AFL overtaking NRL in QLD

[Billy ray]

It’s a good venue. Family atmosphere. Been to a few Essendon / Suns games there, including that great contest in 2019. Place was rocking that night with both sets of fans well represented in the house.

Come along next Saturday night.
Wear the bombers beanie or hat. Some folks do that.
And yeh help out your local team.
And stick with bombers for sure- i get that

 

[Bjo187]

Thanks for sharing. The gals are certainly playing it more in clubs etc and some private schools. As a teacher of a few decades I have certainly seen changes. Touch Footy was the game for blokes in high school anyway at lunchtime. Still is for some but getting taken over by soccer and basketball. Gals don't often play at lunch in HS... AFL as always is non-existent apart from a couple who will start with marker's up and drag nobody so often join one of the other three. In Primary school handball (four square) and soccer always dominate. The kids also play 'chasey' type games from the Internet in real life. My spidey senses as a PE teacher interested in the history and reality of all this is that 'The Murderer' Gil is creative in stats. NRL dev't offices mentioned by someone else couldn't be arsed coming to schools. NRL pathways hate schools too. So it's interesting. Before COVID-19 and most of AFLQ got sacked the AFL types couldn't do enough for schools. But if they came once only they counted every kid even non-participants. Much like this thread, The Muderer is good at making polies and blokes with hands on todgers like us salivate over stuff that ain't real. If you looked at the Code that dominates in QLD, NSW and ACT of boys anyway in HS that has the most gifted athletes it's Rugby League and AFL a very distant 4th place and perhaps below... That's the view from the school yard, Cheers team!

Gillons comments must have really triggered you, to sign up especially to post this . Even in Melbourne growing up in the 90s, kids didn't play footy at lunchtime coz it was too physical/ hard to organise, yet most of the boys played on weekends, so I don't think that's a big deal. Also the Q schools cup is just about the biggest school comp in Australia I read, so that's pretty impressive.

Buy a 3 gamer and just go
To some neutral games

I'd get on the suns if I lived up there, you can have two teams especially with a club like the suns that are relatively likeable. Also seeing their academy talent coming through, it's a good time to get on board.

 

[GC2015]

I'd get on the suns if I lived up there, you can have two teams especially with a club like the suns that are relatively likeable. Also seeing their academy talent coming through, it's a good time to get on board.

Hopefully these thousands of Victorians who have moved to the Gold Coast over the last 1-2 years have the same approach as you and we see an increase in crowds/members. We just need to uphold our end of the bargain and win more consistently so attending a game at Heritage Bank Stadium is appealing, even when your own team isn't playing.

 

[RedV3x]

Hopefully these thousands of Victorians who have moved to the Gold Coast over the last 1-2 years have the same approach as you and we see an increase in crowds/members. We just need to uphold our end of the bargain and win more consistently so attending a game at Heritage Bank Stadium is appealing, even when your own team isn't playing.

If you like your football then it's a no-brainer to adopt your local side as an adopted second side.
I support the Dockers unless the Swans are in town.
I actually support the Dockers because my money goes towards them and I am really only following the Swans.

 

[The Educator]

Gillons comments must have really triggered you to sign up especially to post this . Even in Melbourne growing up in the 90s kids didn't play footy at lunchtime coz it was too physical/ hard to organise, yet most of the boys played on weekends, so I don't think that's a big deal. Also the Q schools cup is just about the biggest school comp in Australia I read so that's pretty impressive.



I'd get on the suns if I lived up there, you can have two teams especially with a club like the suns that are relatively likeable. Also seeing their academy talent coming through, it's a good time to get on board.

The funniest bit was how he had "often" observed aborted games of "markers up" in the playground

We obviously can't match the ground work of the teacher-cum-anthropologist who spent so much time observing the children in the play ground, but of the objective data I can tell re Queensland:

• Australian football is marginally behind rugby league in terms of participation according to the Ausplay survey for both kids and adults. It is actually very close (and Aus football is clearly higher than rugby union, they both are well below soccer)
• Attendance is probably 2 to 1 to the NRL
• TV ratings are probably 3 to 1 to the NRL all things considered
• Commercially, the AFL is about half the NRL (by total club football related turnover)
• Google trends puts it at about 2-1 to the NRL

At least in South East Queensland, it is definetly plausible for the Aus football to surpass rugby league by the middle of the century if all things went well

 

[domin8]

Hopefully these thousands of Victorians who have moved to the Gold Coast over the last 1-2 years have the same approach as you and we see an increase in crowds/members. We just need to uphold our end of the bargain and win more consistently so attending a game at Heritage Bank Stadium is appealing, even when your own team isn't playing.

They won’t but their kids will

 

[Cunnington Cartel]

The funniest bit was how he had "often" observed aborted games of "markers up" in the playground

We obviously can't match the ground work of the teacher-cum-anthropologist who spent so much time observing the children in the play ground, but of the objective data I can tell re Queensland:

• Australian football is marginally behind rugby league in terms of participation according to the Ausplay survey for both kids and adults. It is actually very close (and Aus football is clearly higher than rugby union, they both are well below soccer)
• Attendance is probably 2 to 1 to the NRL
• TV ratings are probably 3 to 1 to the NRL all things considered
• Commercially, the AFL is about half the NRL (by total club football related turnover)
• Google trends puts it at about 2-1 to the NRL

At least in South East Queensland, it is definetly plausible for the Aus football to surpass rugby league by the middle of the century if all things went well

If the Queensland AF participation numbers include students who participate in the AFLQ Schools Cup and school footy clinics, like I suspect they do, then this does not equate to sustained and meaningful participation. The total number of junior club participants would provide a far more accurate representation of the popularity of both sports with children and youths in Qld.

 

[GC2015]

They won’t but their kids will

That's the point. It's going to be a generational shift. We've started to already see it with a few of the draftees that have come through like Connor Budarick who claims he grew up supporting the Suns but I'm sure his old man Craig (previous on the Swans list) supported a different club prior to his son being drafted. It will just continue to grow as we get further down the track but we can speed up that growth if we start winning more/playing finals.

 

[The Educator]

If the Queensland AF participation numbers include students who participate in the AFLQ Schools Cup and school footy clinics, like I suspect they do, then this does not equate to sustained and meaningful participation. The total number of junior club participants would provide a far more accurate representation of the popularity of both sports with children and youths in Qld.

THis is from the Ausplay survey. The problem with comparisons of respective governing bodies figures is that there is no way of verifying credibility and making like for like comparisons.

The Ausplay survey is a scientific survey of a large number of people specifically relating to sports and recreational participation

So organised participation for children has rugby league about 10 to 15 % higher (though with 50% more boys)....



...while adult (15 and over) is about the same for "organised" and 25% less for club based

 

[Canberra Pear]

As a teacher If you looked at the Code that dominates in QLD, NSW and ACT of boys anyway in HS that has the most gifted athletes it's Rugby League and AFL a very distant 4th place and perhaps below... That's the view from the school yard.

Thanks for the school yard insight.

Had you heard specific things about ACT schools? Or was that just a north-of-the-Barassi generalisation?

There are slightly more AF high-school-aged boys teams in the ACT than RL teams, and AF teams have more players per team, so I would've at least assumed they'd be on level footing.

 

[Bjo187]

THis is from the Ausplay survey. The problem with comparisons of respective governing bodies figures is that there is no way of verifying credibility and making like for like comparisons.

The Ausplay survey is a scientific survey of a large number of people specifically relating to sports and recreational participation

So organised participation for children has rugby league about 10 to 15 % higher (though with 50% more boys)....

View attachment 1627571

...while adult (15 and over) is about the same for "organised" and 25% less for club based

View attachment 1627574

My understanding from my mate that actually works in schools as a p.e teacher in both Brisbane and the gold coast, is that school sports are a lot more popular in QLD than they are in Victoria.

So school sports participation, particularly for state schools isn't just a one off game, they train and play multiple games. More like the American system where club sports aren't as popular, people play a sport for a school and that's it. So yes I think the Queensland schools competition should be included in the statistics, an AFL clinic that shows up one time per year, not so much.

 

[Cunnington Cartel]

THis is from the Ausplay survey. The problem with comparisons of respective governing bodies figures is that there is no way of verifying credibility and making like for like comparisons.

The Ausplay survey is a scientific survey of a large number of people specifically relating to sports and recreational participation

So organised participation for children has rugby league about 10 to 15 % higher (though with 50% more boys)....

View attachment 1627571

...while adult (15 and over) is about the same for "organised" and 25% less for club based

View attachment 1627574

Footy is killing it with their female youth participation in Qld. I’m sure all codes apply broad interpretations of participation. However, the schools cup is a competition that can certainly be used to inflate participation figures. Students can rock up with their school to a gala day and, if unsuccessful, many of them wouldn’t play any other footy for the remainder of the year. As far as I know, there isn’t a composite state-wide school competition for rugby league or union.

 

[The Educator]

Footy is killing it with their female youth participation in Qld. I’m sure all codes apply broad interpretations of participation. However, the schools cup is a competition that can certainly be used to inflate participation figures. Students can rock up with their school to a gala day and, if unsuccessful, many of them wouldn’t play any other footy for the remainder of the year. As far as I know, there isn’t a composite state-wide school competition for rugby league or union.

The Ausplay survey specifically captures organised "out of school" participation so the children numbers shouldn't include the school competition

 

[Gigantor]

Thanks for the school yard insight.

Had you heard specific things about ACT schools? Or was that just a north-of-the-Barassi generalisation?

There are slightly more AF high-school-aged boys teams in the ACT than RL teams, and AF teams have more players per team, so I would've at least assumed they'd be on level footing.

I think that's wishful thinking on the part of our LU friend.
Bugger all people play rugby league in Canberra.
In fact, half the teams in the Canberra comp are from outside of the ACT!
Even though they make up an absolutely tiny percentage of Canberra's population, over half the players in the senior comp are Pacific Islanders.

 

[Aussie in exile]

I think that's wishful thinking on the part of our LU friend.
Bugger all people play rugby league in Canberra.
In fact, half the teams in the Canberra comp are from outside of the ACT!
Even though they make up an absolutely tiny percentage of Canberra's population, over half the players in the senior comp are Pacific Islanders.

What problem to you have with PIs playing Rugby League?

 

[Cunnington Cartel]

My understanding from my mate that actually works in schools as a p.e teacher in both Brisbane and the gold coast, is that school sports are a lot more popular in QLD than they are in Victoria.

So school sports participation, particularly for state schools isn't just a one off game, they train and play multiple games. More like the American system where club sports aren't as popular, people play a sport for a school and that's it. So yes I think the Queensland schools competition should be included in the statistics, an AFL clinic that shows up one time per year, not so much.

Unsure of how things are on the coast, but in Brisbane secondary schools, AF is rarely (if ever) an option for students to play in inter-school sporting competitions. Across SE Qld, there are about 10 state schools in the Schools of Excellence Competition and there’s the AIC competition for a relatively small number of independent schools. In the grand scheme of things, this is a very small % of secondary schools that actually have teams involved in regular competition. All other schools without established programs can enter teams in the Schools Cup, which is often a one-off, unless the team has some success and progresses to the next stage of the comp.

 

[Gigantor]

What problem to you have with PIs playing Rugby League?

NOthing at all.
It remains a statistical oddity that such a tiny percentage of the population can dominate senior rugby league in both amateur and professional ranks.
This is why I'm confident that the NRL will always be able to fill professional rosters because of a steady supply of Pacific Islanders who, from the day they are born, have about a 50% chance of being good enough to play professionally.
All strength to them I say.

 

[The_Wookie]

I think that's wishful thinking on the part of our LU friend.
Bugger all people play rugby league in Canberra.
In fact, half the teams in the Canberra comp are from outside of the ACT!
Even though they make up an absolutely tiny percentage of Canberra's population, over half the players in the senior comp are Pacific Islanders.

It doesnt matter where they came from, it matters where they are.

 

[RedV3x]

What problem to you have with PIs playing Rugby League?

No problem at all. It's the reliance on international players that is concerning.
It's concerning for NRL that Australians are playing NRL like they used to.

 

[Gigantor]

It doesnt matter where they came from, it matters where they are.

Yeh, well, if the majority of your players come from a population group which makes up less than 1% of the total population, I would suggest to you that that might end up being somewhat limiting.
But granted, if that's enough to provide the NRL with all the players it needs for future growth, then so be it.
No harm done.

 

[Bjo187]

Yeh, well, if the majority of your players come from a population group which makes up less than 1% of the total population, I would suggest to you that that might end up being somewhat limiting.
But granted, if that's enough to provide the NRL with all the players it needs for future growth, then so be it.
No harm done.

You'll find wookie gets extremely defensive of any criticism of the NRL these days, he won't hear a bad word about it, straight onto it in a flash.

 

[The Educator]

Yeh, well, if the majority of your players come from a population group which makes up less than 1% of the total population, I would suggest to you that that might end up being somewhat limiting.
But granted, if that's enough to provide the NRL with all the players it needs for future growth, then so be it.
No harm done.

Yeah the point is smack on. You are obviously not being racist for making it

It is one thing for a population of a few hundred thousand people being sufficient to produce increasingly a majority of your elite talent, but the other factor is the knock-on effect that ultimately has on broader engagement with the game......particularly when you are up against another sport with more money that is far better at directing it towards grass roots development

 

[The_Wookie]

You'll find wookie gets extremely defensive of any criticism of the NRL these days, he won't hear a bad word about it, straight onto it in a flash.

Its called having a balanced view point. Not agreeing with you on things does not mean im "defensive of any criticism of the NRL". It means Im not interested in pointless code wars over nothing.

And refrain from playing the man.

 

[GC2015]

Unsure of how things are on the coast, but in Brisbane secondary schools, AF is rarely (if ever) an option for students to play in inter-school sporting competitions. Across SE Qld, there are about 10 state schools in the Schools of Excellence Competition and there’s the AIC competition for a relatively small number of independent schools. In the grand scheme of things, this is a very small % of secondary schools that actually have teams involved in regular competition. All other schools without established programs can enter teams in the Schools Cup, which is often a one-off, unless the team has some success and progresses to the next stage of the comp.

Basically the complete opposite on the Gold Coast. Essentially every GC government school plays AF with many of them running excellence programs - Helensvale, Miami, Palm Beach Currumbin, Pacific Pines, Southport, Varsity etc. The government schools have the local GC AF inter-school competition as well as the QLD Schools Cup that they compete in as well and virtually every year it's an all Gold Coast final of PBC v Helensvale at both senior and junior level. The elite APS private schools on the GC also have their own AF inter-school competition with the GF each year being played at the Suns' stadium.

Many of those private schools also compete in the QLD Schools Cup as well. The APS school that takes AF the most seriously on the GC is All Saints and they allow many northern boarders to move to the Gold Coast to pursue their footy dreams. The All Saints' production line of AFL talent is quite impressive - Nick Riewoldt, Kurt Tippett, Lachie Weller, Jack Bowes, Alex Davies and even Will Ashcroft in his younger years. Then there's the in between schools on the Gold Coast that are a mash up of private schools that aren't quite considered elite as well as middle of the road Catholic schools. There's some impressive AF programs starting to develop at this level too with a school like Hillcrest being coached by former AFL player Matty Lappin and the school winning QLD Schools Cup a few years ago and making another final last year.

The one school on the Gold Coast that doesn't seem to give AF a chance is an all boys school known as TSS and it's mainly because they are a member of the prestigious GPS competition which is full of the most elite private school based in Brisbane and they take rugby union extremely seriously, to the point that AF is flat out banned at TSS. There's hope that this ban will one day be lifted because TSS, without even trying, has had some AFL players walk through their doors like Clark Keating and Brad Moran so we wonder how many more AFL players they would produce if the sport wasn't banned. TSS's sister school, an all girls school known as St Hilda's, have recently started taking AF seriously as well with former Sun Jesse Joyce taking up a sports administrator role at the school shortly after his AFL career came to an end and has really pushed AF at the school. It's also worth mentioning that a lot of the government schools running sports excellence programs on the GC seem to have an AF club within walking distance of the school and I'm not sure if that was intentional, but it certainly makes a difference in creating a clear pathway for the juniors.

So yeah. Very different situation on the Gold Coast when compared to Brisbane where school sport is essentially dominated by rugby union / cricket at the private school level and the government schools virtually always preference rugby league over AF. It's going to be very hard for AF to make any inroads at the school level in Brisbane (other than the second tier AIC competition that seem to be taking AF a bit more seriously these days) but AF at Gold Coast schools really seems to be taking off these days and the recent population boom of Victorians moving here is only going to strengthen it even more. This is probably a big factor behind our academy dominance over Brisbane in recent years.

 

[Seedsfan]

Today’s result also makes a mockery of the AFL’s introduction of expansion clubs. Perhaps some lessons for the AFL to learn if the NRL can introduce a club that wins their very first game. An enormous contrast to what transpired with the Suns and Giants being hugely uncompetitive for their first few seasons.

They should have promoted Southport as they had the best chance of making it and standing on their own two feet