AFL 2006 Talk

[davey_magik]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Get the engine from AFL PE (Which I thought was the best out of the AFL games) and make updates to it.
-Put the draft in. Except make the draft even as in terms of trading players (Pick 70 for Jonathan Brown WTF?) and make a random name generator. Throw in around 50 first names and 50 last names instead of this 'Brett Riewoldt' and 'Daniel Voss' crap. That kind of stuff just ****s people up the wall because it sounds crap and is just a stupid idea.
-Stop letting players get injured so easily. Having half your side out halfway through the season could possibly happen but don't be so easy with the injuries and let players do their knees every 2nd game.
-Make it so you can choose whether to kick to a lead or just bomb the damn thing long and hope players will run onto it.
-Make players man up. This has been a problem throughout all of the games. If I had a dollar for every time the opposition got a centre clearance and their CHF was 30m in the clear I'd be able to make my own game. Make the tactics actually WORK and perhaps a setting for your backmen so you can select certain backmen to run off their opponents and others to stick tight.
-Put the damn stats back in. I want to see Brent Moloneys 30 possession 5 goal figures at the end of each game!
-Enable it so you can manage your side through the off-season. I don't mean have heaps of options but you can choose how hard they train and if they train too hard players are more at risk of injuring themselves but will come out better in the next season.
-Stop making Collingwood one of the best sides! It's ridiculous!

 

[shanefos]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

-Put the damn stats back in. I want to see Brent Moloneys 30 possession 5 goal figures at the end of each game!

-Stop making Collingwood one of the best sides! It's ridiculous!

I dunno which game you're playing??? The stats are there at the end of the game - press 'S'.

And yep, no more Collingwood, I say.

 

[goDees22]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

I dunno which game you're playing??? The stats are there at the end of the game - press 'S'.

And yep, no more Collingwood, I say.

he means on ps2. there is so much wrong with the game that it isnt funny, but i would play it no matter how crap it was if it had CREATE A PLAYER!!! just copy a create a player from any NBA live game or soccer game, put it in. and u should be able to edit the current players, cos some are nowhere near as good as they should be, and others r way to good. wells is not a better mark than neitz!

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

he means on ps2. there is so much wrong with the game that it isnt funny, but i would play it no matter how crap it was if it had CREATE A PLAYER!!! just copy a create a player from any NBA live game or soccer game, put it in. and u should be able to edit the current players, cos some are nowhere near as good as they should be, and others r way to good. wells is not a better mark than neitz!

Rest assured that the folks in charge of rating the players are hardcore AFL fans so stats will be more accurate this time around.

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

So with the last game, the stats we got were based on the designer being a Collingwood supporter? Wouldn't someone during the process of making the game have said, "Mate, aren't Collingwood rated a little high considering where they are on the ladder?".

What kind of crazy company are making AFL games? Stats determined by what team the designer supports...unbelievable.

Every time we get the same old promises, and the 'we really value feedback' line. Most of time though, the game is delayed, and when it comes out, it obviously hasn't been tested thoroughly and the product is below standard.

I'm sure those working on the new game will do their best to put together a quality product, but there have been just too many broken promises with past games.

Fair enough that you are discouraged from past products. I too am a game buyer burnt my previous AFL incarnations. All I ask is that you put a little faith in the steps they are taking now. Please get involved by emailing switchingplay@hotmail.com - the input relayed through there has already been taken on board and in some cases subsequently implemented into the game.

 

[Bourky23]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

At least the umpiring is realistic.

hahaha man that is gold I laughed for about 5 mins without stopping

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

A quick question for the sporting game nuts out there...which approach is better to Trading players? The FIFA style where offers are made to you based on who you selected or the NBA2K/Madden style where you select players on your side and then players on opposition sides to see if they are interested?
The Drafting in AFL 2006 is being revamped but we're wondering how much you as the user want to get involved in the process...any ideas/suggestions?

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

A quick question for the sporting game nuts out there...which approach is better to Trading players? The FIFA style where offers are made to you based on who you selected or the NBA2K/Madden style where you select players on your side and then players on opposition sides to see if they are interested?
The Drafting in AFL 2006 is being revamped but we're wondering how much you as the user want to get involved in the process...any ideas/suggestions?

I'd prefer both options. Being able to select a player(s) from either your or the opposition's team and seeing what offer they make, but also being able to make your own offers (eg. Offer Nick Riewoldt for Jonothan Brown). It gets very annoying sometimes when you keep on asking what they want for any of their players, and they keep on asking for someone you refuse to trade under any circumstances.

Also, I get heavily involved in drafting nowadays. I've created a team completely out of draftees (delisted every player after simulating the entire 2005 season, and drafted new guys). I've just started playing the games now that I'm up to 2014 and the draftees are AFL quality (loved develpoing them through simulated games), and IMO its by far the most enjoyable way to play. It really feels like you've created the team from scratch, so you don't have superstars handed to you on a platter.

However I do think there should be some more quality in the draft. With pick 2 the best I could get in one draft was a player with average kicking, tackling, handballing etc, 49 for marking and 29 for speed. (Which are the two main factors I look at, as well as stamina). However in some other drafts I can get players with 48 for making and 45 for speed (or about that). Also, there shouldn't be so many old guys in the draft. Often, the best player by far is 23 or something. If they were that good they would've been picked up in a previous draft when they ad more scope for improvement. BTW, I was wondering if you could tell me when they stop improving, as the best available player I could find in one draft was 22, so should I persist with him (as he hasn't got the stats to get a spot in the team without favouritism), or play other, older players who can hold down a spot?

Forgot to mention...how you manage players in the post season also influences the rating of your team.

Not sure what this means...how can you manage them in the off-season? All you have is the trade week then the draft. After that its straight into the season.

(P.S Will AFL 2006 be available on Xbox? Cos I ain't getting a Playstation just for that)

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

it's great that hard really is hard, but you feel like you are battling the game and not the opposition

Very well said. Most of the time when you don't have an amazing team, you're playing against the game's faults rather than your opposition.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Also, has anyone else had the problem that sometimes when you take a mark, it doesn't count as a mark, and the game just plays on?

This gets extremely annoying, but thankfully it usually stops by the start of the next quarter.

 

[HorseHead]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Yeah, very well could be!

Also I've noticed for every AFL Live/Premiership game I've played, Geelong never win more than two games a season. So, methinks Geelong-hating Colligwood supporters made the game.

In all seriousness: who hates Geelong?

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

In all seriousness: who hates Geelong?

Everyone?

 

[Mikes4]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Not sure what this means...how can you manage them in the off-season? All you have is the trade week then the draft. After that its straight into the season.

)

I guess it would be things like pre-season training. Like each week you get a certain amount of time or money to spend developing your team, and how you allocate that time or money will affect how your team improves etc.

 

[Lonie_from_50]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

RE: AFL PE engine

I agree, I liked the format of AFL PE, ie, the camera. I found the cameras in AFL 2005 were harder to adapt to, especially after you take a mark and it is on side, where as in PE, it actually gave you a view of where to kick.

Just add the draft/trade/create a player to it. Keep the stats, dont know why you got rid of them.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Another thing that bugs me, is that usually after 2005/2006, teams have crap, short people playing in key-positions. Often they'll have no one over 190cm in their forward or back line, have a 191cm ruckman, and three giant midfielders.

When drafted, players should be listed as a KP Forward, or Small Forward, not simply Forward. There's also the problem of 200cm midfielders, which desperately needs to be addressed.

 

[Total_Juddshanks]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Hawk, One thing you should have gathered from this thread by now is that pretty much everyone agrees on the most important thing-

1. GAMEPLAY GAMEPLAY GAMEPLAY. Everything else is peripheral to this. If I were the project manager, I'd be locking the development team in a room with a pile of AFL game tapes and making them watch for a few weeks before letting them code anything. Look at what actually happens in a pack, look at how players go about gathering the ball, the way they kick, the way they mark, the way they run out space and jostle for position. Football is fun to watch and play because it is a big game broken down into lots of little contests and duels in different situations- for an AFL based sim to be realistic AND fun, all those contests and duels need to be as involving and as complex as they are in real life. When it comes right down to it, the biggest problems with the previous titles was that there were things you'd do 50 times a game (eg, marking) which simply weren't that fun because all you had to do is hit one button at the right time- hitting a button at the right time is how you microwave some instant noodles, not how you take a mark, and strangely enough there have been very few instant noodle sims out there.

The basic game mechanics are everything- footy fans (ie, us) will forgive an awful lot of problems in the way of graphics or lack of features if the core gameplay is enjoyable.

The only other points I'd make are some not very difficult ways of making gameplay more fun.

2.) More than a lot of sports, football is a game of momentum- teams wrestle for momentum, one side get a run on, the other side drops their head and suddenly its a rout. I think it'd be neat if this was subtley implemented- if you kick a few goals in quick succession (and are playing in front of a home crowd?) the crowd should get noisier, and your team should play better- perhaps get a temporary boost in their stats or forget about fatigue for a while, whilst the opposition got rattled and are more likely to make mistakes. If the gameplay was genuinely challenging and even, you'd play the game looking to get that 2 or 3 goal break you need to rattle the other team and start to control the game- that's realistic, and would also add an intriguing tactical element to the games- when commentators talking about dropping men back or changing ruckmen or whatever, the reason to do that is to arrest the flow of momentum.

3.) It'd be neat (and make the gameplay a lot more fun) if some of the player attributes were reflective of some of the more unique things about football- whilst numerical rankings strength/speed/skill/tackling are all well and good, would it be possible to implement some more unorthodox attributes? I'm talking about things like a ranking of
"Mongrel" - Affects how likely a player is going to put his head over the ball, or go back with the flight of the ball when taking a mark- even if person playing the game hits 'mark' a player with a low mongrel rating might hesitate for a second before backing into a pack, whilst a high mongrel player (say, Kerr or Ricciuto or whoever) should go hell for leather, and maybe even contest marks when not expressly told to. It could also affect movement of unselected (ie computer controlled) players, so a player with high mongrel would be likely to gravitate towards packs and congestion a player with low mongrel will drift off and wait for the feed.
"Clutch" There is a similar attribute in some of the NBA live titles- players with high 'clutch' values should ignore fatigue in the last few minutes of close games, and be more likely to successfully complete actions during that time. Low clutch players the opposite.
"Cool" Affects how swept up players get by things like momentum or whatever- a player with a high cool rating should still play well even if his team is struggling- but also, a player with low cool should be able to be put off his game by things like getting a free against or a heavy tackle or whatever- either making him more likely to infringe next time he lays a tackle, or just worse at everything for a short period.

Obviously that would take a lot more work, because those things are subjective- but even just letting players edit the stats so they can make the players in their team behave how they think they are.

4.)

(yes, there are player stats this time around and they will be influenced by how you play players as to whether they go up or not). In other words how you play the game with your team will influence how they are rated and also the teams you play.

That sounds very good- not only would it make the kind of thing i talked about above easier (guys who do courageous things increase their mongrel rating as the season goes on), it would make the season a heck of a lot less tedious- if you can bring in a raw rookie and, by playing him in one location, develop him into a specialised forward or whatever, it would make the season mode something other than 22 random games strung together.

Hawk, if you're sincere in seeking feedback, those are the kinds of things I think most people would agree would be good. But you need to understand that most people here (and most people who bought the previous awful games) are very very cynical about what good this feedback is going to do and very much doubt the ability of IR to produce a decent AFL game- prior to '06 being released there were the same requests for feedback and the same reams of things typed by hopefuls here and then a massive massive let down when the game came out.

Its rather a case of thrice bitten, very very very shy. It would take some pretty danged convincing independent reviews or word of mouth to make me consider buying a sequel to what have been some very sub-standard titles.

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Another thing that bugs me, is that usually after 2005/2006, teams have crap, short people playing in key-positions. Often they'll have no one over 190cm in their forward or back line, have a 191cm ruckman, and three giant midfielders.

When drafted, players should be listed as a KP Forward, or Small Forward, not simply Forward. There's also the problem of 200cm midfielders, which desperately needs to be addressed.

In the next version all players have a primary and secondary position. Who gets to play in that position is based on the best rated player available to play. Will solve the issue of wrong players in wrong positions and allow the players to play to their strengths.

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

RE: AFL PE engine

I agree, I liked the format of AFL PE, ie, the camera. I found the cameras in AFL 2005 were harder to adapt to, especially after you take a mark and it is on side, where as in PE, it actually gave you a view of where to kick.

Just add the draft/trade/create a player to it. Keep the stats, dont know why you got rid of them.

Trading/Drafting system is more in depth and realistic next time around. Create-a-player is still in discussion however. Stats are back and won't be going anywhere anytime soon if I have anything to do with it!

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Hawk, One thing you should have gathered from this thread by now is that pretty much everyone agrees on the most important thing-

1. GAMEPLAY GAMEPLAY GAMEPLAY. Everything else is peripheral to this. If I were the project manager, I'd be locking the development team in a room with a pile of AFL game tapes and making them watch for a few weeks before letting them code anything.

Believe it or not, that has actually taken place for this one.

Look at what actually happens in a pack, look at how players go about gathering the ball, the way they kick, the way they mark, the way they run out space and jostle for position. Football is fun to watch and play because it is a big game broken down into lots of little contests and duels in different situations- for an AFL based sim to be realistic AND fun, all those contests and duels need to be as involving and as complex as they are in real life.

Totally agree and steps have been taken to isolate and sort out these scenarios that take place on the field. Games can be won and lost depending on who you have in place in a given situation and what the team tactic is. Trust me, this is being looked at in great depth.

When it comes right down to it, the biggest problems with the previous titles was that there were things you'd do 50 times a game (eg, marking) which simply weren't that fun because all you had to do is hit one button at the right time- hitting a button at the right time is how you microwave some instant noodles, not how you take a mark, and strangely enough there have been very few instant noodle sims out there.

The Marking model has been stripped back and worked on. Gone are the days of the out of nowhere specky and the instant mark. If you haven't got the timing with regards to position at the contest and your button pressing you're not going to take a mark anytime soon.

2.) More than a lot of sports, football is a game of momentum- teams wrestle for momentum, one side get a run on, the other side drops their head and suddenly its a rout. I think it'd be neat if this was subtley implemented- if you kick a few goals in quick succession (and are playing in front of a home crowd?) the crowd should get noisier, and your team should play better- perhaps get a temporary boost in their stats or forget about fatigue for a while, whilst the opposition got rattled and are more likely to make mistakes. If the gameplay was genuinely challenging and even, you'd play the game looking to get that 2 or 3 goal break you need to rattle the other team and start to control the game- that's realistic, and would also add an intriguing tactical element to the games- when commentators talking about dropping men back or changing ruckmen or whatever, the reason to do that is to arrest the flow of momentum.

This momentum idea is prevelant in EA's Rugby titles. It's well implemented and I agree it's something that definitely needs to be considered/added to the next AFL game. Momentum can be depicted in numerous ways...we'll definitely have some aspects of momentum added to the game.

3.) It'd be neat (and make the gameplay a lot more fun) if some of the player attributes were reflective of some of the more unique things about football- whilst numerical rankings strength/speed/skill/tackling are all well and good, would it be possible to implement some more unorthodox attributes? I'm talking about things like a ranking of
"Mongrel" - Affects how likely a player is going to put his head over the ball, or go back with the flight of the ball when taking a mark- even if person playing the game hits 'mark' a player with a low mongrel rating might hesitate for a second before backing into a pack, whilst a high mongrel player (say, Kerr or Ricciuto or whoever) should go hell for leather, and maybe even contest marks when not expressly told to. It could also affect movement of unselected (ie computer controlled) players, so a player with high mongrel would be likely to gravitate towards packs and congestion a player with low mongrel will drift off and wait for the feed.
"Clutch" There is a similar attribute in some of the NBA live titles- players with high 'clutch' values should ignore fatigue in the last few minutes of close games, and be more likely to successfully complete actions during that time. Low clutch players the opposite.
"Cool" Affects how swept up players get by things like momentum or whatever- a player with a high cool rating should still play well even if his team is struggling- but also, a player with low cool should be able to be put off his game by things like getting a free against or a heavy tackle or whatever- either making him more likely to infringe next time he lays a tackle, or just worse at everything for a short period.

Obviously that would take a lot more work, because those things are subjective- but even just letting players edit the stats so they can make the players in their team behave how they think they are.

Good to see we are on the right track. There will be players with special abilities that allow them to perform 'extra' roles on the field.

4.)
That sounds very good- not only would it make the kind of thing i talked about above easier (guys who do courageous things increase their mongrel rating as the season goes on), it would make the season a heck of a lot less tedious- if you can bring in a raw rookie and, by playing him in one location, develop him into a specialised forward or whatever, it would make the season mode something other than 22 random games strung together.

Hawk, if you're sincere in seeking feedback, those are the kinds of things I think most people would agree would be good. But you need to understand that most people here (and most people who bought the previous awful games) are very very cynical about what good this feedback is going to do and very much doubt the ability of IR to produce a decent AFL game- prior to '06 being released there were the same requests for feedback and the same reams of things typed by hopefuls here and then a massive massive let down when the game came out.

Its rather a case of thrice bitten, very very very shy. It would take some pretty danged convincing independent reviews or word of mouth to make me consider buying a sequel to what have been some very sub-standard titles.

First year players can be moulded into positions through your actions. This involves experience on the field as well as how they perform in certain positions. I'm a big fan of management type games but I love AFL footy gameplay to be just as important. We are looking to strike a balance and build from there. Rest assured the game is heading in the right direction at last.

I understand your cynicism with regards to how far this feedback travels. It works two-fold currently. Firstly it gives us ideas with how to take a certain aspect in a certain direction. It's great to hear what you guys want. Secondly, it re-affirms the steps we have already taken and allows us to explore them as much as possible in our allocated dev time.

Please keep the suggestions coming. We fully appreciate the feedback, especially feedback with positive ideas/suggestions.

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

I guess it would be things like pre-season training. Like each week you get a certain amount of time or money to spend developing your team, and how you allocate that time or money will affect how your team improves etc.

Yep, the details are still being sorted out but Mikes4 is on the right track. We want to give the User an "in" with regards to the management of the side and the development of the players.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Will AFL 2006 be on xbox/pc as well?

 

[TheGhostOfJohnBelushi]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Whatever you do, don't release the game at the end of the season. Release it pre-season (or early season at the latest). If the game is not going to be ready then don't rush it and put out a half-***ed effort that comes out after the finals.

I want in this order:
Good gameplay - decent basics and fun to play
Goalkicking meter - The one used in the NES Aussie Rules Footy would be perfect
Current team lists - ie. release it at the start of 2007 with 2007 lists (or at least the ability to change the 2006 lists)
Trading - ESSENTIAL!!
Trackable stats - goals, possessions, marks etc
Realism - your actual captain goes to the coin toss (allow for the user to set who their captain is, like in EA Cricket)
More indepth gameplay - different kinds of marks etc
Awards - Brownlow, Norm Smith etc... make it a bit more realistic. I'm sick of computer players that rack up 15 useless possessions getting votes over someone who kicks 7 goals.
More indepth stats - time in possession, contested marks etc
Better graphics - more lifelike players and faces

That's the basics that should be covered. If you want to add training or something else, it should NOT be to the detriment of any of those.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

I like the idea that you could choose your own captain...perhaps that player could get a boost of 10 in their marking, speed etc..

Also, on goal-kicking, I think they should keep the '05 style, but maybe have a stat for goal-kicking (or just use kicking), and the higher their stat is, the easier it is to control the arrow? So if you had Mark McGough taking a set-shot, the arrow would be going all over the place, but if it was Stephen Milne, it'd be fairly easy to control.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

Also, just a little annoyance I'd like to be taken care of, is when you're looking at a player's profile, it switches between the player's averages per game, and their career stats every 5 seconds or so. This gets extremely annoying when I'm trying to see which player averages the most possessions, or has kicked the most goal, played the most games etc..And it wouldn't be too hard to make up a little bio for new draftees. Just something simple like "Tall forward with a strong mark and good pace. Taken by Fremantle with pick 12 in the 2008 draft, then traded to Richmond for Danny Meyer".

 

[Fiery Hawk]

Re: Fixing up the AFL games

I like the idea that you could choose your own captain...perhaps that player could get a boost of 10 in their marking, speed etc..

Also, on goal-kicking, I think they should keep the '05 style, but maybe have a stat for goal-kicking (or just use kicking), and the higher their stat is, the easier it is to control the arrow? So if you had Mark McGough taking a set-shot, the arrow would be going all over the place, but if it was Stephen Milne, it'd be fairly easy to control.

You can nominate your captain/vice-captain and also hopefully edit the jumper numbers of the players so a) they match players at all times for seasons to come and b) with retiring players you can promote player jumpers or even retire the number by not assigning it. Loving the idea of editing player jumpers as you can allocate special numbers at your club to your high draft picks.