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Opinion AFL season 2016: Which problem do Richmond Tigers tackle?

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THE THIN MAN

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Rohan Connolly
Published: July 3, 2016 - 8:25PM

AFL list management is a fine art, with much wisdom to be had in hindsight. Which is why it's too easy to whack Richmond for over-estimating how far they could go with their current list.

Leading into 2016, the Tigers had won 15 games and narrowly missed a top-four berth two years out of three, and in-between launched a phenomenal comeback over the second half of 2014 to reach September.

That was a pretty handy response to any jibes about three consecutive failures at the first finals hurdle, and a successful enough base from which to justify taking yet another calculated punt on the services of AFL-experienced types, this time Chris Yarran, Jacob Townsend and Andrew Moore.

If the jury was out for a long time on Richmond, the final verdict has been emphatically delivered. The Tigers simply aren't good enough, and it's time to start again. How, though? Well, that is the first thing an entire club needs to resolve.

Is the problem the coaching, the players, the recruiting or the development? Ask insiders at Punt Road, let alone what has become the most patient support base in the AFL, and you might get several different answers.

Coach Damien Hardwick has, on occasion, appeared to change his mind. After only three games this season, he spoke about the Tigers taking a "half step backwards to take two steps forwards". Six weeks ago, he believed he had "as good a list as I think we've had at my disposal since I've been there".

But after Port Adelaide extinguished any flickering finals hopes on Friday night, the party line was different again. "We're off the pace – that's the reality of it," Hardwick said. "So we need to find players who can continue to take us forward and get us back to where we need to be."

Do Richmond's players acknowledge that? Reigning best and fairest Alex Rance doesn't appear to. "I see so much potential [in the group] Rance told SEN on Saturday. "I feel like we're so close and I feel like we've got some really good talent there, it's just our consistency that's really let us down."

Is that a coaching issue? Perhaps. Game style certainly is, and this column has written previously this season about the Tigers too often playing with the handbrake on, seldom recapturing the excitement or potency they had during their best football played in 2013.

Hardwick has to accept plenty of responsibility for the decisions made on senior-experienced trade-ins. But Richmond, having extended the coach for another two seasons beyond this year, just four months later can hardly say "we got it wrong". That would also be a virtual statement that the list is good enough. It isn't.

It lacks skill, it lacks capable key forwards and it certainly lacks depth of quality. If you doubt that, do this little exercise and ask yourself who are the club's best five players.

Ask that question of just about any team in the competition and you'll be forced to ponder a shortlist of at least seven or eight players. Richmond? Not a single person could possibly pick a five other than one containing the names Martin, Rance, Riewoldt, Deledio and Cotchin.

The gap between the stars and the rest is a gulf, and it's arguably no closer to being closed now than three years ago. So is that about recruiting or development? It's a tougher one to answer.

Richmond have had eight top 20 national draft picks during Hardwick's seven-year tenure – Martin, Ben Griffiths, Reece Conca, Brandon Ellis, Nick Vlastuin, Ben Lennon, Corey Ellis and Daniel Rioli.

All are still at the club, which indicates the Tigers still believe they identified the right talent. But, Martin aside, are they key players threatening the status of that top five? Forgetting Martin and the first-year Rioli, that's six players who've played a combined 27 seasons and 343 senior games for, in terms of honours, just Brandon Ellis' runner-up in the 2014 best and fairest.

That was Ellis' breakout year, and he's plateaued since. Griffiths' and Vlastuin's averages and performances have stayed largely the same throughout seven and four seasons respectively.

Then there's the group of players still being introduced, some would argue too cautiously. Sam Lloyd and Ben Lennon, both controversially omitted for last year's elimination final. Lloyd has at least been a constant this season, Lennon injured. Jayden Short looks promising.

But trade pick-ups Moore, Townsend and Taylor Hunt have played just 14 games between them. Forward Liam McBean is in his fourth AFL season for a total of two senior games, tall defender Todd Elton his fifth year for two games.

Hardwick says Richmond have "blooded a lot of young players this year". But the Tigers have used 34 so far this season, fewer than seven rivals. Surely, that figure must rise substantially now, with absolutely nothing to be lost from unveiling as many as possible at senior level, and with close to half the list coming out of contract.

That might help Richmond determine who's worth persisting with and who isn't in 2017. First, though, the Tigers need to agree not just that there's a problem, but agree upon what that problem actually is.

This story was found at: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/afl...o-richmond-tigers-tackle-20160703-gpxlg5.html
 

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DH has been left alone from media scrutiny for too long.
The RFC spin doctor media campaign has finally run its race.
Seriously sooks on here saying to leave us alone is utter rubbish as members were taken for a massive ride. DH is an incompetent fool who changes his opinion on coaching issues based on the consistency of his last crap. This club needs everything from a colonoscopy to a brain scan done to it and I'm finally happy after seven years it's happening.
 
DH has been left alone from media scrutiny for too long.
The RFC spin doctor media campaign has finally run its race.
Seriously sooks on here saying to leave us alone is utter rubbish as members were taken for a massive ride. DH is an incompetent fool who changes his opinion on coaching issues based on the consistency of his last crap. This club needs everything from a colonoscopy to a brain scan done to it and I'm finally happy after seven years it's happening.

Has he?

Almost every second article is criticising him our the club when we are doing shit.
 
Has he?

Almost every second article is criticising him our the club when we are doing shit.
Dh has avoided more criticism than any other coach (that deserves it )in the past 7 years
He's been a media pr0n star. The 17 other clubs love it when they see this potato is still our coach as he's not rated by them.
 
Wow, can't disagree with any of that. The club deserves its criticisms, we've had an abundance of time on our hands (7 years to be exact), and have failed miserably. I'd say we were a better team in 2012 than what we are now, recruiting and player development has been shocking. We've tried to lure quality players across, but they simply don't want to come to us.

We're stuck in mediocrity.
 
A lot of it is correct regarding our bottom tier. However I thought his assessment of Vlastuin is harsh as he is a good honest footballer with footy smarts and is lauded as a future captain. I am very comfortable with that pick.
 
It is a good read and makes very good points.


But I wish the journos/media would leave us the **** alone at times xD

Why would you want them to leave us alone.? I think they should continue the pressure on this club and force them to make changes. I know it sounds crazy & falling into media pressure but the club ain't listening to their supporters and keep offering lucrative contracts to players & coaches who don't perform.

For once, I am enjoying all these articles in hope that something changes at punt road. My rant, money or emotions are not enough for a change to happen.
Media is weapon.......I would love Caro to write something very very nasty but I know she won't.
 

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I was listening to 774 (I think) on Saturday morning. They had Trent on for an interview. Geez he sounded dejected. Was offered the opportunity to bury some team-mates but wouldn't do it. Didn't really say anything about the coach and coaching. So maybe he was just being diplomatic about his team-mates or maybe he knew it wasn't the done thing to speak ill of his coach and game-plan.

Anyway, I'd start with the coach.
 
I will tell you 2 problems we must rectify if we want to go forward:

1: We simply must tackle. In this era of football when it is fast running, overlap style, playing a corral style pressure game simply gets carved apart, especially when, like us, we will push to many to pressure the ball carrier leaving a number of opposition runners 10 meters off the contest and free in space. If you target the ball carrier, don't target them to corral them. Target them to tackle them and tackle them to hurt them. At least with a tackle, you take the opposition player out of the next passage. Corralling means that you are outnumbered, particularly at Richmond when we push 3 players in to corral the single ball carrier.

2: Develop players natural games. Whilst I understand it is important to develop every facet of a players game, we are better off playing players in their natural positions. It is easier to draft for positional needs, rather than develop. If you need a defender, draft a defender. Their development is going to be a LOT faster in the position they have played the majority of their careers rather than taking someone and putting them in a foreign position and telling them to learn. Obviously some players will adapt, but for the most part, you develop what you have, and draft what you don't. We seem to draft what we have, and develop what we don't.
 
I will tell you 2 problems we must rectify if we want to go forward:

1: We simply must tackle. In this era of football when it is fast running, overlap style, playing a corral style pressure game simply gets carved apart, especially when, like us, we will push to many to pressure the ball carrier leaving a number of opposition runners 10 meters off the contest and free in space. If you target the ball carrier, don't target them to corral them. Target them to tackle them and tackle them to hurt them. At least with a tackle, you take the opposition player out of the next passage. Corralling means that you are outnumbered, particularly at Richmond when we push 3 players in to corral the single ball carrier.

2: Develop players natural games. Whilst I understand it is important to develop every facet of a players game, we are better off playing players in their natural positions. It is easier to draft for positional needs, rather than develop. If you need a defender, draft a defender. Their development is going to be a LOT faster in the position they have played the majority of their careers rather than taking someone and putting them in a foreign position and telling them to learn. Obviously some players will adapt, but for the most part, you develop what you have, and draft what you don't. We seem to draft what we have, and develop what we don't.

Yes, l can't agree more man, and I've used this example before:

Carlton recruit Troy Menzel.
Immediately into the forward pocket, and 5-10 games into his career he is kicking goals and looking dangerous. He was part of a massive comeback against us at the start of 2014 which they nearly won. Yes, they traded him in the end, but he was a gun forward pocket and did well there, what good would ever have come playing him down back, they would have been wasted years.


We recruit Ben Lennon.
We see his best footy up forward, yet give him bugger all chances, play him as the sub more often that not, then start playing him down back....


Vlastuin was a midfielder bobbing up forward at times, now a backman.

Corey Ellis recruited as a midfielder, playing as a backman now.

Conca was played down back this preseason.

Short is a forward pocket playing down back.

Markov is playing defense in the VFL. He's a forward/wing.

Chol is a natural forward, now he's in defense in the VFL.

Astbury is a key defender in our side. Recruited as a forward.

There's probably more.

WTF IS GOING ON.


You can't spend all your time in so-called development, you end up just treading water or going backwards.
Hardwick's best time was 2013 which was a culmination of the actual progress we made in 2010, 2011, and 2012.
He didn't play blokes out of position, and we steadily improved and became a force in 2013.
But after that we never continued building, he dialled it way back, started this position shuffling crap and ultimately screwed us.
 
It is a good read and makes very good points.


But I wish the journos/media would leave us the **** alone at times xD
I dont, I want the blowtorch to come. I want us under massive pressure. I want something to force the clubs hand and that will only come with pressure. We need a change. Hardwick is not the man, nor is the current football department and recruiting staff.

Everything needs a cleanout.
 
We recruit Ben Lennon.
We see his best footy up forward, yet give him bugger all chances, play him as the sub more often that not, then start playing him down back....

Actually think one day of his best games in the seniors was off HBF against Adelaide where his kicking and marking were great.

His best VFL games are off HBF

Vlastuin was a midfielder bobbing up forward at times, now a backman.

Was u/18 AA HBF, played majority of his final year across HBF. Also played a lot of midfield before that

Short is a forward pocket playing down back.

Played mostly as a mid/HBF in tac cup

Chol is a natural forward, now he's in defense in the VFL.

Played mostly ruck and CHB for Queensland and lions academy

Astbury is a key defender in our side. Recruited as a forward.

Was a swingman for the rebels playing CHF and CHB. Probably showed more as CHB from memory.
There's probably more.

started this position shuffling crap and ultimately screwed us.

Played out of position means nothing. In fact it's usually great for development as kids see the game differently. It happens at every club and has for years. In fact it's vital in today's game where versatility and flexibility are at a premium.

Bigger concerns are a stale game plan, curbing players natural instincts to play within that game plan and limited exposure to the top level consistently.
 
Actually think one day of his best games in the seniors was off HBF against Adelaide where his kicking and marking were great.

His best VFL games are off HBF



Was u/18 AA HBF, played majority of his final year across HBF. Also played a lot of midfield before that



Played mostly as a mid/HBF in tac cup



Played mostly ruck and CHB for Queensland and lions academy



Was a swingman for the rebels playing CHF and CHB. Probably showed more as CHB from memory.
There's probably more.



Played out of position means nothing. In fact it's usually great for development as kids see the game differently. It happens at every club and has for years. In fact it's vital in today's game where versatility and flexibility are at a premium.

Bigger concerns are a stale game plan, curbing players natural instincts to play within that game plan and limited exposure to the top level consistently.
You make some really good points then, but, it just feels like we're just sitting in this constant stage of 'teaching' players how to defend and never actually getting anywhere with it.

It CLEARLY doesn't work. We do not tackle, and aside from last year, we are pretty easy to score against.

I would much rather Corey Ellis bursting to 50 and kicking goals like he did off a wing against Essendon last year, and I would much rather Vlastuin teaming up with Dusty and Miles to beast mode the stoppages like they did against Sydney a few weeks back. Get some ACTUAL defenders and play them there ffs.
 

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Yes, l can't agree more man, and I've used this example before:

Carlton recruit Troy Menzel.
Immediately into the forward pocket, and 5-10 games into his career he is kicking goals and looking dangerous. He was part of a massive comeback against us at the start of 2014 which they nearly won. Yes, they traded him in the end, but he was a gun forward pocket and did well there, what good would ever have come playing him down back, they would have been wasted years.


We recruit Ben Lennon.
We see his best footy up forward, yet give him bugger all chances, play him as the sub more often that not, then start playing him down back....


Vlastuin was a midfielder bobbing up forward at times, now a backman.

Corey Ellis recruited as a midfielder, playing as a backman now.

Conca was played down back this preseason.

Short is a forward pocket playing down back.

Markov is playing defense in the VFL. He's a forward/wing.

Chol is a natural forward, now he's in defense in the VFL.

Astbury is a key defender in our side. Recruited as a forward.

There's probably more.

WTF IS GOING ON.


You can't spend all your time in so-called development, you end up just treading water or going backwards.
Hardwick's best time was 2013 which was a culmination of the actual progress we made in 2010, 2011, and 2012.
He didn't play blokes out of position, and we steadily improved and became a force in 2013.
But after that we never continued building, he dialled it way back, started this position shuffling crap and ultimately screwed us.

You forgot us drafting brandon ellis as a defender, who now plays midfield. But you could be forgiven for forgetting that, because his defensive pressure seems to be non-existent and plays with zero accountability.
 
Yes, l can't agree more man, and I've used this example before:

Carlton recruit Troy Menzel.
Immediately into the forward pocket, and 5-10 games into his career he is kicking goals and looking dangerous. He was part of a massive comeback against us at the start of 2014 which they nearly won. Yes, they traded him in the end, but he was a gun forward pocket and did well there, what good would ever have come playing him down back, they would have been wasted years.


We recruit Ben Lennon.
We see his best footy up forward, yet give him bugger all chances, play him as the sub more often that not, then start playing him down back....


Vlastuin was a midfielder bobbing up forward at times, now a backman.

Corey Ellis recruited as a midfielder, playing as a backman now.

Conca was played down back this preseason.

Short is a forward pocket playing down back.

Markov is playing defense in the VFL. He's a forward/wing.

Chol is a natural forward, now he's in defense in the VFL.

Astbury is a key defender in our side. Recruited as a forward.

There's probably more.

WTF IS GOING ON.


You can't spend all your time in so-called development, you end up just treading water or going backwards.
Hardwick's best time was 2013 which was a culmination of the actual progress we made in 2010, 2011, and 2012.
He didn't play blokes out of position, and we steadily improved and became a force in 2013.
But after that we never continued building, he dialled it way back, started this position shuffling crap and ultimately screwed us.

He tries too hard to turn everyone into a utility.
 
You make some really good points then, but, it just feels like we're just sitting in this constant stage of 'teaching' players how to defend and never actually getting anywhere with it.

It CLEARLY doesn't work. We do not tackle, and aside from last year, we are pretty easy to score against.

I would much rather Corey Ellis bursting to 50 and kicking goals like he did off a wing against Essendon last year, and I would much rather Vlastuin teaming up with Dusty and Miles to beast mode the stoppages like they did against Sydney a few weeks back. Get some ACTUAL defenders and play them there ffs.

I don't disagree there are issues, tackling as at the top of that list. We need a clean out of the FD. But I just hate hearing about drafted as a forward why don't we play him there, most of these kids need to be able to play everywhere and usually when your the best junior you mostly play midfield but you play every position as your team needs.

Also we've had top 3 defense for previous 3 seasons since Chappy came across. This year is a mess and we get scored against from turn overs making our defenders vulnerable.

Hardwick has set us up with a terrible game that is costing us, our confidence is shot and it's hard to develop our kids when our game plan curbs there natural instincts. Personally think the player most affected by this is BEllis, he over thinks everything he does now and panics.
 
Yes, l can't agree more man, and I've used this example before:

Carlton recruit Troy Menzel.
Immediately into the forward pocket, and 5-10 games into his career he is kicking goals and looking dangerous. He was part of a massive comeback against us at the start of 2014 which they nearly won. Yes, they traded him in the end, but he was a gun forward pocket and did well there, what good would ever have come playing him down back, they would have been wasted years.


We recruit Ben Lennon.
We see his best footy up forward, yet give him bugger all chances, play him as the sub more often that not, then start playing him down back....


Vlastuin was a midfielder bobbing up forward at times, now a backman.

Corey Ellis recruited as a midfielder, playing as a backman now.

Conca was played down back this preseason.

Short is a forward pocket playing down back.

Markov is playing defense in the VFL. He's a forward/wing.

Chol is a natural forward, now he's in defense in the VFL.

Astbury is a key defender in our side. Recruited as a forward.

There's probably more.

WTF IS GOING ON.


You can't spend all your time in so-called development, you end up just treading water or going backwards.
Hardwick's best time was 2013 which was a culmination of the actual progress we made in 2010, 2011, and 2012.
He didn't play blokes out of position, and we steadily improved and became a force in 2013.
But after that we never continued building, he dialled it way back, started this position shuffling crap and ultimately screwed us.
The way the list should be broken down:

KPD: Rance Astbury Elton Chaplin
Mid Sized Defenders: Grimes McIntosh Broad Batchelor
Small Defenders: Houli Yarran Castagna Drummond Morris Hunt

KPF: Riewoldt Griffiths Vickery McBean Chol C.Moore
Mid Sized Forwards: Deledio Martin Lennon Markov
Small Forwards: Lloyd Rioli Short Butler

Rucks: Hampson Soldo Maric
Inside Midfielders: Miles Vlastuin Townsend A.Moore Marcon
Hybrid Midfielders: Cotchin Edwards Grigg C.Ellis Conca Lambert
Outside Midfielders: B.Ellis Menadue

Now obviously those players aren't locked into those positions but you use them as the basis. When someone in that group is under performing or injured you take the next player off the list and play them in the spot until the higher ranked player is either back in form or uninjured. You don't just do it in the seniors either, you stick to it in the VFL side as well. That way you get continued development in players rather than taking a kid who is playing as a forward one week being played down back the next and vice versa.

The biggest benefit of that being in place is that using the Hawthorn mantra of when one soldier falls the next one take their place you know that who you are bringing in is more than capable of stepping into the role and understanding what they are expected to do.

Right now we have guys getting shuffled around like the deck chairs on the Titanic. It's not helping anything in regards to keeping the ship afloat and it's taking Hardwick down with the ship. Now I don't see Hardwick being sacked despite the desire of some fans and media for it to happen. The club will look like complete fools if they did sack him now. But he needs to decide on a course he wants to go and stick to it. Right now he has said that the preference will be for youngsters to be picked over experienced types. If that's the way he wants to go then stick to it, don't get 3-4 weeks down the track and decide to go back to the older types. Sticking with the one plan will buy him some space with most level headed fans, but flipping and flopping between plans won't.
 

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