List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion

[SaintsofSteel]

Of course we’d offer the most money to the least important position.

I dont believe Melbourne supporters think that when Gawn is dominating everything and opposition teams try to play around him.

 

[Southeastsainter]

Don’t need a ruckman on 1.7 million a year or whatever is reported. We need a gun midfielder, throw the cash at LDU / Callaghan/ Brayshaw.

We will get a free agent eventually, just hopefully it’s a good one!

 

[hayes]

I dont believe Melbourne supporters think that when Gawn is dominating everything and opposition teams try to play around him.

What about every other premiership team? Was Nankervis dominating everything around him? Stanley? Whoever was in the ruck at the time for Hawthorn? I don’t think Darcy Fort caused too many headaches last year either.

It’s probably not true but either way it’s not a position you should invest heavily in.

 

[Jack Stevens]

St Kilda and making and opposition club pay overs to re-sign a ruckman; name a more iconic duo

 

[SaintsofSteel]

What about every other premiership team? Was Nankervis dominating everything around him? Stanley? Whoever was in the ruck at the time for Hawthorn? I don’t think Darcy Fort caused too many headaches last year either.

It’s probably not true but either way it’s not a position you should invest heavily in.

1.7m is a lot for a ruckman, but a dominant ruckman is as important as any position. I do agree that I would much rather spend that cash on an A grade midfielder, but lets remember its a February media beat up story and we get mentioned every time a free agent is up for contract.

It's obvious we have struggled to attract elite free agents at every opportunity, we obviously dont have the huge supporter bases, 3rd party sponsors or geographical benefits of other clubs. If no other free agent (midfielder) was willing to come to the Saints I would be more than happy to spend some extra $$$ on TDK.

But chasing a midfielder like LDU, Brayshaw or Callaghan makes a lot more sense.

 

[gringo2011]

Coops needs to play as a starting forward every game this year.

We need to score

And Coops is a natural forward. Let's stop f*cking around with his development. Back him in as an important part of our forward structure.

I'm guessing we play a forward line of King, Owens, Butler, Snags, Henry/Hill/Hall and one of Hammer or Sharman.


Cordy or Hammer can cover Dougal's role but then Battle needs cover from McLennan, Wood, Sharman, Ari or one of those types.

 

[gringo2011]

1.7m is a lot for a ruckman, but a dominant ruckman is as important as any position. I do agree that I would much rather spend that cash on an A grade midfielder, but lets remember its a February media beat up story and we get mentioned every time a free agent is up for contract.

It's obvious we have struggled to attract elite free agents at every opportunity, we obviously dont have the huge supporter bases, 3rd party sponsors or geographical benefits of other clubs. If no other free agent (midfielder) was willing to come to the Saints I would be more than happy to spend some extra $$$ on TDK.

But chasing a midfielder like LDU, Brayshaw or Callaghan makes a lot more sense.

I think he's getting big money because he's a genuine ruck forward. Not sure he'll be a dominant Gawn type in the actual ruck duel.

We have a lot of mids in development and if Phillipou and Garcia are tracking well by the end of the year that might beliers of a need. Also have potential to move guys like Nas and Wilson on ball longer term. Travaglia and Hastie types drop in across HB.

 

[austinnn]

St Kilda and making and opposition club pay overs to re-sign a ruckman; name a more iconic duo

Good point. If we've done anything we'll recently, it's this strategy of bidding high for oppo players and forcing their clubs to stretch the salary cap. Not quite as cool as taking the player, but I'd call it the soft win of a win-win option.

If we ever do get a player then so much the better, but it doesn't cost us anything besides Gubby's salary and blowing up multiple salary caps in the AFL could be an advantage to us down the track.

TDK isn't who I would choose to put all that money into but he does play ruck and key back, two positions we need a convincing answer for and he is gettable (out of contract at a club with teetering salary cap).

My worry is our salary cap is probably starting to look a little proppy itself. King is on loads, we'll surely have to surrender loads to keep NWM, if LDU and TDK come, will there be anything left for anyone else? A bit of an exaggeration but we don't want to be in a situation where we were at the end of the last Lyon era, paying the top 10 shedloads and the rest of the squad peanuts, do we? Maybe Lyon does, maybe he thinks that's how it's done: I'm open to being convinced if it gets results, and you can argue that it very nearly did.

 

[Sully111]

I'm guessing we play a forward line of King, Owens, Butler, Snags, Henry/Hill/Hall and one of Hammer or Sharman.


Cordy or Hammer can cover Dougal's role but then Battle needs cover from McLennan, Wood, Sharman, Ari or one of those types.

Sharman, King and Higgins should be locks in the forward line imo.

I have Sharman ahead of Owens and Butler in order of importance, as far as scoring potential goes.

 

[SG34]

Sharman, King and Higgins should be locks in the forward line imo.

I have Sharman ahead of Owens and Butler in order of importance.

Speaking of Owens, could Mitchito do the Battle role?

1) Strong
2) Good reach and hands
3) good wrestler
4) decent kick

Fair dinkum, unless we wanna put absolute green horns straight into the fire, we are looking at both Sharman AND Caminiti down back, for Battle and Howard respectively. And then Cordy as a decoy forward with King.

And if King doesn't fire as a forward this season, and I mean fire on all cylinders from game one, ..guess who might be asked to go back there after the bye?

 

[Sully111]

Speaking of Owens, could Mitchito do the Battle role?

1) Strong
2) Good reach and hands
3) good wrestler
4) decent kick

Fair dinkum, unless we wanna put absolute green horns straight into the fire, we are looking at both Sharman AND Caminiti down back, for Battle and Howard respectively. And then Cordy as a decoy forward with King.

And if King doesn't fire as a forward this season, and I mean fire on all cylinders from game one, ..guess who might be asked to go back there after the bye?

No to Owens.

King is no chance.

 

[THE_GUN]

Two things can be guaranteed when a report like this happens in February.
1 - the amount of money is being grossly exaggerated for clicks
2 - the trade/deal is never happening which is why it's being 'reported' when nothing else is going on

This has been in the works for a while and the money is very very high
alot of work has been done on this

 

[THE_GUN]

Good point. If we've done anything we'll recently, it's this strategy of bidding high for oppo players and forcing their clubs to stretch the salary cap. Not quite as cool as taking the player, but I'd call it the soft win of a win-win option.

If we ever do get a player then so much the better, but it doesn't cost us anything besides Gubby's salary and blowing up multiple salary caps in the AFL could be an advantage to us down the track.

TDK isn't who I would choose to put all that money into but he does play ruck and key back, two positions we need a convincing

TDL plays Ruck / Fwd
cant say i have ever seen him play key back , Thats his brother Sam

 

[mad-saint-guy]

I don't mind us spending big on a gun FA but I don't think TDK is worth that contract. Especially not when we already have Marshall and two young rucks developing plus Keeler as a fwd/ruck. TDK is not much of a forward and doesn't win a whole lot of hitouts. The big money needs to be thrown at a game changing mid

 

[Sarcoidevo]

Eye on the ball here ..... TDK will be FA and will cost us nothing but cap space

There is LDU who is also FA but North are going to offer him a bomb as well .... Brayshaw is FA too but word is he is wants to stay at Freo given they just bolstered their list with some decent additions and should be Finals bound

As for other prized mids coming out of contract like Callaghan ... well he isn't a FA so will cost draft capital ..... which we don't really have .... as well as cap space

Think some should go back and watch TDK's back half of last season ..... he was dynamic

His center square work is top notch as well .... like having an extra midfielder .... very mobile

And as a tall ..... there could still be improvement to come

 

[Sarcoidevo]

Finn Callaghan would be great but it will cost us at least 2 first rounders

 

[MordySaint]

Eye on the ball here ..... TDK will be FA and will cost us nothing but cap space

There is LDU who is also FA but North are going to offer him a bomb as well .... Brayshaw is FA too but word is he is wants to stay at Freo given they just bolstered their list with some decent additions and should be Finals bound

As for other prized mids coming out of contract like Callaghan ... well he isn't a FA so will cost draft capital ..... which we don't really have .... as well as cap space

Think some should go back and watch TDK's back half of last season ..... he was dynamic

His center square work is top notch as well .... like having an extra midfielder .... very mobile

And as a tall ..... there could still be improvement to come

Imagine having him and Marshall roaming around the ground together. it would change the whole team dynamic and thats the sort of thing we need to do.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

1.7m is a lot for a ruckman, but a dominant ruckman is as important as any position. I do agree that I would much rather spend that cash on an A grade midfielder, but lets remember its a February media beat up story and we get mentioned every time a free agent is up for contract.

It's obvious we have struggled to attract elite free agents at every opportunity, we obviously dont have the huge supporter bases, 3rd party sponsors or geographical benefits of other clubs. If no other free agent (midfielder) was willing to come to the Saints I would be more than happy to spend some extra $$$ on TDK.

But chasing a midfielder like LDU, Brayshaw or Callaghan makes a lot more sense.

or Rowell

 

[True Believer]

1.7m is a lot for a ruckman, but a dominant ruckman is as important as any position. I do agree that I would much rather spend that cash on an A grade midfielder, but lets remember its a February media beat up story and we get mentioned every time a free agent is up for contract.

It's obvious we have struggled to attract elite free agents at every opportunity, we obviously dont have the huge supporter bases, 3rd party sponsors or geographical benefits of other clubs. If no other free agent (midfielder) was willing to come to the Saints I would be more than happy to spend some extra $$$ on TDK.

But chasing a midfielder like LDU, Brayshaw or Callaghan makes a lot more sense.

There's a lot I agree with here. I think the number is potentially just media speculation, and a genuine grandfather offer to a player will have been well thought out, with structure to align with cap increases and major payout years, escalations and retirement years for the rest of our list.

The big thing I am thinking of in all this is game plan - does that elite inside/outside mid (Harley Reid type) become less relevant when we are looking to have this all consuming running game, coupled with player versatility? Are we looking to have a TDK, paired with Marshall and ultimately with Keeler, who can swap between ruck and 2nd Key forward, feeding a fleet of runners, who basically run the opposition off their fleet over the course of a game, to the point that any inside stoppage dominance becomes irrelevant?

To me it smacks of "we've tried repeatedly and can't get a Bont, Oliver, Petracca, Reid type via trade or free agency, so let's build a better team, that plays in a style that largely negates the influence of those "hero" type mids"........

 

[Diehard Saint]

There's a lot I agree with here. I think the number is potentially just media speculation, and a genuine grandfather offer to a player will have been well thought out, with structure to align with cap increases and major payout years, escalations and retirement years for the rest of our list.

The big thing I am thinking of in all this is game plan - does that elite inside/outside mid (Harley Reid type) become less relevant when we are looking to have this all consuming running game, coupled with player versatility? Are we looking to have a TDK, paired with Marshall and ultimately with Keeler, who can swap between ruck and 2nd Key forward, feeding a fleet of runners, who basically run the opposition off their fleet over the course of a game, to the point that any inside stoppage dominance becomes irrelevant?

To me it smacks of "we've tried repeatedly and can't get a Bont, Oliver, Petracca, Reid type via trade or free agency, so let's build a better team, that plays in a style that largely negates the influence of those "hero" type mids"........

Grandfather?
How old is the guy anyway?

Now godfather, that's another thing entirely

 

[gringo2011]

Eye on the ball here ..... TDK will be FA and will cost us nothing but cap space

There is LDU who is also FA but North are going to offer him a bomb as well .... Brayshaw is FA too but word is he is wants to stay at Freo given they just bolstered their list with some decent additions and should be Finals bound

As for other prized mids coming out of contract like Callaghan ... well he isn't a FA so will cost draft capital ..... which we don't really have .... as well as cap space

Think some should go back and watch TDK's back half of last season ..... he was dynamic

His center square work is top notch as well .... like having an extra midfielder .... very mobile

And as a tall ..... there could still be improvement to come

Yep, North can probably blow us out of the water on contract terms. Carlton are going to be spread thin and have zero chance of matching.

TDK could be one of those additions that end up the most dominant player in the comp types....or another of our best paid GOP in the league types.

 

[gringo2011]

or Rowell

I would prefer Anderson. The talk was that they drafted them together to keep them both there. If Rowell walks then Anderson might be gettable. His old man should be working on him.

 

[BrutThough]

I would prefer Anderson. The talk was that they drafted them together to keep them both there. If Rowell walks then Anderson might be gettable. His old man should be working on him.

Same. Anderson has more stings to his bow and a more balanced player.
Although, doesnt seem he is as interested in leaving as Rowell.

 

[SaintsofSteel]

Same. Anderson has more stings to his bow and a more balanced player.
Although, doesnt seem he is as interested in leaving as Rowell.

Anderson would be the perfect fit for us, he is a much more rounded player than Rowell. Unfortunately with Hardwick now up there they will be unlikely to let too much talent leave. They do have some brilliant young midfielders on the list and coming through the academy though!

 

[saintbill]

I thought the offer to De Koning was b/s until this morning. A mate who is very close to it, has told me categorically it is 100% real and those numbers are about right. I trust him.

That's insanely dumb, even for us. Makes me think NAS is out the door.