All things Politics

[DinoSoar]

It is recognised that this is a fraught topic for any number of you posting here. Some of you will have family in Israel or Palestine. Some of you will have connections to either side of the conflict. What you need to understand is that this site has rules governing posting standards and the appropriate way to talk to other posters, and you will abide by them.

How this interacts with this thread is that the following will result in your post being deleted, with a recurrence of the same behaviour resulting in (depending on severity) a threadban for a week and a day off:

• direct labelling of someone as anti-semitic or a terrorist sympathiser for posting that is merely critical of Israel's response over time. Israel has the right to defend themselves from violence, but that does not mean that Israel has carte blanche to attack disproportionately towards people under their care.
• deliberate goading or flippant responses, designed to get people reacting to your posting emotionally.
• abuse.
• attempts to turn this into a Left vs Right shitfight.
• Use the word 'Nazi' in here, you had better be able to justify it in the post you're making and the comparison had better be apt. Godwin's law is in full effect for the purposes of this thread; if you refer to Nazis, you've lost whatever argument you're involved in.
• Any defense of Hamas' actions on the basis of justification. There's no justification for genocide, regardless of whether or not they have the power to do so.

Please recognise that this is a difficult time for all involved, and some level of sensitivity is absolutely required to permit discussion to flow. From time to time, mods will reach out to specific posters and do some welfare checks; we may even give posters who get a bit too involved some days off to give people some time to cool down. This is not a reflection on you as a poster, merely that this is an intense subject.

I get that this is a fairly intense topic about which opinion can diverge rather significantly. If you feel you cannot be respectful in your disagreement with another poster, it is frequently better to refuse to engage than it is to take up the call.

From this point, any poster who finds themselves directly insulting another poster will find themselves receiving a threadban and an infraction, with each subsequent reoccurance resulting in steadily more points added to your account.

It has also become apparent that this needs to be said: just because someone moderates this forum that does not hold them to a different standard of posting than anyone else. All of us were posters first, and we are allowed to hold opinions on this and share them on this forum.

Treat each other with the respect each of you deserve.

Maggie5 Gone Critical Anzacday Jen2310

 

[Mollythedolly]

First home buyers are already fully or partially exempt from stamp duty. It's not much of a barrier at all.

To me this change is relatively superficial - pretty close to simply a deferral. 5.5% up front duty compared to 1%p.a. of the unimproved value x 10.

First home buyers aren’t the only people trying to get into the market. Just about to start that process myself.

Superficial to those that have the 5.5% to pay up front I guess. That’s $55k+ for $1m+ properties.

 

[sideswipe]

First home buyers aren’t the only people trying to get into the market. Just about to start that process myself.

Superficial to those that have the 5.5% to pay up front I guess. That’s $55k+ for $1m+ properties.

Well, for a $1m commercial property with say an unimproved value of $500k, the buyer will have to find $5kp.a. for 10 years. That'll be factored into servicing calculations for borrowers. Better than paying up front duty but not to any great extent.

 

[Mollythedolly]

Well, for a $1m commercial property with say an unimproved value of $500k, the buyer will have to find $5kp.a. for 10 years. That'll be factored into servicing calculations for borrowers. Better than paying up front duty but not to any great extent.

Don’t see the issue.

 

[Maggie5]

I'm not arguing that, I'm more than aware.

Like I said earlier, have been advised to raise the rent by my property manager. Don't want to, but to keep up with the land tax, might have to.

What would you like me to do about that?

You may have to do as advised.

Members of my family are in a similar position and have the same attitude as you have but doing the numbers they don't seem to have a choice.

To be fair Mags, you're basically saying ' go see how it's worse for others than yourself', that's a popular line.

And? What would you like us to do about that.

Take the hit for everyone else?

I really wasn't saying that especially given your previous post not referring to you.

I am not sure what the answer is but just saying I have seen another side and wasn't directed at you.

 

[sideswipe]

Don’t see the issue.

Well, instead of finding the extra 5.5% at the start, the borrower needs to pay the 1% land tax for 10 years. That amount will be factored into the borrower's servicing calculation - so there will be a hit to their borrowing capacity. If at their limit, bank will say, "need more equity mate"

 

[Black_White]

Geez the slumlords are up and about.
Bit like the pharmacists that don’t like the general public taking back some of their profits.
I suppose they could always vote against the government at the election(s).
Oh, wait….
Like it or not,if you can afford to own more than one property you can pay for the privilege.
Just like if you have more than $10 million in payroll you can afford to pay a little extra. These places could always reduce the CEO’s annual bonus….

 

[eddiesmith]

Geez the slumlords are up and about.
Bit like the pharmacists that don’t like the general public taking back some of their profits.
I suppose they could always vote against the government at the election(s).
Oh, wait….
Like it or not,if you can afford to own more than one property you can pay for the privilege.
Just like if you have more than $10 million in payroll you can afford to pay a little extra. These places could always reduce the CEO’s annual bonus….

Maybe the government should take your advice and if things are tight, cut the premiers pay?

 

[Black_White]

Maybe the government should take your advice and if things are tight, cut the premiers pay?

Haha!
Andrews could make 10 times what he gets as Premier in private enterprise.
Like all Premiers and PM’s of all persuasions. Our highest pollies are underpaid, always have been.
I remember in the 70’s when 747 pilots earned twice what Malcolm Fraser was getting.

 

[eddiesmith]

Haha!
Andrews could make 10 times what he gets as Premier in private enterprise.
Like all Premiers and PM’s of all persuasions. Our highest pollies are underpaid, always have been.
I remember in the 70’s when 747 pilots earned twice what Malcolm Fraser was getting.

His only experience in life is politics, he‘d be lucky to get half what he is currently on. He could always run a union but even the highest paid union leader is only slightly above Dan in wage.

His future is likely whatever cushy job the CCP has lined up him.

 

[leon123]

What is your opinion on minimal deposit into home investment in property.

Nowadays I think a minimum of 30%.
Even more if looking at 1 million investment.

Ultimately, the lower deposit rates will increase purchase price of dwelling, a delayed outcome though

 

[Black_White]

His only experience in life is politics, he‘d be lucky to get half what he is currently on. He could always run a union but even the highest paid union leader is only slightly above Dan in wage.

His future is likely whatever cushy job the CCP has lined up him.

Ha!
Jealousy much?
One of the all time great Premiers.
That’s why people are flocking to Victoria and Melbourne is set to become the biggest city in Australia.
Even interstates love our Dan. No matter what Murdoch says!

 

[leon123]

Ha!
Jealousy much?
One of the all time great Premiers.
That’s why people are flocking to Victoria and Melbourne is set to become the biggest city in Australia.
Even interstates love our Dan. No matter what Murdoch says!

Hate to burst ya bubble, but reason melbourne will overtake sydney in population is simply about land supply opportunities. Premier in this instance is irrelevant.

 

[Maggie5]

His future is likely whatever cushy job the CCP has lined up him.

I think he should have stepped down after pandemic but surely you really don't believe that.

I laughed.

 

[HeathySure]

I think he should have stepped down after pandemic but surely you really don't believe that.

I laughed.

Maggie, all readers of Murdoch believe that lol Even if they have no idea what a socialist actually is.

 

[eddiesmith]

I think he should have stepped down after pandemic but surely you really don't believe that.

I laughed.

It would definitely explain the taxpayer funded trip to China which no one was allowed to know what happened on.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Haha!
Andrews could make 10 times what he gets as Premier in private enterprise.
Like all Premiers and PM’s of all persuasions. Our highest pollies are underpaid, always have been.
I remember in the 70’s when 747 pilots earned twice what Malcolm Fraser was getting.

Not that that is the point though.

The narrative seems to be 'if you can afford more than one home, you should foot the bill'. So on face value that somewhat takes away incentive for anyone to try and get ahead and get a second property.

(I'll debate the 'homes shouldn't be an investment' theory when one eventually throws that in a reply.)

Andrews would certainly be able to afford more than one, so to be consistent he should be footing the bill, like 747 pilots or anyone that can afford more than one.

 

[Gone Critical]

Take as stroll thru some major shopping centres (Puckle Street, Sydney Road), dozens of empty shops with premises on the top. Have been empty for months/years.

I tried to rent shop for a short term (6 months) in a shop in Moonee Ponds and even though had been empty for more than a year, rent asked was hysterical (it is still empty).

Premise up the top could easily accommodate a family of four (not that I wanted that part).

Don't base it on your experience.

Not sure commercial rentals in strip shopping centres, who have been suffering for a long time, business killed off by the big centres, are a good example. Those landlords will be feeling a lot of pain as a rule. They need commercial clients who will take a 2x2, 3x3 etc type lease, do a fit out and put down some roots and longevity. Giving a 6 month rental would interfere further with getting the type of tenant they need.


Residential availability is very low. There will be a tiny number of landlords who actively dont want a tenant. I know the census gives an empty dwelling rate of around 10% in Aust consistently but this doesnt mean 10% dwellings that are suitable for renting out. 1986 was the last census to track why dwellings were unoccupied at census. At that time 25% were holiday houses unused on the day, 35% were absent residents on the night of the census. Other reasons were dwellings for sale, between tenancies, being built or renovated.

When you think about it just over 70% of the 2 million plus landlords in our country have 1 property and if you add those with 2 it goes to 90%. Its hard to believe any in that group would choose to not rent out their property.

 

[Maggie5]

Not sure commercial rentals in strip shopping centres, who have been suffering for a long time, business killed off by the big centres, are a good example. Those landlords will be feeling a lot of pain as a rule. They need commercial clients who will take a 2x2, 3x3 etc type lease, do a fit out and put down some roots and longevity. Giving a 6 month rental would interfere further with getting the type of tenant they need.


Residential availability is very low. There will be a tiny number of landlords who actively dont want a tenant. I know the census gives an empty dwelling rate of around 10% in Aust consistently but this doesnt mean 10% dwellings that are suitable for renting out. 1986 was the last census to track why dwellings were unoccupied at census. At that time 25% were holiday houses unused on the day, 35% were absent residents on the night of the census. Other reasons were dwellings for sale, between tenancies, being built or renovated.

When you think about it just over 70% of the 2 million plus landlords in our country have 1 property and if you add those with 2 it goes to 90%. Its hard to believe any in that group would choose to not rent out their property.

The commercial properties in the streets I mentioned have been like that for years, not a recent thing.

Many well before Covid. I still don't understand it.

Didn't really affect me as in the end I rented a (pop-up) shop in Keilor Road, Niddrie.

 

[Gone Critical]

The commercial properties in the streets I mentioned have been like that for years, not a recent thing.

Many well before Covid. I still don't understand it.

Didn't really affect me as in the end I rented a (pop-up) shop in Keilor Road, Niddrie.

Strip shopping centres have suffered for a long time now. Decades I would say. Many empty around me for a long time. The landlords would all want tenants but those shops struggle in the modern world. You need much longer leases than you do in the residental market I think. Tend to be more about rental returns than capital growth compared to residental. Thats my guess.

 

[Maggie5]

Strip shopping centres have suffered for a long time now. Decades I would say. Many empty around me for a long time. The landlords would all want tenants but those shops struggle in the modern world. You need much longer leases than you do in the residental market I think. Tend to be more about rental returns than capital growth compared to residental. Thats my guess.

True but don't understand if standing empty for a year or two why not take the short term rental as at least it would cover rates.

Further, most have accommodation on top floor, surely they could be let out.

Lygon Street was similar but now all you see are units/flats with a supermarket on ground floor.

Wouldn't like to see that on Puckle Street although parts of Sydney Road (past Bell Street) wouldn't be that bad.

 

[Black_White]

Hate to burst ya bubble, but reason melbourne will overtake sydney in population is simply about land supply opportunities. Premier in this instance is irrelevant.

Well, how wrong can you be?
It’s about opportunity and Victoria has more opportunities because of the creation of opportunity by Dan.
NSW have a chance to pull some people back, now that they’ve seen the light.

 

[Black_White]

Not that that is the point though.

The narrative seems to be 'if you can afford more than one home, you should foot the bill'. So on face value that somewhat takes away incentive for anyone to try and get ahead and get a second property.

(I'll debate the 'homes shouldn't be an investment' theory when one eventually throws that in a reply.)

Andrews would certainly be able to afford more than one, so to be consistent he should be footing the bill, like 747 pilots or anyone that can afford more than one.

Well in everything in life there is a line that divides between affordable and non affordable.
That line is being changed.
And that line is already artificial by the way borrowing on a second property is handled. Government tax breaks for second properties are keeping people out of being first home buyers. Why aren’t they given incentives like this?
The line to invest has always been a floating one, don’t whinge when suddenly you are on the wrong side of it.

 

[leon123]

Well, how wrong can you be?
It’s about opportunity and Victoria has more opportunities because of the creation of opportunity by Dan.
NSW have a chance to pull some people back, now that they’ve seen the light.

You can say Im wrong, but that dont make it the truth.

You said, its because of Dan - Melbs will overtake Sydney in population.

Two core reasons why this is:
1) record overseas net migration, of which around 60% goes to Melbourne'
2) Melbourne has relatively ample land supply opportunities - meaning as an outcome more affordable housing - Sydney does not.

Interstate migration from Sydney to Melb is negligible compared to a) natural increase and b) more importantly net OS migration to Melbs.

Dan does not control points 1 and 2 (point 2 is effectively based on Melbs geography). Now I know u reckons he is good, but surely he is not that good to be able to create flat land around our growth areas... thats Jesus level stuff.

Now we talk about opportunities, you mean employment. You think Dan created all employment in Melbs (get off the mushrooms). Employment growth in Melbs has largely been driven by population growth i.e. services, housing, retail etc. Please refer back to points 1 and 2.

FYI... melbourne experienced the first decline in population (i.e. negative growth) (outside of wars) ever under Dans leadership.

Sydney in the future will struggle to experience significant population growth due to land supply opportunity shortgages.. we will see hinterland growth outside of Sydney (think historically outer eastern suburbs of Melbs)

If you are going to blatantly say someone is wrong... know ya facts first hey

 

[Black_White]

You can say Im wrong, but that dont make it the truth.

You said, its because of Dan - Melbs will overtake Sydney in population.

Two core reasons why this is:
1) record overseas net migration, of which around 60% goes to Melbourne'
2) Melbourne has relatively ample land supply opportunities - meaning as an outcome more affordable housing - Sydney does not.

Interstate migration from Sydney to Melb is negligible compared to a) natural increase and b) more importantly net OS migration to Melbs.

Dan does not control points 1 and 2 (point 2 is effectively based on Melbs geography). Now I know u reckons he is good, but surely he is not that good to be able to create flat land around our growth areas... thats Jesus level stuff.

Now we talk about opportunities, you mean employment. You think Dan created all employment in Melbs (get off the mushrooms). Employment growth in Melbs has largely been driven by population growth i.e. services, housing, retail etc. Please refer back to points 1 and 2.

FYI... melbourne experienced the first decline in population (i.e. negative growth) (outside of wars) ever under Dans leadership.

Sydney in the future will struggle to experience significant population growth due to land supply opportunity shortgages.. we will see hinterland growth outside of Sydney (think historically outer eastern suburbs of Melbs)

If you are going to blatantly say someone is wrong... know ya facts first hey

So many months since the Danslide and I still get pleasure from reading/seeing those who remain bitter and twisted.
Struggling to justify their hatred.
Struggling to understand Murdoch’s media no longer has the public’s ear.
It’s simply Magpienificent!

 

[leon123]

So many months since the Danslide and I still get pleasure from reading/seeing those who remain bitter and twisted.
Struggling to justify their hatred.
Struggling to understand Murdoch’s media no longer has the public’s ear.
It’s simply Magpienificent!

Something seriously wrong with you.

I present facts... you are the type that would argue with a surgeon and tell them they are wrong, because you read it somewhere or ya mum told ya so

Secondly, Im far from anti Dan, I dont know how you can even conclude that from what I stated - facts.

I think your admiration for the man is blinding you from basic facts

If you have a view state it, your response is at best, childish