List Mgmt. 2014 Draft Trade FA Megathread

[goodie23]

Could then also trade 22 & 26/27 for a pick in the teens and have 3 inside 20 again!

6/7, pick inside teens, where does the third one come from?

 

[12Chill]

6/7, pick inside teens, where does the third one come from?

He said to trade 22 and 26/27 to a team with a pick in the teams, for example those picks to North Melbourne for pick 12 or something.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

The end result in that trade left us with 2, 6/7, 22 & 26/27.

Anyway I hope we don't trade Armo just a suggestion.

I'm hoping we are auctioning off pick 1 to GWS and Melb for the rights to Petracca.

Pick 1 for pick 2 & Toumpas
Pick 1 for pick 3, Jaksch & JOR

I'd be happy with either...as long as we were assured of McCartin.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

Not a fan of Wright. I would only trade down if we were certain to get McCartin at 3/4; or stuff GWS and trade with Melb.

What if the deal was ridiculously good?

Pick 1 -> Pick 4 (Wright), Pick 20, Jaksch & O'Rourke?...You'd have to pull the trigger TLE?

 

[Grav]

Still like to know what the go is with Jeremy Cameron, out of contract next year but wants to move on. Surely GWS still wants to get a $ or two for him. Are we still in the hunt?

 

[cuzo]

The end result in that trade left us with 2, 6/7, 22 & 26/27.

Anyway I hope we don't trade Armo just a suggestion.

I'm hoping we are auctioning off pick 1 to GWS and Melb for the rights to Petracca.

Pick 1 for pick 2 & Toumpas
Pick 1 for pick 3, Jaksch & JOR

I'd be happy with either...as long as we were assured of McCartin.

Why wouldn't we be pushing for another player or pick along with Toumpas like we are with GWS?

 

[TheLastEmperor]

What if the deal was ridiculously good?

Pick 1 -> Pick 4 (Wright), Pick 20, Jaksch & O'Rourke?...You'd have to pull the trigger TLE?

Yea you would that deal is massively in our favour. I'm still sceptical about this trade. So far we've heard Cameron, Boyd, even Hoskin-Elliot's name was mentioned and now Jaksch and JOR.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

Why wouldn't we be pushing for another player or pick along with Toumpas like we are with GWS?

2 & Toumpas is already in our favour so just trying not to be too greedy, I'll leave that to the Pelican.

 

[Rors]

Im putting it out on the table right now.... I'd be seriously disappointed if we were seduced into a deal with GWS because the sweetener was Mr Hamstring Twang himself, Jono O'Rourke.

Cmon fellas, the poor kid has already torn his hammy's about 5-6 times in the space of 2 seasons & for a 18-19 year old, that's not a very good sign.

Call me overly critical, but its just not worth the risk IMO. And that last hammy he tore in the Collingwood game looked as brutal as they come.

 

[felsty]

Can we stop and think about this Pick 1 for Pick 3, Jacksch and ORourke.

Why would GWS do this? Getting rid of two out of contract kids for a two spot upgrade?

I know people will say it's for the rights to the best U18 AFL Footballer in the country, but they are only giving up the rights to the third best.

They would be better off pawning Jacksch off to the highest bidder and getting a late first, early second rounder for him.

From my perspective, I would love Jacksch and think we need him to sure up our big man stocks. With Gwilt leaving I think there is a spot for him as well. Would Delaney have had a few games off for his hip injury during the year if we had Kristian to fill the void?

Rate him highly up either end.

Do not rate ORourke unless we think we can fix his hammy issues, because otherwise he seems to have all the tools to become something.

 

[Rors]

Do not rate ORourke unless we think we can fix his hammy issues, because otherwise he seems to have all the tools to become something.

StKilda's track record at fixing serious hamstring issues in young players....

Xavier Clarke - fail
Jesse W Smith - fail
Leigh Fisher - fail

I dont like those odds.... Jono O'Rourke - no thanks

 

[Barrels]

For those writing off JOR, I simply say this; he is 20!! Not only that, but he missed virtually the entire season last year - having had his jaw broken, but tellingly playing out the game - and his hamstrings are a concern, but he is a jet, very much in the Cotchin/Delidio mould.

For reference, via Knightmare:
#2 GWS (Via Gold Coast) - Jonothan O’Rourke (VIC - Mid)
Height: 183cm, Weight: 75kg, DOB: 21/04/1994
Recruited from: Calder Cannons
Style: Brett Deledio
Player comparison:
Range: 2-6

Profile: Missed most of the 2011 season with a hamstring injury but has come back hard in 2012 and shown us just how good he is. O’Rouke is a very explosive, highly skills inside receiver. He has some balance between inside and outside game but I wouldn’t consider him a master of either with limited inside ball winning ability and an average linkup game. Maybe not your most natural ball winner but he attacks the ball hard. Very good all rounder who stands out most is his ball use, particularly by foot which is just so good for an inside player. Finds targets consistently by foot, has some hurt factor and finishes beautifully around goal. Decision making ability good and chooses the right target more often than not. Is also a very good athlete and has great pace with the ability to burst away from packs and a nice leap on him. Very good in congestion and has that great decision making ability choosing the right targets even while pressured which is impressive. He is more your inside receiver who benefits from the work of the stronger, ball winning inside midfielders who can accelerate away from the contest and deliver to the targets up the ground by foot and this is more what I see his role as but not so sure that inside game ever develops and makes him into that Dangerfield explosive type inside guy who can win his own ball even though his explosiveness is just as good. One move I’d consider with O’Rourke is a move onto a back flank at some stage. 1v1 game will need to get stronger but with his elite pace and footskills he could become a real weapon off a back flank for a team.

Fix his hamstrings, which are certainly a relevant concern, and he could be the mother of all 'steak knives' wins. He's still got an immature body as well (78kgs), so we need to be patient and let him get it right and add some mass if he comes to us.

Think of the impact that Sean Dempster, himself a 'steak knives' acquisition has had for us.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

Can we stop and think about this Pick 1 for Pick 3, Jacksch and ORourke.

Why would GWS do this? Getting rid of two out of contract kids for a two spot upgrade?

I know people will say it's for the rights to the best U18 AFL Footballer in the country, but they are only giving up the rights to the third best.

They would be better off pawning Jacksch off to the highest bidder and getting a late first, early second rounder for him.

From my perspective, I would love Jacksch and think we need him to sure up our big man stocks. With Gwilt leaving I think there is a spot for him as well. Would Delaney have had a few games off for his hip injury during the year if we had Kristian to fill the void?

Rate him highly up either end.

Do not rate ORourke unless we think we can fix his hammy issues, because otherwise he seems to have all the tools to become something.

GWS will likely use 2 picks on academy players (Finlayson and Steele) which means they may only use 2-3 live picks on top of that.

Ideally they will be looking at upgrading picks, not gaining further picks. But they would be pushing hard to give us Jaksch for the 3-1 pick upgrade and then do similar with JOR.

Their draft strategy would be something like this:
Pick 3 - Package with Jaksch/O'Rourke to upgrade
Pick 20 - Package with Jaksch/O'Rourke to upgrade
Pick 23 - Finlayson
Pick 41 - Steele

They won't be after pick 15-25 for each of Jaksch and O'Rourke, it will be all about the pick upgrade.

Best case scenario for them is pick 3 & Jaksch for pick 1-2 & pick 20 & JOR for pick 10-15.

Whilst I agree the JOR/Jaksch/pick 3 deal is heavily weighted in our favour if they really want pick 1 and are not getting offers suggested in best case scenario then they may be willing to trade with us.

 

[Rors]

For those writing off JOR, I simply say this; he is 20!! Not only that, but he missed virtually the entire season last year - having had his jaw broken, but tellingly playing out the game - and his hamstrings are a concern, but he is a jet, very much in the Cotchin/Delidio mould.

For reference, via Knightmare:
#2 GWS (Via Gold Coast) - Jonothan O’Rourke (VIC - Mid)
Height: 183cm, Weight: 75kg, DOB: 21/04/1994
Recruited from: Calder Cannons
Style: Brett Deledio
Player comparison:
Range: 2-6

Profile: Missed most of the 2011 season with a hamstring injury but has come back hard in 2012 and shown us just how good he is. O’Rouke is a very explosive, highly skills inside receiver. He has some balance between inside and outside game but I wouldn’t consider him a master of either with limited inside ball winning ability and an average linkup game. Maybe not your most natural ball winner but he attacks the ball hard. Very good all rounder who stands out most is his ball use, particularly by foot which is just so good for an inside player. Finds targets consistently by foot, has some hurt factor and finishes beautifully around goal. Decision making ability good and chooses the right target more often than not. Is also a very good athlete and has great pace with the ability to burst away from packs and a nice leap on him. Very good in congestion and has that great decision making ability choosing the right targets even while pressured which is impressive. He is more your inside receiver who benefits from the work of the stronger, ball winning inside midfielders who can accelerate away from the contest and deliver to the targets up the ground by foot and this is more what I see his role as but not so sure that inside game ever develops and makes him into that Dangerfield explosive type inside guy who can win his own ball even though his explosiveness is just as good. One move I’d consider with O’Rourke is a move onto a back flank at some stage. 1v1 game will need to get stronger but with his elite pace and footskills he could become a real weapon off a back flank for a team.

Fix his hamstrings, which are certainly a relevant concern, and he could be the mother of all 'steak knives' wins. He's still got an immature body as well (78kgs), so we need to be patient and let him get it right and add some mass if he comes to us.

Think of the impact that Sean Dempster, himself a 'steak knives' acquisition has had for us.

Uncle Barrels.... Here is his 2014 season preview Bio from GWS website:

"It was a rookie year blighted by injuries for the No. 2 pick in the 2012 NAB AFL Draft. It started with hamstring problems and continued with a broken jaw, resulting in just one senior appearance against the Sydney Swans in round 16. He will be hoping for a decent run this year to show the type of efficiency and ball-winning ability that underlined his outstanding junior career."

So his hamstrings were a big issue in his TAC cup years in 2011 & 2012.... Then in his debut year in the AFL in 2013.... Now add a further 3 (edited) hamstring tears over 2014 preseason & during this season... No thanks.

If he's so bloody good & his hamstrings aren't too much of an issue, why does he remain uncontracted at GWS? I get that he may come good, but cant we just ask for a good player to start with or just bloody take Petracca ourselves?

 

[TheLastEmperor]

For those writing off JOR, I simply say this; he is 20!! Not only that, but he missed virtually the entire season last year - having had his jaw broken, but tellingly playing out the game - and his hamstrings are a concern, but he is a jet, very much in the Cotchin/Delidio mould.

For reference, via Knightmare:
#2 GWS (Via Gold Coast) - Jonothan O’Rourke (VIC - Mid)
Height: 183cm, Weight: 75kg, DOB: 21/04/1994
Recruited from: Calder Cannons
Style: Brett Deledio
Player comparison:
Range: 2-6

Profile: Missed most of the 2011 season with a hamstring injury but has come back hard in 2012 and shown us just how good he is. O’Rouke is a very explosive, highly skills inside receiver. He has some balance between inside and outside game but I wouldn’t consider him a master of either with limited inside ball winning ability and an average linkup game. Maybe not your most natural ball winner but he attacks the ball hard. Very good all rounder who stands out most is his ball use, particularly by foot which is just so good for an inside player. Finds targets consistently by foot, has some hurt factor and finishes beautifully around goal. Decision making ability good and chooses the right target more often than not. Is also a very good athlete and has great pace with the ability to burst away from packs and a nice leap on him. Very good in congestion and has that great decision making ability choosing the right targets even while pressured which is impressive. He is more your inside receiver who benefits from the work of the stronger, ball winning inside midfielders who can accelerate away from the contest and deliver to the targets up the ground by foot and this is more what I see his role as but not so sure that inside game ever develops and makes him into that Dangerfield explosive type inside guy who can win his own ball even though his explosiveness is just as good. One move I’d consider with O’Rourke is a move onto a back flank at some stage. 1v1 game will need to get stronger but with his elite pace and footskills he could become a real weapon off a back flank for a team.

Fix his hamstrings, which are certainly a relevant concern, and he could be the mother of all 'steak knives' wins. He's still got an immature body as well (78kgs), so we need to be patient and let him get it right and add some mass if he comes to us.

Think of the impact that Sean Dempster, himself a 'steak knives' acquisition has had for us.

I'm probably one that has been overstating his hamstring issues. Worth noting he only had one hamstring injury in 2013 and one at the end of this season. He actually had a good run this year.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

StKilda's track record at fixing serious hamstring issues in young players....

Xavier Clarke - fail
Jesse W Smith - fail
Leigh Fisher - fail

I dont like those odds.... Jono O'Rourke - no thanks

His hammies are nowhere near as chronic as the injuries those guys had.

 

[Mindtraveller]

StKilda's track record at fixing serious hamstring issues in young players....

Xavier Clarke - fail
Jesse W Smith - fail
Leigh Fisher - fail

I dont like those odds.... Jono O'Rourke - no thanks

AFAIK he had no cartilage in his ankles. Thats why he stopped playing.

 

[holllywood]

100% behind Rors on this.

Tom Lee can barely got on the park due to dodgy shoulders and it frustrates me to no end and I can see something similar with JOR with his hammies.

Seems like his hamstring problems could be biological or mechanical rather than being unlucky. Not an easy fix.

 

[Rors]

His hammies are nowhere near as chronic as the injuries those guys had.

Not yet.....

 

[TheLastEmperor]

AFAIK he had no cartilage in his ankles. Thats why he stopped playing.

Correct. He had a chronic ankle injury from 2006. Also had his hammy issues throughout his career but the ankle is what caused his retirement.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

Not yet.....

If they are Cyril Rioli level hammies then I wouldn't go near him. But at the moment we are looking at a guy thats had two hamstring injuries over two seasons so they may not be as bad as we think. Rob Harvey had dodgy hammies throughout his career and he seemed to manage okay.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

Different types of players I know, but Rhys had huge hammy problems in his first three seasons but he seems to have overcome those.




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[joop]

Yeh but Gumbleton also had hammy problems..

 

[Rors]

If they are Cyril Rioli level hammies then I wouldn't go near him. But at the moment we are looking at a guy thats had two hamstring injuries over two seasons so they may not be as bad as we think. Rob Harvey had dodgy hammies throughout his career and he seemed to manage okay.

I get that. But if you go further back, hamstring issues derailed his junior TAC Cup season in 2011, then in 2012 he became a standout senior TAC Cup player, then his first AFL season (2013) he had hamstring issues & a broken jaw, then he had hamstring issues over 2014 preseason & now the epic tear against Collingwood 2 weeks back....

To me he sounds like what Cyril Rioli & Winderlich are at present, without ever being able to have got those early few years injury free under his belt....

NB: Harves had hamstring problems persistent over his career because he used to train by himself while he was injured & would never let them heal properly. That is fact

 

[TheLastEmperor]

I get that. But if you go further back, hamstring issues derailed his junior TAC Cup season in 2011, then in 2012 he became a standout senior TAC Cup player, then his first AFL season (2013) he had hamstring issues & a broken jaw, then he had hamstring issues over 2014 preseason & now the epic tear against Collingwood 2 weeks back....

To me he sounds like what Cyril Rioli & Winderlich are at present, without ever being able to have got those early few years injury free under his belt....

NB: Harves had hamstring problems persistent over his career because he used to train by himself while he was injured & would never let them heal properly. That is fact

I wasn't aware of his 2014 preseason injury or the severity of his latest. That doesn't sound too good. Just how bad is his latest hamstring? Are we talking Riewoldt 2010?