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I sense a hate there for Rance, from you, or at least sour taste, the feeling is not mutual from me towards Rance
Player Watch #40: Callum Coleman-Jones
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I sense a hate there for Rance, from you, or at least sour taste, the feeling is not mutual from me towards Rance
Man I love the Rance...
But that is also one interesting take on Rance's 'carve-up'...
re-watch the game. Its on pirates bay. He lost out to Mason Cox, 100%. s**t happens in footy, i remember Jordan getting his arse handed to him by Derek Smith, even the all time greats have those game. But it happened & it was Alex's last full game he ever played for Richmond. The crazy thing was it happened in such an important match, thats the part which is rare.
Rance went onto him in the 2nd quarter. Astbury started on him. Cox literally carved all 3 of the backmen up - Astbury, Rance, Grimes. They all had a go and failed.
Highlight video of Cox game below, Rance & Astbury couldn't get close to him. Astbury went into the game with a bad virus and the club probably made the wrong call playing him based on the performance.
grab your spew bags fella's - your gonna se Rance in a Bombers guernsey
www.afl.com.au
VFL TEAMS: Superstar to make shock VFL appearance
Richmond premiership player Alex Rance will line up for an old rival this week
www.afl.com.au
grab your spew bags fella's - your gonna se Rance in a Bombers guernsey
VFL TEAMS: Superstar to make shock VFL appearance
Richmond premiership player Alex Rance will line up for an old rival this week
Sorry have NFI how i posted this in the wrong thread. Sorry people
Hmm Chol is neither a front line ruckman or front line key forward. When hes played as a key forward and had strong match ups hes has been killed and the same goes for when he is rucking.
CC-J has not shown a lot as a ruckman mainly because he has not been played there much even in the magoos. So for me the question is will he become a top line key forward and i have my doubts . The one thing that may save him as a key fwd is his hands, he is a very strong mark. Personally i see a bit of Sam Jacobs about him and if persevered with in the ruck could become a very good ruckman. I also think theres plenty of room for improvement with him especially with size and core strength a bit of work on his agility and pace would also see improvement.
The both of them seem to be okay at both roles atm ruck and fwd but dominant at neither. Chol plays the ruck role better which aint saying much and CC-J'S hands see him as a bigger danger up fwd.
If Nankervis goes down mate Soldo when fit will take over and likely dominate most ruck contests.
We have those four and we have two other genuine ruckmen in Colina a whopping 213cm who is very much a project player in the mould of Soldo. Samson Ryan is a 206cm skinny 20yo who shows heaps of promise. Both will take a bit of time Ryans hands look great already.
Finally there is no way we can play all four of Soldo Nankervis Chol and CC-J. Two will miss out nearly every week hence we have a situation of Chol and CC-J BEING SPOKEN ABOUT AS TRADES. We certainly cannot justify keeping what is primarily six ruckmen on the list as it robs us for numbers in other areas.
Im happy to lose one of Chol or CC-J and with whatever we get for them lump it up with whats needed to get a High quality GENUINE KPF in the draft or in a trade.
It is paramount we target a quality key forward with Lynch approaching 30 and JR turning 33 soon.
Take them both off the list and ask yourself where is the genuine high quality kpf coming thru and please dont say Chol or CC-J.
Disappointment is the word. I was incredibly disappointed at this decision to walk out on us & thought his timing was incrediblty selfish. I've covered it at length so no shortage of post out there where i explain why
I can forgive and forget very very easily, but if he ends up at Essendon, Geelong etc - then no ******* way. I was literally the only person here a week ago making post saying the club should 100% be in his ear about coming back & how we need him back to complete this story - I want to see JR*, Cotch & Rance again for one more season.
I would take a flag next year with those 3 boys re-united over us winning a 3-peat this year. To me, that would bookmark our dynasty way more than "3 in a row". The thing that made this era so memorable was the players we succeeded with. I totally bought into them, their ethos, their culture - everything they represented. For him to go to Essendon makes me feel pretty much duped tbh. I mean seriously, if bojangles turned around tomorrow and said he has decided to barrack for Essendon - are we all going to wish him well??? * no! Why would we then do that with a guy who was meant to be the spiritual leader of our club & its impressive brotherly culture??
Players will always come and go - but it always comes down to "how" you handle coming and going. When Butler, Markov, Brandon Ellis, Townsend, Lloyd, Lids left - it insulted no one. We got it. More money, more security, more opportunity - we all wish them well and continue to wish them well.
But Jack Higgins or lets say Brad Ottens? Neither of those 2 fella's got the same goodwill back. There is reasons why. The way i look at it, Rances departure and deflection would be just as bad, i really can't see how it wouldn't be. Its not that dis-similar to Mal Michaels departure from Brisbane & he is completely forgotten off everyones list of key members of the Lions dynasty now. You think of the Great Lions team, you think of Voss, Black, Power, Lynch - Malk Michael was a massive part of that success. FB, AA - the works. His 2 extra years at Essendon cost him his legacy @ Brisbane essentially - he is pretty much a forgotten bloke. Hell even Akka has more love from the Lions faithful because he was essentially sacked from them for his behaviour - but they all knew who Akka was, he never pretended not to be the vagrant that eventually cost him his trust at the Lions - Akka is still well loved by the Lions faithful and thought of very fondly.
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_RT_
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So we've got a kid who has shown that he can play at the level, but for a late first round pick you'd trade him out after putting 5 years of development into him so we can start again with a younger kid, because there is no assurance that CCJ will make it and no guarantee that he won't go off the rails.
Can I ask, what assurance do you have that the younger kid will make it and won't go off the rails?
Showed more Cleve-age?
None, but I wouldn't use that first round pick for another tall forward. I would choose a midfielder instead. For mine, I feel we need to shore up our midfield with our current top line midfielders struggling to get on the park or close to retirement.
CJ doesn't strike me as anywhere near the ability as Jack and Lynch. If we can keep him, without a guarantee of AFL game time over the next couple of years, I'd love to have him for depth but if it means an early retirement for Jack or having to change our game style to squeeze three tall forwards in, I'd take a high offer for him.
I understand that your trying to ensure that we have someone to take Jack's place in the future but is that worth sacrificing the present? For me the decision really depends on him and whether he is patient or desperate for game time.
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I don’t think he has the lateral movement to make it as a gun. In my opinion he might be a solid target as his contested marking is great but seems a bit lumbering. If we can get a top 25 pick then I’d take it.
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So you're trading out a KPF/ruck and replacing them with a midfielder but you're still wanting to groom a younger KPF for the future, so when are you picking up one of them given you've said you're not using the first round pick we'd get for CCJ?
Its a bummer putting years into the development of any player. Chol is improving a bit this year and is becoming a passable back up player. I feel that we will lose one of Chol or CJ. So, new young KPPs we draft will have time to develop in the VFL. COVID is really stuffing football up. CJ and Miller can't get on the park.
We could do with a KPD too. I keep suggesting CJ to stay, and try out as a KPD. Post Astbury 2023 because he became redundant as a KPF the day Lynch walked in.
Our picks might be best available mid or KPP, depending on CJ/Chol's decisions on their future.
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CCJ looks to me to be too big at the moment. I remember a few years ago when Jack was told to put on weight to play that bullocking full forward role but he lost all his mobility. CCJ seems to be the same.
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Anyone who wants chol over ccj has their head up their ass. Chols an absolute down hill skier, soft as butter will never make it at afl level.
easy to say when CCJ is not even playing & the entire team is playing like they have PTSD.
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Ive never seen chol play well in a game where we got smacked, no tank at 24 plays like 55% game time.
Lazy footballer.
I’m not a fan of the Chol and CCJ comparison. I understand they’re both ruck/forwards but I think they’re completely different styled players.
For example, I personally believe CCJ is much more of a Tom Lynch than he is Toby Nankervis. I think CCJ is a genuine KPF who can pinch hit in the ruck when required. I understand there’s no requirement for another tall forward when we have both Lynch and Riewoldt but we may not have Riewoldt for much longer and without another young forward developing we just cannot afford to lose him.
Whereas Chol isn’t a number one ruck but he’s also not a KPF forward, he’s best suited when rotating between the two.
For example, I personally believe CCJ is much more of a Tom Lynch than he is Toby Nankervis. I think CCJ is a genuine KPF who can pinch hit in the ruck when required. I understand there’s no requirement for another tall forward when we have both Lynch and Riewoldt but we may not have Riewoldt for much longer and without another young forward developing we just cannot afford to lose him.
Whereas Chol isn’t a number one ruck but he’s also not a KPF forward, he’s best suited when rotating between the two.
Look at the size of Lynch, CCJ is nowhere near that size, and nowhere near as mobile either. Good hands but he needs to keep his size and work on his running or he will be a stay at home 200cm full forward. Not many of them have ever made it. Injuries and suspension have curtailed him this year, but he really needs to get proper AFL key forward fit and mobile, as Chol's spot is there for the taking.
Tiger_Of_Old
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Wouldn't say Lynch is the most nimble of any KPF's in the comp.
Infact i think CJ is better below his knees than Lynch but that may have to do with age & Injury.
The question is who do we trust more once Jack retires.
Chol or CJ?
Lynch is not so much nimble, although he has a reasonable side step, but when he plays his best footy he is leading up the ground. Still dangerous up forward if the ball is coming in well, which isn't often...
CCJ has to increase his flexibility as a forward. Not seen a lot to show me he is much chop off the ground, but neither did Stewie Loewe. But stay at home full forwards unless they are very quick and agile like the King boys struggle. Lynch when he hasn't moved around hasn't been much chop this season, and Lynch would probably be the best 200cm forward of the last decade.
We have nobody other than Balta who can take Jack's place, a mobile forward. Chol is so hot and cold. So if CCJ wants to play, he needs to add more stings to his bow.
Neither imo Chol really needs to be traded out while he has some sort of percieved value.Imo we desperately need to find a quality genuine forward who is agile quick and has good hands JR is not going to be there forever in fact my money is on next year being his last.
Have said this a bit but one more time won't hurt. CC-J to me looks like a ruckman first and foremost who can play a second fiddle role up fwd. This is how we should be developing him.I reckon we have gone the other way around.
The question people avoid is who out of Nankervis and Soldo should we keep. Ithink it is a relevant question.Soldo while no Nankervis in a lot of areas is our best actual ruckman at the ruck contest. If CC-J was to take the next step then he should get picked as the second ruck/fwd.It leaves one of those two vulnerable imo as ideally we could only play one as neither really look as good as CC-J as a fwd.
I say this from the point of Nankervis being one of my favorite tiger players but im asking what would be the best set up for us. Id like to go with something like this
FF: QUALITY SML - Lynch - Ruck/fwd or agile Third tall type.
HF: Quality goal kicking Med - Genuine KPF - Rotating goal kicking mids like Bolton.
It only leaves space for one front line ruckman in the 22.
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Without throwing the baby out with the bath water unless you want to trade in a key CHF
FF: Bolton/mid - Lynch - Riewoldt
HF: Lambert - Balta - Ralphmith/Cumberland
Possible Rioli Jnr as a forward pocket.
I think Jack will go around again and if he is not the key forward and more a third tall I think he could still be better than most third talls.
It is hard to see where Chol and CCJ fit in if Jack is playing. I like you see CCJ as a ruck and a potentially good one but he needs to do a
fair bit of VFL footy as no.1 ruck before that is likely to happen. Will he stay around knowing that might be the case.
I actually like that but it still leaves the problem of JR's career coming to an end and no games for CC-J. Arent they in the process of signing JR for next year?
It is also not ideal that Lynch is also 30 next year we really should have been developing a couple of GENUINE key fwds for the last three or four seasons.
Ihave to reiterate i don't consider Chol in particular a key fwd and im really concerned CC-J is a for want of a better word a bitsa. Abit of ruck man a bit of fwd but not top end at either.I think his best chance is as a Ruckman.
It also leaves the backline bereft of any player of decent size and quality if Astbury retires. Taking Balta out of the backline really is robbing Peter to pay Paul.
What it does show is just how bereft we are for key defenders and key forwards actually coming thru or at varying stages of development and just how much work will be required when the retirements do happen.
As it stands and regardless of where we play Balta moving fwd we really need a quality KPD and its ditto for a KPF. Thats not to mention other obvious holes in the list.
