Traded Jacob Hopper [Trade with #53, #63 to Richmond for #31 and F1]

[Andyy]

I'm happy with the outcome.

Makes you wonder if the cap squeeze at GWS influenced the trades but hey at least they didn't have to flog off their players as cheaply as Grundy or Bowes were moved on.

Hopefully for GWS' sake they nail the draft.

Richmond has done very well when you consider they acquired Tarrant and pick 19 as part of the trade for CCJ.


As someone else posted elsewhere, Richmond have effectively traded:

IN: Taranto, Hopper, Tarrant, picks 40 + 53 + 63

OUT: 12, F1, 31, 42, 47, 70, Coleman-Jones.

 

[Giant Pete]

I tend to agree with you in that they're B+ at this stage. I think (hope) they will go that next level in a more selfless midfield group. At GWS there was too many selfish players and Taranto will be playing more midfield with us so I'm confident he atleast will go another level or bring that 2019 form with him.

No.
The problem for the Giants was we had way too many of same type… Taranto, Hopper, Ward, Coniglio, Green.
We want Callaghan in there with Green getting solid time in there. Even guys like Daniels roll through so that it’s not too same same.

I'm happy with the outcome.

Makes you wonder if the cap squeeze at GWS influenced the trades but hey at least they didn't have to flog off their players as cheaply as Grundy or Bowes were moved on.

Hopefully for GWS' sake they nail the draft.

Richmond has done very well when you consider they acquired Tarrant and pick 19 as part of the trade for CCJ.


As someone else posted elsewhere, Richmond have effectively traded:

IN: Taranto, Hopper, Tarrant, picks 40 + 53 + 63

OUT: 12, F1, 31, 42, 47, 70, Coleman-Jones.

Tarrant hasn’t been too good.

 

[Muddiemoose]

No.
The problem for the Giants was we had way too many of same type… Taranto, Hopper, Ward, Coniglio, Green.
We want Callaghan in there with Green getting solid time in there. Even guys like Daniels roll through so that it’s not too same same.

Tarrant hasn’t been too good.

Think Tarrant has been very good for us, was a little shaky early on but has really settled into our system especially in the back half of the year

Probably only had two games where you could say he lowered his colours the worst being round 5 v Adelaide where Tex kicked 5.2 on him

But otherwise he has kept basically all of direct match ups to a non factor and also contributing in attack

When other forwards have got run on us it was generally Gibcus/Broad/Balta needing to take more responsibilities due to the injury to grimes but in terms of Tarrant couldn’t ask anymore and been a fantastic pick up for us

 

[tigerfan1961]

.

Tarrant hasn’t been too good.

A clueless opinion, just wow. Aside from a poor game against Adelaide, he was bloody good value for us this season

 

[The 747]

Tigers have done well here, really strengthened a key area of weakness in their team.

Gave up a fair bit but they took a lot of kids last year.

Only query for me is that these are long-ass contracts for players who are not guns (yet).

 

[Andyy]

Tarrant hasn’t been too good.

Don't agree on this point and I'm wondering how many Richmond games you watched in their entirety?

Tarrant started slow and was probably learning our structure for the first half of the year or so.

He finished the year very well, ironically after he broke his hand.

I feel like the whole team didn't finish the year very strongly but couldn't point the finger at Tarrant myself.

 

[dean33]

Tigers have done well here, really strengthened a key area of weakness in their team.

Gave up a fair bit but they took a lot of kids last year.

Only query for me is that these are long-ass contracts for players who are not guns (yet).

Contracts that cover their prime years… 24/25 - 31/32. With the cap going up and more players retiring and easing pressure on it over the next few years it’s shrewd list management. Watch How much better our defence is next year with the extra pressure being applied in the middle. No club has fixed their glaring weakness better in this trade period than the tigers.

 

[The 747]

Contracts that cover their prime years… 24/25 - 31/32. With the cap going up and more players retiring and easing pressure on it over the next few years it’s shrewd list management. Watch How much better our defence is next year with the extra pressure being applied in the middle. No club has fixed their glaring weakness better in this trade period than the tigers.

You seem very certain about the future.

 

[Muddiemoose]

You seem very certain about the future.

Like anything, in order to improve risks must be taken otherwise staying stagnant is just as bad as activity going backwards because the rest of the comp will continue to improve regardless of what you do as a club

Will it work out? Only time will tell and I think the comp is trending to a longer contract model anyway so we may even find that risk pretty standard in a few seasons time anyway

 

[DontArgue4]

Tigers have done well here, really strengthened a key area of weakness in their team.

Gave up a fair bit but they took a lot of kids last year.

Only query for me is that these are long-ass contracts for players who are not guns (yet).

The thing is though, they are guns.

Thats why they were both being courted by several teams, including your own.

Bigfooty is the absolute best, i wish i could see the alternate universe where hopper chose the cats...

"Omg what a steal, hes a gun and makes our midfield the best in the comp"

But nah, our reality is that he chose richmond. So the sentiment is..

"Meh, hes no gun anyway"

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

If it's a Future 1st and 31 there is no way a pick is coming back, that's way under the odds

Good call again.

 

[juss]

Tigers have done well here, really strengthened a key area of weakness in their team.

Gave up a fair bit but they took a lot of kids last year.

Only query for me is that these are long-ass contracts for players who are not guns (yet).

I only worry about long contracts when I think the player is at risk of not coming on, or they have significant injury/age concerns.

I don't think either applies to Hopper/Taranto. Over a sample size of 114 (so longer than a flash in the pan), both have career averages of over 22 disposals a game, over 4 tackles and clearances a game each, and just under half a goal a game.

While that's a very basic analysis, it's a good quick snapshot that they are good inside midfielders, and coming into their prime years it's a good indication that they can do the job that will be asked of them, which will be to win contested ball, be a presence inside, tackle and win clearances.

Statistically, they compare relatively similarly to Dion Prestia who currently plays that role for us, and Trent Cotchin.

In 2022 they didn't have their best years in the B&F, as they only played 16 and 7 games respectively.
Taranto and Hopper came 3rd & 4th in their 2021 B&F
Outside top 10 (only played 11 games) & 4th in 2020
1st & 3rd in 2019 (Grand Final year)
8th & 10th in 2018 (It was their 2nd and 3rd seasons)

That's enough of a sample size to show that they are at the pointy end of performance over a period of time, and we're talking about guys who will be 25 and 26 for the entirety of the 2023 season. If you factor in the 7 year deals, we still get them for the prime years of their 26, 27, 28, 29, 30 years as inside mids, and then maybe in their seasons at 31, 32, 33 we see some decline. That being said, there's still inside mids running around in their 30s who still added great value to the team (Selwood, Mundy, Dangerfield, Pendlebury, Josh Kennedy, Ward, Cotchin, etc) in their twilight years.

Long story short, unless they get significantly affected by injury, the 7 year deal is of no concern.
And I would say that injury risk applies to any player on a long term deal, so I'm not terribly worried about that either, no more than any other player.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

2 B+ graders.

Wrong thread.
Bowes/Bruhn thread >>>>>>>>

 

[Orange crush]

Good call again.

Tbf, they are nothing picks added out of goodwill you’d think .... although they will come in nicely after the lions take the f/s picks

 

[dean33]

You seem very certain about the future.

No one can ever be 100% certain however if you aren’t bold and sit on your hands you get passed by the rest of the comp.
As a cats fan you should no doubt agree with this?

 

[juss]

Tbf, they are nothing picks added out of goodwill you’d think .... although they will come in nicely after the lions take the f/s picks

That's the thing, GWS won't use them, so they have no value to them, and the Tigers will take a couple of swings, so they add value to us this year looking for a speculative development tall, or an unexpected slider.

That's a win/win there.

 

[MisterMarcus]

The thing is though, they are guns.

Thats why they were both being courted by several teams, including your own.

Bigfooty is the absolute best, i wish i could see the alternate universe where hopper chose the cats...

"Omg what a steal, hes a gun and makes our midfield the best in the comp"

But nah, our reality is that he chose richmond. So the sentiment is..

"Meh, hes no gun anyway"

Tbf, posters on our board were pretty polarised about Hopper.

Some I agree were absolutely gung-ho for him, others thought he wasn't going to be worth the cost we'd need to pony up to get him.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

77 players were drafted in 2016. The last 2 years have been 59 and 65. This year is predicted to have some of the worst depth ever. picks in the 50s and 60s aren't going to make a rats arse of difference to the guy you pick. You'll have someone in mind and you'll get them whether with the picks you already had or the ones you just got.

So in summary. Some other guy said you wouldn't get anymore than x, you got x + a 2 trash picks that neither team will use, they thought it was worth flexing over the guy because they're a w***er, and when it was pointed out how much of a w***er they were, you're now pointing to some guy you picked up with the pick 6 years ago as though this is somehow another flex. The even funnier thing is you think we actually give a toss about graham. He was a budget option after Dunkley rejected us and before JHF wanted to come home. You're like the other Richmond w***ers who come into every thread and starts out by saying 'does anyone want to talk about Richmond'.

Nice melt.lol

 

[Orange crush]

It’s weird .... tiger and giant fans all seem pretty happy ... other clubs sounding offended

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Tbf, they are nothing picks added out of goodwill you’d think .... although they will come in nicely after the lions take the f/s picks

Yeah i know.
We may use one if a certain player we like is there.
If not we'll just upgrade rookies and keep one open for the mid season.

 

[The 747]

The thing is though, they are guns.

Thats why they were both being courted by several teams, including your own.

Bigfooty is the absolute best, i wish i could see the alternate universe where hopper chose the cats...

"Omg what a steal, hes a gun and makes our midfield the best in the comp"

But nah, our reality is that he chose richmond. So the sentiment is..

"Meh, hes no gun anyway"

Rah rah rah Geelong this, we are seh persecuted. Hard to have any form of reasonable discussion with many Tiger fans on here.

 

[DontArgue4]

Tbf, posters on our board were pretty polarised about Hopper.

Some I agree were absolutely gung-ho for him, others thought he wasn't going to be worth the cost we'd need to pony up to get him.

Not being "worth the cost" you'd need to get him doesnt mean he isnt a gun. In the end the deal that got him was absolutely worth it.

A future first, likely to be a fairly late one, plus pick 31 is nothing in reality considering where our list is at, and it would have been the same for you.

To turn around after and try tell us its not a massive pick up is just sour grapes, thats a fact.

 

[The 747]

No one can ever be 100% certain however if you aren’t bold and sit on your hands you get passed by the rest of the comp.
As a cats fan you should no doubt agree with this?

Sure, but your post seemed very certain about that future.

 

[DontArgue4]

Rah rah rah Geelong this, we are seh persecuted. Hard to have any form of reasonable discussion with many Tiger fans on here.

Truth hurts, huh?

 

[The 747]

I only worry about long contracts when I think the player is at risk of not coming on, or they have significant injury/age concerns.

I don't think either applies to Hopper/Taranto. Over a sample size of 114 (so longer than a flash in the pan), both have career averages of over 22 disposals a game, over 4 tackles and clearances a game each, and just under half a goal a game.

While that's a very basic analysis, it's a good quick snapshot that they are good inside midfielders, and coming into their prime years it's a good indication that they can do the job that will be asked of them, which will be to win contested ball, be a presence inside, tackle and win clearances.

Statistically, they compare relatively similarly to Dion Prestia who currently plays that role for us, and Trent Cotchin.

In 2022 they didn't have their best years in the B&F, as they only played 16 and 7 games respectively.
Taranto and Hopper came 3rd & 4th in their 2021 B&F
Outside top 10 (only played 11 games) & 4th in 2020
1st & 3rd in 2019 (Grand Final year)
8th & 10th in 2018 (It was their 2nd and 3rd seasons)

That's enough of a sample size to show that they are at the pointy end of performance over a period of time, and we're talking about guys who will be 25 and 26 for the entirety of the 2023 season. If you factor in the 7 year deals, we still get them for the prime years of their 26, 27, 28, 29, 30 years as inside mids, and then maybe in their seasons at 31, 32, 33 we see some decline. That being said, there's still inside mids running around in their 30s who still added great value to the team (Selwood, Mundy, Dangerfield, Pendlebury, Josh Kennedy, Ward, Cotchin, etc) in their twilight years.

Long story short, unless they get significantly affected by injury, the 7 year deal is of no concern.
And I would say that injury risk applies to any player on a long term deal, so I'm not terribly worried about that either, no more than any other player.

Well yes, injury is the main concern I was thinking of, particularly as Hopper seems to get hurt a lot. It's a long time to be paying a player if something goes wrong.

But then again the Tigers are very well run these days so I am sure they have thought it through and decided the risk is worth it.