Bluemour Melting Pot XXIX

[Metalcrusher]

I agree

I’d love him but I don’t think the $750 should be spent in that type of midfielder


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agreed.

 

[Manhattanite]

Gifs are amusing, especially when delivered with the deftness a pro. Emojis can be used by toddlers. I'd like to see some more maturity.

Bluemour by gif.

Gauntlet thrown, people!

Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[zeggie]

Would trade our first pick for Cerra in a heartbeat.

Happy to cash in Fisher.

SPS I'm on the fence.

Dow I'm starting to think needs another year with better coaching to really isolate whether he will make it or not.

 

[tragic]

I would be happy to trade a future first for Cerra. Bet on our selves. No way would i trade a top 5 pick

 

[zeggie]

Anyone know if we have advised coaching assistants etc. on the 1 August deadline?

Just read an article indicating the club had not...

 

[Coops93]

Anyone know if we have advised coaching assistants etc. on the 1 August deadline?

Just read an article indicating the club had not...

Iirc we applied for an extension as a result of our ongoing review.

 

[Gethelred]

You can make a chicken or egg case for it, are they symptomatic of a system that doesn't allow them to do it for 3 qtrs, or is it in their own makeup that limits the impact across a game?

I'd be cautious at expecting a system to fix all those players ability to impact a game instead of downhill skiing.

See, I had a bit of a theory about 2008-2012 Hawthorn, based mainly on Roughead: they were a whole team of downhill skiers, because all of a sudden they'd grow another leg after they'd kicked a goal. Roughead in particular used to kick 1 goal, and then another 4-5 after his team hit the lead.

It was Clarko's genius instead of trying to fill his side with players who weren't downhill skiers, but to manufacture game situations in which they could downhill ski for all they're worth. To have players (Hodge, Mitchell, Cyril, Franklin) who weren't downhill skiers and could be required to do the heavy lifting and to get the system working, but once it was working they just clicked into gear and thrashed their opponents.

The way this pertains to our situation right now is that we have a flock of occasionally underperforming midfielders and flankers. These players are not being paid massive amounts, nor are they demanding massive amounts or are they going to garner much in a trade situation. From here, we have a lot of choices but with these players specifically they boil down to 2: keep or ditch.

Ditching requires finding better players either via trade or the draft, and I don't think it's that easy to do.

Give them the chance under the new coach/development setup, and see if we can resurrect a career or two.

 

[Schoonerman]

Would trade our first pick for Cerra in a heartbeat.

Happy to cash in Fisher.

SPS I'm on the fence.

Dow I'm starting to think needs another year with better coaching to really isolate whether he will make it or not.

I reckon Fish, SPS and Dow could all be exceptional under a strong coach..

 

[Bic]

The 750k for Cerra must be looked at with a grain of salt. It's being reported by the media - who don't know the facts. We're about to have one of the younger lists going around. It could be front ended. It could be incentive based on awards etc. He is a READY MADE AFL level calibre midfielder. He fits the age profile of our list.

Also you need to remember, the majority of the draft pool have been affected by COVID. They have had limited exposure.

Let me put it to you - Can pick 5 be ready to go and make an impact at AFL level to propel this new coach and direction into finals? Not many can.

Cerra is ready to and has so much scope to improve. Has the opportunity as well to play in the midfield.

Let's also remember, nobody knows what our offer for Cerra is. It could be a future first. It might not be a first at all.

So if we keep pick 5 and get Cerra - I am sure everybody would be happy.

Personally I would be happy to part with pick 5 if we ended up with the calibre of a Cerra.

 

[Large Hawaiian]

My dads statement on current events at our club:

"I have been watching Carlton play since the 1960's. But I find the current board administration and players unrecognisable. They don't play with any passion and almost seem happy when they lose. Maybe their thinking about their pay packets to fall back on. The Carlton Football Club when I was a kid was a powerhouse of the competition. The benchmark of the completion. Teams did not like venturing to Princes Park for our home games. The current players are an embarrassment to the AFL. What Carlton needs is a complete cleanout. Someone needs to come to the club with a very large broom and sweep out the president, the board and administration in 1 go. We need someone like Jack Elliott or his son Tom to return to the club ASAP. Most supporters of my age have either given up or become completely dislodged with the current club. The final straw for me was the demolition of the Pratt stand recently. Apparently this was just another of Loguidice's community projects. He fails to recognise how important this stand was for old time club supporters like myself that contained the Bruce Doull and Alex Jeasoulenko suite as well as the cups. Its unforgivable. The club has lost its soul, as well as its purpose. And not surprisingly we finished well out of the finals race, yet again. How long are members going to put up with this. We need a complete revolution down at Princes Park and I'm happy to start it. These clowns that think that they perpetuate themselves inside the board room, need to be exposed to the membership. While most other clubs embark on 5 year plans to win Premierships, Carlton is on a 26 year plan and running to head in the opposite direction. Good luck, you're going to need it"

Be careful what you wish for, Jack took a long retired premiership coach for lunch a few weeks back with a “plan” to take back the club featuring a number of favourite sons and administrators. He was serious. I wish I was making this up.

 

[Schoonerman]

I’d be trading/Delisting Newnes, Gibbons, Williamson, Newman and sorry even Ed before Fish, Dow, OBrien and SPS..

 

[gab213]

Be careful what you wish for, Jack took a long retired premiership coach for lunch a few weeks back with a “plan” to take back the club featuring a number of favourite sons and administrators. He was serious. I wish I was making this up.

Haha, this was a dream you had right? There's zero chance that the members would get behind something like this.....at least i'd hope not.

 

[I bleed Blue]

Big no to Billings. Too injury prone and inconsistent

Will fit right in at Carlton

 

[Crippablues]

I’d be trading/Delisting Newnes, Gibbons, Williamson, Newman and sorry even Ed before Fish, Dow, OBrien and SPS..

Wouldn't get anything for Williamson with 1 year left, the others are out of contract. Rather stick with Williamson if we're getting eg" pick 60. Gibbons, Newnes can be out the door though

On SM-N986B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Large Hawaiian]

Haha, this was a dream you had right? There's zero chance that the members would get behind something like this.....at least i'd hope not.

It definitely happened and you are correct, nobody is getting behind it.

 

[branedotorg]

Not sold on Dow yet. He's had big qtrs but hasn't put together a game yet for me. Also seems to only have those good qtrs when things are going our way, once the opposition gets on top he goes missing. He's shown some promising signs but hasn't done it with any substance for me yet.

compared to where he was 12 months ago i'll take it. I think people are looking for positives and it shows that he is salvageable and not the write-off a lot of us suspected.

 

[Coops93]

See, I had a bit of a theory about 2008-2012 Hawthorn, based mainly on Roughead: they were a whole team of downhill skiers, because all of a sudden they'd grow another leg after they'd kicked a goal. Roughead in particular used to kick 1 goal, and then another 4-5 after his team hit the lead.

It was Clarko's genius instead of trying to fill his side with players who weren't downhill skiers, but to manufacture game situations in which they could downhill ski for all they're worth. To have players (Hodge, Mitchell, Cyril, Franklin) who weren't downhill skiers and could be required to do the heavy lifting and to get the system working, but once it was working they just clicked into gear and thrashed their opponents.

The way this pertains to our situation right now is that we have a flock of occasionally underperforming midfielders and flankers. These players are not being paid massive amounts, nor are they demanding massive amounts or are they going to garner much in a trade situation. From here, we have a lot of choices but with these players specifically they boil down to 2: keep or ditch.

Ditching requires finding better players either via trade or the draft, and I don't think it's that easy to do.

Give them the chance under the new coach/development setup, and see if we can resurrect a career or two.

Interesting theory, I think there's more to it like the players individual mentality and things like that but I can see that perspective.

You still need to have a gut of players who will do it either way, like you've said there with Hodge, Mitchell, Franklin and Cyril with probably another couple here or there. Right now I'd say the only players who butter up for better or worse would be Walsh and Weiters. I would've said Cripps a year or 2 ago, hopefully his issues now are fitness related and he can get back in that group.

It's ok to have some frontrunners but we don't have enough dependable players to support them.

 

[branedotorg]

I’d be trading/Delisting Newnes, Gibbons, Williamson, Newman and sorry even Ed before Fish, Dow, OBrien and SPS..

for list spots only, none of them have any trade value imo

 

[Gethelred]

Interesting theory, I think there's more to it like the players individual mentality and things like that but I can see that perspective.

You still need to have a gut of players who will do it either way, like you've said there with Hodge, Mitchell, Franklin and Cyril with probably another couple here or there. Right now I'd say the only players who butter up for better or worse would be Walsh and Weiters. I would've said Cripps a year or 2 ago, hopefully his issues now are fitness related and he can get back in that group.

We still need more from those guys instead of frontrunning all the time. It's ok to have some frontrunners but we don't have enough dependable guys to support them.

It's funny, but it's where we actually really miss 2020 Gibbons. He has absolutely been the one to spark us and get us going against the match trend multiple times over the past few years, but this season he's just fallen off a cliff and been allowed to stay there.

 

[Coops93]

compared to where he was 12 months ago i'll take it. I think people are looking for positives and it shows that he is salvageable and not the write-off a lot of us suspected.

Agree, I like what he's done too. Just saying he's not done enough to confirm his place yet. He's definitely shown positives and I wouldn't be getting rid just yet.

 

[Gethelred]

Interesting theory, I think there's more to it like the players individual mentality and things like that but I can see that perspective.

You still need to have a gut of players who will do it either way, like you've said there with Hodge, Mitchell, Franklin and Cyril with probably another couple here or there. Right now I'd say the only players who butter up for better or worse would be Walsh and Weiters. I would've said Cripps a year or 2 ago, hopefully his issues now are fitness related and he can get back in that group.

It's ok to have some frontrunners but we don't have enough dependable players to support them.

It's also why I'd be offering Zac Butters 800 a season for 6 years and Port our next two first round picks.

 

[Coops93]

It's funny, but it's where we actually really miss 2020 Gibbons. He has absolutely been the one to spark us and get us going against the match trend multiple times over the past few years, but this season he's just fallen off a cliff and been allowed to stay there.

It was mentioned earlier in the year but his form drop coincided directly with Betts coming into the team after what, rd 3 was it? Playing as a small fwd he was in great form, but moving up to a small high half forward role to give Betts his place he got lost.

 

[Own The Future]

Wouldn't get anything for Williamson with 1 year left, the others are out of contract. Rather stick with Williamson if we're getting eg" pick 60. Gibbons, Newnes can be out the door though

On SM-N986B using BigFooty.com mobile app

It’s a great story that he came back from such a debilitating injury, but I find Willo incredibly frustrating to watch. While I’d keep him rather than getting a 4th round pick for him, as is he is simply not a best 22 player.
The next coaching staff need to rein him in, and first and foremost teach him to know his limitations. I cannot remember the last time he was not caught HTB at least once in a game. He vastly overestimates his ability to burst through players, and it rarely works.
I know you have to live with occasional turnovers from guys who take the game on, but he just seems unwilling or unable to learn from his mistakes. If he plays within his means I see him as a nice depth player, especially if we have a better run with injury as a club.

 

[Schoonerman]

for list spots only, none of them have any trade value imo

I agree but if I had a choice I’d go with the youngsters

 

[Mr_Plow]

The 750k for Cerra must be looked at with a grain of salt. It's being reported by the media - who don't know the facts. We're about to have one of the younger lists going around. It could be front ended. It could be incentive based on awards etc. He is a READY MADE AFL level calibre midfielder. He fits the age profile of our list.

Also you need to remember, the majority of the draft pool have been affected by COVID. They have had limited exposure.

Let me put it to you - Can pick 5 be ready to go and make an impact at AFL level to propel this new coach and direction into finals? Not many can.

Cerra is ready to and has so much scope to improve. Has the opportunity as well to play in the midfield.

Let's also remember, nobody knows what our offer for Cerra is. It could be a future first. It might not be a first at all.

So if we keep pick 5 and get Cerra - I am sure everybody would be happy.

Personally I would be happy to part with pick 5 if we ended up with the calibre of a Cerra.

One of those scenarios where:

- We keep pick 5 and go the draft to hopefully pick up and develop a guy with the probability that he reaches Cerra's ceiling being quite unlikely...

or

- We trade pick 5 and steak knives for Cerra

I don't trust the club enough to take pick 5 to the draft and play with probabilities.