Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion Part II

[Weiterbot23]

I'd be that excited for pick 18 if we somehow landed it for Casboult. Puts us in Worpel territory.

Wasn't he being talked about as pick 1 early days?

 

[Soapy V]

HSun reporting that if cas leaves, we'll get pick 18 in return.

Really?? Sold!!

 

[rog1995]

Any indication who SOS likes at this stage with our first selection. Would love Rayner personally based on X Factor.

 

[BlueTongue]

Kelly isn't a Free Agent

Errr - Duh - I guess i shoulda realized that with all the discussion of what picks we'd be giving up...

 

[Cutz]

The big point you are missing here is that we are not getting flogged when we lose. We are an improving side but prone to a fade-out due to not having enough longterm fitness & a lack of games under the belt.

RD 13 - beat GC by 10
RD 14 - lost to Tiges by 26
RD 15 - lost to Crows by 22
RD 16 - lost to Dees by 8
RD 17 - lost to dogs by 20
RD 18 - lost to Lions by 30
RD 19 - lost to Cats by 65
RD 20 - lost to Bombers by 8

Take out the Geelong match and we have been very competitive over the past 2-months.

No need to reinvent the rebuild game or go for the quick fixes, just keep going back to the draft and pick up quality youth, it's worked so far hasn't it ??

Yep,,fair enough...two blowouts doesn't mean we're getting regularly flogged and we have been there or thereabouts most weeks.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Any indication who SOS likes at this stage with our first selection. Would love Rayner personally based on X Factor.

Rayner seems the standout in most people's opinions. The question mark is whether he can do a Dusty and become a midfielder that rests forward, or if he'll be a predominantly forward 50 player due to lack of endurance. Martin is the direct comparison, but could just as easily end up a Stringer.

Lucas Davies-Uniacke is the highest rated inside mid. Is pretty powerful on the burst, but from what I've seen he appears pretty lead-footed a lot of the time. Win the ball, stand up through the tackle, dish the ball off. I'd like to see him offer something else to justify spending a top 2 pick on him, because someone like Worpel will do a similar job and would be gettable with a late first rounder. Reminds me a bit of Sydney's Josh Kennedy, good at what he does but a little one-dimensional.

Adam Cerra is a balanced midfielder with more of an inside lean. Probably not as high a ceiling as other top end mids, but you'd be pretty confident of getting a quality midfielder by picking him up. Think slightly bigger Darcy Parish.

Paddy Dow is another inside-leaning midfielder. Has a good turn of pace and always looks to drive the ball forward. Rides contact really well which releases opponents into space when he gives off. Left-field comparison here which may divide people, but I see a bit of Steele Sidebottom in him (a player who I think is hugely underrated).

 

[Iamcarlton]

Jusge him on his footy. There is no doubt he is a player on the up IMO. Obviously can play forward or back. Is he a left footer also?? Would be nice if we could get him more cheaply than that though.

I think there may be quite a few people re evaluating their original opinion of Sicily he's been a fine player for Hawthorn of late has the smarts as well . Taking out the temper and brain fades occasionally will be his next challenge .

 

[BlueTongue]

I think there may be quite a few people re evaluating their original opinion of Sicily he's been a fine player for Hawthorn of late has the smarts as well . Taking out the temper and brain fades occasionally will be his next challenge .

I'd swap Casboult/Pick 18 for Sicily in a heartbeat. Make no mistake that kid can play, even though he throws the odd tanty (which I happen to like as he shows passion for the game). I think he played better last year than this year but he'll be a champion no doubt. WANT!!

 

[viking12]

if we land pick 18, thank you for your service Levi Casboult

 

[Iamcarlton]

Really?? Sold!!

I feel that the value of what we get for Casboult cant be judged until we see what the club does if he does go . If we bring in someone else to replace him then it would have to be a very low pick or DFA for losing Cas to be a win for us ?

 

[HARKER]

Any indication who SOS likes at this stage with our first selection. Would love Rayner personally based on X Factor.

I've wondered what may come about if we attain one of Kelly or Hopper, whilst keeping this years first.
Just speculating and it would have to be close between players available at our pick, but could it be that if we get;

a. Hopper. We have our inside mid and opt for some x-Factor with Rayner.
b. Kelly. We have our inside/outside goal-kicking mid and target someone like Davies-Uniacke.

 

[Iamcarlton]

I'd swap Casboult/Pick 18 for Sicily in a heartbeat. Make no mistake that kid can play, even though he throws the odd tanty (which I happen to like as he shows passion for the game). I think he played better last year than this year but he'll be a champion no doubt. WANT!!

Yes i like him too was a little perplexed on the reaction of many when it was first raised on here about Sicily . Has now proven he can play at both ends he's young and improving and if we are interested maybe the little leg up we gave Hawthorn to obtain Omeara comes into play .

 

[Soapy V]

I'd swap Casboult/Pick 18 for Sicily in a heartbeat. Make no mistake that kid can play, even though he throws the odd tanty (which I happen to like as he shows passion for the game). I think he played better last year than this year but he'll be a champion no doubt. WANT!!

Seems to be a bit like Jones in that he has turned his game around as a defender. In that case is he what we need?

 

[Old navy]

Talk on SEN, Cas could be receiving a 600k offer from the tigers and due to the Whitfield penalties that could get us pick 18, which technically is a first rounder.
If GWS want two 1st rounders for Jelly, the dream scenario would be get the crows to find a better 1st rounder for Gibbs, say pick 8-12 then give GWS that pick and pick 18, which would allow us to keep our pick 1 or 2 this year and get Josh Kelly.
Would basically be Gibbs and Cas for Jelly.

 

[Azul]

I'd swap Casboult/Pick 18 for Sicily in a heartbeat. Make no mistake that kid can play, even though he throws the odd tanty (which I happen to like as he shows passion for the game). I think he played better last year than this year but he'll be a champion no doubt. WANT!!

Maybe with a later pick but I'm not keen on pick 18, for a soon to be 23yo flanker.

We desperately need impact players at centre bounces and stoppages. If not a contested hulk like Cripps then lightning quick players who will zoom away with the ball with the wind at their back.

 

[BlueTongue]

Yes i like him too was a little perplexed on the reaction of many when it was first raised on here about Sicily . Has now proven he can play at both ends he's young and improving and if we are interested maybe the little leg up we gave Hawthorn to obtain Omeara comes into play .

That is EXACTLY what I thought when the rumours of Sicily to Carlton started circulating.
SOS might be a 'top bloke' but I dare suspect there may have been some last second Gent's agreement made with the Omeara deal. Considering the hardball SOS is playing with Gibbs, I doubt very much his rescue of the Omeara/Hawthorn trade was generosity...

 

[Blue__Balls]

Talk on SEN, Cas could be receiving a 600k offer from the tigers and due to the Whitfield penalties that could get us pick 18, which technically is a first rounder.
If GWS want two 1st rounders for Jelly, the dream scenario would be get the crows to find a better 1st rounder for Gibbs, say pick 8-12 then give GWS that pick and pick 18, which would allow us to keep our pick 1 or 2 this year and get Josh Kelly.
Would basically be Gibbs and Cas for Jelly.

GWS won't say "we want two first rounders" and then meekly accept 12 + 18.

Pick 2 will be the starting point. They'll want 18 as well, will probably offer some junk picks or players to sweeten the deal, but we'll hold firm on Pick 2 only, with maybe a swap of late picks (which would be a face-saving for GWS only as they probably won't need the extra picks/points anyway).

If we get 18 for Casboult, I'd be pushing 2 + 18 for Kelly and Hopper. Then take whatever we get for Gibbs to the draft, or trade it for Whitfield/Sicily and whatever else we can get.

Casboult compo - Pick 18.
Gibbs traded for Pick 10.

Picks 2 + 18 for Kelly + Hopper.

Pick 10 for Whitfield.
OR Pick 10 + 2018 Second for Sicily + 2018 First.
OR Pick 10 to the draft.

 

[Iamcarlton]

That is EXACTLY what I thought when the rumours of Sicily to Carlton started circulating.
SOS might be a 'top bloke' but I dare suspect there may have been some last second Gent's agreement made with the Omeara deal. Considering the hardball SOS is playing with Gibbs, I doubt very much his rescue of the Omeara/Hawthorn trade was generosity...

Yep you dont do those sorts of things at the deadline of trade period without a little kickback somewhere along the line . For sure it got us some young talent in Williamson etc . But without our help Hawthorn dont have Omeara . May not be Sicily but one could certainly think SOS is up to something there i agree .

 

[Sector 7G]

Paddy Dow is another inside-leaning midfielder. Has a good turn of pace and always looks to drive the ball forward. Rides contact really well which releases opponents into space when he gives off. Left-field comparison here which may divide people, but I see a bit of Steele Sidebottom in him (a player who I think is hugely underrated).

If Dow has a good turn of pacy he isn't anything like Sidebottom who is as one paced as they come.

 

[therubbernub]

GWS won't say "we want two first rounders" and then meekly accept 12 + 18.

Pick 2 will be the starting point. They'll want 18 as well, will probably offer some junk picks or players to sweeten the deal, but we'll hold firm on Pick 2 only, with maybe a swap of late picks (which would be a face-saving for GWS only as they probably won't need the extra picks/points anyway).

If we get 18 for Casboult, I'd be pushing 2 + 18 for Kelly and Hopper. Then take whatever we get for Gibbs to the draft, or trade it for Whitfield/Sicily and whatever else we can get.

Casboult compo - Pick 18.
Gibbs traded for Pick 10.

Picks 2 + 18 for Kelly + Hopper.

Pick 10 for Whitfield.
OR Pick 10 + 2018 Second for Sicily + 2018 First.
OR Pick 10 to the draft.

SoS wont give out our pick 1or 2 and then give GWS a second pick IMO. Its 1/2 on its own or its 2 later first round picks.

 

[Benaly28]

Any indication who SOS likes at this stage with our first selection. Would love Rayner personally based on X Factor.

Have heard Rayner is the one they want.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Yep you dont do those sorts of things at the deadline of trade period without a little kickback somewhere along the line . For sure it got us some young talent in Williamson etc . But without our help Hawthorn dont have Omeara . May not be Sicily but one could certainly think SOS is up to something there i agree .

Where's the onus on Hawthorn to actually follow up though? Not like SOS can complain to the AFL if Hawthorn renege on some shady, behind closed doors promise.

The only thing he could do would be to refuse to deal with them at some point. Best case scenario we'd be saying no to a deal we don't like anyway, worst case is we're cutting off our nose just to spite them if we knock back a deal that we actually like.

If SOS wanted more from Hawthorn, he'd have been better off getting payment up front.

 

[therubbernub]

Yep you dont do those sorts of things at the deadline of trade period without a little kickback somewhere along the line . For sure it got us some young talent in Williamson etc . But without our help Hawthorn dont have Omeara . May not be Sicily but one could certainly think SOS is up to something there i agree .

if there was a deal, then the fact that willow ended up as a good pickup, is irrelevant. Whatever arrangement they came to cant be rewritten in hindsight- not if the hawks want to deal with SOS again

 

[Blue__Balls]

SoS wont give out our pick 1or 2 and then give GWS a second pick IMO. Its 1/2 on its own or its 2 later first round picks.

That's what I said, isn't it?

Pick 2 and some junk pick swaps for Kelly.
Or Picks 2 + 18 for Kelly and Hopper.

 

[Benaly28]

Yes i like him too was a little perplexed on the reaction of many when it was first raised on here about Sicily . Has now proven he can play at both ends he's young and improving and if we are interested maybe the little leg up we gave Hawthorn to obtain Omeara comes into play .

Where would you play him,forward or back?