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A Realist's Perspective

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UpTheMags

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First let's track my own personal expectations back to the end of 2010.

In 2011, of course, I entertained the idea of a dynasty beginning. Unfortunately things unravelled badly at the crux of the season, with injuries, Malthouse's media sook and timing our run too early all playing a part.

In 2012 I still believed we would be right up there. As it so happened, we had about 5 or 6 season-ending injuries and eventually scraped through to a prelim and got thumped.

In 2013 my faith was dwindling but I was still looking to believe we could do it. Once again we had a frustrating number of injuries but for the most part it was our attitude that startled me. There was a real feeling of insolence that had spread into our on-field performance. The mutterings were that it was Buckley, it was the rat-pack, it was injuries, or even maybe it was an illusion and that the Pies were going to flick into their 2010 form at any moment.

For mine it was ANZAC day last year that was my final straw. It was another pathetic performance in which we showed just how much our hunting attitude had been lost. We had nurtured this inexplicable tendency to go missing not unlike Melbourne.

FUNDAMENTALLY, we were a new side, and we all had to come to terms with that in our own time.

So, on ANZAC day 2013 I finally dropped this idea that we could flick a switch and become our 2010 self again and began looking at the list overhaul that Buckley was undertaking. I don't need to explain the changes that we have seen, we all know them well. What I wanted to say after all this is that for the first time since 2010 I came into this season as a blank canvas. I look at a loss to Fremantle as hopefully an anomaly but an all-too-familiar reminder of this lack of effort which I find unwatchable. I look at the win against Sydney and I see a great effort, maybe our execution left a lot to be desired but at least we tried for 3 quarters and even when we weren't really trying we didn't just bend over. I see the loss to Geelong as a HUGE positive. With a backline that has more than half our regular VFL team and a host of our young up-and-comers who I am itching to see develop, there was a lot that could go wrong and a lot that could've lowered our resolve. I see a game plan that that is slowly looking more familiar. I see players like Grundy, Elliott and Marley showing genuine star quality on a regular basis. I see other kids like Fasolo, Seedsman, Frost and Thomas who look like becoming above-average contributors. I see heaps waiting in the wings for an opportunity who could be anything like Kennedy, Scharenberg, Broomhead, Freeman and Adams. What we are all seeing is a mid-tier team which is a complete blank canvas. Unfortunately we will always be living in the shadow of our former selves and our reputation. But so far, with the right attitude, I am thoroughly enjoying what I am seeing in 2014.

Put it this way, at least we aren't losing games with 30 year old ******s like Brock McLean and Andrew Carazzo still getting a game
 
Great post. Nicely done bringing in a bit of a different perspective and objectivity.
I'm in the same boat in that I've let go of expectations built on past seasons. I'm seeing a lot that I like but also equal measures of what I don't. Actually thats bullshit. The negatives far outweighs the positives.
The hunting you mentioned that has disappeared from our game is something I sorely miss. The way we used to run down the opposition like a rabid wolf pack was a really exciting thing to watch and was very effective in the turnovers and pressure it created. I see shadows of it here and there but not enough unfortunately.
I had a point but its gone unfortunately. I'm deflated in general as a supporter. A great game last night, no doubt there was effort there. I can't help but feel we threw the game away though and that if we'd been just 10% better we could have ran over the top of them. I guess that in itself is a huge positive, just need to find that extra 10% now.
 
First let's track my own personal expectations back to the end of 2010.

In 2011, of course, I entertained the idea of a dynasty beginning. Unfortunately things unravelled badly at the crux of the season, with injuries, Malthouse's media sook and timing our run too early all playing a part.

In 2012 I still believed we would be right up there. As it so happened, we had about 5 or 6 season-ending injuries and eventually scraped through to a prelim and got thumped.

In 2013 my faith was dwindling but I was still looking to believe we could do it. Once again we had a frustrating number of injuries but for the most part it was our attitude that startled me. There was a real feeling of insolence that had spread into our on-field performance. The mutterings were that it was Buckley, it was the rat-pack, it was injuries, or even maybe it was an illusion and that the Pies were going to flick into their 2010 form at any moment.

For mine it was ANZAC day last year that was my final straw. It was another pathetic performance in which we showed just how much our hunting attitude had been lost. We had nurtured this inexplicable tendency to go missing not unlike Melbourne.

FUNDAMENTALLY, we were a new side, and we all had to come to terms with that in our own time.

So, on ANZAC day 2013 I finally dropped this idea that we could flick a switch and become our 2010 self again and began looking at the list overhaul that Buckley was undertaking. I don't need to explain the changes that we have seen, we all know them well. What I wanted to say after all this is that for the first time since 2010 I came into this season as a blank canvas. I look at a loss to Fremantle as hopefully an anomaly but an all-too-familiar reminder of this lack of effort which I find unwatchable. I look at the win against Sydney and I see a great effort, maybe our execution left a lot to be desired but at least we tried for 3 quarters and even when we weren't really trying we didn't just bend over. I see the loss to Geelong as a HUGE positive. With a backline that has more than half our regular VFL team and a host of our young up-and-comers who I am itching to see develop, there was a lot that could go wrong and a lot that could've lowered our resolve. I see a game plan that that is slowly looking more familiar. I see players like Grundy, Elliott and Marley showing genuine star quality on a regular basis. I see other kids like Fasolo, Seedsman, Frost and Thomas who look like becoming above-average contributors. I see heaps waiting in the wings for an opportunity who could be anything like Kennedy, Scharenberg, Broomhead, Freeman and Adams. What we are all seeing is a mid-tier team which is a complete blank canvas. Unfortunately we will always be living in the shadow of our former selves and our reputation. But so far, with the right attitude, I am thoroughly enjoying what I am seeing in 2014.

Put it this way, at least we aren't losing games with 30 year old ******s like Brock McLean and Andrew Carazzo still getting a game


That's a great post mate. That's what I was thinking at the game last night. There were periods there in the second and final quarters where our kids really did go hunting their opposition again. Taylor Adams was determined to run with Selwood and threw himself at contests, Frosty was everywhere in the second quarter (he's so fast and determined), Elliott looked so dangerous all night we could hear Stevie J yelling at his defenders to" find the kid" in the last quarter. This team is starting to look like a unit again, albeit a young work in progress type unit.
I was proud of them last night.
 
So where is the realism here? I dont understand how you're assessment is "realistic" compared to others.

Have you ever noticed that when players are accessing coaches, they talk about how well the coach gives them a clear assessment of how well they are doing? It's something that promotes respect between two people.

I'm not sure that I would tell Alex Fasolo that he looks like becoming above average. I think he's had far too publicity for what he has done so far. Jamie Elliot can jump but he needs to round out his game. The others that you've mentioned have also go a way to go.

The problem with talking up younger players is you tend to feel let down when they dont seem to progress fast enough. A good example is Keeffe who seems to be out of form at the moment. I've seen a few comments from people saying that he was over-hyped. The problem seems to be that these are the people who are doing the hyping in the first place.

I'm all for realism
 

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So where is the realism here? I dont understand how you're assessment is "realistic" compared to others.

Have you ever noticed that when players are accessing coaches, they talk about how well the coach gives them a clear assessment of how well they are doing? It's something that promotes respect between two people.

I'm not sure that I would tell Alex Fasolo that he looks like becoming above average. I think he's had far too publicity for what he has done so far. Jamie Elliot can jump but he needs to round out his game. The others that you've mentioned have also go a way to go.

The problem with talking up younger players is you tend to feel let down when they dont seem to progress fast enough. A good example is Keeffe who seems to be out of form at the moment. I've seen a few comments from people saying that he was over-hyped. The problem seems to be that these are the people who are doing the hyping in the first place.

I'm all for realism
i totally respect your opinion, i get the feeling you are lowering expectations because you've become used to being disappointed in the last few years. What im trying to say is that a large part of the reason that we've all come to experience regular disappointment has been because of how far we've fallen since 2010/11. What I've been trying to do and feel I've achieved recently is to relinquish all my preconceptions about our team that are based on our success 4 years ago and go into each game looking at our team as a blank canvas. All I want to see more than anything is effort and belief because I do believe our list is 2-3 years off being very strong. I am not going to assume that we will be right back up there this year or next or the year after that but I won't rule out that in a few years time we will finally have a list capable of something with the right structures and man-management.

One more point, yes thats very true about keeffe. The flip-side of that is the pleasant surprise of players like marley williams who looked like spuds and came crazy good. You never know where those ones are gonna come from, maybe Thomas is another, Seedsman definitely is, Langdon could be one. So yeh there's plenty of disappointment but you just never know, you have to be cautiously optimistic and hope that for every disappointment you get a surprise packet
 
And the other thing is to let yourself believe you're building towards something because its fun. Even if you don't achieve the holy grail you just bottom out and rebuild and get to enjoy the process again. Theres a lot to enjoy watching your team grow into itself
 
I think the thing that really frustrates me is that we have so many stars in the side, and when we play poorly (even in a win), it kinda makes me feel like we arent meeting our potential. That's kinda where my negativity comes from I think. Ultimately once a day after the game has passed I'm back to thinking straight.
But names like Swan, Pendles, Cloke, Reid, Beams, Sidebottom... wow that is some serious talent. I think I get frustrated because with names like that you kinda expect success, which I know isn't right... but hard to help sometimes.
 
i totally respect your opinion, i get the feeling you are lowering expectations because you've become used to being disappointed in the last few years. What im trying to say is that a large part of the reason that we've all come to experience regular disappointment has been because of how far we've fallen since 2010/11. What I've been trying to do and feel I've achieved recently is to relinquish all my preconceptions about our team that are based on our success 4 years ago and go into each game looking at our team as a blank canvas. All I want to see more than anything is effort and belief because I do believe our list is 2-3 years off being very strong. I am not going to assume that we will be right back up there this year or next or the year after that but I won't rule out that in a few years time we will finally have a list capable of something with the right structures and man-management.

One more point, yes thats very true about keeffe. The flip-side of that is the pleasant surprise of players like marley williams who looked like spuds and came crazy good. You never know where those ones are gonna come from, maybe Thomas is another, Seedsman definitely is, Langdon could be one. So yeh there's plenty of disappointment but you just never know, you have to be cautiously optimistic and hope that for every disappointment you get a surprise packet

I dont even consider post 2010. I'm talking about the last 120 years of football. I'm not trying to lower expectations because I've been posting to this forum for too many years. People are go up and down like yo-yos

I'm not an iceman on losing. Let me tell you. I'm in a bad mood every weekend that we lose. Losing isnt like water off a ducks back. But I'd be more depressed if we werent doing the right things to win a premiership some time in the future. But 2 or 3 years? Well it could be 5.... it could be more. You just keep trying.
 
First let's track my own personal expectations back to the end of 2010.

I think everybody on here considers themself to be a "realist".

We must all see different realities :p
 
I think the thing that really frustrates me is that we have so many stars in the side, and when we play poorly (even in a win), it kinda makes me feel like we arent meeting our potential. That's kinda where my negativity comes from I think. Ultimately once a day after the game has passed I'm back to thinking straight.
But names like Swan, Pendles, Cloke, Reid, Beams, Sidebottom... wow that is some serious talent. I think I get frustrated because with names like that you kinda expect success, which I know isn't right... but hard to help sometimes.

Try considering selwood, bartels etc etc. We dont play with ourselves every weekend..... well at least the players dont
 
I think the thing that really frustrates me is that we have so many stars in the side, and when we play poorly (even in a win), it kinda makes me feel like we arent meeting our potential. That's kinda where my negativity comes from I think. Ultimately once a day after the game has passed I'm back to thinking straight.
But names like Swan, Pendles, Cloke, Reid, Beams, Sidebottom... wow that is some serious talent. I think I get frustrated because with names like that you kinda expect success, which I know isn't right... but hard to help sometimes.
i completely get that but i suppose ive come around to the idea that it doesnt matter how talented your nucleus is, if you have no defence everyones heads are lowered, if you have a gameplan that we are yet to really master you lose yourself in your structures and if 50% of our side is kids then 50% of the time the ball is in the hands of someone whos gonna need it 500 more times before hes any good at using it.

In saying that I'm not convinced things are all peachy just yet, but I do see our team as raw and i'm becoming more understanding of our faltering. I do hope that our board has the balls to make the tough call in a couple of years if our coaching department does prove to be a square peg in a round hole. Right now though i think we'll be right
 
I think the thing that really frustrates me is that we have so many stars in the side, and when we play poorly (even in a win), it kinda makes me feel like we arent meeting our potential. That's kinda where my negativity comes from I think. Ultimately once a day after the game has passed I'm back to thinking straight.
But names like Swan, Pendles, Cloke, Reid, Beams, Sidebottom... wow that is some serious talent. I think I get frustrated because with names like that you kinda expect success, which I know isn't right... but hard to help sometimes.
Actually consider carlton for a second. How many superstars do they have in their team: Judd, Murphy, Gibbs, Henderson, Walker. They have proven every year for the last 4 or 5 that they still suck cos you can have as many stars as you want but if your last 5-10 players are shit then your team is shit. At least our bottom 5-10 are 18-21 not 27-32 hahaha. I love how bad they are. Then they go ahead and try and rectify all their failing by picking up a 27 year old in Daisy Thomas but they've ignored the fact that its not more superstars they need, it's less 30 year retrds
 

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