Don't think that this high altitude training works!

[daics cousin]

Don't think this high altitude training really works.Did they have to go all the way to arizona to waste more of the club's money.I remember earlier this year when the players came back,some sporting pro wrote an article saying that they can achieve the same results going to the highlands of country Victoria.The team took off ok during the start of the season then ran out of puff during the second half of the year.Isn't high altitude training meant to give players extra oxygen to continue through and accelerate performance as time goes by not work the opposite effect like it did this year?Guys your thoughts please!

 

[DarrenM]

It's just meant to give you more fitness by increasing oxygen supply to blood vessels and muscles. However last year they didn't do their research and didn't stay long enough. They can go to falls creek and do training their but i think arizona is at slightly higher altitude. They could just go do falls creek and stay a bit longer but collingwood have so much money they have to spend it somehow. Even if the altitude training is 'successful', its not suddenly going to turn all Collingwood players into high endurance running machines. It may help lift their fitness by a few percent but nothing drastic. But Collingwood need to use every possible resource they can to help to improve their side and that is why they are continiuing to try this type of training. It would be ironic though if they didn't improve their positon on the ladder next year.

 

[Jabso]

It's training. Don't start to believe it will work miracles. It may be high altitude training but in the end it is just training.

 

[DarrenM]

Exactly

 

[chappo52]

the biggest advantage of this trip is the team bonding and if they happen to come back a little fitter then all the better for us

 

[MarkT]

Troop was the one you are probably referring to. We don’t have the hight or the facilities here. I’m not convinced there is lasting benefit either but if we don’t spend our money on something like this we will hire another Wayne Carey to drop in for 5 minutes a week and bank the rest for a rainy day. The AFL insures for the rain and there is a drought anyway. If nothing else the players get fit and bond.

I reckon we beat St. Kilda in the pre season comp based on better fitness and in round 1 Adelaide beat us for fitness. Whether selecting a better side for the opponent and conditions would have changed round 1 is another matter. There certainly wasn’t any conclusive proof of any benefit last year. If our good start was in any way due to the Arizona trip it didn’t last and it did us no good in September but it certainly can’t do any harm.

EM’s response to Troop at the AGM was that the main purpose of the camp was to ensure the players were fit to put in a big pre season. The altitude effects were ever meant to play a role as the season progressed except to give the players a good fitness base to hit pre season training proper from. It sounds like a sound theory to me.

 

[Coin_Toss]

the biggest advantage of this trip is the team bonding and if they happen to come back a little fitter then all the better for us

Exactly...

Team bonding is very important, having to mix with your teammates 24/7, for 17 days, this creates understanding with one another and special friendships, which translates well to the football field.

At high altitude you don't have to train as hard and still receive the same benefits as you would do at sea level.

 

[Coin_Toss]

I reckon we beat St. Kilda in the pre season comp based on better fitness

But take into account that we were 3 weeks in advanced of pre season training

 

[Nesian]

What high altitude training does as darren mentioned is add on to your performance at ground level by allowing your body to get that little bit extra out of it. It allows our players to improve on the PBs and performances at ground level, but given the human body can reach limits given age, height, weight and all that, we cant expect them to come back as some super beings. While the magpies can do it in australia and should probably do it at least 3-4weeks rather than 2 weeks (though i guess thats why we built the high alt room), I think that the extra altitude in arizona does help. The added benefit of begining the training in Arizona is the the fact that it allows the players to focus on training more without the media and what not interferring and disrupting. Also allows the players to enjoy it more and the whole bonding aspect as well.

 

[sloth6]

If Wizard is willing to give the club $200,000 towards it, then why the f**k not go! and I'm sure a certain portion is taken from their salaries to cover some of the costs.

Would be a great experience to go overseas as a group, particularly blokes like Thomas, Pendles and other draft picks from last season who didn't get to attend.

 

[MagpieScouser]

i hope high altitude training can help guy richards play more than 5 games a year without getting injured

 

[njac3]

the biggest advantage of this trip is the team bonding and if they happen to come back a little fitter then all the better for us

Couldnt of said it better

 

[johnson_26]

Realistically, being at a high altitude place like arizona, and training where the oxygen is thin and less in particle numbers, will not do much in terms of chronic adaptations if you're only there for a week. it needs to be a constant practice that has been undertaken.

It's been scientifically proven that training at high altitudes expands the lung tidal volume and capacity of a reasonable period of time, therefore increasing cardio-respiratory endurance and the body's a-VO2 (aterio-venous difference), which is a specific indicator of how efficiently the body, particularly the working muscles during excercise, are extracting O2 from the blood during maximal activity.

What this camp will achieve is;
- the players will experience some distress when working maximally at high altitudes. This experience will enable the players to train harder at ground level, by being able to mentally 'push themselves harder'. This is due to working at the same intensity at a higher altitude, so logically they could work at a greater intensity than previously thought at ground level.

- the second thing which has been picked up on is bonding. Most of the activities they do over there are all team oreintated tasks, such as problem solving, or even tasks such as hiking where encouragement amongst all players is needed to help each other psuh through pain barriers.

 

[Aristotel]

I remember watching games early in season 2006 and thinking the the Pies' looked super enthused and were the hardest running side in the comp. Blokes like Anthony Rocca were jumping out of their skin, and we were winning by big margins.

I don't know if this was to do with the high altitude training or due to the fact that the club seemed really upbeat about the inclusion of top players that were missing in the previous year.

The point is if Arizona helped, it didn't help for long. We want September champions, not April ones. The club needs to get the training right to ensure we're super-competitive at the business end of the season. Clubs like Sydney seemed to get it right, no-one even rated them until about sept 1st! They even dropped their round one game to Essendon!!!! And we were on top after round 6. Big deal.

 

[chappo52]

i remember watching beyond the boundary and they showed brodie hollands
house and how for the majority of the week he sleeps in a tent that simulates those altitudes

 

[Aristotel]

I

i remember watching beyond the boundary and they showed brodie hollands
house and how for the majority of the week he sleeps in a tent that simulates those altitudes

I think that was E.T.

 

[magpies42]

Don't think this high altitude training really works.Did they have to go all the way to arizona to waste more of the club's money.I remember earlier this year when the players came back,some sporting pro wrote an article saying that they can achieve the same results going to the highlands of country Victoria.The team took off ok during the start of the season then ran out of puff during the second half of the year.Isn't high altitude training meant to give players extra oxygen to continue through and accelerate performance as time goes by not work the opposite effect like it did this year?Guys your thoughts please!

There is no doubt that altitude training has its benefits. It increases the red blood cell count in your blood (red blood cells are responsible for the disperstion of oxygen thru the body). It enables players to get there aerobic and anerobic fitness up without doing as much work (thus saving the players like bucks and rocca from injurying themselves). Sure you could probably get the same effects here in australia, but could you get the same quality facilities and could you get the players away from media scrutiny, families, clubbing and other distractions! The trip had major benefits last year, we were pretty injury free and we had an outstanding start to the year so i cant see why we would invest in the trip again!

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

We could go to Falls Creek to do the training, but last time I checked, there isn't one of the most high-tech, world-reknowned training facilities in the world in Falls Creek, and I'm not sure training like it's Rocky IV is really going to be what we need.

 

[GRANGE_GSM]

i think its a great idea!...you guys dont understand it breaks the year up for the boys and gives them something to look forward to!...to think high altitude will work is silly,it wont "work as such" but it will definatly help!
could anyone name a negative with the lads going over????

not only it sells the club well overseas but its a different enviroment!how would we all go training the same place for 10-12 years?pretty stail and bored id think.

oh and atleast they get a 2 day holiday on the way home (hawaii)

 

[Dazman]

Your right Grange, its does give the players something to look forward to. Something out of the ordinary that beats the usual routine of running around Melbourne. More importantly it allows for team bonding. These blokes will be living 24/7 with their teammates and that is great for team balance, especially for the new kids talen in last years draft and Medhurst. Selling the club overseas, didn't even think of that one.

Safe to say that the fitness benefits of the trip may be minimal, but with our financial situation, there is definitely no negatives.

 

[GRANGE_GSM]

yeh selling the club will benefit more than you all think...think of all the americans that have heard of out great game and see collingwood and think oh next time i go to australia im guna go watch those blokes in black and white! and not to mention those aussie who are over there may even come home and buy a membership!

yes the altitude training will HELP but to say it wont "work" is just stupid! it will never "work" becasue if all it took was going to the states and trainng at high altitude to win a flag then pre season would be simple!
and what the hell i wouldnt knock back a chance of going to the usa for an experience to see the worlds greatest training facilities and walking through/around the grand canyon! if your work company said ok in november would anyone be interested in goign to the USA for a 3 week holiday but expect alot of hard work with all expenses paid for? i would jump at the chance!..to those that are questioning altitude training,then go into the lexus centre and stand in the altitude room and try and ride/run on the bike or treadmill and see how much more harder it is!

 

[MarkT]

Do you honestly think this would get much coverage in the US? Even if it did the number of people seeing any of it that happened to venture to Australia would be minimal at best and the number of those in which it would develop an interest to see a game let alone one involving Collingwood if they happened to remember the name would be somewhere around 0. Even if I am wrong and someone does come to a game there is a 50% probability it will be an away game and Collingwood would get nothing out of it anyway. We might get a few cents if this person has a large family and we crack the odds that it is a home game.

This has no marketing or exposure value whatsoever. It has a very probable bonding value, a probable training value with a debated altitude element and it has a definite cost which the club can well afford.

The amount it achieves can best be summed up with 7th last year which is to say it is marginal at best but it can’t hurt. Winning still comes down to the list and the coach and if we were short of funds I’m much rather spend the money on recruiting and paying out a failed coach but we aren’t short of funds.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

Do you honestly think this would get much coverage in the US? Even if it did the number of people seeing any of it that happened to venture to Australia would be minimal at best and the number of those in which it would develop an interest to see a game let alone one involving Collingwood if they happened to remember the name would be somewhere around 0. Even if I am wrong and someone does come to a game there is a 50% probability it will be an away game and Collingwood would get nothing out of it anyway. We might get a few cents if this person has a large family and we crack the odds that it is a home game.

This has no marketing or exposure value whatsoever. It has a very probable bonding value, a probable training value with a debated altitude element and it has a definite cost which the club can well afford.

Growing the brand HAS to start somewhere. You can't just start with a 30 second Superbowl spot.

Logically, it has to help more than doing NOTHING would help. You can call it negligible if you want, but it can't hurt.

The amount it achieves can best be summed up with 7th last year which is to say it is marginal at best but it can’t hurt. Winning still comes down to the list and the coach and if we were short of funds I’m much rather spend the money on recruiting and paying out a failed coach but we aren’t short of funds.

7th last year from 15th the year before. That's better than anyone else who's finished that low in recent years. I don't see how anyone can complain about that rate of improvement.

I mean, Richmond and Hawthorn have been down for 3 years now, and they still don't necessarily look like finals contenders. Carlton have won 3 spoons in 5 years.

Compared to that, finishing 7th looks pretty good.

 

[GRANGE_GSM]

Do you honestly think this would get much coverage in the US? Even if it did the number of people seeing any of it that happened to venture to Australia would be minimal at best and the number of those in which it would develop an interest to see a game let alone one involving Collingwood if they happened to remember the name would be somewhere around 0. Even if I am wrong and someone does come to a game there is a 50% probability it will be an away game and Collingwood would get nothing out of it anyway. We might get a few cents if this person has a large family and we crack the odds that it is a home game.

This has no marketing or exposure value whatsoever. It has a very probable bonding value, a probable training value with a debated altitude element and it has a definite cost which the club can well afford.

The amount it achieves can best be summed up with 7th last year which is to say it is marginal at best but it can’t hurt. Winning still comes down to the list and the coach and if we were short of funds I’m much rather spend the money on recruiting and paying out a failed coach but we aren’t short of funds.

mate the amount of clinics the boys do when they are supposed to be having an "off day" is more than you would think! and the facilities they use (wotever team it is) they do actually get coverage around the town and it is known thats we are over there!
yes,the "sellling" of the club over there isnt a reason to go over but i think its better going than not going! and if you carefully read what ive written you wouldnt be saying to me that "winning comes to the list and the coach" because i continually say that goign over there that it helps not "works"!! and i clearly stated that going to the USA will not win a flag (re read what iv written u imbosile) but hey name a negative of going to the US????!!!!

 

[GRANGE_GSM]

Growing the brand HAS to start somewhere. You can't just start with a 30 second Superbowl spot.

Logically, it has to help more than doing NOTHING would help. You can call it negligible if you want, but it can't hurt.


7th last year from 15th the year before. That's better than anyone else who's finished that low in recent years. I don't see how anyone can complain about that rate of improvement.

I mean, Richmond and Hawthorn have been down for 3 years now, and they still don't necessarily look like finals contenders. Carlton have won 3 spoons in 5 years.

Compared to that, finishing 7th looks pretty good.

spot on!...i have never said that collingwood will get 1,000 more members thanks to the US but the international market will start somewhere! and never (mark t this is to u again) did i say that going from 15th then the USA to 1st will happen as u expect to happen just from goin to the US. yes u said that flags are won from coaches and list managment but if im reading it right it was directed at me implying i think it will win i flag.