List Mgmt. Will the Hawks end up landing a big fish? Trade and FA news discussion of Hawthorn targets

[Ned Ryerson]

Didn't I read or hear somewhere that Wright has or was being moved to a management role and someonelse is doing the moving and shaking on the recruiting front.
So in whom do we trust? Also this years draft is akin to the Roughie - Buddy draft so I wouldn't be trading out 1st rounders for anyone, not mention its about time to stock up on key position players, looking at BoxHill I only see one project tall so get lynch to nominate then go to the draft or buy into the draft for an early pick and build a spine.

In whoever we trust.
After some research I have an edit.
View attachment 470352
So it appears we need to change the mantra on here to in Macca we trust.

Has been Wright's 2IC for quite a few years - and Wrighty will still have an oversight on recruitment in his GM role. We're in good hands.

 

[Bumps"N"Grins]

Has been Wright's 2IC for quite a few years - and Wrighty will still have an oversight on recruitment in his GM role. We're in good hands.

Not the point I was making but anyway to your point, yes Wright is still heavily involved in all things football so he will still be across recruiting a good thing on past deeds, just saying its not his show anymore so therefore from 2018 trade and draft it becomes the Macca era.

 

[Roddy]

A forward line of Rough, Lynch, Rioli, Gunston, Bruest, Poppy etc would be close to unstoppable, especially, as Clarko says in that interview, with the supply it gets.

 

[WWSD]

A forward line of Rough, Lynch, Rioli, Gunston, Bruest, Poppy etc would be close to unstoppable, especially, as Clarko says in that interview, with the supply it gets.

Don’t forget Impey. Plus Burton and Sicily as other options too.

 

[Roddy]

Don’t forget Impey. Plus Burton and Sicily as other options too.

Yep, I knew I was missing a few options as I typed that.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Not the point I was making but anyway to your point, yes Wright is still heavily involved in all things football so he will still be across recruiting a good thing on past deeds, just saying its not his show anymore so therefore from 2018 trade and draft it becomes the Macca era.

Wasn't aware that you were making any point - you were wondering out aloud so I gave you some details.

 

[Bumps"N"Grins]

Has been Wright's 2IC for quite a few years - and Wrighty will still have an oversight on recruitment in his GM role. We're in good hands.

Should this be oversight or insight? Nothing worse than being micromanaged.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Should this be oversight or insight? Nothing worse than being micromanaged.

McKenzie will answer to him per the lines of management - so it would definitely be oversight. I have zero clue as to Wrighty's particular brand of management though.

 

[TheFourPillars]

More i think about it the more i think that we need midfielders. I mean in 2009 we got burgoyne even though we had mitchell lewis hodge etc going by that we need two more

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

More i think about it the more i think that we need midfielders. I mean in 2009 we got burgoyne even though we had mitchell lewis hodge etc going by that we need two more

In 2009 we had two of the best young key forwards in the game. We don’t have that at the moment.

 

[TheFourPillars]

In 2009 we had two of the best young key forwards in the game. We don’t have that at the moment.

Yes i agree but our inherent weakness is midfield much higher priority than anywhere else. Heaven forbid there is an injury to mitchell

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Yes i agree but our inherent weakness is midfield much higher priority than anywhere else. Heaven forbid there is an injury to mitchell

Midfielders can be gotten every draft though. There's a plethora of them at other clubs too.

If Rough goes down again or falls in a whole this year we are skint for tall forwards.

 

[Brishawk]

We will need both to challenge for flags but mids are available in every draft and champion kpf are rarely available. I’d take best available in the draft though.

 

[Gralin]

Midfielders can be gotten every draft though. There's a plethora of them at other clubs too.

If Rough goes down again or falls in a whole this year we are skint for tall forwards.

yeah we are light on for backups in a couple of places and you can get mids more easily than keys, and mids take less time to develop than keys but we had some pretty bloody good players in their prime on all lines

If we need to replace some on all lines and we need a certain age profile as well the draft only helps based on how much other clubs value the picks

 

[TheFourPillars]

Well look at this way we had rough and bud we lost bud and didnt replace we have lost 3 out of our fab 4 and the final warrior is on his final year. We have replaced them with two. One hasnt really graced the field. We need the mids to make of the list we currently have.

Our gaping hole is midfield

 

[flinchfree]

Well look at this way we had rough and bud we lost bud and didnt replace we have lost 3 out of our fab 4 and the final warrior is on his final year. We have replaced them with two. One hasnt really graced the field. We need the mids to make of the list we currently have.

Our gaping hole is midfield

Not good when you add Mitchell and Omeara in a 12 month period and say we have a gaping hole in the middle...
I would have thought our drafting of Cousins, Morrison, Hanrahan, Lovell and Worpel should have provided nice depth to find the additional workers and class to supplement the stars that are in Tommy and hopefully will be in Jaeger. Add to that the trading in of Impey - if we are more than one very talented mid away I'd say our recruiting and drafting for onballers has been a bad miss the last 24 months.

I'm punting on this being the rare occasion you're wrong 4P. I can't go with the idea of needing to replace in quality like for like for Mitch and JOM. No one carries that kind of depth pay wise or opportunity wise on their lists.

We should be planning on having enough quality now running around that maybe just needs some maturing and chemistry time, with the plan of adding top up with a Finn or other quality mid type at end of year.
I'm with others on this, Key power forward who can dominate aerially is the much bigger need and concern for our NOW and future.



Edited to rework this line: Rough needs a very good year up top for us. Should read, "wishing Rough a very good year!"

 

[Gralin]

I would have thought our drafting of Cousins, Morrison, Hanrahan, Lovell and Worpel should have provided nice depth to find the additional workers and class to supplement the stars that are in Tommy and hopefully will be in Jaeger. .

This is the issue I reckon.
We had Sam and Lewis to carry the load with Hodge and Burger to be thrown in when needed
We then had support in Sewell, Shiels, Langford that one time with Hill and Smith on the outside.

Compare that to now we have Tom and maybe Jaeger with Burger to be thrown in when needed.
Shiels and Smith to support. Howe could be part of it, Lovell Worps Impey Ollie Cousins and Harry could be part of it.

We are trying to replace some all time club greats and we don't know who the replacements are, we have hope but not certainty

 

[Wandering Hawk]

Our forward line is living on borrowed time and we have minimal future developers awaiting us here. We absolutely need 2-3 forwards pronto.

Just try aging this three years:

Roughead is 31
Puopolo is 30
Rioli is 28.5

Breust and Schoenmakers are 27
Gunston is 26

We then have Impey and the struggling TOB.

That's kinda it. Perhaps Duryea or Langford? Perhaps swing Burton and Sicily forward and rebuild the backline instead?

In three years what are we planning? We barely have depth now, especially tall depth, and anyone recruited aged 18 this year will be just 21 and trying to hold the forward line together. It's imperative that we add at least 2-3 decent forwards over the next 3 years and probably 5-6 over the next five.

We need to add about an Impey each year plus a Roughead replacement this year or next year.

If we focus on getting midfield and backline to premiership standard over the next few years we are at risk of then squandering those players with a rebuilding forward line that's not capable of finals.

 

[flinchfree]

This is the issue I reckon.
We had Sam and Lewis to carry the load with Hodge and Burger to be thrown in when needed
We then had support in Sewell, Shiels, Langford that one time with Hill and Smith on the outside.

Compare that to now we have Tom and maybe Jaeger with Burger to be thrown in when needed.
Shiels and Smith to support. Howe could be part of it, Lovell Worps Impey Ollie Cousins and Harry could be part of it.

We are trying to replace some all time club greats and we don't know who the replacements are, we have hope but not certainty

Yup. But we didn't know Sam was Sammy bloody Mitchell, or Lewis was Lewey frickin Lewis until they had produced over and over for us, big games and small. So for a time we had Crawf, but was there enough?
Get my thinking? Were at the start, so the proving will take time. I don't see us insta baking a midfield unit immediately as potent as our premiership busting group of the last decade and a bit.

Our new Mitch is already a certainty, and no less a player than Lewis or maybe even Hodge when specifically on ball. Sammy is all time all time, so only an approximation can ever be hoped for. I actually think there's more talent in the new crop than we found in Sewell, Shiels and Langford.
Lets see how it goes.

 

[Gralin]

Yup. But we didn't know Sam was Sammy bloody Mitchell, or Lewis was Lewey frickin Lewis until they had produced over and over for us, big games and small. So for a time we had Crawf, but was there enough?
Get my thinking? Were at the start, so the proving will take time. I don't see us insta baking a midfield unit immediately as potent as our premiership busting group of the last decade and a bit.

Our new Mitch is already a certainty, and no less a player than Lewis or maybe even Hodge when specifically on ball. Sammy is all time all time, so only an approximation can ever be hoped for. I actually think there's more talent in the new crop than we found in Sewell, Shiels and Langford.
Lets see how it goes.

Oh I get your thinking
I hope you're right and the core is there and we just don't know it yet.
I reckon how well our mids do this year will dictate how the team goes so we should find out a bit

 

[Wandering Hawk]

I think the young mids are a pretty good mob.

Cousins 20
Lovell 21
Hanrahan 19
Worpel 19
Morrison 19
Moore 19
Jones 19

That's a pretty good group to add to the core of:
(Shiels) 27
Mitchell 25
JOM 24
Howe 22
(Langford) 25 - depth

Getting pretty close to good enough. Just recruit one more A grade star in say 3-4 years as we have a tilt (to say replace Smith) and we're completely there. By then we'll be very attractive to established stars seeking success.

It only looks bad at the moment because the kids are all 19-20 and JOM is only just coming back. This is a great group by 2020. We don't need to target a big fish here. If even three kids of the magnificent seven become ok, add one decent trade in once we know what's lacking and we're there. Extra role player mids are easy to add on for later depth to stay up there.

We need our current big fish to be a power forward.. TOB and Schoenmakers are getting games currently because there's no tall depth, and Roughead sadly isn't forever.

 

[SA HAWK]

More i think about it the more i think that we need midfielders. I mean in 2009 we got burgoyne even though we had mitchell lewis hodge etc going by that we need two more

We need midfielders & a kp forward & defender.

 

[Slysh]

I think the young mids are a pretty good mob.

Cousins 20
Lovell 21
Hanrahan 19
Worpel 19
Morrison 19
Moore 19
Jones 19

That's a pretty good group to add to the core of:
(Shiels) 27
Mitchell 25
JOM 24
Howe 22
(Langford) 25 - depth

Getting pretty close to good enough. Just recruit one more A grade star in say 3-4 years as we have a tilt (to say replace Smith) and we're completely there. By then we'll be very attractive to established stars seeking success.

It only looks bad at the moment because the kids are all 19-20 and JOM is only just coming back. This is a great group by 2020. We don't need to target a big fish here.

We need our big fish to be a power forward..

I sort of agree, i think that midfield group could be good and carry us through the next 5-10 years. The problem is outside of Mitchell we don't have anyone we can say with confidence will be an absolute lock in our midfield for years to come. Jaeger obviously has all the talent and i am very bullish on him, i think this is his year to prove he is over the worst of it, but of course we need to see it before we can bank on it. Howe was very impressive at times last year and i think he could be a big part of out future, but outside of Mitchell, Jaeger and Howe i think we start to have some question marks.

I like quite a few of those youngsters named in the group above. I am a huge fan of Cousins and think Lovell could be good if his body lets him have a decent crack. We still haven't seen enough of these players though, 5 of those players have never even played a game. We are currently banking on having these players come on and be able to cement spots in our midfield and we just haven't seen them prove that they can yet.

It's really hard to say what we need before the season has even started, this year is going to be very telling for what we need to look at in terms of recruiting. If 2 or 3 of those above names really come on this year and Jaeger gets back to his best, i would agree that we need to target the forward line and look to who may replace Roughy in a few years. If they don't come on as we would hope though we would be going in to 2019 with some massive holes in our midfield.

 

[Wandering Hawk]

I sort of agree, i think that midfield group could be good and carry us through the next 5-10 years. The problem is outside of Mitchell we don't have anyone we can say with confidence will be an absolute lock in our midfield for years to come. Jaeger obviously has all the talent and i am very bullish on him, i think this is his year to prove he is over the worst of it, but of course we need to see it before we can bank on it. Howe was very impressive at times last year and i think he could be a big part of out future, but outside of Mitchell, Jaeger and Howe i think we start to have some question marks.

I like quite a few of those youngsters named in the group above. I am a huge fan of Cousins and think Lovell could be good if his body lets him have a decent crack. We still haven't seen enough of these players though, 5 of those players have never even played a game. We are currently banking on having these players come on and be able to cement spots in our midfield and we just haven't seen them prove that they can yet.

It's really hard to say what we need before the season has even started, this year is going to be very telling for what we need to look at in terms of recruiting. If 2 or 3 of those above names really come on this year and Jaeger gets back to his best, i would agree that we need to target the forward line and look to who may replace Roughy in a few years. If they don't come on as we would hope though we would be going in to 2019 with some massive holes in our midfield.

Agreed.

Although we may need an extra year to know and not just 2018. We may see Cousins and Lovell and Morrison this year add games, to then win regular spots next year, but if they do we're unlikely to see Worpel, Moore, Jones, and Hanrahan having much more than a cameo this year. Next year is when they'll all be fighting properly for spots and can be evaluated far better.

Also there's only so many spots for midfield youth at Box Hill - I'd wait a year or two and add new young forwards for two drafts whilst we digest the hordes of youth in the midfield and back line. Any mids picked up this year will hardly have any chance at getting a game for at least two years given the queue.

This year a young key tall forward on big bucks. Next year a key tall defender as spots open. Third year lure the mid we need with the offer of a flag tilt.

 

[lickmerocks]

Understanding where your list is at is important, so too is understanding who on said list is injured, who is out of form & who might be struggling for another reason.

4 of the players you mentioned were out injured, not having form slumps.
Of the other 3 you could argue for all 3 but I’ll stick to Gunners & Punky.
Gunners would usually take the 2nd best tall defender while Punky would usually take the 2nd best small defender. With Cyril out, Punky was taking the best small defender.

We need to look at the full picture & not just the trailers.

Look at the entire season & look at why we were where we were

Thanks but disagree. We were complete junk and when the injuries came our hand was forced and we played youngsters who were keen and we noticed a massive spike in effort and competitiveness.

Our Senior players early in the year last year were not serious and were battling for effort and energy.

This year will be very interesting to watch. Do the 4 time GF players have the zip, energy and motivation to go again is the million dollar question or are some of these guys mentally cooked and need a change of scenery.