Opinion A different perspective

[jenny61_99]

A few people over the last few months have suggested maybe we are a broken club. And I'm not talking about the current shit fight going on with personnel, rather the mental strength of the players. Now this is something that might be getting overlooked as we quickly try to "fix" that which ails us. It is interesting that two of the four "outsiders" that were brought into review the club are specialists in high performance and sports psychology and that they had apparently already been at the club addressing issues. Someone in the footy department wanted the mental health of our players assessed.

When Walshy was murdered, there were a group of players left absolutely shattered. He was their new coach, they were learning his ways. It appears that they had bonded well with the new coach and taken ownership of his game plan. Certainly new Captain Taylor Walker had. So, in the July, when Walsh was brutally murdered by his son, those players were thrown into a head space no other club has ever had to deal with. Tex rallied the troops and they all vowed and declared they wouldn't give in until they'd "got the job done". Scott Camporeale was caretaker coach for the rest of the year, and the boys seemed buoyed and playing with a purpose. The first chink in their armour was Patrick Dangerfield's decision to return home to Geelong. It seemed a shitty thing to do to the team mates you'd vowed just a few months before to get the job done, especially when it was later revealed that he'd told David Noble that he would be leaving the club at the end of the year BEFORE Walsh was killed. Probably brought about by the fact that Walsh hadn't chosen him as Captain. Even after the tragedy he decided to abandon his team mates in their greatest hour of need.

Enter Pyke. Pyke seemed to bond well with the players... he appeared to be very similar to Walsh in his demeanour and also seemed to embrace the Walsh philosophy that still hovered over the club like an unfinished masterpiece. Over the next two years, Don got the boys to play off in a grand final, after being arguably the best team throughout the season though not without some hiccups along the way and perhaps a tell tale sign that not everything was perfect at the club. The loss of both Mitch McGovern and Charlie Cameron at the end of 2017 sent the club into free fall that sees us where we are today.

But for me I think the core group of players (that were there when Walsh died) never really got over that tragedy. While help may have been offered by the Club... was it the right sort of help? Pyke was certain there were some mental toughness issues among the playing group after the GF loss (hence the introduction of Collective Minds). Obviously that was an absolute disaster and he acknowledged that, while refusing to apologise for trying "something new". I was hoping after the grand final loss, that they could put their debts to Walshy to bed. It was time to let him go and let us move forward now with a new focus and new philosophy. I'm still not sure they've done that.

 

[hugecannon]

I think that the truth is fairly obvious, we have a large group of players who have a huge sense of entitlement, when the results are there all is good, but the moment coaches hold them to account they turn on him.

 

[6BTS]

Dangerfield also admitted on Barrett's podcast that he made his decision to leave the Crows 18 months before he departed.

 

[subaru]

We need Jenny Williams on the payroll

She’s outstanding in sports psychology

That said - the last few months on these boards, some of the completely uninformed commentary has been nothing short of defamatory.

 

[WeeBlake]

Don suggested he thought the players needed to take more responsibility in his press conference.

I think the death of Walsh is given too much weight. He was only there less than a year, and has now been dead a long time. Most people move on in those circumstances. Much more likely the current problems are related to problems since Walsh died.

 

[tiggsy]

They lost Dean Bailey the year before Walsh as well. I also was wondering whether the idea of telling people they were weak and needed to toughen up (which appears to be the message behind the CM debacle) was a total misread of where the players were at. I know a lot of supporters were shattered by the death of Phil Walsh and can only imagine it would have been far worse for the players. They picked themselves up and got to a Grand Final 18 months later, went in favourites and lost. I suspect that that may have been the straw that broke the camels back for some of the playing group.

 

[ams4crows]

I think the rise of social media 2012 till now has not been handled well by any clubs, in particular ours. The media has such a vicious cancel culture, the fact a journalist can tweet literally any thing and within 20 mins the whole world is putting their own two bobs worth in on top of that.... mental health is barely reconised in Australia..... the stigma around it....a whole lot of people think its an excuse people use when things get hard and not a debilitating disease in alot of cases.

So much of this has been aided by this compound effect which starts with social media and involes death, player exodous almost success and ends in utter failure.

It's no secret the the Vics and their media hate us, and they have been laying in the boot time and time again we can only take so much and we've finally reached breaking point, the vics like a bully are loving we a struggling so much and are still continuing to hit us.... no wonder the players are mentally shot.

 

[jackster83]

I think the GF destroyed them more than Walsh's passing, though you could be right in that it was the straw that broke the camel's back. It certainly broke the bond that had been pretty strong throughout the club.

It's obvious that the club has struggled to move on from that day in 2017, whether it be selections, staff appointments, tactics, comments in the media, even drafting and trading (we seem to be looking for players to complement what we've got instead of replacing them). That has seen entitlement and toxicity creep into the club, particularly as things have gone wrong and when we've tried to make a statement (such as dropping Jenkins).

Tex and Pyke standing down (assuming they weren't pushed) is a good start, however others need to go if we're to move forward. We also need a psychologist to be permanently employed by the club.

 

[jenny61_99]

Don suggested he thought the players needed to take more responsibility in his press conference.

I think the death of Walsh is given too much weight. He was only there less than a year, and has now been dead a long time. Most people move on in those circumstances. Much more likely the current problems are related to problems since Walsh died.

And perhaps it’s not given enough weight? And the reason why this went so pear shaped? This was unprecedented, and on the back of the loss of Bails who by all accounts, the players loved too. You forget these guys spend 6 days a week together. Many socialise together too. Some of the lads played golf with Walshy. You’re right, some people get over things pretty quickly, while others take a long, long time. The very nature of the loss of Walsh (as opposed to cancer with Bails) makes this completely different to “normal” circumstances.

And I agree with Don. I think the players DO need to take more responsibility - as well. But I just don’t think we can discount what they’ve been through.

 

[WetCrow1991]

I think people are far more resilient with regards to the deaths of colleagues and bosses than this thread suggests.

 

[1990crow]

I think if we had better people running the club we wouldn’t be looking for any explanations, performance would be better and More players would stay.

 

[arrowman]

I think people are far more resilient with regards to the deaths of colleagues and bosses than this thread suggests.

True enough, although 2017 probably felt to the players that they were about to finish what Walsh had started (and Pyke to his credit had continued), and when it came crashing down the club's / coaches' response was completely off the mark. So no, it wasn't all about a lack of resilience in the face of tragedy, as you say.

 

[Mismatched]

A few people over the last few months have suggested maybe we are a broken club. And I'm not talking about the current s**t fight going on with personnel, rather the mental strength of the players. Now this is something that might be getting overlooked as we quickly try to "fix" that which ails us. It is interesting that two of the four "outsiders" that were brought into review the club are specialists in high performance and sports psychology and that they had apparently already been at the club addressing issues. Someone in the footy department wanted the mental health of our players assessed.

When Walshy was murdered, there were a group of players left absolutely shattered. He was their new coach, they were learning his ways. It appears that they had bonded well with the new coach and taken ownership of his game plan. Certainly new Captain Taylor Walker had. So, in the July, when Walsh was brutally murdered by his son, those players were thrown into a head space no other club has ever had to deal with. Tex rallied the troops and they all vowed and declared they wouldn't give in until they'd "got the job done". Scott Camporeale was caretaker coach for the rest of the year, and the boys seemed buoyed and playing with a purpose. The first chink in their armour was Patrick Dangerfield's decision to return home to Geelong. It seemed a s**tty thing to do to the team mates you'd vowed just a few months before to get the job done, especially when it was later revealed that he'd told David Noble that he would be leaving the club at the end of the year BEFORE Walsh was killed. Probably brought about by the fact that Walsh hadn't chosen him as Captain. Even after the tragedy he decided to abandon his team mates in their greatest hour of need.

Enter Pyke. Pyke seemed to bond well with the players... he appeared to be very similar to Walsh in his demeanour and also seemed to embrace the Walsh philosophy that still hovered over the club like an unfinished masterpiece. Over the next two years, Don got the boys to play off in a grand final, after being arguably the best team throughout the season though not without some hiccups along the way and perhaps a tell tale sign that not everything was perfect at the club. The loss of both Mitch McGovern and Charlie Cameron at the end of 2017 sent the club into free fall that sees us where we are today.

But for me I think the core group of players (that were there when Walsh died) never really got over that tragedy. While help may have been offered by the Club... was it the right sort of help? Pyke was certain there were some mental toughness issues among the playing group after the GF loss (hence the introduction of Collective Minds). Obviously that was an absolute disaster and he acknowledged that, while refusing to apologise for trying "something new". I was hoping after the grand final loss, that they could put their debts to Walshy to bed. It was time to let him go and let us move forward now with a new focus and new philosophy. I'm still not sure they've done that.

I've been suggesting similar for quite some time. There was a lot of emotional energy that went into getting to that Grand Final, including the deaths of both Dean Baily and Phil Walsh. This being not for gone from the Tippett debacle and the controversial sacking of Sanderson. Personally I think this banded the group, especially the older ones, together into this purpose of winning a premiership, it gave them drive, focus and energy to push them on.

I think this likely made the place a rather intense place to be and I suspect a few of the younger, more laid back players struggled a bit. Probably wasn't helped that Pyke was a pretty intense, driven character himself.

I think Danger leaving probably hurt, but getting to the last saturday in september only to fail miserably broke them. Then Lever/Cameron and a few key personnel leave and the media batter us from pillar to post for anything and everything.

Then in our infinite wisdom, Brett Burton, Don Pyke, Mark Ricciuto and co, in conjunction with the not psychologically trained mind training people, decided to take them on the infamous camp and completely obliterate any spirit they had left.

This is a team who's spirit is broken. Its irreparable without significant changes to both on and off-field personnel IMO.

 

[jenny61_99]

I think if we had better people running the club we wouldn’t be looking for any explanations, performance would be better and More players would stay.

This is true in that those people would have ensured the players got the help they needed. I’m sure they tried to help the players but I don’t think they had the knowledge or tools to do it. Not sure that anyone would have to be honest.

 

[King Elvis]

I think people are far more resilient with regards to the deaths of colleagues and bosses than this thread suggests.

I agree.

He was the coach for six months.

People lose fathers, partners, siblings - life goes on.

This constant and intense reference to Walsh is a bit much, in my opinion.

The issue is the GF - the preparation, and the reaction to it; and the fact that nobody involved has actually been held accountable for those disasters.

 

[marvin]

No doubt the loss of Walsh affected the players profoundly. Tex has that iconic photo of him looking at Phil as his twitter profile.

However, less than half the 2019 squad was there at the time. Wayne Milera has known no other AFL coach, for example.

Sadly, tragedies have affected many football clubs over the years, from Peter Crimmins to Matthew Broadbridge, from John McCarthy to Josh Deegan. There comes a point where as much as people's memories remain, the impact of the loss is really not a factor in the performance of those who remember.

 

[Geoffa32]

I have been thinking for a while that the death of Walshy has been discounted a bit in regards.to oir performance.

My thought is that our guys built themselves up so much to win a flag for Walshy. Got within the sight of the summit and failed. Losing a GF can shatter a lot of Footballers. But a lot of our guys had an extra burden. The mental affects of this may be in play now.

I reckon CM tried to fix this somewhat with the Camp. But they were cowboys.

At least.one of the guys doing the review works in this field. So I do wonder if that is something that is being explored.

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[Jack is Back]

At least four players have experienced a death in their immediate family since Walshy’s death. Sauce, Tex, Sloaney and Greenwood. Over the last two years there have been matches when the team completely give up. The second half of the Showdown, the Melbourne match in Alice Springs last year are just two examples. On the other hand we have had some good performances but the overall trend has been down.

The magic glue that bonds premiership teams is missing and the departure of players who have been offered the Big Bucks like Lever, Cameron and McGovern have further weakened the spirit of the group.

It seems like we have lost our desperate drive to win a flag and I think the only way to reverse the trend is for a significant turnover of older players, coaches and other personnel. This year there was is only 21 players left from the Walsh era and this number is likely to be reduced significantly this year (Douglas, Otten, Jacobs, Betts, Greenwood, Keath, CEY, Jenkins, Knight, dare I suggest even McKay).

The fortunate thing is that we have some high quality Kids who are ready to step up and carry little or no baggage.

 

[jenny61_99]

I have been thinking for a while that the death of Walshy has been discounted a bit in regards.to oir performance.

My thought is that our guys built themselves up so much to win a flag for Walshy. Got within the sight of the summit and failed. Losing a GF can shatter a lot of Footballers. But a lot of our guys had an extra burden. The mental affects of this may be in play now.

I reckon CM tried to fix this somewhat with the Camp. But they were cowboys.

At least.one of the guys doing the review works in this field. So I do wonder if that is something that is being explored.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

That was my thought with this sports psych brought in... and the fact that these guys were already in there doing a review before they were added to the external review panel. SOMEONE - who knows who - felt that we needed to address something among the playing group.

 

[Moonwatcher]

I think after the Grand Final the players lost a lot of faith in each other, they knew they were a Dangerfield calibre midfielder short of competing with the likes of Richmond on their home ground.

I suspect that Dangerfield leaving was heavily influenced by the administration mismanaging Tippett leaving so poorly that we lost Tippet and 2 first rounders. He could not continue to tell Mardi that he wanted to have team success with the Crows when the Crows were robbing him of that chance through incompetence.

The CM camp blaming the players when it was the administration's/ coaches' failings together with what I agree is effectively bullying from the media, was the last straw.

 

[Moonwatcher]

Damien Hardwick has spoken about the GF itself as being a marathon, you must focus on each and every step to make it to the finish line. Richmond were preparing for Grand Final success, Adelaide were preparing power stances to win the national anthem.

EDIT: Climbing a mountain.

 

[Dixie Normous]

The culture is broken, not the club. Fix that and we'll be kicking arse again

 

[WeeBlake]

I think after the Grand Final the players lost a lot of faith in each other, they knew they were a Dangerfield calibre midfielder short of competing with the likes of Richmond on their home ground.

I suspect that Dangerfield leaving was heavily influenced by the administration mismanaging Tippett leaving so poorly that we lost Tippet and 2 first rounders. He could not continue to tell Mardi that he wanted to have team success with the Crows when the Crows were robbing him of that chance through incompetence.

The CM camp blaming the players when it was the administration's/ coaches' failings together with what I agree is effectively bullying from the media, was the last straw.

I actually think the last straw was the players realising that things were bad and nothing was ever gonna change

 

[Geoffa32]

That was my thought with this sports psych brought in... and the fact that these guys were already in there doing a review before they were added to the external review panel. SOMEONE - who knows who - felt that we needed to address something among the playing group.

I personally think the external review started when these two guys started work for us. A couple of months ago.



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[tiggsy]

Personally, I think it's hard to say whether players are affected by Phil Walsh's death or not. I'd say everybody would be different. Obviously Matty Jaensch found it too much and left the AFL. I would think that some players would be affected and some not, but I don't think I would want to make a blanket statement to say nobody would be.

I was also wondering about the impact of Leading Teams on all of this as well. I heard Ray McLean on Talking Mike say that they were working with Adelaide. They also seem to focus on a tough love approach to leadership and culture (having watched Ray McLean's interview). I did a quick Google on it and found an article about them working with the club in June this year. I don't know if that's when Leading Teams started working with the club, but it is interesting that that sort of lines up with the team falling off a cliff in terms of performance. Does the team need a more compassionate approach to pulling them together? I don't know, but I thought the timing was interesting.