Autopsy Round 9 - St Kilda v Carlton *SPUD'S GAME*

[Teflon]

I wouldn't be so reckless. Hill offers (and disclaimer, he is old), way more value than Travaglia or Wilson, right now, if getting 4 points next week is a priority.

You watch the game ? I mean seriously?
Go back to Dogs game too - liability in that also
Hill is cream on the cake we ain’t got the cake
Looks good when we are 8 goals up breezing down the wing under no pressure
Put ANY heat on him and he crumbles
I think he’s overrated on output but each to their own
He’ll probably cream West Coast but when quality oppo comes …judge him then

 

[gringo2011]

Honestly feels like his ceiling is Tom Scully, very similar players in a bunch of ways. Get to be a strong B grade winger who runs all day and fills the right holes but never quite blows teams away.

He has a bit of X factor that isn't showing through this year. He can kick bags of goals and can run. His ceiling is unlimited. Tom Scully was a pretty limited footballer. An athlete who chose to play footy.

 

[gringo2011]

Need to go faster and need more speed

We had trouble breaking through their defensive wall. Looked similar to how Bevo got us. Max King or a central tall to spill or score would have been super handy.

Not sure speed would have helped as much as contested ball winning through the midfield.

 

[gringo2011]

He was terrible
And don’t give me the “he was creating”
Every time he touched the ball you knew Carlton were getting it back
Was with a Blues mate who asked “when’s this guys expensive contract up” fair question
His disposal under no pressure is overrated

A huge difference in playing style is that Carlton players all ran to space to create options ahead of the ball carrier. Our guys have to hold on too long because no-one finds space or provides options ahead of the ball carrier. Hill was shit but again he's often getting the ball because he's the only one running to provide a get out. He's then holding on to the ball waiting for options that don't open up.

Byrnes is a near identical type of option provider. He's probably suffering from the same symptom a lot of the time and both would be absolutely cooked from gut running 300 meters to get into space. Nas and Sincs will run past for an overlap but neither are great space finders. LOC is a naturally smart player because he does that space finding instinctively.

 

[gringo2011]

I like Brad but he could have easily been the difference in a fifteen point game.
He turned so many attacks into desperate defence.

I think our youth quota was too high. You can carry about 4 to 6 under 50 games players if the rest of the squad is well drilled and experienced. We had too many on-ball especially.

Boxshall, Collard, Garcia, LOC, Wilson, Hammer, Phillipou, Hall all under 50 games. 4 of them under 20 games.

Then a big pool under 70 games like Owens, Stocker, Sharman, Byrnes, Windhager etc.

Then the senior guys and Nas who's on about 75 games. Youth are going to always be up and down in their output until they get up around 100 games unless you find a star like Nas.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

We had trouble breaking through their defensive wall. Looked similar to how Bevo got us. Max King or a central tall to spill or score would have been super handy.

Not sure speed would have helped as much as contested ball winning through the midfield.

It is also not helping that Marhsall has not been himself taking those contested grabs on the wings.

 

[BrutThough]

I think our youth quota was too high. You can carry about 4 to 6 under 50 games players if the rest of the squad is well drilled and experienced. We had too many on-ball especially.

Boxshall, Collard, Garcia, LOC, Wilson, Hammer, Phillipou, Hall all under 50 games. 4 of them under 20 games.

Then a big pool under 70 games like Owens, Stocker, Sharman, Byrnes, Windhager etc.

Then the senior guys and Nas who's on about 75 games. Youth are going to always be up and down in their output until they get up around 100 games unless you find a star like Nas.

Or even just distributed better in the 22. Having 2 of them in the main midfield rotation isn't sustainable because they don't have consistency yet. Ideally, we would have someone else who can help bridge that expereince gap so we only have 1 of Garcia or Box in there at a time instead of both.

 

[Diehard Saint]

I think our youth quota was too high. You can carry about 4 to 6 under 50 games players if the rest of the squad is well drilled and experienced. We had too many on-ball especially.

Boxshall, Collard, Garcia, LOC, Wilson, Hammer, Phillipou, Hall all under 50 games. 4 of them under 20 games.

Then a big pool under 70 games like Owens, Stocker, Sharman, Byrnes, Windhager etc.

Then the senior guys and Nas who's on about 75 games. Youth are going to always be up and down in their output until they get up around 100 games unless you find a star like Nas.

Definite balance between blooding the youth, but still trying to win.
Too many kids in the midfield is a problem.
I expect to see Clarke back in and Jones, potentially the sub, as he is a good one.
At the same time I would like to persist with Boxshall.
This is a must win game.

 

[gringo2011]

It is also not helping that Marhsall has not been himself taking those contested grabs on the wings.

Wood missing not helping either. Wood and Byrnes are the two best kicks inside 50 at the club. A few times Byrnes had sprinted into space out on a flank and teammates didn't spot him before blazing away and dropping it straight to Carlton's pool of tall defenders. Getting it into his hands would have given us a potential mark inside 50. Just poor decision making.

 

[gringo2011]

Definite balance between blooding the youth, but still trying to win.
Too many kids in the midfield is a problem.
I expect to see Clarke back in and Jones, potentially the sub, as he is a good one.
At the same time I would like to persist with Boxshall.
This is a must win game.

Jones or Clark for either Hugo or Boxshall would have at least provided another option to change things ups.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Jones or Clark for either Hugo or Boxshall would have at least provided another option to change things ups.

Higgins could b a problem with his calf. Can Garcia move forward and persist with Boxshall?

ETA for Butler?

 

[gringo2011]

Higgins could b a problem with his calf. Can Garcia move forward and persist with Boxshall?

ETA for Butler?

I think Said was supposed to be a small forward/mid. Perhaps get a look at him even.

 

[BrutThough]

I think Said was supposed to be a small forward/mid. Perhaps get a look at him even.

He's been out with a calf.

 

[Diehard Saint]

I think Said was supposed to be a small forward/mid. Perhaps get a look at him even.

Forgot about him

 

[jwikked]

Forgot about him

I had no idea who he was until I saw him on the injury list lol

 

[Saint Shags]

Cripps - 21 CBAs and 3 centre clearances. Additionally, 26 disposals and 15 contested possessions.

Steele - 22 CBAs and 0 centre clearances. Additionally, 20 disposals and 7 contested possessions.

He’s not captaining this side and occupying over 90% CBAs to nullify an elite mid every week, and even if he is he’s failing most weeks at doing that and showing accountability to his match up.

I read we should be giving Steele his flowers. Seriously?

I'd look at all the numbers. Not just ones that suit your argument.
Was its Steele's best game? No.
Did Cripps own us? No.

I could argue that with Cripps playing as second ruck that his clearance numbers and contested possessions are somewhat inflated.

I could also make the argument that Steele had more impact on the game than Cripps.
42% disposal effectiveness compared to 70%
4 turnovers to 2
2 marks to 6
Intercept possessions 2 to 4
Score involvements 4 to 7.

This pile on at present is just a tad over the top.

Edit: just to further the argument. Both AFL ratings and Champion Data also give Steele a better game than Cripps.

 

[sauce_head]

He's looked better as a defender but he's still average there and poor as a forward...

He’s a stop gap. Really we have nobody better than him to replace him with. At least you know he will try.

 

[sauce_head]

We really lacked any dare tonight. Didn’t even feel like we were trying to win at times.

How many inside 45m kicks did we take?
Why were so many of our kicks inside 50 deep into the pockets?

It seemed like coaching instructions.

agree. It was almost as if we decided to play more like Freo last week than ourselves. Very strange. I doubt it was coaching instructed though.

 

[sauce_head]

Sharman is the best forward on our entire list.

Brad Hill and Darcy Wilson are scarily similar, both can absolutely butcher the ball and have zero interest in the contest.

Not sure I’ve been to a game where I’ve been more frustrated watching. The Owens free out of the middle which he then underkicked by about 5 metres just killed us. Watching us constantly switch the ball and switch it back to end up in the same place we started was infuriating. Not sure if it was the game plan or if we were scared to move the ball or what.

Byrnes was very good and I’m not a big fan of his. Caminiti is an awful awful awful forward, he has to be a defender or in the VFL.

Phillipou needs to be in the midfield next week. I’d give Hill a rest, bring in Travaglia. Give Heath a game instead of Caminiti for a week & see how he goes. Tauru in after his suspension.

We aren’t winning the flag in 2025, give our top 10 picks a chance to develop in the AFL.

Disappointing result, on to next week!

Higgo is the best forward on our list by a county mile.

There is nobody to replace Caminiti. When there is he will be gone.

 

[SaintsofSteel]

Richmond just beat WCE by 2 points. Without sounding overly negative I have a feeling we will be the first team to lose to WCE this year.

 

[Teflon]

A huge difference in playing style is that Carlton players all ran to space to create options ahead of the ball carrier. Our guys have to hold on too long because no-one finds space or provides options ahead of the ball carrier. Hill was shit but again he's often getting the ball because he's the only one running to provide a get out. He's then holding on to the ball waiting for options that don't open up.

Byrnes is a near identical type of option provider. He's probably suffering from the same symptom a lot of the time and both would be absolutely cooked from gut running 300 meters to get into space. Nas and Sincs will run past for an overlap but neither are great space finders. LOC is a naturally smart player because he does that space finding instinctively.

That’s all true except I’m talking about where he had options and simply kicked to the opponents or missed target - at the game live multiple times under limited to sometimes no pressure
He’s thinking going forward is hit and miss it’s execution and he butchered it at crucial times
Agree he was shit

 

[Teflon]

Richmond just beat WCE by 2 points. Without sounding overly negative I have a feeling we will be the first team to lose to WCE this year.

IF on our own re bound we can’t bounce back and crush this lot we should fold
No more excuses- don’t give a fck what Richmond did
If we can’t stand up fold

 

[SaintlyHymns]

Or even just distributed better in the 22. Having 2 of them in the main midfield rotation isn't sustainable because they don't have consistency yet. Ideally, we would have someone else who can help bridge that expereince gap so we only have 1 of Garcia or Box in there at a time instead of both.

Made even more apparent when Steele and Macrae are getting beaten around the ball and one of them goes to rest, to be replaced by a player with less than 20 games.

Thought Sinclair made a real difference when he went in but then we lacked drive off half back. Rob Peter to pay Paul.

 

[MOLTEN GANGLANDS]

Richmond just beat WCE by 2 points. Without sounding overly negative I have a feeling we will be the first team to lose to WCE this year.

lol

 

[SainterinSydney]

Richmond just beat WCE by 2 points. Without sounding overly negative I have a feeling we will be the first team to lose to WCE this year.

If we lose, the pitchforks will be out