Toast A Step In The Right Direction

[Markfs]

Women were significantly more likely than men to want to change the date of Australia Day (43% compared to 33% men).

This is in keeping with studies showing women are more progressive than men.

Meanwhile, about 66% of those living outside capitals cities were opposed to changing Australia Day. This reduces to 60% opposed to change in capitals. This is driven by boomers in regional areas, who are significantly more opposed than boomers in cities.

60% of Australians want to keep Australia Day on January 26, but those under 35 disagree

A new national survey shows the majority of Australians want the day left as it is. But it also suggests a groundswell for change is in the works.

theconversation.com

 

[76woodenspooners]

Welcome to Country is a ceremony in which people who are not part of a mob are welcomed to share in the bounty of the land. Yet I’ve read some people say that this is not enough, or that they are bored by it.

I’d reckon they’re more likely to be referring to the ‘acknowledgement of country’ ceremony (maybe they can’t tell the difference), which, you have to admit is often done in a way that is rote and without much meaning behind it.

What would you suggest Aboriginal people do differently?

Not my place to suggest others do anything (lest of all Aboriginal people).

Why is it even their problem to begin?

I didn’t say that anything is “their problem”.

Reconciliation is a challenge for all Australians.

Let’s face it, white people haven’t been too welcoming to them since 1788. We can’t even agree on changing our national day to not be the anniversary of the beginning of their suffering.

Sure, but why is that? And what can we as a society do about it?

We’re a society who recently voted overwhelming in favour of SSM … indicating compassion toward the dignity of a minority group.

Why doesn’t changing Jan 26th have greater support?

 

[jmac70]

Why doesn’t changing Jan 26th have greater support?

Ignorance and apathy.

 

[Anzacday]

The best Welcome to Country speech I’ve seen…

 

[76woodenspooners]

Ignorance and apathy.

How do we ‘fix’ ignorance and apathy?

 

[Kappa]

Listening to Aboriginal people is also an issue political parties won’t touch.

You know Aboriginal people get more social benefits and handouts than any other group on the planet, right?

Let's not pretend the government isn't helping out a lot. Go do some research about the hundreds of millions the Government invests in trying to fix Aboriginal issues every year.

 

[leon123]

You know Aboriginal people get more social benefits and handouts than any other group on the planet, right?

Let's not pretend the government isn't helping out a lot. Go do some research about the hundreds of millions the Government invests in trying to fix Aboriginal issues every year.

I would suggest to you that a) middle to high income households and b) large corporations get more 'handouts'/subsidies' in terms of actual gross dollars than any other group.

FYI, Im a qualified and practising economist

 

[Kappa]

I would suggest to you that a) middle to high income households and b) large corporations get more 'handouts'/subsidies' in terms of actual gross dollars than any other group.

FYI, Im a qualified and practising economist

So you're saying a large billion dollar corporation gets more money in gross amounts than an individual person?

Well I'll be damned, you are a qualified economist...

 

[Lockyer24]

Hopefully we change the date as it’s such an easy fix.
And I hope we can then move on in unity, rather than continual identity politics.

 

[leon123]

So you're saying a large billion dollar corporation gets more money in gross amounts than an individual person?

Well I'll be damned, you are a qualified economist...

No as a sector, ths was obviously implied.

 

[Mark W]

You know Aboriginal people get more social benefits and handouts than any other group on the planet, right?

Let's not pretend the government isn't helping out a lot. Go do some research about the hundreds of millions the Government invests in trying to fix Aboriginal issues every year.

so you have an encylopedic knowledge of the social benefits and handouts of every group in the planet? Wow, Im very impressed...So facts and figures please.

Please share with us your encylopedic knowledge and list the social benefits and handouts of aboriginal people and then compare them to every group on the planet....

 

[Kappa]

No as a sector, ths was obviously implied.

Ah, so the billion dollar company sector gets more gross money than individuals? Again, thanks for pointing out that amazing piece of relevant information.

 

[Kappa]

so you have an encylopedic knowledge of the social benefits and handouts of every group in the planet? Wow, Im very impressed...So facts and figures please.

Please share with us your encylopedic knowledge and list the social benefits and handouts of aboriginal people and then compare them to every group on the planet....

You don't need to compare them to every group on the planet genius, only a handful of 1st world countries have social handouts to the same scale as Australia, and none of them have anything on the same scale for a particular race only like Australia does for Indigenous Australians.

Go google the benefits Indigenous Australians get, from education all the way from primary school to any university through scholarships, indigenous employment programs at all government organisations (and most big businesses) extra benefits in prison, bonuses on your VCE ATAR, extra loans and financial assistance, employment grants, centrelink and housing assistance (only for indigenous people), free health checks up (indigenous only). Free legal services, Indigenous work-for-the-dole program, wage subsides for indigenous employees...

The list actually goes on for much longer, and that's not even getting into the community based programs the government has set up in Indigenous areas, of which there are tonnes.

So, in short, the Aus Government is actually doing a SHITLOAD for indigenous Australians, and to deny that is absolutely dumb and deliberately misleading.

 

[leon123]

Ah, so the billion dollar company sector gets more gross money than individuals? Again, thanks for pointing out that amazing piece of relevant information.

you are a very clever and knowledgeable person Mr.Kappa, I bow down to your superior knowledge of everything.

By the way, your original assertion is complete rubbish. As molly meldrum would say..."do yourself a favour", have a ponder why that might be, rather than simply barking at the world

 

[Kappa]

you are a very clever and knowledgeable person Mr.Kappa, I bow down to your superior knowledge of everything.

By the way, your original assertion is complete rubbish. As molly meldrum would say..."do yourself a favour", have a ponder why that might be, rather than simply barking at the world

I get my knowledge from the experts, only a trained economist like yourself could know billion dollar companies get more gross dollar benefits than an individual making 60k a year. Clearly this is also proof that the Australian Government doesn't look after indigenous Australians

 

[jmac70]

How do we ‘fix’ ignorance and apathy?

How long is a piece of string?

 

[jmac70]

You know Aboriginal people get more social benefits and handouts than any other group on the planet, right?

Let's not pretend the government isn't helping out a lot. Go do some research about the hundreds of millions the Government invests in trying to fix Aboriginal issues every year.

I’m not interested in your gross simplification.

 

[Kappa]

I’m not interested in your gross simplification.

No, all you're interested in is #hashtags. Facts, or actually doing something, is a step too far for most.

 

[jmac70]

No, all you're interested in is #hashtags. Facts, or actually doing something, is a step too far for most.

Wrong again. Funding for Aboriginal communities is extremely complex. The simplistic manner in which you address it is frankly offensive. Not to mention it has nothing to do with the topic of the thread.

 

[sr36]

I get my knowledge from the experts, only a trained economist like yourself could know billion dollar companies get more gross dollar benefits than an individual making 60k a year. Clearly this is also proof that the Australian Government doesn't look after indigenous Australians

The assertion was that middle to high income earners and corporations get more benefits

In addition to direct benefits, benefits to companies also trickle down to benefits to individuals - generally middle to high income earners. So it's a lot more complex than you're trying to paint it.

 

[Pie eyed]

26th January 1949 - The Nationality and Citizenship Act is passed. Rather than being identified as subjects of Britain, the Act established Australian citizenship for people who met eligibility requirements.

That is when Australians became Australian, and not British subjects....

Good point.

Although not all people in Australia were eligible.


At the time of Federation, Aborigines were excluded from the rights of Australian citizenship, including the right to vote, the right to be counted in a census and the right to be counted as part of an electorate. In addition, they were not subject to Commonwealth laws and benefits in relation to wages and social security benefits such as maternity allowances and old age pensions.

In 1949 the Commonwealth granted voting rights to Aboriginal ex-servicemen and ex-servicewomen.

It was not until the 1967 referendum that Aboriginal people were granted citizenship, though they were allowed the vote earlier in 1962, though not encouraged to.

So are you suggesting that Jan 26th should be Nationality and Citizenship Day?

 

[slugger01]

Good point.

Although not all people in Australia were eligible.


At the time of Federation, Aborigines were excluded from the rights of Australian citizenship, including the right to vote, the right to be counted in a census and the right to be counted as part of an electorate. In addition, they were not subject to Commonwealth laws and benefits in relation to wages and social security benefits such as maternity allowances and old age pensions.

In 1949 the Commonwealth granted voting rights to Aboriginal ex-servicemen and ex-servicewomen.

It was not until the 1967 referendum that Aboriginal people were granted citizenship, though they were allowed the vote earlier in 1962, though not encouraged to.

So are you suggesting that Jan 26th should be Nationality and Citizenship Day?

Perhaps. Although as you point out, what makes it difficult is that our indigenous people were not eligible to be Australian citizens when that act was passed, but subsequent events made them “eligible”. So I’m not sure how they feel celebrating that day. Particularly when that date has other issues of hurt for them.

 

[PonsfordMagpie]

Hopefully we change the date as it’s such an easy fix.
And I hope we can then move on in unity, rather than continual identity politics.

Keep dreaming. Give them an inch…

Once the date is changed, the next debate will revolve around the idea of whether Australia Day should be celebrated at all.

 

[domus]

try anzac day cheering

View attachment 1318922

Are you saying this is a bad thing? Cheering for the men who sacrificed so much for us?

 

[Kappa]

Wrong again. Funding for Aboriginal communities is extremely complex. The simplistic manner in which you address it is frankly offensive. Not to mention it has nothing to do with the topic of the thread.

It's highly offensive to state facts?

Unfortunately facts don't care about feelings, they're just facts. None of that is my opinion, it's just the objective truth about government services and benefits to indigenous Australians.