List Mgmt. 2019 Draft/Trade/FA Thread - Final Wrap

[OB11]

As much as we are getting pumped each game.
Our backline isn’t the issue.

The backline would be one of the stingiest scored against in the comp per F50 entries conceded

It’s the way the balls been coming in with zero pressure time after time. And lose men running into the F50 that’s the problem.

Tighten up the midfield our backline will do its job.

Atm we are missing our 2 key backs in Thompson and Collins

Though at some point we do need to find the next Harbrow

Disagree - the backline is shite.

The reason they don't get scored heavily against is they play to the boundary and flood back and play team defence.

One on one they are terrible and are horrendous users of the ball.

If they want to play more attacking in the future they need defenders who can defend in their own right and hit targets.

 

[GenYBlue]

Would love to Gold Coast list management go down Silvagni's recycled youth policy he's been utilising at Carlton for a few years now.

Essentially pay unders for good talent that is struggling to find consistency at a higher level in teams that are over-stacked with talent.

This has traditionally been GWS and I still think they're a prime target (Jon Patton as someone mentioned could be a great get for the Suns at the right price), but perhaps also taking a look at Brisbane, Eagles, Cats & maybe even Pies could have some merit.

Essentially it's proven to be a good way to pull the lowest common denominator of the list up, doubly so if you're not really a destination club.

While I think we payed overs for Weller giving up Pick 2, he is close to one of our best and most consistent players.
We need more of this, but getting a better deal out of it.
I think a low first rounder for him would have been fair, but Pick #2 was negligently excessive.
I'm aware we got pick 41 as well, but that's not a great incentive for that trade at all.
A pick in the mid to late 20s? Sure, you'd consider it.

Miles is a good example of this.
He was squeezed out of Richmond because they have such a great midfield, but he's serviceable for us and can play a role.

Just to highlight some excellent pick-ups Silvagni has made at Carlton with this strategy.

Lochie Plowman
Will Setterfield
Caleb Marchbank
Matt Kennedy

Yes there have been some busts & injury-riddled careers along the way, but those top 3 are consistently best 22 and Matt Kennedy looks to have finally found his home off the half-forward line under Teague. We also got a decent back-up ruckman in Phillips running around in the 2s.

I don't think the Gold Coast list is in a terrible position, and some relatively inexpensive quality top-ups like this can help the team be competitive over the next years to come.

 

[gcsunsfc]

Jono o route
Jacksch
Boyd
Schache
Gorringe
Bennell

Be interesting to see what was given up for these lot.

Often highly rated players that can’t get a game.. it’s for a reason



On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[GenYBlue]

As I said you get some duds and stinkers, but I still think it's an effective strategy for a club with an average list.

You need to win games & bring in some level of talent to be a destination club for the top shelf talent.

The alternative is to throw ludicrous amounts of money and/or high draft picks at them otherwise and these can equally or more debilitating long term than getting in a few duds over the course.

 

[HighReeve]

pay unders for good talent

Revolutionary :|... Silvagni hasn't even been good at it.

The tricks interesting the player. In Matt Kennedys case Brisbane offered GWS a better trade than Carlton, and offered Kennedy a higher salary than Carlton.

 

[GenYBlue]

Revolutionary :|... Silvagni hasn't even been good at it.

The tricks interesting the player. In Matt Kennedys case Brisbane offered GWS a better trade than Carlton, and offered Kennedy a higher salary than Carlton.

So because he hasn't executed it perfectly the idea itself is bad?
He hasn't been horrible at it.
The players I listed are a testament that it *can* work theoretically.

Interesting the player is of course important, but that largely revolves around the performance of the club & foreseen potential.
You do the best to make your club desirable, but at the end of the day you need strong negotiation to get good players into the club & at good value.

 

[HighReeve]

So because he hasn't executed it perfectly the idea itself is bad?
He hasn't been horrible at it.
The players I listed are a testament that it *can* work theoretically.

Interesting the player is of course important, but that largely revolves around the performance of the club & foreseen potential.
You do the best to make your club desirable, but at the end of the day you need strong negotiation to get good players into the club & at good value.

Well no.. didn't say that, or that Silvangis' been horrible.
The *idea* getting players for less than they should be valued? That's anyone evers strategy.
They are a testament to Carltons mediocrity for sure. The players you didn't selectively mention are another reason that what Carlton have been doing has * all to do with Gold Coasts path from here.

 

[sunsofanarchy]

If crows come for luko with carlton's pick, what do you think we would want as steak knives?

On SM-G960W using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[kreglze]

Just following from an earlier convo. Tbh Martin is only going to nab us a pick 15 at the absolute best, his form this season has been mostly woeful, which would have hurt his value.

 

[briztoon]

If crows come for luko with carlton's pick, what do you think we would want as steak knives?

On SM-G960W using BigFooty.com mobile app

Unless Lukosius requests a trade home, you tell Adelaide to politely go away.

That would be really bad for team culture and morale.

 

[briztoon]

If crows come for luko with carlton's pick, what do you think we would want as steak knives?

On SM-G960W using BigFooty.com mobile app

If Lukosius does request a trade.

No steak knives. Just a straight up trade.

Otherwise the most likely scenario is Gold Coast having to add some steak knives in to the deal.

 

[Corkie]

What’s our thoughts Suns supporters on likely scenarios?

Trade -
Martin - mid to late 1st round 10-18?

Delist - Senior list:
Hanley - retire
Young
Nicholls - rookie draft a mature state league ruck with potential?
GHS - re rookie in Rischa’s role for the reserves to forfil his contract?


Delist - Rookie list:
Rischatelli - Development coach role like ASwallow?
Leslie
Heron
Scheer
Wigg


Possibly available -
5 senior spots
5 rookie spots

Senior list possibles?
SHill, Blakely...
3 x Rd1 picks - all midfielders?

5 x fresh rookie list players - mix of mature state league & academy potential?

 

[Sunny_]

Where has the Blakely talk come from?

 

[kreglze]

What’s our thoughts Suns supporters on likely scenarios?

Trade -
Martin - mid to late 1st round 10-18?

Delist - Senior list:
Hanley - retire
Young
Nicholls - rookie draft a mature state league ruck with potential?
GHS - re rookie in Rischa’s role for the reserves to forfil his contract?


Delist - Rookie list:
Rischatelli - Development coach role like ASwallow?
Leslie
Heron
Scheer
Wigg


Possibly available -
5 senior spots
5 rookie spots

Senior list possibles?
SHill, Blakey...
3 x Rd1 picks - all midfielders?

5 x fresh rookie list players - mix of mature state league & academy potential?

Mostly agree with this except 2 points.

1. GHS will be on a decent contract. He is not going to, or if would be silly for him to accept being delisted and put onto the rookie list on a rookie salary. You can keep him on the senior list and have him fulfill Rischa's 2nds role.

2. I would look to keep Young around, at least for 2's support, he is a good player, only last year did he snag 4 goals against the Swans in that big win.

However, I would love Blakely if it happened (I don't know where this has come from BTW), Hill (if he can play 16 games) would be a decent pick up.

You are 100% correct though, all the picks/Trades/FA this year should all be on the best midfielders available.

 

[Corkie]

Someone mentioned Connor Blakely a few weeks ago. I’m just going with it...!

 

[thurls64]

What troubles me most is how we never can get these gun draft picks playing well in their first and second year like other clubs do, they get lower draft picks making an impact and helping win games in their first year

We effectively make guys like Luko and King look incompetent and out of their depth, why wouldn't they already be thinking about going home so they don't have to look like spuds

Rozee, Blakey, Duursma etc etc all seem to look like they are ready made players while we continually talk about how long it takes for our guys to get used to AFL

I get it that our guys would play better if we were a winning team but I don't think that is the answer, we are missing something in development of these high draft picks to help them take the step into AFL and be confident and effective

King has done a few nice things but for the most part looked like he was completely out of his depth against Richmond yet we know he has immense talent and experience, then I watch Ports first year players running around with poise, clarity and executing their roles.

When all the talk starts each year about who we will get with our draft picks and how they are ready made etc etc like it will be the missing link we have all been waiting for yet they always end up injured or playing below expectations

Rankine is def the first one I can think of that looks like he has the head for it straight away and yet he cant get on the park

 

[thurls64]

Someone mentioned Blakey a few weeks ago. I’m just going with it...!

the father or the son?????????

 

[Corkie]

Mostly agree with this except 2 points.

1. GHS will be on a decent contract. He is not going to, or if would be silly for him to accept being delisted and put onto the rookie list on a rookie salary. You can keep him on the senior list and have him fulfill Rischa's 2nds role.

2. I would look to keep Young around, at least for 2's support, he is a good player, only last year did he snag 4 goals against the Swans in that big win.

However, I would love Blakely if it happened (I don't know where this has come from BTW), Hill (if he can play 16 games) would be a decent pick up.

You are 100% correct though, all the picks/Trades/FA this year should all be on the best midfielders available.

For mine, guys like Young depend if they are willing to accept pay cuts, and possibly rookie listing?
I imagine he is on reasonable coin to have made the switch to us.
Comes down to output v cost I guess which he is lacking this season. Same as Hanley, Nicholls, etc.
If they can’t crack our best 22 now, it isn’t going to get any easier next year with multiple round 1 picks and hopefully a few mature guys coming in.

 

[thurls64]

I reckon we might be looking at a couple of Hawks vets this off season cant see where else we will find guys wanting to come to us, Hawks rebuild will take too long for some of them to wait around for and Hawks don't pay much

 

[briztoon]

Mostly agree with this except 2 points.

1. GHS will be on a decent contract. He is not going to, or if would be silly for him to accept being delisted and put onto the rookie list on a rookie salary. You can keep him on the senior list and have him fulfill Rischa's 2nds role.

2. I would look to keep Young around, at least for 2's support, he is a good player, only last year did he snag 4 goals against the Swans in that big win.

However, I would love Blakely if it happened (I don't know where this has come from BTW), Hill (if he can play 16 games) would be a decent pick up.

You are 100% correct though, all the picks/Trades/FA this year should all be on the best midfielders available.

GHS wouldn’t be on a rookie contract. You delist him, then redraft him in the rookie draft, and he keeps his current contract, but the rookie list salary figure comes off your salary cap, while the remaining figure of GHS contract counts towards your salary cap.

 

[briztoon]

What troubles me most is how we never can get these gun draft picks playing well in their first and second year like other clubs do, they get lower draft picks making an impact and helping win games in their first year

We effectively make guys like Luko and King look incompetent and out of their depth, why wouldn't they already be thinking about going home so they don't have to look like spuds

Rozee, Blakey, Duursma etc etc all seem to look like they are ready made players while we continually talk about how long it takes for our guys to get used to AFL

I get it that our guys would play better if we were a winning team but I don't think that is the answer, we are missing something in development of these high draft picks to help them take the step into AFL and be confident and effective

King has done a few nice things but for the most part looked like he was completely out of his depth against Richmond yet we know he has immense talent and experience, then I watch Ports first year players running around with poise, clarity and executing their roles.

When all the talk starts each year about who we will get with our draft picks and how they are ready made etc etc like it will be the missing link we have all been waiting for yet they always end up injured or playing below expectations

Rankine is def the first one I can think of that looks like he has the head for it straight away and yet he cant get on the park

No one expected Lukosius and King to perform right away.

From last years draft Sam Walsh and Bailey Smith were the two expected to perform straight away.

There was genuine excitement to see Rankine play AFL, but he plays a different game than Walsh and Smith.

Rozee and Duursma have exceeded everyone’s expectations.


That’s why I brought up the discussion yesterday about players in this years draft ready to play from round one, and mentioned Rowell and Gould.

 

[Corkie]

GHS wouldn’t be on a rookie contract. You delist him, then redraft him in the rookie draft, and he keeps his current contract, but the rookie list salary figure comes off your salary cap, while the remaining figure of GHS contract counts towards your salary cap.

Yeh that was my thought. Move him to the rookie list as a partial salary dump and free up a senior list spot. It’s an awkward scenario. I really had hopes he would be best 22 this season.

 

[briztoon]

Out of Curiosity, is Stephen Hill an restricted free agent?

Just wondering how you’re trading for him and not giving up a first round pick.

 

[Luder]

Out of Curiosity, is Stephen Hill an restricted free agent?

Just wondering how you’re trading for him and not giving up a first round pick.

He's unrestricted, so no cost

Even if he was contracted, he wouldn't cost a 1st round pick. 29 years old and has spent the last 18 months dealing with various injuries

 

[kreglze]

Tom Cutler from Brisbane OOC, Avgs over 21 touches over the 3 games he has played this season. Outside run and pace that our team may need. Would defiantly get a bunch of game time with us.

I still hold out some feint hope we have put a bucket of money towards Harry Cunningham as well as he is a RFA, would be a good bolster to our midfield as well.