Past 40. Michael Gibbons

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Why compare Gibbo to any other underperforming Carlton mid and then say he was unlucky - I don't get the logic.

The whole point of list management is to constantly improve the list - which means at any point in time some players are going to get traded ( if they are lucky) or get cut if there is no other interest.

If Gibbo had any AFL 'currency' the Club would have got a trade for him - like they did with SPS - they didn't/couldn't so bye bye Gibbo. No point keeping players that can be improved upon on the list - none.

Fair enough to argue this bloek shoulda coulda been cut before the other bloke...I get the 'favourites' thing -and I also get the fact that some might argue Teague robbed spme players of development in order to play hsi favourites too...

against which - you have to say if players are talented enough - they but through coach bias- eg Stocker did - watch hsoi highlights someone posted on some thread - kid is a fair dinkum footballer - with brain even and skill and hardness - so pleased for him and us.

I dont put any of Cottrell/Fisher/Dow/Williamson/Parks and maybe Stterfield too - in the "need to have on the list because they are special" category - bog ordinary footballers tbh - Gibbo was a ball hog anyway who managed to burn team mates pretty much every time he had ball in hand - wont be misssed from my starting 22 - all the best to him.

Setterfield- sleepy hollow time folks
Fisher - circle runner one foot kick predictable in forward fifty - developed into a nice non tackler crap podcaster too
SPS - stopped playing for Carlton early this year
Dow - lacks footy brain and jogs - a young Murphy without the brain or kicking skill or running speed or finishing ability or kick - remidnds me of an old Murphy
Cottrell - VFL battler type on a good day
Parks - too short for KPP
Williamson - needs to learn his left side run and bias is predictable so stop with the I can split the pack and run 50 meters and score dreams
Newnes - reminds - probably the pick of teh bunch and still nothing to get inspirted about - will always remeber hsi kick to win after the siren though
Marchbank - gunna be a superstar one day Mk1
Cuningham - gunna be a superstar one day Mk11

Truth is Gibbo isnt a lot worse or better than any of the above based on what he displayed on field - so what?

A bunch of these blokes have a year to show something - that is where their careers are at after 4-5 years in Carlton's 'system'.

I like all of them whilst they are wearing the navy blue colours and wish them well - all of them - but lets not kid ourselves about their AFL 'credentials'.

New coach - new start for all that remain - good luck fellas.
 
The Smoking Gun said:
What...........and Fisher and Cunners do??? Do LOB or Newnes??? What about Setterfield, Carroll, Dow, Kennedy, Williams, Martin, Stocker, etc??? Do they stack up against Oliver, Petracca, Viney??? Take your useless flognostications elsewhere.
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Just debate your player with your view and not attack the poster. I feel cunners has speed, poise, balance. A great kick. Has burst. I feel Fish can escape tight corners. I don’t know what Gibbons has as I see him lose the 1 on 1 situations. Does he try hard. Yes.

As for being wrong let’s see where he ends up. Austin weighed up all of his attributes and chose to delist Gibbons ahead of LoB who has done nothing in two years except about 4 sharp kicks in the last game of the season. An attribute.
 
Justnetime said:
Austin weighed up all of his attributes and chose to delist Gibbons ahead of LoB who has done nothing in two years except about 4 sharp kicks in the last game of the season. An attribute
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Personally to date I think Gibbo is a better player, but LOB has a much higher ceiling if he can put it together.

To me (and I am probably using very navy tinted goggles) I think in a side with good structures LOB will excel. We have seem glimpses. Very much a confidence player. He gets a bit of size and 10 consecutive games I can see him slicing teams apart with his PEG - we lack that
 

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Foucault1989 said:
Carlton are obsessed with athletes who have no idea how to play footy. How Cottrell is still on the list for now while Gibbo is delisted is beyond me.

Seems like most disagree but I would not have delisted Gibbons. He is not in my starting 22 bit he certainly provides quality depth. He can geniuenely make an impact in the afl as a crafty forward half role player. He'll never be an A grade gun but he still has a lot to offer.

One more year, base wage, what's there to lose?

Likewise I have him well above Owies.
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I am a fan of Gibbo, but you are selling Owies well short.



A real feisty, hard working and antagonistic livewire, if not pest for opposition players.

He has shown many times last year, especially in that memorable performance against The Peptides that he can have a significant impact at AFL level, even without a massive possession count.

He is a unique beast in that he almost performs more impressively at AFL than VFL level, even though he gets more possies in the ressies

Naive and unrealistic to expect everyone to be A Grade/top tier talent on their list, good clubs always have room players like Owies, their effort and commitment and workrate is stuff coaches love.
 
Elmer_Judd said:
I am a fan of Gibbo, but you are selling Owies well short.



A real feisty, hard working and antagonistic livewire, if not pest for opposition players.

He has shown many times last year, especially in that memorable performance against The Peptides that he can have a significant impact at AFL level, even without a massive possession count.

He is a unique beast in that he almost performs more impressively at AFL than VFL level, even though he gets more possies in the ressies

Naive and unrealistic to expect everyone to be A Grade/top tier talent on their list, good clubs always have room players like Owies, their effort and commitment and workrate is stuff coaches love.
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Thanks for your post Elmer. I rate Gibbons higher than Owies. I think Owies has some great qualities but a) doesn't get much of the ball (average 8 touches a game), b) is essentially an under sized lead up forward and c) doesn't have enough tricks to be a long term sustainable small forward.

Gibbons obviously had a difficult year with injury so I suspect there is some recency bias but before then he played some very good football.

I like Owies as a footballer but I like Gibbons more. It'd be great to have both on our list but alas not possible.

Also, your last comment misrepresents my point. I clearly said Gibbons is not a star but a serviceable depth player who can play a role in the midfield or forward. I don't appreciate being called "Naive and unrealistic " when I didn't suggest that we need a lost full of A graders.

I think Honey and Durdin, both of whom are fast, more agile and have more small forward craft than Owies, will be playing ahead of him. So essentially both are depth players but one is more versatile
 
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Elmer_Judd a video of Gibbons highlights, am I doing this right?

Quick, agile, smart, creative, hard runner, natural footballer. Owies struggles to kick 35 metres. Gibbons a much more well rounded player for depth spot on our list
 
Foucault1989 said:


Elmer_Judd a video of Gibbons highlights, am I doing this right?

Quick, agile, smart, creative, hard runner, natural footballer. Owies struggles to kick 35 metres. Gibbons a much more well rounded player for depth spot on our list
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Not trying to change your opinion at all As I understand each of us has our personal favourites based on what we see.

Just putting this out there for others that haven’t made up their mind. Gibbons and Owies are playing for a small forward role. Not some of other role where Gibbons might beat Owies.

The current year saw a comparison of 13 and 11 games. Both mostly playing the same role. There are a few stats I like for the small forward role. Stats I personally prioritise. Goals. Owies wins. Goal assists or scoring involvements Gibbons wins easily. This leaves them quite close. The disposals count I personally ignore because Gibbons gets a bit more upfield time And it also leads to quite a high turnover rate anyway.

The next important small fwd stat is tackles. Owies doubles Gibbons on this. This is why i personally ‘slightly’ prefer Owies over Gibbons If it was to come to a choice. Owies is listening to the coach more about what he is supposed to be doing (tackling). I think Gibbons really wants that midfield role and looks for it rather than do the exact job of small forward.

IMO it is all slight preferences. I suspect you like the higher possession count over tackles. I would understand that. I think Austin is a preferred role stat man. He recruited Saad for HBF to replace SPS. One of the biggest differential was metres gained, something SPS was terrible at. I think Austin has prioritised defensive tackling for that small forward role.
 
Justnetime said:
Not trying to change your opinion at all As I understand each of us has our personal favourites based on what we see.

Just putting this out there for others that haven’t made up their mind. Gibbons and Owies are playing for a small forward role. Not some of other role where Gibbons might beat Owies.

The current year saw a comparison of 13 and 11 games. Both mostly playing the same role. There are a few stats I like for the small forward role. Stats I personally prioritise. Goals. Owies wins. Goal assists or scoring involvements Gibbons wins easily. This leaves them quite close. The disposals count I personally ignore because Gibbons gets a bit more upfield time And it also leads to quite a high turnover rate anyway.

The next important small fwd stat is tackles. Owies doubles Gibbons on this. This is why i personally ‘slightly’ prefer Owies over Gibbons If it was to come to a choice. Owies is listening to the coach more about what he is supposed to be doing (tackling). I think Gibbons really wants that midfield role and looks for it rather than do the exact job of small forward.

IMO it is all slight preferences. I suspect you like the higher possession count over tackles. I would understand that. I think Austin is a preferred role stat man. He recruited Saad for HBF to replace SPS. One of the biggest differential was metres gained, something SPS was terrible at. I think Austin has prioritised defensive tackling for that small forward role.
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All valid. For me, Gibbons is simply a better footballer. Owies is a trier. Nothing against Owies but if it's down to those two to select from, I choose Gibbons. Can play higher up the ground, can kick crumbing goals, sets others up, creative, fairly skilful. Always really liked him and disappointed to see him delisted.
 
Foucault1989 said:
All valid. For me, Gibbons is simply a better footballer. Owies is a trier. Nothing against Owies but if it's down to those two to select from, I choose Gibbons. Can play higher up the ground, can kick crumbing goals, sets others up, creative, fairly skilful. Always really liked him and disappointed to see him delisted.
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If the contract situation was reversed and assuming both on the main list Owies might have been the one gone. Then we would have some supporters up in arms in reverse because of Owies inside 50 tackling stat.

They are both fringe selections IMO.
 
RE: the Owies/Gibbons discussion, I think Owies will look better with more midfield time. I see him as a stoppage player who can rest forward, rather than as a proper forward. He'll go back to the VFL this year and work on that.

He also takes a spot outside the regular list rules.

Gibbons just couldn't do enough at an elite level to make himself a difficult match-up and what stoppage and midfield time or position he was given, he was incredibly ineffectual. Couldn't make it to enough packs to crumb either, but was effective with the ball in hand up to around 35-40m.

Basically the same stuff we've gone through with Ellard, Graham, etc, with Fisher being the best of that dogpile so far.
 
Jeremias said:
He will?
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I believe so, he was taking some stoppage minutes in the seniors towards the end of the season. He's strong for contested ground ball, tackles hard, has good acceleration, good vision and a good sidestep, but has fairly average top speed.

Reminds me more of Robbie Gray than a genuine forward.
 
Jimmae said:
I believe so, he was taking some stoppage minutes in the seniors towards the end of the season. He's strong for contested ground ball, tackles hard, has good acceleration, good vision and a good sidestep, but has fairly average top speed.

Reminds me more of Robbie Gray than a genuine forward.
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Comparisons with Robbie Gray. Wow
 

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mediumsizered said:
I see Gibbo has signed with Yarrawonga for the next 3 years.

I was surprised when going through the list of the 800+ players who had nominated for the draft that Gibbo wasn't one of them.
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Read that as $800,000 and almost fell off my chair that Yarrawonga are paying Gibbo that much.
 
Sharks On A Plane said:
Easily good enough to be playing at the highest level. Interesting move that he's chosen to put the cue in the rack.
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He'll be a dominant player at the level. Reading between the lines it sounds like footy hadn't been fun for him the past 12 months and he was struggling a bit mentally with what was going on with the team and himself personally within our system.

I'm surprised he didn't get any interest across the board, but his performances at AFL level just didn't warrant jumping onto a list elsewhere. Wont ever know if he had the capability as an AFL midfielder, but looking at his production and gamestyle as a half-forward I doubt he'd have been able to make the move successfully and we need to prioritise the development of other mids in our most. He was always going to be a career C-grader at best.
 
I think AFL level means he can’t play midfield. He can play midfield at any other lower level. Wish him the best in his new club.

Completely the right decision by the club as has no defensive lockdown skills As small forward.
 
He was a bit unlucky. There are definitely worse AFL lister players in 2022.

I’m not upset he’s no longer with us though. He’s someone I look at and say he’s not a difference maker and he probably doesn’t have enough tricks up his sleeve to take the next step as a player.

I’m certainly very comfortable with the decision not to give him another contract given the depth we’ve got in that half forward position.

He’s done now but regardless he deserves a lot of credit for making his way onto a list after so many years.
 
Simpson was let go a year earlier and was a much better player than Gibbo.

Timing of contracts is a thing.

What it comes back to is Austin’s view of Gibbo vs someone like Lob. If anyone is upset here direct it at Austin who basically rated Gibbo as a zero.
 
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