Have Richmond passed North and west coast

[bzparkes]

Now can you put together the eagles 25 and under team so we can have a look and please dont include rubbish thats getting delisted at the end of the year as we all know who they are

bzparkes​

We have 21 players 22 and under. Work it out yourself.

I've already covered the delistings.

 

[Morro]

So much further ahead they won by 2 points, at home, vs the worst team of the AFL era.

Rebuild over, well done

One game to make your point isnt the flex you think it is.

Lets use the suns game based on your flex. We are basically a top 4 team, great

 

[THE_GUN]

We have 21 players 22 and under. Work it out yourself.

I've already covered the delistings.

And

We have similar , Not hard to work out mate
you are on this thread arguing this point so stop wasting time and get to work

 

[Shueygod]

Now can you put together the eagles 25 and under team so we can have a look and please dont include rubbish thats getting delisted at the end of the year as we all know who they are

bzparkes​

25 and under is genuinely a ridiculous number when we’re discussing rebuilds. List Richmond’s 22 and under and I’ll do the same.

Well i would say he has played as much midfield in 2025 as Harley Reid

you can read into that how you like

Reid’s averaging 3x the clearances, must not be much chop as a midfielder if he’s been in there as much.

 

[THE_GUN]

Cant believe you guys still cant make a team 25 and under yet

It will be a great laugh looking at the names and seeing which survive the cull at the end of the year

 

[Shueygod]

Cant believe you guys still cant make a team 25 and under yet

It will be a great laugh looking at the names and seeing which survive the cull at the end of the year

Eagles 22 and under team:
Bolded currently best 22
Italics played this season

Hough - Brock - Ginbey
Johnston - Maric - Allan
Davis - Reid - Dewar
Long - A.Reid - Brockman
Shanahan - J.Williams - Champion
Livingstone - Hewett - Gross
Hall - Grego - Chesser

Needs are a young ruckman, a KPD, and one elite mid (assuming Reid stays and Hewett continues on his trajectory).

 

[THE_GUN]

Eagles 22 and under team:
Bolded currently best 22
Italics played this season

Hough - Brock - Ginbey
Johnston - Maric - Allan
Davis - Reid - Dewar
Long - A.Reid - Brockman
Shanahan - J.Williams - Champion
Livingstone - Hewett - Gross
Hall - Grego - Chesser

Needs are a young ruckman, a KPD, and one elite mid (assuming Reid stays and Hewett continues on his trajectory).

Thats 21 players ?
Doesnt the eagles have enough players to make a compete team ?

I named 23 for Richmond plus 4 emergencies
That is an extremely shallow talent pool and alot of boys that were late draft picks

 

[Shueygod]

Thats 21 players ?
Doesnt the eagles have enough players to make a compete team ?

I named 23 for Richmond plus 4 emergencies
That is an extremely shallow talent pool and alot of boys that were late draft picks

Richmond have 27 players 22 or under do they? Does it matter if they’re late draft picks when they’ve shown they are afl quality like Maric, J.Williams, Hough etc.

 

[THE_GUN]

Richmond have 27 players 22 or under do they? Does it matter if they’re late draft picks when they’ve shown they are afl quality like Maric, J.Williams, Hough etc.

Perhaps you didnt read my posts properly 25 and under

 

[Shueygod]

Perhaps you didnt read my posts properly 25 and under

I just don’t think including a 25 year old Balta is very indicative of a rebuild.

 

[spky1234]

Feeling free to list the Tigers future midfield once Hopper, Taranto and Nankervis are in decline and then retire?

Sounds like it's all happened already.

Just didn't see too many young mids playing last weekend who will lead the revival.

Why are people acting like Taranto and Hopper are 35 on this forum?

We have 2 top 5 picks likely to be top end midfield talents + Lalor, Smillie and Hotton.

Of course none are guarantees, but we will have top talented midfielders entering the system with protection from 2 guys in their prime.

Whole forum seems to be all about the quantity of players under a certain age, completely omitting their entire draft range, and junior history. Most of our 1st rounders from 2024 have played a handful of games, or not played yet - why are these guys with enormous upside being compared to Eagles youngsters who have spent years in the system.

The fact is the draft class that we haven't fully see develop, the quality of draftees is vast, and that disparity is yet to be seen.

 

[Daka]

I just don’t think including a 25 year old Balta is very indicative of a rebuild.

Since when is 25 years old over the hill... he is in his prime should be for the next 5-6 years.

 

[spky1234]

Why are people acting like Taranto and Hopper are 35 on this forum?

We have 2 top 5 picks likely to be top end midfield talents + Lalor, Smillie and Hotton.

Of course none are guarantees, but we will have top talented midfielders entering the system with protection from 2 guys in their prime.

Whole forum seems to be all about the quantity of players under a certain age, completely omitting their entire draft range, and junior history. Most of our 1st rounders from 2024 have played a handful of games, or not played yet - why are these guys with enormous upside being compared to Eagles youngsters who have spent years in the system.

The fact is the draft class that we haven't fully see develop, the quality of draftees is vast, and that disparity is yet to be seen.

Why are people acting like Taranto and Hopper are 35 on this forum?

We have 2 top 5 picks likely to be top end midfield talents + Lalor, Smillie and Hotton.

Of course none are guarantees, but we will have top talented midfielders entering the system with protection from 2 guys in their prime.

Whole forum seems to be all about the quantity of players under a certain age, completely omitting their entire draft range, and junior history. Most of our 1st rounders from 2024 have played a handful of games, or not played yet - why are these guys with enormous upside being compared to Eagles youngsters who have spent years in the system.

The fact is the draft class that we haven't fully see develop, the quality of draftees is vast, and that disparity is yet to be seen.

22 unders.
West Coast:
Lucca Greggo - Pick 48
Tom Gross - Pick 46 - Looks promising
Jobe Shanahan - Pick 30 - Was rated very highly in the draft, slipped due to attitude?
Hamish Davis - Pick 65 - Very late pick
Bo Allan - Pick 16 - Only 'top' talent from 2024
Archer Reid - Pick 30 - Showed signs
Harvey Johnston - Pick 49 - Never heard of him
Clay Hall - Pick 38 - Showed a bit
Harley Reid - Generational talent (Staying?)
Ginbey - pick 9 - Looks a good defender, not quite sure he's a mid
Hewett - Pick 14 - Showing awesome signs
Ryan Maric - Looks terrific

Been in the system 3-4 years, draft range doesn't really matter anymore:
Noah Long - Playing WAFL
Tyrell Dewar - Showed a bit
Harry Barnett - Played 2 games
Jack Williams - 16 goals in 18 games last year, 8 goals in 6 games this year - Could be good?
Rhett Bazzo - Playing WAFL
Campbell Chesser - Looks a bust
Brady Hough - Looks a very good player
Sandy Brock - SSP recruit. Played a decent game on the weekend.
Tyler Brockman - A lot of potential.

Maric, Ginbey, Hewett, Reid, Hough are the only bankable players here I'd have in this lot outside of the 2024 draft.

 

[spky1234]

22 unders.
West Coast:
Lucca Greggo - Pick 48
Tom Gross - Pick 46 - Looks promising
Jobe Shanahan - Pick 30 - Was rated very highly in the draft, slipped due to attitude?
Hamish Davis - Pick 65 - Very late pick
Bo Allan - Pick 16 - Only 'top' talent from 2024
Archer Reid - Pick 30 - Showed signs
Harvey Johnston - Pick 49 - Never heard of him
Clay Hall - Pick 38 - Showed a bit
Harley Reid - Generational talent (Staying?)
Ginbey - pick 9 - Looks a good defender, not quite sure he's a mid
Hewett - Pick 14 - Showing awesome signs
Ryan Maric - Looks terrific

Been in the system 3-4 years, draft range doesn't really matter anymore:
Noah Long - Playing WAFL
Tyrell Dewar - Showed a bit
Harry Barnett - Played 2 games
Jack Williams - 16 goals in 18 games last year, 8 goals in 6 games this year - Could be good?
Rhett Bazzo - Playing WAFL
Campbell Chesser - Looks a bust
Brady Hough - Looks a very good player
Sandy Brock - SSP recruit. Played a decent game on the weekend.
Tyler Brockman - A lot of potential.

Maric, Ginbey, Hewett, Reid, Hough are the only bankable players here I'd have in this lot outside of the 2024 draft.

Richmond have Tom Brown, Seth Campbell and Josh Gibcus (return from injury is a concern) as bankable players.
With Sam Banks, Judson Clarke and Kane McAulliffe as the only others with potential.

But the 2024 draft classes are night and day. So I'd say quite confidently Richmonds u22's look to have more potential.

 

[bzparkes]

Since when is 25 years old over the hill... he is in his prime should be for the next 5-6 years.

How long does the average rebuild take?

If Richmond started it last year, those blokes would be in their 30s come time to contend, if it goes well.

 

[bzparkes]

22 unders.
West Coast:
Lucca Greggo - Pick 48
Tom Gross - Pick 46 - Looks promising
Jobe Shanahan - Pick 30 - Was rated very highly in the draft, slipped due to attitude?
Hamish Davis - Pick 65 - Very late pick
Bo Allan - Pick 16 - Only 'top' talent from 2024
Archer Reid - Pick 30 - Showed signs
Harvey Johnston - Pick 49 - Never heard of him
Clay Hall - Pick 38 - Showed a bit
Harley Reid - Generational talent (Staying?)
Ginbey - pick 9 - Looks a good defender, not quite sure he's a mid
Hewett - Pick 14 - Showing awesome signs
Ryan Maric - Looks terrific

Been in the system 3-4 years, draft range doesn't really matter anymore:
Noah Long - Playing WAFL
Tyrell Dewar - Showed a bit
Harry Barnett - Played 2 games
Jack Williams - 16 goals in 18 games last year, 8 goals in 6 games this year - Could be good?
Rhett Bazzo - Playing WAFL
Campbell Chesser - Looks a bust
Brady Hough - Looks a very good player
Sandy Brock - SSP recruit. Played a decent game on the weekend.
Tyler Brockman - A lot of potential.

Maric, Ginbey, Hewett, Reid, Hough are the only bankable players here I'd have in this lot outside of the 2024 draft.

No players are 'bankable' until they've done something at AFL level.

 

[Rich01]

How long does the average rebuild take?

If Richmond started it last year, those blokes would be in their 30s come time to contend, if it goes well.

Yup, full rebuilds should take 7-8 years. Ours started last year.
Which explains the glut of 19 year olds we have on our list. West Coasts started three years ago. Which explains why they have more under 22s on their list. Old mate Shuey doesn’t seem to understand this.

Clubs should be contending for a flag when their year one rebuild group hits the 25-27 year mark if they have done it correctly.

 

[bzparkes]

Yup, full rebuilds should take 7-8 years. Ours started last year.
Which explains the glut of 19 year olds we have on our list. West Coasts started three years ago. Which explains why they have more under 22s on their list. Old mate Shuey doesn’t seem to understand this.

Clubs should be contending for a flag when their year one rebuild group hits the 25-27 year mark if they have done it correctly.

What glut?

Also, now that we've established they take 7-8 years, why are 25yo's being included, when they'll be lucky to still be playing then?

 

[Rich01]

What glut?

Also, now that we've established they take 7-8 years, why are 25yo's being included, when they'll be lucky to still be playing then?

Huh? Where did I refer to 25 year olds?
Why don’t you read my posts before responding?

 

[ShereKhan]

Richmond havent even bottomed out yet.

Starting centre square combo Nankervis, Hopper, Taranto plus Ralfsmith and Ross. Pretty mature group that.

Up against Flynn, Hutchings, Liam Ryan, Brockman, Hough, Harley, and Hewett.

And we lost by 2 points. Away at the MCG.

Just pause and think about that Tigers fans.

You just won, at home, with your best available midfield against a very raw, young and developing midfield group.

And needed a non existent 50m penalty to do it.

So not sure why Tigers fans think they are miles and years ahead. They are still relying on an aging midfield core.

The Richmond team was slightly younger and less experienced on average than the Eagles team on the weekend. Eagles are 0-9. Tigers are 3-6 having beaten top-4 team GC, finals aspirant Carlton and Eagles.

And 'best available midfield'...hmmmm.... Prestia is not a bad player. And McCauliffe had 15 x CBA's (he's 20yo and has played 10 games). Sims had 7 (19yo and 1) and Lalor 4 (18yo and 8). Even Dow had 13 (23yo and 43). With Lalor to play more midfield when he builds his tank, and Smillie and Hotton to come in (picks 7 and 12) there's a lot to like about our future midfield.

And Hutchinson didn't attend a CBA. But 27yo Jack Graham attended 11. So your 'very raw, young and developing midfield group regularly included: Flynn (27yo), Ryan (28yo), Graham (27yo) and Williams (25yo).

But yes, overall we had more experience in our midfield, but that's just one part of the ground...what about our forward line? There's the very experienced Lynch, then:

Faull (19yo and 5 games).
Campbell (20yo & 30).
Lalor (18yo & 8).
Sims (19yo and 1).
Green (21 & 15).
Mansell (24 & 29).

So outside Lynch the 6 x forwards had a combined 88 x games - yet we still kicked a winning score.

Eagles forward line at stages contained:
Waterman (27 and 110).
Owies (28 and 81).
Ryan (28 and 112).
Cripps (33 and 260).
Kelly (30 and 151) *played forward on the weekend.
Williams (25 and 77).

So regardless of Richmond's midfield or defensive experience/quality, we are rarely going to kick big scores with such a young and inexperienced forward line.

So Eagles midfield future looks to lack elite young quality outside Reid. And Yeo looks cooked, Kelly disinterested, Sheed cooked, Graham tried hard but a battler and Baker is not a midfielder.

And Eagles forward line is still very reliant on 27yo Waterman, 26yo Allen (probably gone), 33yo Cripps, 28yo Ryan and 28yo Owies. Can't see much elite young quality to be overly optimistic about, albeit I'm sure one or two of the youngsters will surprise.

We can slice or dice lists however we like, but at this stage the bottom line is Eagles 0-9 and Richmond 3-6, with Richmond having just taken 7 top-30 players in the draft and holding 2 x top-4 picks this draft. Meanwhile the Eagles are losing their captain at season's end and likely Harely Reid end of this season or next.

 

[bzparkes]

So Eagles midfield future looks to lack elite young quality outside Reid. And Yeo looks cooked, Kelly disinterested, Sheed cooked, Graham tried hard but a battler and Baker is not a midfielder.

Where's Richmond's young mids?

Lalor, outside of a couple of games, has been mostly invisible.

Smillie's getting mid-teens possessions in the VFL.

Is there anyone else?

The midfield's being carried by Nankervis, Hopper and Taranto.

WCE have Reid, Hutchinson, Hewett and now Hough all going through there, with Brockman going in there and having a big impact on clearances.

Then we have Hall and Gross putting up big numbers in the WAFL for first and second year players, with Grego(another first year) having some standout games playing midfield also.

And Eagles forward line is still very reliant on 27yo Waterman, 26yo Allen (probably gone), 33yo Cripps, 28yo Ryan and 28yo Owies. Can't see much elite young quality to be overly optimistic about, albeit I'm sure one or two of the youngsters will surprise.

Reliant on Waterman, yes, because he's an AA forward.

Not sure if you've watched us this year but Allen's struggled up forward and is now playing back.

Jack Williams has been playing better, although dropped for Bailey Williams on the weekend, as they're both ruck/forwards. JWill should be playing in front of Reid IMO, with Reid and BWill competing for the same spot instead.

Archer Reid has shown enough to suggest he'll be a good player long term.

Owies has been crap and Ryan's been playing up the field, played mid on the weekend to great effect, expect him to play more there..

Cripps the only one of the old brigade playing mostly as a forward, who's still kicking goals. I guess he'll be missed but most are calling for him to be out to give Malakai Champion(regularly in our bests in the WAFL) to be given a chance instead.


Not saying Richmond don't have quality coming through but it's a bit rich to dismiss a team's young players because you don't know anything about them, whilst you pump your own.

 

[ShereKhan]

Reid, Hewett, Hall, Gross, Allan, Hutch, Hough (?), Ginbey (?), if we’re naming Campbell might as well throw Brockman in there.

Eagles 22 and under team:
Bolded currently best 22
Italics played this season

Hough - Brock - Ginbey
Johnston - Maric - Allan
Davis - Reid - Dewar
Long - A.Reid - Brockman
Shanahan - J.Williams - Champion
Livingstone - Hewett - Gross
Hall - Grego - Chesser

Needs are a young ruckman, a KPD, and one elite mid (assuming Reid stays and Hewett continues on his trajectory).

I'll review those that have played:

Hough. Looks average. Playing a bit of midfield in 2025. Has never kicked a goal. 6 x coaches votes in 62 games.
Ginbey. Looked like becoming a quality wing / onballer, but now playing defence. 2 x coaches votes in 42 games. Not sure what level he gets to, but won't be in the midfield.
Maric. Showing good signs, albeit gotta be careful with stats, as in the last 7 x games he's had 127 kicks. 52 from kick-outs. At 196cm he's had only 5 x defensive 1v1 contests and averages 1.7 spoils per games - so not sure if he's a KPD or going to be more of a 3rd man-up type spare man? Looks promising.
Reid. Elite quality but playing mostly C-grade footy in 2025. Badly need to keep him or rebuild hits ground zero when he leaves. Will be a superstar when he matures.
A. Reid. Very raw. Has kicked 4 goals in 9 games, averaging 6 touches and 2 marks. Far too early to judge.
Brockman. 6 goals in his 16 games for Eagles. 2 x coaches votes in his 42 career games. Looking pretty average.
J Williams. Averaging 8 touches a game. 29 goals in 35 games and only 3 x SI per game. Too early to judge entirely, but hasn't shown elite traits and has kicked 2+ goals in only 4 of his 35 games.
Hewett. High draft picks that has shown glimpses, and if he remains fit might become a quality midfielder. Jury is still out but he's promising and could be very good if his body holds up.

From 2015-2022, the failed top-30 picks are going to prove really costly, as they'd all be 22-28yo and at their peak now:
Partington, Venables, Brander, Allen (win), Ryan (win), O'Neill, Foley, Chesser, Ginbey (?), Hewett (?), Barnett, Burgiel. That's 2 x wins, 2 x question marks and 8 x fails. Couple that with trading away 2 x top-3 picks in recent years and it's looking pretty dire.

 

[bzparkes]

I'll review those that have played:

Hough. Looks average. Playing a bit of midfield in 2025. Has never kicked a goal. 6 x coaches votes in 62 games.
Ginbey. Looked like becoming a quality wing / onballer, but now playing defence. 2 x coaches votes in 42 games. Not sure what level he gets to, but won't be in the midfield.
Maric. Showing good signs, albeit gotta be careful with stats, as in the last 7 x games he's had 127 kicks. 52 from kick-outs. At 196cm he's had only 5 x defensive 1v1 contests and averages 1.7 spoils per games - so not sure if he's a KPD or going to be more of a 3rd man-up type spare man? Looks promising.
Reid. Elite quality but playing mostly C-grade footy in 2025. Badly need to keep him or rebuild hits ground zero when he leaves. Will be a superstar when he matures.
A. Reid. Very raw. Has kicked 4 goals in 9 games, averaging 6 touches and 2 marks. Far too early to judge.
Brockman. 6 goals in his 16 games for Eagles. 2 x coaches votes in his 42 career games. Looking pretty average.
J Williams. Averaging 8 touches a game. 29 goals in 35 games and only 3 x SI per game. Too early to judge entirely, but hasn't shown elite traits and has kicked 2+ goals in only 4 of his 35 games.
Hewett. High draft picks that has shown glimpses, and if he remains fit might become a quality midfielder. Jury is still out but he's promising and could be very good if his body holds up.

From 2015-2022, the failed top-30 picks are going to prove really costly, as they'd all be 22-28yo and at their peak now:
Partington, Venables, Brander, Allen (win), Ryan (win), O'Neill, Foley, Chesser, Ginbey (?), Hewett (?), Barnett, Burgiel. That's 2 x wins, 2 x question marks and 8 x fails. Couple that with trading away 2 x top-3 picks in recent years and it's looking pretty dire.

There's no question marks on Hewett and Gibney. Rubbish take.

Ditto on Hough looking 'average'. Been moved to the midfield but due to being a stopper previously, hasn't got the plaudits from Oppo he deserves. Probably end up AA back pick in a year or 2 if he stays there but looks like they want him as an accountable midfielder.

There's certainly been too many misses in the 2nd round though, nobody will disagree on that, which is why our list profile is half the list being 22 and under, with 3 or so players in the 25-27 range and the rest being old.

 

[Scotland]

In 2 drafts, we took 13 kids all rated in the top 30, takes most clubs 5 drafts to achieve this.

Not sure why anyone would dismiss 2021 as not being youth.

OK?

Richmond used picks 9, 17, 28, 29, 30 in 2021 and 1, 7, 12, 14, 21, 23, 28 in 2024. 12 picks.

In the same period WC used 14, 9, 14, 23, 29, 1, 30, 16, 30. 9 picks.

No one really cares about "top 30" picks from 4 years ago. Brady Hough was pick 31 and is great. Campbell Chesser was pick 14 and is not guaranteed to be on the list next year. Sam Banks was great on the weekend but two of Richmond's 2021 picks aren't even playing currently.

The reality is no one talks about Richmond's 2021 "youth" because of topping up with Taranto and Hopper after that. People think rightly or wrongly Richmond started rebuilding in 2024 because in the AFL you start rebuilding the moment you are shit.

 

[ShereKhan]

Where's Richmond's young mids?

Lalor, outside of a couple of games, has been mostly invisible.

Smillie's getting mid-teens possessions in the VFL.

Is there anyone else?

The midfield's being carried by Nankervis, Hopper and Taranto.

WCE have Reid, Hutchinson, Hewett and now Hough all going through there, with Brockman going in there and having a big impact on clearances.

Then we have Hall and Gross putting up big numbers in the WAFL for first and second year players, with Grego(another first year) having some standout games playing midfield also.



Reliant on Waterman, yes, because he's an AA forward.

Not sure if you've watched us this year but Allen's struggled up forward and is now playing back.

Jack Williams has been playing better, although dropped for Bailey Williams on the weekend, as they're both ruck/forwards. JWill should be playing in front of Reid IMO, with Reid and BWill competing for the same spot instead.

Archer Reid has shown enough to suggest he'll be a good player long term.

Owies has been crap and Ryan's been playing up the field, played mid on the weekend to great effect, expect him to play more there..

Cripps the only one of the old brigade playing mostly as a forward, who's still kicking goals. I guess he'll be missed but most are calling for him to be out to give Malakai Champion(regularly in our bests in the WAFL) to be given a chance instead.


Not saying Richmond don't have quality coming through but it's a bit rich to dismiss a team's young players because you don't know anything about them, whilst you pump your own.

Hough looks pretty ordinary, let's not sugar coat it. He had 3 kicks on the weekend. He is going worse than T Dow, and we can't wait to move him out of our midfield.

2025 stats - Dow v Hough:
Player rating: 7.1 v 6.7
Disposals: 19.6 v 14.2
CP's: 7.3 v 4.7
Clearances: 3.0 v 1.1
SI's: 3.6 v 2.7

So if you're including Hough as a promising young mid, I'll include Dow - and he's average.

Hewett is promising but still a question mark. Hutchinson didn't attend a centre bounce on the weekend.

And Mcauliffe has been dominating his VFL appearances as a mid across 2024-25. He's only played 10 x games, many as sub. He is very promising as a second year player who'd had a few injuries. But I'd largely ignore lower level performances. Sonsie gets 30 and 10 clearances playing VFL most weeks, but can't cut it at AFL level - so I wouldn't put a heap of stock in lower level form.

And Smillie had 7-8 x weeks off the early season with a hamstring. Played a half in VFL with 12 touches. Then played full game the next week and led our disposals in a 120-point loss with 23. Quiet game the week after and now injured again and will be out for 4-5 x weeks. So for a young kid off an injury interrupted pre-season, I won't write him off just yet. Pick-7 in a very strong draft suggests he'll make then grade, but only time will tell. W

And Hotton coming off an ACL. Was touted a top-5 pick before ACL, as was dominating early season Under-18's. He might be a bust, but it would be highly unlikely.

Taranto is only 27yo, and Hopper 28yo, so each has 3-5 x years at or near their peak. Then add Lalor, Smillie, Mcauliffe and Hotton. Of course there are question marks, but I know Lalor will be at least very good, and the odds are at least one of those other 3 will be very good midfielders. And it could be all of them, so time will tell.

Then there's Dow and Ross as depth, and I won't count Campbell as he may never be a mid, even though he has the ability. And with 2 x top-4 picks in the bank, I'm sure at least one will be a midfielder.

So TT, Hopper, Lalor is a pretty solid start, with likely 4 x mids taken top-12 in the draft to come in: Smillie, Hotton, 2 x top-4 picks. Plus Mcauliffe who is very promising, Even if a couple are a bust we'll still be in very good shape.