Roast AFLW Tiresome Debate Thread

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JimmyBeerCans said:
Six figure sums for at best a 12 week season if you make finals lol carn'
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Full time athletes are full time athletes. NFL players earn millions for 18 games a year.

‘Deserving it in the eyes of JimmyBeerCans’ isn’t a significant factor in sporting salaries.
 
Papa G said:
The difference is that in AFLW, Lesbianism is common, open and accepted.
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The bigoted presumption that LGBT people have a higher level of perversion is not ‘different’, particularly when presented as unfounded unsourced rumour.
 

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Butters Made Me Do It said:
Full time athletes are full time athletes. NFL players earn millions for 18 games a year.

‘Deserving it in the eyes of JimmyBeerCans’ isn’t a significant factor in sporting salaries.
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Well it should be! there is nothing remotely full time about an 8 week regular season.
 
JimmyBeerCans said:
Well it should be! there is nothing remotely full time about an 8 week regular season.
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I am certain AFLW players would love a 20 week season. They’re the ones arguing for it to be extended in the first place.
 
Butters Made Me Do It said:
I am certain AFLW players would love a 20 week season. They’re the ones arguing for it to be extended in the first place.
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They should be shooting for 14-15 rounds plus finals obviously gives the whole thing less of a lightning carnival feel.
 
JimmyBeerCans said:
They should be shooting for 14-15 rounds plus finals obviously gives the whole thing less of a lightning carnival feel.
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I reckon they internally worked out what the AFL might cop to and asked for that with the intention of upping that demand in future.

Unions don’t start at ‘complete socialism’ when they negotiate either
 
Butters Made Me Do It said:
I reckon they internally worked out what the AFL might cop to and asked for that with the intention of upping that demand in future.

Unions don’t start at ‘complete socialism’ when they negotiate either
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Never negotiated with the CFMEU I see.
 
Jonts said:
You're underestimating that accessibility at a young age is more important than long term career path. You could go play underage girls footy but it was it wasn't as easy as playing underage men's footy. Having heroes and people to look up to is important but they don't need to be paid professionally if you get them enough eyeballs (back to the free is good at this stage)

If it's easier/ as easy to play footy with their friends at primary school and high school/club level than to play netball/soccer/other sports that will go a longer way to increasing the standard and professionalism of AFLW than paying the current players substantially more.
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I agree that the most important aspect in terms of getting girls to play footy is accessibility and heroes/a summit to aspire to. I don't think many kids start playing any sport because they see a career pathway financially (except maybe kids pushed into sports like tennis and golf by their parents at a young age), I think the money just ends up being the bonus once you're an adult and excelling at that sport.

Having said that, the AFLW still needs to be a heavily marketed, highly visible, highly successful product before it captures the imagination of girls wanting to play sport in the way that the AFL captures the imagination of boys wanting to play sport. At the moment, is is much less visible than soccer and cricket, for example. The AFL need that to change - and a strong AFLW competition with a lengthier season and full time athletes is the best way of achieving that goal.
 
At the moment it's a two bit comp and there are already girls, and I'm sure some boys, saying I want to play footy like Tayla Harris.

Surely this is a great thing for OUR sport.
 
Eddie Dingle said:
At the moment it's a two bit comp and there are already girls, and I'm sure some boys, saying I want to play footy like Tayla Harris.

Surely this is a great thing for OUR sport.
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Yeah but what if that threatens my enormous male ego?
 

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Papa G said:
I get this is a touchy subject for you but that isn't what I'm implying.
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Papa G said:
This will cause outrage among a few of you but...

I know of a highly respected ex AFL footballer who in the end didn't let his daughter play AFLW due to the high incidence of predatory Lesbians playing the game.
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really

“high incidence of predatory lesbians”
 
AFLW needs to be the SANFL of women's sport in Australia.

It's not going to compete with world class elite women's sport like tennis, basketball or football, because those players get paid more - which means that the truly talented players are always going to go down those pathways.

However, there's nothing stopping those players who don't quite have the skill set to compete in those sports to excel at the next level down, which is where AFLW should be setting its sights. Like this:

Tier 1 (World Class):

Tennis
Basketball (WNBA)
Football (Europe leagues/NSWL)

Tier 2 (National Class):

AFLW
Netball

Tier 3 (State Class):

WNBL
W-League

It's not about gender equality. It's about how relevant each sport is, there potential market and how much of a head start they have had in terms of development. No women's sport in Australia is full time professional. Netball players get paid $27k-$30k a year for a 14 game season. WNBL players get paid $10k-$13k a year.

AFLW players get paid between $13k-$19k, or $1850-$2750 per match. The problem is that they are still only playing 7 matches a season. Bump that up to 16 matches (9 teams in 2 conferences playing each other twice), and the pay goes up to $29,600-$44,000...which would make it the highest paying women's national league in Australia, just eclipsing netball.

That to me is a good place to start. It's not professional level, but it's SANFL tier i.e. they would still have to have a part time job (that the club could organise for them through sponsorships etc).
 
Schulzenfest said:
The problem with the pay equality argument when it comes to professional sport is that 'equal pay for equal work' is not how professional sport works at all. It's a meritocracy. Dustin Martin gets paid more than Cam Sutcliffe, and rightly so. But Can Sutcliffe is a better footballer than anybody in the AFLW.

I get the growth argument as well, but the growth argument is how we ended up with the SUNS rather than a team from Tassie.
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Certainly AFLW players will rightly get more pay over time, but unlike the men's game of it being a fairly simple pays as a percentage of revenue there's:

1. How much the AFLW brings in now over costs (bugger all for the AFL directly, some to the clubs with teams)
2. How much it will in the future (it will never be in the ball park of the men's) if pays attract the best talent
3. How much a quality AFLW brings in female supporters that then follow AFL as well
4. How much a visible AFLW has parents (mothers) willing to have sons play a game now open to their daughters as well

To progress the AFLW needs to move towards being a professional league with associated pay. Given it's fairly new and the big uptake in participation from girls will take years to come through to them being playing age it doesn't need to jump hugely straight away, but something where those drafted can afford to commit to it full time. Which is at least the average wage for those working full time.

Though if they are full time professionals then there's the associated argument of when the AFLW season should be. A truncated season over summer isn't giving any impression of being professional.
 
Janus said:
AFLW needs to be the SANFL of women's sport in Australia.

It's not going to compete with world class elite women's sport like tennis, basketball or football, because those players get paid more - which means that the truly talented players are always going to go down those pathways.

However, there's nothing stopping those players who don't quite have the skill set to compete in those sports to excel at the next level down, which is where AFLW should be setting its sights. Like this:

Tier 1 (World Class):

Tennis
Basketball (WNBA)
Football (Europe leagues/NSWL)

Tier 2 (National Class):

AFLW
Netball

Tier 3 (State Class):

WNBL
W-League

It's not about gender equality. It's about how relevant each sport is, there potential market and how much of a head start they have had in terms of development. No women's sport in Australia is full time professional. Netball players get paid $27k-$30k a year for a 14 game season. WNBL players get paid $10k-$13k a year.

AFLW players get paid between $13k-$19k, or $1850-$2750 per match. The problem is that they are still only playing 7 matches a season. Bump that up to 16 matches (9 teams in 2 conferences playing each other twice), and the pay goes up to $29,600-$44,000...which would make it the highest paying women's national league in Australia, just eclipsing netball.

That to me is a good place to start. It's not professional level, but it's SANFL tier i.e. they would still have to have a part time job (that the club could organise for them through sponsorships etc).
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Why do we have to limit where we aim with women’s footy?

Being the sfanl of anything is degrading even for the lafns
 
Well AFL men get paid a pittance as well in terms of big global sports it's a flawed view
 
Papa G said:
They weren't my words
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they literally were

you could’ve said:

‘i know a crank who wouldnt let his girls play AFLW because of all the lezzos he imagines will molest them’

you actively chose to push the high incidence of predatory lesbians angle
 
Eddie Dingle said:
Why do we have to limit where we aim with women’s footy?

Being the sfanl of anything is degrading even for the lafns
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You don't have to limit it. Go for as much as you can. But it will never reach the world class level of tennis, basketball or football, because those sports are played by more countries and the best players from those countries will always gravitate toward the best tournaments/leagues, which increases their exposure and budget.

It's why AFL players don't get paid anywhere near the levels of money that professionals in other sports do - limited market (only played professionally in Australia) equals limited money. It's just the way the world works. It shouldn't always be about money, but sadly, it is.
 
The overriding message I'm taking out of this is just make all change rooms / public bathrooms unisex. No more arguments over who identifies as whatever (everyone's personal choice). And since we're (mostly except a few nut jobs) having no issues with same sex attracted people not mass perving or jumping on people there, then we should obviously have no issue with opposite sex people likewise won't be doing mass perving or jumping on people. Would be very 21st century 'leave your labels in the past'. :think:
 
Great article by Penberthy in the Tiser today, initially referencing Obama, where he discussed how more prevalent are becoming the incidences where individuals and small groups often throw terms like racism, bigotry, xenophobia, etc around like confetti, just to try to intimidate often innocent people into not feeling comfortable in expressing their views - which in many cases are the result of quite genuine discussions being undertaken, and to make a point, and rarely intended to deride or castigate others.

I have often felt that people probably need to chill a bit, before shooting from the hip in response to other people's opinions, and wrongly labelling them (or their motives) as an affront to their own supremely infallible knowledge base.

Everyone thinks they know better than anyone else what is truth and what is lies. But it all comes down in many caes to individual opinions - and who can say unequivocally which of us is right and which are right when discussing an issue?

Sometimes the real position is not at either end of a very broad spectrum, but somewhere in between, where we often never seem to meet that often.
 
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