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Delisted 13. Liam Stocker

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gbatman said:
Interesting we rated him at pick 6. Had we taken him at that pick he'd definitely be in a lot of best 22s going around. We were clearly over the moon when we landed him.
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He is clearly earmarked for Boltons best 22. And clearly no other player was...'if we cant get our player we wont do the deal' ...Bugsy SOS for all the world running a racket there..lucky for us
 

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HARKER said:
Must say that the opening scenes of that video struck me as being just a little odd.
The fact that the group were discussing the pros of Stocker and then even watching video of him, is something that would have been done days out from the draft.
The whole notion of making a play for Stocker was already afoot, given some of the dialogue between SOS, Adelaide & Port Adelaide.

If this did play out as is being portrayed, Bolton must have had no idea what was going on. How could this be so?
Surely the coach of the club has some input or at least has taken out the time to see some vision of who may be coming into the club.
This video had Bolton shown up as having no idea at all, as he even requested the number of the player he was to be looking at.

Anyway, the video did get a lot of people talking and even if a little doctored, made for fascinating viewing.
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I don’t think the coach has that much input into drafting to be honest. A lot of the recruitment work would be done in season and the head coach’s responsibility would be the team. I’m sure there’s discussion at some level but the coach would have little say in it.
 
gardiner stand said:
I don’t think the coach has that much input into drafting to be honest. A lot of the recruitment work would be done in season and the head coach’s responsibility would be the team. I’m sure there’s discussion at some level but the coach would have little say in it.
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I agree more or less. But I would frame it in a different context. That the coach is in deep discussion with recruiters in early days especially with a wishlist and strategies mapped out and then steps back while the recruitment team do whats possible. Its a whole team effort and everyone has a specified part in it. As far as I am concerned no organization can work succesfully without total input from everybody. But the coach has to be number one in the end no matter what. We can put a hundred guys in recruiting but if they dont get what the coach demands its a waste of time. And if it fails the coach is the first one out the door.
 
Blue and Blue said:
I agree more or less. But I would frame it in a different context. That the coach is in deep discussion with recruiters in early days especially with a wishlist and strategies mapped out and then steps back while the recruitment team do whats possible. Its a whole team effort and everyone has a specified part in it. As far as I am concerned no organization can work succesfully without total input from everybody. But the coach has to be number one in the end no matter what. We can put a hundred guys in recruiting but if they dont get what the coach demands its a waste of time. And if it fails the coach is the first one out the door.
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The buck always stops with the coach so I’m sure he’s got input but I don’t think he’s the one who decides which player is drafted. In the video you can see sos reassuring Bolton that he’s drafted the right player.
 
Blue and Blue said:
I agree more or less. But I would frame it in a different context. That the coach is in deep discussion with recruiters in early days especially with a wishlist and strategies mapped out and then steps back while the recruitment team do whats possible. Its a whole team effort and everyone has a specified part in it. As far as I am concerned no organization can work succesfully without total input from everybody. But the coach has to be number one in the end no matter what. We can put a hundred guys in recruiting but if they dont get what the coach demands its a waste of time. And if it fails the coach is the first one out the door.
Click to expand...
The buck always stops with the coach so I’m sure he’s got input but I don’t think he’s the one who decides which player is drafted. In the video you can see sos reassuring Bolton that he’s drafted the right player.
 
HARKER said:
Must say that the opening scenes of that video struck me as being just a little odd.
The fact that the group were discussing the pros of Stocker and then even watching video of him, is something that would have been done days out from the draft.
The whole notion of making a play for Stocker was already afoot, given some of the dialogue between SOS, Adelaide & Port Adelaide.

If this did play out as is being portrayed, Bolton must have had no idea what was going on. How could this be so?
Surely the coach of the club has some input or at least has taken out the time to see some vision of who may be coming into the club.
This video had Bolton shown up as having no idea at all, as he even requested the number of the player he was to be looking at.

Anyway, the video did get a lot of people talking and even if a little doctored, made for fascinating viewing.
Click to expand...
Could have been going back over the key targets.

GWS put out some footage shortly after the draft which has them going through a range of players (the ones they chose) as they had picks through the first round. At times it seemed like they were stating the obvious about those players, but it came across that they were doing it for all the players in their range so they could confirm their order.
 
slashin_velvet said:
Could have been going back over the key targets.

GWS put out some footage shortly after the draft which has them going through a range of players (the ones they chose) as they had picks through the first round. At times it seemed like they were stating the obvious about those players, but it came across that they were doing it for all the players in their range so they could confirm their order.
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Yep, selective editing. Taking all & sundry through the caryard/home open for final thoughts before the big purchase and the options available.

Agreed on the GWS vision, which was also a good watch, can only be those players you end up selecting that make the final cut. They did have a good draft however by the looks.
 
gbatman said:
Interesting we rated him at pick 6. Had we taken him at that pick he'd definitely be in a lot of best 22s going around. We were clearly over the moon when we landed him.
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Silvagni's reaction said it all really.
 
gbatman said:
Interesting we rated him at pick 6. Had we taken him at that pick he'd definitely be in a lot of best 22s going around. We were clearly over the moon when we landed him.
Click to expand...
Clearly our recruiters had him top 6 going by the vision. Which means that with the trade, we effectively got two top 10 draft picks this year....and assuming the Cows finish somewhere between 6 and 12, we're still likely to receive a top 10 pick or thereabouts in 2019.

The other important thing to note with the vision was that SOS and co weren't trading to get back into the draft earlier, they had a specific target. If Stocker wasn't available at #19, no deal.

I reckons the Stocker trade was a no brainer....although it appears that we're looking to trade our first rounder next year for a 'big fish'. Even better!!!

A Billings or Jack Martin would be nice, a Taranto, Kelly or Coniglio would be awesome :)
 

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Haven’t heard too much about Liam’s trackwork as yet (finished his TAC Cup season with a minor shoulder injury, but has since fully recovered. He joined Carlton's main group from day one of pre-season) so it’ll be interesting to see his development between now & JLT.

Walsh must be an impressive footballer from the commentary from his (load monitored) training already. This on top of the Geelong references from his training there, should see regular AFL games for ‘19.

Hoping to hear that Liam’s kicking is a standout by his peers on the track (we need added class on that front, lace out kicks from Liam, SPS, LOB, Willo) and then his clearance work can grow from Crippa’s tutelage whilst his running is worked upon, though not sure if it’ll be at AFL level or NB’s to start with.
 
In the draft night video, Bolton's role is very passive, virtually a passenger along for the ride. I find this very reassuring. It demonstrates total trust in others to do their job and it is the job of the recruiting team not Bolton to identify the best talent available.

But common sense tells me that it is the coach who has had the major input into recruitment needs - player types not specific players. I am sure it is an ongoing conversation throughout the year but no doubt strategy is finalized and agreed at a meeting with the coach at season end.

It is also reassuring that Bolton is not wasting energy trawling through draft prospect videos - he has other priorities. We have come a long way from Malthouse.
 
Bamboo Harvester said:
Clearly our recruiters had him top 6 going by the vision. Which means that with the trade, we effectively got two top 10 draft picks this year....and assuming the Cows finish somewhere between 6 and 12, we're still likely to receive a top 10 pick or thereabouts in 2019.

The other important thing to note with the vision was that SOS and co weren't trading to get back into the draft earlier, they had a specific target. If Stocker wasn't available at #19, no deal.

I reckons the Stocker trade was a no brainer....although it appears that we're looking to trade our first rounder next year for a 'big fish'. Even better!!!

A Billings or Jack Martin would be nice, a Taranto, Kelly or Coniglio would be awesome :)
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You should always have a specific target, what you don't do is inflate them so much that if a player you thought you had no chance of drafting slips, you stick with the player you thought you'd get. Looking back at the 2012 draft, It seemed like we didn't have a target for our first pick until virtually the last minute but I get the impression that we talked up Tom Temay (remember him?) into something resembling the second coming of Juddy just because we knew we could get him.
 
Bamboo Harvester said:
Clearly our recruiters had him top 6 going by the vision. Which means that with the trade, we effectively got two top 10 draft picks this year....and assuming the Cows finish somewhere between 6 and 12, we're still likely to receive a top 10 pick or thereabouts in 2019.

The other important thing to note with the vision was that SOS and co weren't trading to get back into the draft earlier, they had a specific target. If Stocker wasn't available at #19, no deal.

I reckons the Stocker trade was a no brainer....although it appears that we're looking to trade our first rounder next year for a 'big fish'. Even better!!!

A Billings or Jack Martin would be nice, a Taranto, Kelly or Coniglio would be awesome :)
Click to expand...
Billings. As in Jack Billings?

Dont make me report this post.



All the others are completely acceptable.
 
Bamboo Harvester said:
Clearly our recruiters had him top 6 going by the vision. Which means that with the trade, we effectively got two top 10 draft picks this year....and assuming the Cows finish somewhere between 6 and 12, we're still likely to receive a top 10 pick or thereabouts in 2019.

The other important thing to note with the vision was that SOS and co weren't trading to get back into the draft earlier, they had a specific target. If Stocker wasn't available at #19, no deal.

I reckons the Stocker trade was a no brainer....although it appears that we're looking to trade our first rounder next year for a 'big fish'. Even better!!!

A Billings or Jack Martin would be nice, a Taranto, Kelly or Coniglio would be awesome :)
Click to expand...
Agreed. This is why the trade also cannot be thought of as pick 19 and swap of firsts, rather it should be Stocker (with Adelaide giving up pick 19) and swap of firsts. I know that many (maybe not on this board) think of it as a top 4 pick for a pick above 10 and 19. However, in a normal pick swap you don’t know who you are going to get, so it’s a bit more of a gamble and risk which dilutes the value of the trade. In this case though, we were trading only if we could get our man.
 

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Press Box Wing said:
In the draft night video, Bolton's role is very passive, virtually a passenger along for the ride. I find this very reassuring. It demonstrates total trust in others to do their job and it is the job of the recruiting team not Bolton to identify the best talent available.

But common sense tells me that it is the coach who has had the major input into recruitment needs - player types not specific players. I am sure it is an ongoing conversation throughout the year but no doubt strategy is finalized and agreed at a meeting with the coach at season end.
Click to expand...

Yeah fair post. Coach should be having input into establishing team needs, or whether certain kids fits the team ethos or not, but from there you’d kinda be hoping recruiters are trusted to fill the brief.
 
Taranto would cost more than Shiel and rightly so. We'd have to give up the first round we got from Crows and our 2020 1st rounder for Giants to even look at it. I doubt Taranto will be on table. They will lock him into a long term contract during the year.
 
ferrisb said:
I think that means it's time to start a Round 1 preview thread.....

In unrelated news, does anyone know when Aph goes on holidays? :)
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To my inbox bearing pineapples
 

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