we used 2 x 1sts last year so we can go this year and the next 2 years without using a 1st at the draft).

I want every single one of those picks over the next 3 years used on mature (24-28 year old) players.

Agree with you though I'd top it out at 26 this year (27 next, etc.). Theoretically gives them 5 years of high level football (to age 31) with us. Definitely there for the hopeful premiership window and winding down into a replaceable level so that we put ourselves in a Geelong, Hawthorn, Sydney longterm type picture.

 

[Jimmae]

I gave up trying to decipher the message after a minute. Legend.

I know Jimmae will be really pleased if we managed to snag A Bonar.

Happy to take someone like a Bonar but you're right, nice to have but absolutely not what we need.

Bonar I believe is contracted to till 2021, we don't have a second round pick so will likely cost is the crows pick. Do people think that he would add to our list.
In my opinion we are better off going that pick for a mature talent.

Contracts are worth doodly squat these days....we got a pick 5 in Setters for a few 2nd rounders, so don't count it out.

GWS has a brilliant list strategy stockpiling top end talent, with the knowledge that they can't keep them all....so they trade those not currently in their starting line up for high draft picks, and bring in more high end talent. The best will rise, the others will likely get traded. Two 1st rounders for Shiel, they'd be rapt with that deal.

They also have a kid named Caldwell waiting in the wings, so pushes Bonar even further back.

Big bodied mid who bursts out of stoppages, could be more than useful.

They've got Hately too.

And Shipley. And O'Halloran. In terms of youngsters, save for Idun, all the Giants have are top 30 draftees and academy kids (sometimes they're both).

He should cost a shade more than Kennedy; a pick swap with Adelaide's first and then maybe our 2020 3rd, or we could trade up somewhat with the fistful of later picks we have at present.

Speaking of Kennedy, Bonar is a massive step up in the role we've tried to develop Matthew for. Bonar is not super agile, but he has great pace and a long kick. Regularly gets on the score sheet at all levels of footy with his directness with footy in hand. Plays the game like few can with his rare athleticism.

Without giving too much away if we beat Essendon then a few more games and Bolton keeps his job it would be very ironic.

Woosha? You're making me doubt your other rumour now.

 

[ESKIE]

Ross Lyon ?
Mark Harvey ??

Holy **** not either of those two

Lyon ... no no

 

[ESKIE]

1. To protect a talented kid from media speculation and pressure whilst in contract.

2. We all know it's going to eventually but BB is under the pump enough as it is and just mentioning other people's names is disrespectful. I hope the 2nd half of the season we finally win some games and have a good game plan that gives the board confidence in BB and the direction we are heading in. Last year we traded our future first and second believing we would improve significantly and its not even just BB we have to worry about losing now but there are senior ppl at the club SS who are actually contemplating getting out of the club.

What is SS and what senior people

 

[I bleed Blue]

I agree with your value on Bonar. Think he would add lots to our team.

I dont think we need to trade our 2020 1st. I think we again will receive a PP at the end of the 1st round so we will have adelaides pick along with the PP: 12 &19.

If we somehow got Coniglio and Ellis (yep i know its a dream scenario) as FAs, i would send pick 12 to sydney for Papley, 19 to Freo for Ed Langdon and trade our adelaide 3rd and our 2020 2nd to gws for bonar and change.

Even if we exclude the FAs, thats what i would be doing while holding onto our 2020 1st. Think those 3 would add a lot to our list in 2020

If the year continues like this we should definitely get a priority pick.

If our last two years don't justify one nothing ever will.

 

[Zuribagger]

Dazdoggy what’s the source: no names but description (eg cfc director, ex player...)?

 

[Mister Carlton]

That's our official verdict on a young, inexperienced player who's had a long-term injury - after a whopping 6 games back playing AFL, is it?

Rightio.

Because going after young inexperience long term injury players from GWS have worked well for us. Pass.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Because going after young inexperience long term injury players from GWS have worked well for us. Pass.

Which ones out of our PRIME targets have failed?

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

I sound like a broken record but do people realise Bonar is very likely ahead of where they would’ve expected him to be when they drafted him at 11 two years ago?

 

[Accidental genius]

Which ones out of our PRIME targets have failed?

Marchbank/plowman are ok
Can’t really judge the others that we still have due to injuries/lack of fitness....can’t see anything special apart from picket and maybe setters..

 

[Benaly28]

Marchbank/plowman are ok
Can’t really judge the others that we still have due to injuries/lack of fitness....can’t see anything special apart from picket and maybe setters..

Sorry are you talking about Plowman the turnover king!The guy who is as slow as a snail.The guy who dosent know what stage the game is at to kill the ball or when to go fast when there two minutes left.But no I can’t talk about Plowman as others here think that he is best 22 and important to our side.So I’ll keep my mouth shut.