kickthething
Brownlow Medallist
I hope that doesn’t mean we have to wait until 2029 before Gus hits his straps
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Preview Round 11: Swans v Demons
- Thread starter Dubai Quacker
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Great to have Captain Cal back.
How exactly did we treat Cameron? He wasn't better than alternatives when fit, and when opportunity arose, he was injured.
Same with Nankervis, he just wasn't Best 22 and left for more opportunity, that's how it goes sometimes.
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- #304
Didn’t recognise their potential.
In 2018 we had 3 rucks - Sinkers, Naismith & Cameron. And we prioritised Sinkers.
My point is: prioritising honest triers over emerging talent rarely works. If we prioritise Adams over Sheldrick, I see it as a mistake.
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In 2018 we made finals, we weren't in a rebuild, why would we prioritise younger players based on potential?
In 2019 when there were opportunities, he was injured, only played 11 NEAFL games.
Cause Cameron was a Potato when he played for the swans.
If he stayed. He would have been de-listed.
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- #307
Just added to my earlier post to explain my point.
We got it wrong with Cameron & Nank - because they had average but entrenched incumbents ahead of them. So we lost the rising talent.
My point is IF we prioritize Adams over Sheldrick (and its only an IF at this stage), I'd see it as a blunder.
We didn't get it wrong because there were better alternatives in a non rebuilding team.
Naismith was the better rising talent at the time as a pure ruck. Tippett was not average. Sinclair better at the time.
Cameron could have played more in 2019 but was injured. No-one's fault.
I don't think it's an apt comparison between Sheldrick and Adams, given Sheldrick's game last weekend was better than a lot of Adams performances for us. So yes, if Adams comes into the 22 and Gus is out, it's a blunder, but not comparable to Cameron, Nank.
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- #309
And yet he suddenly became good upon arriving a few month later at Collingwood.
He wasn’t a spud - he was injured a fair bit through his final year at the Swans & we didn’t recognise the potential.
It was a blunder.
AFL clubs sometimes get things wrong.
- Mar 29, 2019
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Yes, if he replaces somebody in the extended squad before the final 23 is named at 5pm.
- Thread starter
- #311
Tippett was not average - because he didn’t play in 2019. He was a rookie listed non-player. I think that qualifies his as below average.
Anyway, this is a preview thread & provided Adams doesn’t take Sheldrick’s spot, I’m at peace with the world.
Or he didn't like playing in Sydney and grew a extra leg under the spot light in Melbourne.
Like Bobby Hill?
Look at Matt Kennedy . Average at Carlton. One of the Form players of the comp for the Dogs.
These weird revisionist takes that you embrace and consequently use as justification for the on-going and future management of a unrelated player are just odd. IMO.
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- #313
You said Darcy Cameron was a spud.
Spuds don't suddenly become good players because they move to another city. Sure, some players improve, some regress, but the underlying talent was always there with Cameron.
My view: the Swans didn't appreciate or value the emerging talent & made a list management blunder.
I am worried we might do it again, by prioritizing the over 30's currently on the list. Perhaps I'm wrong - but I don't know why it's a "weird revisionist take".
I wasn't talking about Tippett re: Cameron in 2019 clearly.
I was talking about Tippett re: Nank (who you had also mentioned in the post I was responding to), because I had just said Naismith was the better rising talent at the time. Can hardly call Naismith a rising talent in 2019...
If a player wants to leave because they weren't the best option when fit, and were injured when opportunities arose, then how is that just a club blunder?
Both the Nank and Cameron criticisms of the club do appear to be arguments from hindsight mostly, which I don't have much respect for. Because what is the club supposed to do, play them over better alternatives while you're still trying to make finals or win flags, just because they might be unhappy?
It's not the same as Sheldrick v Adams, because at the moment Sheldrick is better than Adams and should not make way at the moment. If Adams plays and plays better, then yeah, Gus might make way (e.g. with Mills increasing mid time in future weeks) and it'd be fair enough.
Right now though, it's just not comparable to Cameron, Nank unless Gus falls behind say Adams in performance and goes back to the VFL, which would not be a club blunder either, it's selection integrity in a non rebuilding year.
If we were rebuilding or the season becomes lost then yeah, give games to younger players, until then it's the better player.
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- #316
Thats fair.
The basic point is that things can be incredibly frustrating, especially in hindsight, without being club blunders/mistakes. Clubs have to make decisions based on the context and constraints at the time.
Of course there have been list blunders which didn't appear to have a good rationale at the time, but not going to rehash them here.
Of course there have been list blunders which didn't appear to have a good rationale at the time, but not going to rehash them here.
Nankervis was best 22 ! partly cost us a flag
He was injured all the time
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Have to disagree there. I was rapt with us drafting him when we did, but as a pure ruck in 2016 he was behind Naismith, and he was behind several up forward.
Round 16, 2019 was the golden opportunity for him. We were 6-8, on a 3 game winning streak, so were still gunning for finals, but Sinclair does his shoulder the week before.
But Cameron is out injured and doesn't get the opportunity. Can't blame the club for that.
No he wasn't , at least he could take a mark , something Sam found nearly impossible , also Nank would've rag dolled Boyd
Here we go again
Where can you tell me where i blamed the club
- Thread starter
- #325
Sometimes its fun to just stir up the board.
For beginners, all you have to do is raise one of the following topics:
(1) Kurt Tippett
(2) The Dawson trade
(3) Potato scallops
(4) JUH
(5) Gus Sheldrick
For beginners, all you have to do is raise one of the following topics:
(1) Kurt Tippett
(2) The Dawson trade
(3) Potato scallops
(4) JUH
(5) Gus Sheldrick
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