Preview Round 8 vs West Coast Preview & Discussion

stkildathunda · May 15, 2012

After a awesome win over Carlton we head over to Perth on a 6 day break, but dont worry bout that as we then have another two 6 day breaks after this week! What does this mean? Well i reckon we will see the young guys rotated a fair bit as the younger guys might struggle to get up with short breaks, especially after a tough match last night.

Not a dig at Siposs, but not sure he was great choice as sub. So will be interesting if he gets full game next week or gets pushed back to VFL for some more full match time.

Think Beau Wilkes needs to stay in the side until McEvoy comes back. Basically think our entire gameplan is most dangerous around 3 talls and then the small crumbing. It also allows Blake to go into defence and take a tall forward. Stanley needs as much time in middle as possible to fast track his development.

James Gwilt is ready for a return but not sure flying him over to Perth for his comeback is greatest idea, maybe following week in Lenny's 250th is perfect time!

Unfortunately for us Nic Nat appears to be coming back this week, so Stanley, Kosi & Blake going to have their work cutout for themselves. Really need Stanley to run with him as he's only one that has the agility and pace to keep up with this freak.

Not sure when MRP findings come out but bit worried that Kosi will get charged due to carryover points for knee to head of Scotland. Was pretty reckless and lazy by big man.

At this stage i think only the one change.

OUT: Siposs (full match in VFL)
IN: Cripps

Might do bit more of a write up later on, but just thought would get thread going.

For any Western Saints out there or if your heading over for game make sure you check out information on their Family Fun Day this Saturday

saintsrfreak · May 15, 2012

I'd bring Ledger in as the sub

LordJimmy · May 15, 2012

Tough ask. Tough tough tough ask. No seriously, really tough ask.

...

We'll win.

goodie23 · May 15, 2012

Wilkes might be spared because he knows Subiaco, could prove very handy. Definitely like the idea of bringing in another West Aussie for Siposs (also giving him a full run in the VFL), either Ledger or Cripps. If we can get Gwilt back, that's another excellent inclusion.

stkildathunda · May 15, 2012

INJURY UPDATE
Sam Fisher - Hamstring - 1 week
Jay Lever - Groin - 1 week
Ben McEvoy - Knee - 4-5 weeks
Jimmy Webster - Shin - 5-6 weeks
Nicholas Winmar - Ankle - Test

Looks like Schneiderman to return to VFL this week. Cant see him coming straight in afyer missing about 8 weeks!

hayes · May 15, 2012

Would be hard to change a team that played so well but with the big open spaces of Subi or whatever it's called now I'm not as confident in the Kosi-Roo-Wilkes forward like. I guess if the three smalls are going to crumb like they did last night then it may just work again.

The only change I'd make is Gwilt for Blake. Yes it's harsh but these are the sort of problems you get when you have depth. Gwilt is one of our best players and he's had enough games in the VFL to be ready. He's looked more than ready in the games I've watched.

If they don't like the idea of bringing him back on such a big ground then I'd just go unchanged. Siposs as the sub again to come on if we're a bit top heavy.

Going to be a big ask but I'm confident we can do it.

TassieSaint · May 15, 2012

Bit off topic, but have anyone seen the poll on the Age? They're asking which team is gonna win the flag and Saints are first with 23% of the vote (next is Collingwood with 14% so it's a fair margin). What's going on there? 2500+ votes too so it's not just Saints fans. We looked great against Carlton last night but we've also looked very average at other times.

Anyway on this game, we've actually had a pretty good record against West Coast at Subi recently haven't we? I remember upsetting them in '07 and '11 when they were well above us on the ladder, so I give us a decent chance.

stkildathunda · May 15, 2012

Jeez despite having Nic Nat & Cox they Eagles are actually not that dominant in midfield!

HITOUTS
West Coast: 42 (8th)
StKilda: 34 (16th)

CLEARANCES
West Coast: 37 (13th)
StKilda: 38 (12th)

Shows you dont need dominate big man to win the ball..

Falchoon · May 15, 2012

hayes said:
The only change I'd make is Gwilt for Blake. Yes it's harsh but these are the sort of problems you get when you have depth. Gwilt is one of our best players and he's had enough games in the VFL to be ready. He's looked more than ready in the games I've watched.

You don't drop guys on the sort of effort Blake gave last night, it sends the wrong message.

saintsrfreak · May 15, 2012

Falchoon said:
You don't drop guys on the sort of effort Blake gave last night, it sends the wrong message.

Yep, Gilbert for Gwilt is the obvious change

TassieSaint · May 15, 2012

aussiethunda said:
Shows you dont need dominate big man to win the ball..

Carlton killed us in the hitouts last night 60 - 25. We won the clearances 42-37.

West Coast have a good midfield though and some great ball winners, but I expect our tactic of pretty much conceding the ruck and sharking taps will be the same.

stkildathunda · May 15, 2012

TassieSaint said:
Carlton killed us in the hitouts last night 60 - 25. We won the clearances 42-37.

West Coast have a good midfield though and some great ball winners, but I expect our tactic of pretty much conceding the ruck and sharking taps will be the same.

Fremantle smashed us in hitouts and we won clearances by 13.... I like to call it the Lenny Hayes factor

thomas_m18 · May 15, 2012

I say we go into this week unchanged. If it ain't broke... I can understand the argument to getting Siposs a full game, but I think I'd rather him give him a few weeks at the top. I don't really like the idea of pulling a kid out of the VFL to have him travel all the way to Subiaco to get him 20 minutes of game time. Having said that, if Gwilt is ready, Siposs goes out. If the club drops Gilbert, we have to be committed to the move, and he doesn't come back until he shows he is well above the VFL level. Not exactly thrilled at dropping Siposs after two weeks, but it's him or Gilbert, and IMO this year Gilbert offers more value if he can hit his form. Besides, WC, despite having Kennedy, LeCras and Nicoski out, still are potent up forward. Darling, Lynch, Hill and Cox/Naitanui are still a dangerous forward line at best.

What's more difficult is picking a sub. If we don't change the team, Siposs is the natural choice, but I'd like to see him playing full games. However, hypothetically, if we swap Siposs for Gwilt, it's hard to think of a player to make sub. Surely Milera and Saad start the game, and Gilbert doesn't strike me as a sub type, despite his versatility. He might be the one we have to go to, unless we decide to give it to Geary, Armitage or Steven. They'd all be unlikely to be affected though.

Not a bad dilemma to have.

L_W_P · May 15, 2012

saintsrfreak said:
Yep, Gilbert for Gwilt is the obvious change

This.

IN: Gwilt, Cripps
OUT: Gilbert, Siposs

Geary - Blake - Dempster
Gram - Gwilt - Simpkin
Montagna - Hayes - Dal Santo
Milera - Riewoldt - Stanley
Milne - Wilkes - Saad
Koschitzke - Armitage - Steven
Goddard - Ray - Jones - (Cripps)

Look2Me4Guidance · May 15, 2012

aussiethunda said:
Jeez despite having Nic Nat & Cox they Eagles are actually not that dominant in midfield!

HITOUTS
West Coast: 42 (8th)
StKilda: 34 (16th)

CLEARANCES
West Coast: 37 (13th)
StKilda: 38 (12th)

Shows you dont need dominate big man to win the ball..

Wouldn't worry about Kosi, AT. Absolutely nothing in it. He did well not to do any further damage.

In regards to those clearance stats, they don't tell the full story. I assume they are averages. Needs to be married up with how many stoppages are occurring in a game. I prefer to look at differential stats in stoppages and contested possessions to see how we're tracking. You're dead right though, we need to win the clearances to beat the Coasters.

hayes · May 15, 2012

Falchoon said:
You don't drop guys on the sort of effort Blake gave last night, it sends the wrong message.

Pretty fair point, I just rate Gwilt extremely highly and I think he can do what Blake does as a defender (he's done jobs on guys like Podsiadly and Dawes in the past) but also be another option to bring the ball out of defense that we lost in Fisher. We all know how good his kicking is.

It would be an incredibly tough call, but I've always thought he was just warming the spot for Gwilt anyway. Either way it's a good problem to have.

goodie23 · May 15, 2012

hayes said:
Pretty fair point, I just rate Gwilt extremely highly and I think he can do what Blake does as a defender (he's done jobs on guys like Podsiadly and Dawes in the past) but also be another option to bring the ball out of defense that we lost in Fisher. We all know how good his kicking is.

It would be a tough call, but I've always thought he was just warming the spot for Gwilt anyway. Either way it's a good problem to have.

With Big Ben down, I'd keep Blake as a back-up ruck as well as defender. Gives us a better chance to wear down their duo, means Stanley and Kosi doesn't have to sprint to make throw-ins in the backline.

That and form mean he's well safe

Plugger35 · May 15, 2012

I don't think we need to make many changes to a team that played so well last night but I agree with some others that maybe we should bring in Ledger or Cripps for Siposs who once again struggled to have much impact.

Ledger's pace could be handy on a big ground like Subi and Cripps seems to be the player who has performed best for us as the sub. Both are WA boys too so it would be nice to give them a trip home and a game in front of family and friends.

Not sure if Gwilt or Fisher will be ready for this week but if they are then Gilbert would probably be the defender to drop based on performance. Gilbert worked hard last night but his kicking is still a worry and he caused a couple of turnovers early on with poor kicks. You can't drop Blake after the great game he played last night and none of our other defenders deserve to be dropped.

Our record at Subi has been pretty good in recent years so hopefully it continues with a win on Sunday. Should help with Watters having a good knowledge of the ground having coached Subiaco in the WAFL at that ground many times.

Darkhour · May 15, 2012

I really don't see what all the fuss about Siposs is..? Every time I watch him play this season, he hasn't really done anything special and in fact has butchered opportunities.. The kid might have talent but doesn't seem to fit the big stage just yet...

I would love to see Gwilt back into the lineup though. Maybe a swap for Gilbert as he has been down. Otherwise swap siposs for ledger maybe?

Fehring · May 15, 2012

TassieSaint said:
Bit off topic, but have anyone seen the poll on the Age? They're asking which team is gonna win the flag and Saints are first with 23% of the vote (next is Collingwood with 14% so it's a fair margin). What's going on there? 2500+ votes too so it's not just Saints fans. We looked great against Carlton last night but we've also looked very average at other time.

Goldfish. It was a poll of goldfish.

hayes · May 15, 2012

Siposs hasn't been great and maybe he isn't quite ready yet, but I think he deserves more than 5 quarters to prove whether he is or not. We all saw the upside last year and if he can get it going then we become even more dangerous, if not then Schneider, Ledger or Cripps come in. No biggie.

mysainters · May 15, 2012

Anyone watch OTC, and the in depth look into our stoppage work v Carlton?

Showed how the boys set up to cover Carlton getting the ball outside, and that was a key to the win.

Does credit once again have to go to Laidley, who is said to be doing a heap of work here?

You'd have to say though that if Nic Nat plays, same tactic may not work, he has the ability to clear the ball from the immediate stoppage.

sammm · May 15, 2012

hayes said:
Would be hard to change a team that played so well but with the big open spaces of Subi or whatever it's called now I'm not as confident in the Kosi-Roo-Wilkes forward like. I guess if the three smalls are going to crumb like they did last night then it may just work again.

The only change I'd make is Gwilt for Blake. Yes it's harsh but these are the sort of problems you get when you have depth. Gwilt is one of our best players and he's had enough games in the VFL to be ready. He's looked more than ready in the games I've watched.

If they don't like the idea of bringing him back on such a big ground then I'd just go unchanged. Siposs as the sub again to come on if we're a bit top heavy.

Going to be a big ask but I'm confident we can do it.

If you want to get Gwilt in, i would change Gwilt for Gilbert.

However i can't imagine that Scotty would bring in gwilt for the WA match, leave him for the sydney match and Lenny's 250th.

bluejay · May 15, 2012

aussiethunda said:
I like to call it the Lenny Hayes factor

Great name for a factor, hehe. And yes, Lenny is the big contributor when sharking up for taps in a down and under work, but this year we must also admit that Armitage is finally proving his worth and has improved A LOT, and other players like Steven have also been helping there too.

HoldenMCaulfield · May 16, 2012

hayes said:
The only change I'd make is Gwilt for Blake. Yes it's harsh but these are the sort of problems you get when you have depth.

Depth will result in harsh selection decisions, but I doubt that someone will be dropped after two BOG or close to BOG performances.

Gwilt is an outstanding kick and a better rebounder, but not really a full back type defender (he did well against Podsiadly running off him with the lose defender helping him defensively, but I remember monster forwards like Dawes wrestling him out of the contest on numerous occasions). He has been good in the VFL, I hear, but I would not bring him back with a trip to Perth.

West Coast may have lost some of their forwards to injury, but are still one of the better and tall forward lines in the AFL, especially if Naitanui is back and Cox can play forward. Blake (and Gilbert for that matter) will be required if we want to shut them down.

As to Siposs, well, he should get a full game - either in the AFL or the VFL. I am not sure that the huge Subiaco ground will be good for him, especially if used in a winger type role (I cannot see a spot for him in the forward line these days).

I therefore expect:

Out: Siposs
In: Cripps (sub)

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