Play Nice 46th President of the United States: Joe Biden 2: Incidit in scyllam cupiens vitare charybdim

[Crankyhawk]

Yep, was making no reference to the coming election.





China is steadily becoming the dominant financial, military and diplomatic country on earth and each year that only increases.

The rest of the world is smart enough to care about that, they know their country's relations with China in coming years and decades will go a large way in determining the future health and prosperity of their people.

They also know that China plans over decades and has a very long memory.

Who knows what brand of idiots could be inhabiting the White House over coming decades...is that future looking good to you if you're a US partner or loosely aligned with a choice to make?




Right.

So if Russia had gone to war with Ukraine straight away after Ukraine seized independent Crimea, then re-established independent Crimea by force, rather than foolishly trying to broker a political resolution for all those years right up until 2014, you'd have to back that decision under the same logic and moral standards.

Thanks for clearing that up.

Russia is not a valid party in whether crimea is independent. Crimea made a unilateral and invalid Declaration of Independence; it’s about as stupid as if Western Australia did the same.

 

[Rayzorwire]

Seems the Biden thread is has now become International Politics.

Why are people talking about international politics on the thread about the 'leader of the free world?'

It's a mystery, but don't stop complaining.

Even a casual observer would now realise that I am 100% anti Trump but that doesn't mean I am a Biden supporter but I find it difficult to read that Biden is at fault for giving Israel $$$$.

He has delivered 320,000 tonnes of 'dumb' bombs to Israel just since the conflict began (i.e. they already had plenty to begin with).

That devastating amount of munitions, provided by Biden, who openly declares himself a "Zionist", has been used to facilitate the genocide of nearly 30,000 men, women and children.

Murdered hundreds of doctors, aid workers and journalists for daring to try and help.

Destroyed their homes. Destroyed all Gaza's hospitals and universities, ruined Gaza's economy for decades.

Not only will he not stop supplying the bombs, or tell Israel to stop using them 'or else', Biden won't even ensure that Palestinian children won't starve.

To be here every day, defending Biden, making excuses for him, you have to every day defend things like this:


Joe Biden and Kamala Harris celebrated what would have been the 51st anniversary of Roe v. Wade in late January — their first campaign event of 2024. The “Restore Roe” rally in northern Virginia made it clear that the Biden/Harris ticket will center abortion rights in the reelection campaign. The theater was filled with the president’s supporters and leadership from national reproductive rights organizations who have endorsed him, including Planned Parenthood, the National Organization for Women and Reproductive Freedom for All.

Only a few minutes into Biden’s speech, several protesters interrupted, calling for a cease-fire in Israel’s U.S.-backed military operation in Gaza, which has killed more than 28,000 Palestinians and set off a maternal and reproductive health crisis.

The president was interrupted over a dozen times as security struggled to wrangle protesters who were screaming “Genocide Joe!” and demanding a cease-fire. Hundreds of Biden supporters tried to drown out the protesters by clapping and chanting, “Four more years!”

“Israel kills two mothers every hour in Gaza! Cease-fire now! End the genocide!” one protester yelled at Biden, who was standing on stage in front of a massive “Restore Roe” banner and flanked by supporters holding “Defend choice” signs.

…

Gaza is home to about 55,000 women who are currently pregnant, according to a recent report. There’s been a 300% increase in pregnancy loss due to the lack of neonatal and maternal health care since the conflict began five months ago. Most women are giving birth in crowded tents or on the streets because there’s no ambulance or car to take them to a hospital. There have been several reports of women undergoing C-sections without anesthesia or properly sanitized medical tools, leading to wound infections.

Basic prenatal care, such as treating anemia, is nonexistent, causing more women to die during childbirth and more babies born prematurely, many of whom die without access to hospital incubators. Food shortages are leaving pregnant women, new mothers and newborns malnourished. And a lack of menstrual hygiene products has caused an increase in infections in women and girls.

“No one is making the connection that there’s a huge repro genocide happening in Gaza that we are funding, and the big repro organizations that are endorsing him are pretending like it’s not happening,” one leader who has met with the Biden administration on abortion issues told HuffPost. Most of the workers who spoke with HuffPost asked to remain anonymous for fear of retaliation from their employers or others in the reproductive rights field.

Many Reproductive Rights Workers Are Fed Up With Biden

Reproductive justice workers believe Biden is contributing to a maternal and reproductive health crisis in Gaza. They’re deeply frustrated with him and the big reproductive rights groups that are backing him.

www.huffpost.com

Please, feel free to defend the above, say it can't possibly be Joe's fault, whatever.

The world sees the truth.

Doubt that anything would change with Trump as he was the first to recognise Netanyahu declaring Jerusalem as the capital and also was very happy to fully recognize Israel's Sovereignty over the Golan Heights. So don't believe that Trump would be better in fact worse.

 

[Rayzorwire]

Russia is not a valid party in whether crimea is independent.

Yet Ukraine was "a valid party" when they invaded and removed independent Crimea's president at gunpoint?

That's some seriously twisted logic at work, IMO.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Yet Ukraine was "a valid party" when they invaded and removed independent Crimea's president at gunpoint?

That's some seriously twisted logic at work, IMO.

1) yes because crimea was part of Ukraine at the time as agreed by both Russia and Ukraine
2) individuals do not have a right to determine they are their own country just because the vibe. That’s essentially what the Crimean oblast leader did.

 

[Rayzorwire]

1) yes because crimea was part of Ukraine at the time as agreed by both Russia and Ukraine

Crimea was an autonomous Republic until Ukraine decided it wasn't anymore.

At gunpoint.

Did Crimea have its own constitution and president, as agreed by all parties involved (Russia included) after that?

Rhetorical question.

2) individuals do not have a right to determine they are their own country just because the vibe.

Tell that to 'independent' Taiwan...

Don't forget to let 'independent' Kosovo know too...though apparently it's really easy to forget all about those poor buggers...


The failure of U.S. nation-building might not be too surprising in places like Iraq or Afghanistan, where the local populations were less than pleased to see American GIs come marching in. But Kosovo is another matter.

For one, the country is tiny, roughly one-third the size of Belgium, with a population of 1.8 million, well under that of the Brussels metropolitan area.

With a GDP of about $10 billion, Kosovo’s economy is less than one-quarter the size of Vermont’s, the smallest U.S. state in terms of economic activity. In other words, making a difference there would not require the U.S. to invest the trillions poured into Afghanistan and Iraq.

…

By most objective measures, the American engagement in Kosovo hasn’t been much of a success.

While the U.S. threw plenty of money at the country, a closer look suggests that Washington’s priorities were informed more by short-term American business interests than providing the country what it really needed to develop.

The most glaring example of that failing is the country’s power infrastructure. A generation after its war with Serbia, Kosovo’s electricity supply still depends on two rickety coal-burning power stations, the older of which went into service in 1962 with used Westinghouse and General Electric turbines. The plants, located just outside Pristina are considered the dirtiest in Europe, spewing a steady stream of brown smog that has made the city one of the Continent’s most polluted.

Put simply, even after decades of American aid and support, the country remains an economic and political basket case.

How the US broke Kosovo and what that means for Ukraine

Washington’s track record suggests it’s better at fighting wars than dealing with what follows.

www.politico.eu

 

[Crankyhawk]

Crimea was an autonomous Republic until Ukraine decided it wasn't anymore.

At gunpoint.

Did Crimea have its own constitution and president, as agreed by all parties involved (Russia included) after that?

Rhetorical question.





Tell that to 'independent' Taiwan...

Don't forget to let 'independent' Kosovo know too...though apparently it's really easy to forget all about those poor buggers...


The failure of U.S. nation-building might not be too surprising in places like Iraq or Afghanistan, where the local populations were less than pleased to see American GIs come marching in. But Kosovo is another matter.

For one, the country is tiny, roughly one-third the size of Belgium, with a population of 1.8 million, well under that of the Brussels metropolitan area.

With a GDP of about $10 billion, Kosovo’s economy is less than one-quarter the size of Vermont’s, the smallest U.S. state in terms of economic activity. In other words, making a difference there would not require the U.S. to invest the trillions poured into Afghanistan and Iraq.

…

By most objective measures, the American engagement in Kosovo hasn’t been much of a success.

While the U.S. threw plenty of money at the country, a closer look suggests that Washington’s priorities were informed more by short-term American business interests than providing the country what it really needed to develop.

The most glaring example of that failing is the country’s power infrastructure. A generation after its war with Serbia, Kosovo’s electricity supply still depends on two rickety coal-burning power stations, the older of which went into service in 1962 with used Westinghouse and General Electric turbines. The plants, located just outside Pristina are considered the dirtiest in Europe, spewing a steady stream of brown smog that has made the city one of the Continent’s most polluted.

Put simply, even after decades of American aid and support, the country remains an economic and political basket case.

How the US broke Kosovo and what that means for Ukraine

Washington’s track record suggests it’s better at fighting wars than dealing with what follows.

www.politico.eu

Independent Taiwan were the existing government of China fleeing from revolution and managed to establish themselves for sufficient time to be seen as independent.
Crimea never had the right to unilaterally declare independence; the people were never asked if that’s what they want. And it is ridiculous for you to argue about Crimean independence when they certainly don’t have that as part of Russia. But of course you refuse to keep Putin accountable.
Show me a where the Ukrainian constitution allows for states to secede?

 

[Bloods86]

As someone who would be very much classified as politically from the 'far-left', over recent years I've increasingly found myself in the bizarre situation of having to decide that sometimes I'm gonna have to hold my nose and support a particular policy or stance from a 'far-right' candidate, because they are the only one standing up for a fundamental principle of democracy.

The faux, corporate captured 'left-wing' major parties, are increasingly behaving in ways that are decidedly undemocratic.

...

I stand by assertion that if you boil down the dozens of reasons for one candidate or another, from the perspective of my personal political stance, there's bugger all difference.

Conveniently fails to mention that there is some bipartisan opposition to this, inconveniently including Democrats.

Conveniently fails to mention Trump rubber stamped this in his term and is by no means better on this issue.

Loading…

www.reuters.com

The Trump Administration Is Hiding a Crucial Report on NSA Spying Practices | ACLU

www.aclu.org

Trump Administration Secretly Seized Phone Records of Times Reporters (Published 2021)

The admission by the Biden Justice Department followed similar recent disclosures to The Washington Post and CNN.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Rayzorwire]

Independent Taiwan were the existing government of China fleeing from revolution and managed to establish themselves for sufficient time to be seen as independent.

Well, that certainly sounds far more legitimate than the truth.

Chiang Kai-shek should have ended up on trial in the Hague along with all the other Nazi's of that era. Instead, the West legitimised a full-blown Nazi out of convenience, to seize effective control of Chinese territory:


The New Life Movement, initiated by Chiang, was based upon Confucianism mixed with Christianity, nationalism, and authoritarianism that have some similarities to fascism. Frederic Wakeman argued that the New Life Movement was "Confucian fascism."[59] Chiang also sponsored the creation of the Blue Shirts Society, in conscious imitation of the Blackshirts in the Italian Fascist Party and the Sturmabteilung of the Nazi Party.[60] Its ideology was to expel foreign (Japanese and Western) imperialists from China and to crush communism.[61] Close ties with Nazi Germany also gave the Nationalist government access to German military and economic assistance during the mid-1930s.

Chiang Kai-shek - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

There's no shortage of details on the civilian massacres, deliberate starvation of civilians etc. in the link above, he's certainly the kind of bloke who deserves to be supported in his ambition to split a sovereign state apart!

Is it any wonder Biden, the US government and the wider Western media insist on skipping over all this annoyingly inconvenient Chinese and Russian history, in order to get to the parts from which they can make their own interference sound vaguely legitimate!

Shouldn't the US have helped mount an international coalition to see Chiang tried for his many crimes against humanity, with Taiwan restored to China at the end of that process?

And it is ridiculous for you to argue about Crimean independence when they certainly don’t have that as part of Russia. But of course you refuse to keep Putin accountable.

Crimea has no capacity to be independent while Ukraine retains the capacity to militarily threaten them.

Since 2014, they've needed Russia's protection and Western polling shows the Crimean people to be overwhelmingly satisfied with that situation for now.

In the future, who knows?

Show me a where the Ukrainian constitution allows for states to secede?

Show me any country's constitution which says that.

Certainly wasn't in Serbia's, definitely not part of Spain's etc., on and on through the world's many, many separatist movements...

Anyway, none of the above is directly Biden specific, so while I fully respect your right of response to the above, let's try and steer the conversation back that way again, agreed?

 

[Rayzorwire]

Conveniently fails to mention that there is some bipartisan opposition to this, inconveniently including Democrats.

Conveniently fails to mention Trump rubber stamped this in his term and is by no means better on this issue.

Loading…

www.reuters.com

The Trump Administration Is Hiding a Crucial Report on NSA Spying Practices | ACLU

www.aclu.org

Trump Administration Secretly Seized Phone Records of Times Reporters (Published 2021)

The admission by the Biden Justice Department followed similar recent disclosures to The Washington Post and CNN.

www.nytimes.com

If you read back, I was speaking more widely than this one particular issue, over a period of years.

On this specific topic (which I raised to point out how very far to the right the Biden admin continues to swing with their policies and it also being recent news), I agree, there is little to distinguish between the fascist, civil rights eroding positions of either party.

Which has been another running point I've made.

The wider perspective here, is that shouldn't we all be concerned, bordering on frightened, that the 'left-wing', 'progressive' party of the world's most powerful democracy and our own #1 ally, is behaving in this way?

Not really the moment to default to a Butt Trumpet and a 'nothing to see here' response?

 

[Crankyhawk]

Well, that certainly sounds far more legitimate than the truth.

Chiang Kai-shek should have ended up on trial in the Hague along with all the other Nazi's of that era. Instead, the West legitimised a full-blown Nazi out of convenience, to seize effective control of Chinese territory:


The New Life Movement, initiated by Chiang, was based upon Confucianism mixed with Christianity, nationalism, and authoritarianism that have some similarities to fascism. Frederic Wakeman argued that the New Life Movement was "Confucian fascism."[59] Chiang also sponsored the creation of the Blue Shirts Society, in conscious imitation of the Blackshirts in the Italian Fascist Party and the Sturmabteilung of the Nazi Party.[60] Its ideology was to expel foreign (Japanese and Western) imperialists from China and to crush communism.[61] Close ties with Nazi Germany also gave the Nationalist government access to German military and economic assistance during the mid-1930s.

Chiang Kai-shek - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

There's no shortage of details on the civilian massacres, deliberate starvation of civilians etc. in the link above, he's certainly the kind of bloke who deserves to be supported in his ambition to split a sovereign state apart!

Is it any wonder Biden, the US government and the wider Western media insist on skipping over all this annoyingly inconvenient Chinese and Russian history, in order to get to the parts from which they can make their own interference sound vaguely legitimate!

Shouldn't the US have helped mount an international coalition to see Chiang tried for his many crimes against humanity, with Taiwan restored to China at the end of that process?





Crimea has no capacity to be independent while Ukraine retains the capacity to militarily threaten them.

Since 2014, they've needed Russia's protection and Western polling shows the Crimean people to be overwhelmingly satisfied with that situation for now.

In the future, who knows?





Show me any country's constitution which says that.

Certainly wasn't in Serbia's, definitely not part of Spain's etc., on and on through the world's many, many separatist movements...

Anyway, none of the above is directly Biden specific, so while I fully respect your right of response to the above, let's try and steer the conversation back that way again, agreed?

Agree it is off topic
Though will point out that starvation of oppression of the peasants is pretty much standard through Chinese history so what we would call nazi collusion to them is just Tuesday.

 

[Rayzorwire]

FWIW, I have said several times I'd hold my nose and vote for RFK. I don't agree with all his policies, far from it, but on the things most important to me, he's clearly the best candidate.

More than that, I think on the numerous policies I do disagree with, he'd be far less destructive than the alternatives' policy in that area and way more open to changing his mind on policy, having been swayed by voter opinion and democratic means.

In short, he's the only vaguely semi-viable candidate that has a hope in Hades of preventing the US empire's decline spilling over into much wider global strife and conflict.

No endorsement whatsoever, simply by way of example and to stand in contrast with how Biden can sell himself to the US people:







If the Democrats backed Kennedy to run for their party like his forefathers did (as he would like to do), he'd absolutely smash Trump. As an independent, under their system he has literally zero chance of becoming president.

So while the powerbrokers in the Democrat party routinely bleat about preventing Trump from taking office, they care just as much (I would argue more!) about keeping a man who will end/curtail their corporate plunder gravy train and wind back the US' imperial ambitions out of the White House too.

They're happy to risk Trump winning, in order to run a woeful, comparatively D-grade candidate (Biden), in preference to RFK.

And that's this US election in its nuttershell, right there.

 

[Rayzorwire]

Agree it is off topic
Though will point out that starvation of oppression of the peasants is pretty much standard through Chinese history so what we would call nazi collusion to them is just Tuesday.

Well, I was referring to Chiang's actual Nazi collusion, with Hitler's own Nazi party, but yes, there is no shortage of cruel overlords in Chinese history, along with some rather wonderful ones (by Europe or anywhere else's standards in judging the relative merits of past autocratic monarchs).

 

[Rayzorwire]

And here we go again - can't go having countries run by socialist presidents who do things the US would rather keep really quiet, like Venezuela's government achieving its goal of building a million houses a year, each year, for the poor over the last decade.

How are these socialist dictators being allowed to get away with this! The international community needs to use the Rules Based Order to teach them a lesson!

Bring back the corporate flunkies under the guise of 'democracy' and lets get the plunder of Venezuela for US corporate gain instead its own citizens back on schedule!

[sarcasm off]


Washington Promotes Venezuelan Opposition Candidate

Setting the Stage for Delegitimizing the Presidential Election

by Roger D. Harris Posted on February 14, 2024

Venezuela’s Bolivarian Revolution marks its 25th anniversary this month, despite continuous US-led hybrid warfare to overthrow the socialist project. The Venezuelan government of President Nicolás Maduro has successfully forced the US to de facto engage with it, although Washington still maintains the fiction that the defunct 2015 National Assembly is the “last remaining democratic institution” there.

The US has been relegated to vetting candidates for the upcoming Venezuelan presidential election. While still egregiously interventionist, the imperial power has failed to achieve outright regime change. The appearance of Venezuelan opposition politician Maria Corina Machado before a US congressional committee is the latest in the empire’s quest for a trustworthy confederate. Hopes are high among Republicans that she is the right collaborator. The Democrats may have another but complementary gameplan.

The opposition to the ruling Venezuelan socialist government is composed of many small and fractious sects, usually associated with a dominant personality, such as Machado’s Vente Venezuela party. The US spends millions each year meddling in the internal affairs of Venezuela in what it euphemistically calls “democracy promotion.” USAID alone pledged $50M to “push” the presidential elections, scheduled for later this year.

Washington’s efforts to force a unified opposition have been so far unsuccessful in Venezuela. But that has not deterred the Yankees from imperiously selecting the candidate they think ought be Venezuela’s leader.

Washington Promotes Venezuelan Opposition Candidate - Antiwar.com

Venezuela’s Bolivarian Revolution marks its 25th anniversary this month, despite continuous US-led hybrid warfare to overthrow the socialist project. The - Roger D. Harris for Antiwar.com

original.antiwar.com

Mod edit: anti-war.com

Anti-War - Bias and Credibility

QUESTIONABLE SOURCE A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no

mediabiasfactcheck.com

Overall, we rate Antiwar.com Right-Center biased and questionable based on several instances of publishing false or misleading claims regarding Ukraine. We also rate them Mixed for factual reporting due to the promotion of conspiracy theories, propaganda, and poor sourcing.

 

[Satan]

FWIW, I have said several times I'd hold my nose and vote for RFK. I don't agree with all his policies, far from it, but on the things most important to me, he's clearly the best candidate.

More than that, I think on the numerous policies I do disagree with, he'd be far less destructive than the alternatives' policy in that area and way more open to changing his mind on policy, having been swayed by voter opinion and democratic means.

In short, he's the only vaguely semi-viable candidate that has a hope in Hades of preventing the US empire's decline spilling over into much wider global strife and conflict.

No endorsement whatsoever, simply by way of example and to stand in contrast with how Biden can sell himself to the US people:







If the Democrats backed Kennedy to run for their party like his forefathers did (as he would like to do), he'd absolutely smash Trump. As an independent, under their system he has literally zero chance of becoming president.

So while the powerbrokers in the Democrat party routinely bleat about preventing Trump from taking office, they care just as much (I would argue more!) about keeping a man who will end/curtail their corporate plunder gravy train and wind back the US' imperial ambitions out of the White House too.

They're happy to risk Trump winning, in order to run a woeful, comparatively D-grade candidate (Biden), in preference to RFK.

And that's this US election in its nuttershell, right there.

Super Bowl ad for RFK Jr. stirs Democratic and family tension over his independent 2024 presidential bid

After the game, Kennedy responded to online criticism, including from one of his cousins, emphasizing that his campaign did not produce the spot, which cost an estimated $7 million.

www.pbs.org

Apologized for ad but still had it on his website

 

[bourbons]

As is always the case with this argument, it completely disregards the sovereign wants and preferences of Ukraine and their people, just coz they happen to align with US interests.

Poll: 62% of Ukrainians support joining NATO, 68% - EU - Freedom

62% of Ukrainians support Ukraine’s accession to NATO, 30% have a negative ...

uatv.ua

Unsure why Vlad riding roughshod over 2/3 of Ukraine's population regarding the status of their own country is seen as reasonable.

 

[Maggie5]

Why are people talking about international politics on the thread about the 'leader of the free world?'

It's a mystery, but don't stop complaining.





He has delivered 320,000 tonnes of 'dumb' bombs to Israel just since the conflict began (i.e. they already had plenty to begin with).

That devastating amount of munitions, provided by Biden, who openly declares himself a "Zionist", has been used to facilitate the genocide of nearly 30,000 men, women and children.

Murdered hundreds of doctors, aid workers and journalists for daring to try and help.

Destroyed their homes. Destroyed all Gaza's hospitals and universities, ruined Gaza's economy for decades.

Not only will he not stop supplying the bombs, or tell Israel to stop using them 'or else', Biden won't even ensure that Palestinian children won't starve.

To be here every day, defending Biden, making excuses for him, you have to every day defend things like this:


Joe Biden and Kamala Harris celebrated what would have been the 51st anniversary of Roe v. Wade in late January — their first campaign event of 2024. The “Restore Roe” rally in northern Virginia made it clear that the Biden/Harris ticket will center abortion rights in the reelection campaign. The theater was filled with the president’s supporters and leadership from national reproductive rights organizations who have endorsed him, including Planned Parenthood, the National Organization for Women and Reproductive Freedom for All.

Only a few minutes into Biden’s speech, several protesters interrupted, calling for a cease-fire in Israel’s U.S.-backed military operation in Gaza, which has killed more than 28,000 Palestinians and set off a maternal and reproductive health crisis.

The president was interrupted over a dozen times as security struggled to wrangle protesters who were screaming “Genocide Joe!” and demanding a cease-fire. Hundreds of Biden supporters tried to drown out the protesters by clapping and chanting, “Four more years!”

“Israel kills two mothers every hour in Gaza! Cease-fire now! End the genocide!” one protester yelled at Biden, who was standing on stage in front of a massive “Restore Roe” banner and flanked by supporters holding “Defend choice” signs.

…

Gaza is home to about 55,000 women who are currently pregnant, according to a recent report. There’s been a 300% increase in pregnancy loss due to the lack of neonatal and maternal health care since the conflict began five months ago. Most women are giving birth in crowded tents or on the streets because there’s no ambulance or car to take them to a hospital. There have been several reports of women undergoing C-sections without anesthesia or properly sanitized medical tools, leading to wound infections.

Basic prenatal care, such as treating anemia, is nonexistent, causing more women to die during childbirth and more babies born prematurely, many of whom die without access to hospital incubators. Food shortages are leaving pregnant women, new mothers and newborns malnourished. And a lack of menstrual hygiene products has caused an increase in infections in women and girls.

“No one is making the connection that there’s a huge repro genocide happening in Gaza that we are funding, and the big repro organizations that are endorsing him are pretending like it’s not happening,” one leader who has met with the Biden administration on abortion issues told HuffPost. Most of the workers who spoke with HuffPost asked to remain anonymous for fear of retaliation from their employers or others in the reproductive rights field.

Many Reproductive Rights Workers Are Fed Up With Biden

Reproductive justice workers believe Biden is contributing to a maternal and reproductive health crisis in Gaza. They’re deeply frustrated with him and the big reproductive rights groups that are backing him.

www.huffpost.com

Please, feel free to defend the above, say it can't possibly be Joe's fault, whatever.

The world sees the truth.

TLDR

 

[Bloods86]

If you read back, I was speaking more widely than this one particular issue, over a period of years.

On this specific topic (which I raised to point out how very far to the right the Biden admin continues to swing with their policies and it also being recent news), I agree, there is little to distinguish between the fascist, civil rights eroding positions of either party.

Which has been another running point I've made.

The wider perspective here, is that shouldn't we all be concerned, bordering on frightened, that the 'left-wing', 'progressive' party of the world's most powerful democracy and our own #1 ally, is behaving in this way?

Not really the moment to default to a Butt Trumpet and a 'nothing to see here' response?

It's not a "nothing to see here" response. You keep saying there's really no difference between Biden and Trump, yet I've pointed out positives for Biden (in areas Trump runs distinctly in the other direction), and all you've given back is at best break-evens.

 

[Spearman]

The US' official position is that Taiwan is part of China, because they know China won't tolerate anything else.

But that is simply a diplomatic pretence, we can all see that they very willingly test the boundary of every single inch that China will tolerate, all in the name of "peace", then use their media dominance to pretend it's China stoking tensions every time they dare to assert their sovereign right to not be surrounded by the ever encroaching US war machine.





Where do you think the endless provocation from the US towards China you happily condone on the basis of 'defence' ultimately leads?

In Australians quite possibly having to go back to war, against an 'enemy' that our economy is utterly reliant on.

provocation is a loaded term, and you might want to take a peek at the TRA

 

[Bloods86]

provocation is a loaded term, and you might want to take a peak at the TRA

It's the standard line from people whose foreign policy position boils down to "America bad" (can insert NATO, the West in some instances). Imperialism, aggression, invasions, authoritarianism etc by other powers are downplayed and/or justified because "America bad". No matter the facts, that's all they need to know.

 

[Spearman]

TLDR

Is this guy one of Chief's 50¢ers? All over the shop.

 

[Zidane98]

Yet Ukraine was "a valid party" when they invaded and removed independent Crimea's president at gunpoint?

That's some seriously twisted logic at work, IMO.

This is a falsehood. Ukraine never invaded Crimea, it remained part of Ukraine following independence from the USSR.


Saying this is like saying Russia invaded Belgorod region and forcibly brought about its transfer from Ukraine to Russia in the early USSR days.

 

[Trouto]

This is a falsehood. Ukraine never invaded Crimea, it remained part of Ukraine following independence from the USSR.


Saying this is like saying Russia invaded Belgorod region and forcibly brought about its transfer from Ukraine to Russia in the early USSR days.

Republic of Crimea (1992–1995) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Zidane98]

Republic of Crimea (1992–1995) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yes, Crimea remained part of Ukraine pre and post USSR independence. Was never an independent republic and certainly not invaded as others claimed.


The only invasion of Crimea happened around this time 10 years ago by Putin & co.

 

[Rayzorwire]

TLDR

We both know you most certainly got far enough in to know that Genocide Joe isn't just innocently supplying Israel cash, as you asserted, he's supplying the actual bombs, with more on the way, to murder more innocent civilians, coz, y'know, 320,000 tonnes a couple of months back wasn't enough:


US President Joe Biden's administration is preparing to send arms to Israel even as Washington pushes for a ceasefire in Gaza, according to a report on Friday in the Wall Street Journal citing current and former American officials.

The planned weapons delivery includes MK-82 bombs and KMU-572 Joint Direct Attack Munitions that add precision guidance to bombs, as well as FMU-139 bomb fuses.

The value of the arms is estimated to be in the "tens of millions of dollars", according to the report.

US 'will continue to send weapons to Israel' while pushing for ceasefire

The planned weapons delivery comes as Israel prepares a ground invasion of Rafah, where 1.4 million displaced Palestinians are sheltering

www.middleeasteye.net

If you're perfectly OK spending your day running interference for a bloke actively facilitating genocide, mock anyone who dares criticise him for it, happy to play 'see no evil, hear no evil' no matter what level of human suffering you have to deliberately ignore, then that's your choice.

 

[Rayzorwire]

It's not a "nothing to see here" response. You keep saying there's really no difference between Biden and Trump, yet I've pointed out positives for Biden (in areas Trump runs distinctly in the other direction), and all you've given back is at best break-evens.

You've decided to completely avoid commenting on what the Democrats are doing and their continuing attack on civil liberties.

Seemingly, to set up another dozen-round bout of Butt Trumpet.

As I posted yesterday, there's already loads of policy positions in the mix from each potential candidate without them having really launched campaigns yet, and while others may be really interested in comparing and contrasting that for dozens, if not hundreds of hours in minutiae in order to establish that Biden is 2% less evil than Trump, I'm really not.

For starters, what Trump says and does are entirely different things, so you're already debating an ever-changing tangled mess of hypotheticals to sort out what he says his policy is and what he can realistically achieve. Then he'll shift the policy, or bury it in so much contradictory waffle you wish you'd never bothered starting to investigate what the hell he means.

We know exactly what Biden is going to provide, we've seen nearly 4yrs of creeping borderline fascism within the US and endless warmongering abroad.

Trump didn't do worse in his first term and I see no reason to automatically assume he would in a potential 2nd.