List Mgmt. All Trades and Draft Part 2- Draft edition

[FKASC]

That's ******* brilliant you kent.

It was better originally but my Firefox crashed

 

[Keys]

Great summation Keys and thanks for the mammoth effort.


It's always an interesting time immediately after the trade period when the media and us footy tragic's ponder who did the best.

While I acknowledge that this is a somewhat simplistic approach, as it places a much lower value on what might be got with the respective draft picks.

BUT

The key question I ask myself for teams, that are a chance to make the eight and more importantly, the teams genuinely contending for the .

Is This.

Which teams have improved and now appear a more formidable opponent, next season with their inclusions from trade week.

Here is my take on it.

Didn't do a lot, didn't need to, and with their numerous picks they are well armed to trade picks for better pole position come draft night.
Bit of a nothing trade period. Remain the same.
Good trading and got some handy players ( Birchell if he is able to play will be a very good get. )
Bit of a nothing trade period for them. Haven't improved.
Lost their second best player and the two players they have bought in don't improve the collective. Went backwards.
Clearly have improved as their KPP stocks were a weakness.
Remain the same, bit of a nothing trade period for them.
Lost Howard and that weakens them. Went backwards.
Ever so slight improvement with Frost. However Clarkson still being their best weapon.


Now ......... as for us.

Call me biased but the inclusion of Kelly makes us a much stronger out fit.


Dogies and us have not only improved but have specifically addressed the areas of list dept that has needed most attention and got the improvement in those areas that they needed.


All the other Clubs are just shuffling about, looking to the future, for any significant advancement in ladder position in 2020.

Agreed. We became significantly better with the addition of Kelly whilst other contending clubs with the exception of the bulldogs made no such external changes. Some, like Geelong, lost ground

It’s quite a difference to last year when several big name players switched clubs with the likes of Lynch, Shiel, Beams, Neale, Hogan, May, Polec, Scully, Wingard and Lycett all making a move.

The addition of Kelly for us is as significant in the short term as Richmond getting Lynch was, perhaps even more so. In the longer term it’s a bit different as Lynch was a free agent and as such didn’t cost any draft capital like Kelly did

 

[Keys]

Sad day for BigFooty.

It turns out Keyser actually passed away halfway through writing this post and it was completed by one of his grandkids.

RIP friend, you were always so full of life

LOL

 

[bodazoka]

Has masten missed out on getting to another club? was he keen on that? I thought he was heading to the gold coast

 

[Ok Boomer]

Has masten missed out on getting to another club? was he keen on that? I thought he was heading to the gold coast

He can still get somewhere as a delisted free agent.

 

[Keys]

Has masten missed out on getting to another club? was he keen on that? I thought he was heading to the gold coast

I don’t think there was much interest although he might find his way onto a list as a delisted FA now trade period is over and clubs can assess where they’re at and look through other clubs castoffs

Given the amount of experience that walked out the door at Adelaide he wouldn’t be a bad option for them

 

[Chris_6678]

Get Masten a gig as a pre-season Train the house down coordinator.

 

[mattyc75]

Agreed. We became significantly better with the addition of Kelly whilst other contending clubs with the exception of the bulldogs made no such external changes. Some, like Geelong, lost ground

It’s quite a difference to last year when several big name players switched clubs with the likes of Lynch, Shiel, Beams, Neale, Hogan, May, Polec, Scully, Wingard and Lycett all making a move.

The addition of Kelly for us is as significant in the short term as Richmond getting Lynch was, perhaps even more so. In the longer term it’s a bit different as Lynch was a free agent and as such didn’t cost any draft capital like Kelly did

I'm probably in the minority but i dont think geelong have lost too much for next year. Steven will go some way to filling the gap left by kelly and jenkins will split time between the forward line and ruck,both needs for the cats.
They also really strengthened their draft hand for the next 2 drafts which will help rejuvenate their aging list

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[AsterixTheGaul]

Some key dates ahead of us

Thursday 17 October - AFL Trade Period Opens (selections only).
Friday 18 October 5pm - Application to Relist a Player Close
Thursday 31 October 2pm - List Lodgement (1)

Friday 1 November - AFL Delisted Player Free Agency Period (1) Commences
Monday 11 November- AFL Delisted Player Free Agency Period (1) closes

Tuesday 12 November 2pm - List Lodgement (2)

Wednesday 13 November - AFL Delisted Player Free Agency Period (2) Commences

Friday 22 November 2pm - NAB AFL Trade Period Closes (for exchange of selections only)
Friday 22 November 5pm - AFL Delisted Player Free Agency Period (2) Closes

Wednesday 27 November 7pm - 9.30pm - NAB AFL Draft Selection Meeting (Round One), Marvel Stadium.
Thursday 28 November 7pm - 9.30pm - NAB AFL Draft Selection Meeting (Round Two onwards to conclusion).

Thursday 28 November (post draft) - AFL Delisted Player Free Agency Period (3)

Thursday November 28 post draft OR Friday 29 November from 9am - NAB AFL Rookie Draft

Monday 2 December 2pm - Final AFL Club List Lodgement

 

[kane249]

I'm probably in the minority but i dont think geelong have lost too much for next year. Steven will go some way to filling the gap left by kelly and jenkins will split time between the forward line and ruck,both needs for the cats.
They also really strengthened their draft hand for the next 2 drafts which will help rejuvenate their aging list

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The question mark for the Cats is do their older players still have what it takes or will age catch up to them
Stanley 30
Touhey 31
Ablett 36
Taylor 34
Jenkins 31
Steven 30
Selwood 32
Duncan 29
Rohan 29
Henderson 31
Hawkins 32
Dangerfield 30
Blicavs 29

With the exception of Henderson you are looking at 12 of your best 22 being 29+ next year. Time's running out very quickly for them IMO

 

[Dark Sharks]

Ugh, i forgot all about how the national draft is split over 2 days now.

Great idea, whoever thought of that is an absolute pioneer

 

[Chris_6678]

Geelong remind me of North 2014-16 but with better talent. Still this wont end well in a year or so when most of those 30+ hang the boots up.

 

[ziad]

I'm probably in the minority but i dont think geelong have lost too much for next year. Steven will go some way to filling the gap left by kelly and jenkins will split time between the forward line and ruck,both needs for the cats.
They also really strengthened their draft hand for the next 2 drafts which will help rejuvenate their aging list

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Agreed they didn't fall apart, but Sevens may or may not be effective. Losing Kelly was like us losing Schey or Yoe. It hurts particularly as Gaz and coy are aging. Kids will not fill the gaps

 

[Bender_]

The question mark for the Cats is do their older players still have what it takes or will age catch up to them
Stanley 30
Touhey 31
Ablett 36
Taylor 34
Jenkins 31
Steven 30
Selwood 32
Duncan 29
Rohan 29
Henderson 31
Hawkins 32
Dangerfield 30
Blicavs 29

With the exception of Henderson you are looking at 12 of your best 22 being 29+ next year. Time's running out very quickly for them IMO

Jesus, that's an old bunch. It's like Keys's highschool reunion!

amirite Dark Sharks?! Pick 33 etc

 

[eagles rule]

***LONG POST INCOMING***

Clubs essentially get one opportunity per year to improve their list through either trades, the draft or a combination of the two. The trade period is complete so clubs will have looked to have brought a player(s) in, kept required players and position themselves as best as possible in the draft given their ladder position and net player gains/losses

Going through what each club has done I’m pretty comfortable with our efforts which was basically selling the farm for Tim Kelly. There’s a valid argument that we gave too much and should have pushed for a better deal to retain one of our second round picks. I’d counter that there was no guarantee Geelong would have conceded any ground and prolonging negotiations would have caused undue stress to Kelly and his family and opened the door for Fremantle to get involved.

In any case the deal is done and rather than ponder what might have been let’s consider that if improving the list is the main goal we’ve just added a player in the top echelon of the competition. We’ve gone all in on another premiership tilt by addressing our main weakness (the midfield) at the expense of trading out of this years draft and the first round of next years.

It’s a risk, but a calculated one given we’ve invested heavily in recent drafts. In comparison to other clubs I feel we’ve done particularly well and in the wider AFL community our trade period is considered to be among the best. Personally I think we’ve done better than anyone after going through each clubs efforts detailed below

•Adelaide
In - Frampton plus picks 37,45,49,2020 2nd(WB),4th(GC),4th(Carl)
Out - Ellis-Yolman, Betts, Jacobs, Greenwood, Keath, Jenkins and 2020 3rd
Draft - 4,23,28,37,45,49
Lost a raft of players that will kill their depth and in reality got little back in the way of quality draft picks. They do get a future 2nd from the bulldogs but have also traded out their future 3rd and I doubt the difference between those will be much. I hope Matthew Nicks brings a kick ass fire extinguisher with him to put out a dumpster fire that’s bordering on out of control.

•Brisbane
In - Achee, Birchall, Ellis-Yolman plus picks 48,52,72,2020 3rd(Ess)
Out - Cutler, Taylor plus picks 46,91,2020 2nd & 4th
Draft - 16,21,34,48,52,55,72
Some potentially handy players coming in without losing much the other way. Have a couple of handy draft picks still without compromising 2020 to any significant degree. For a side that finished H&A in 2nd spot steady as she goes is a good approach given that their young list should improve organically

•Carlton
In - Betts, Pittonet plus picks 57,70
Out - Phillips plus picks 48,72,2020 4th
Draft - 9,43,57,79,85
Given that there’s a good chance they’ll get Martin in the PSD for free their trade period will improve a little. It needs to because otherwise it’s pretty shit. Carlton finished 16th and have swapped backup rucks, brought in a 33 year old with maybe one decent year of footy left in him and have just one pick in the first 40. They also failed to prise Papley away from Sydney despite chasing him hard albeit it was always going to be difficult since he was contracted as we discovered last year with Kelly. Not a great result

•Collingwood
In - Cameron plus picks 62,2020 2nd & 4th (StK)
Out - Aish plus picks 56,69,2020 3rd
Draft - 35,62,74
What’s the opposite of balanced. Collingwood. They’ve got all their eggs in the midfield basket thanks to the unplanned acquisition of Beams who not only cost them last years and this years first round picks but has put unnecessary pressure on their salary cap. Basically gave Aish away in a salary dump and brought in a ruckman they don’t really need unless Grundy gets injured and if he does they’re f’ed anyway. First pick is 35 without bringing anyone in so their list goes nowhere this off season. Oh and they still reportedly have salary cap issues heading into 2020

•Essendon
In - Cutler, Phillips plus picks 33,61,64
Out - Picks 37,52,70,2020 3rd
Draft - 31,33,61,64,65,88
When you’re biggest achievement is retaining a contracted, injury prone forward that wanted out and you get congratulated for it then the bar is set pretty low. Two players that aren’t best 22, a nil all draw on picks in/out and nothing but two low 30 picks in the first three rounds of the draft. Good luck with that

•Fremantle
In - Acres, Aish plus picks 10,22,58,69,79,2020 2nd(Mel) & 3rd(Coll)
Out - Hill, Langdon plus picks 26,2020 3rd & 4th
Draft - 7,10,22,58,69,79,83
When you finish 13th and lose two of your top 5 in the B&F you’d expect to have something decent coming back. Aish and Acres are handy foot soldiers but a significant drop off from Hill and Langdon. Freo do have a handy draft hand at the pointy end with two top 10 picks and enough cover with 22 to match a bid on Henry if/when a bid in the teens comes through. Could get tricky if a bid comes before 10 though. The rebuild is 4 years and counting

•Geelong
In - Steven, Jenkins plus picks 14,24,2020 1st(WC) & 3rd(GC)
Out - Kelly, Smith plus picks 57,2020 3rd
Draft - 14,17,24,36,93
Lost the best player of the trade period but got a handy raft of draft picks in return. Jenkins was gifted to them but it’s hard to see where he fits in a forwardline that already has Hawkins and Ratagulea. Steven is low risk/high reward and will be a more than capable replacement for Kelly in the short term if he can get back to his best although that’s far from guaranteed. Four picks inside the first 40 plus our 2020 first is a decent start on rejuvenating an aging list. I hate to admit but they’ve made the best of a bad situation with Kelly wanting out

•Gold Coast
In - Ellis, Greenwood, Smith plus picks 2020 2nd & 4th (Bris)
Out - Achee plus picks 58,2020 3rd & 4th
Draft - 1,2,15,20,78,90
Cut their nose off to spite their face by not agreeing to a trade for Martin and will now likely lose him for donuts which will keep Dew fed for a day or two. Ellis and Greenwood were good mature bodied pickups as free agents but losing Achee for a couple of future picks is just more evidence of a failed development system. Get another good draft hand thanks to being shit and the AFL’s generosity. Best news for them was extending Kings contract. Hopefully this reboot works but I doubt it.

•GWS
In - Jacobs plus picks 6,40,59,2020 3rd(NM)
Out - Bonar, Patton, Tomlinson plus picks 12,18,2020 4th
Draft - 6,40,59,60,80,94
The revolving door of high draft picks to Victorian clubs continues unabated but this time not much came back. Pick 6 leaves them in a tricky spot as it’s likely a bid comes on their academy prospect (Greene) before then especially with Sydney holds pick 5. May have been better off holding 12 and 18 rather than trading up for 6. Not a great trade period to be honest and their draft cache isn’t great

•Hawthorn
In - Frost, Patton plus picks 42,54,63
Out - Birchall, Pittonet plus picks 50, 2020 2nd
Draft - 11,30,42,54,63,87,92
Another year another bargain buy from GWS and another premiership star out the door for a bag of chips. Frost is handy and Patton could be a master stroke or a bust depending on his recovery. Picks 11,30 and 42 is something half decent to take to the draft. Hawthorn are in danger of treading water where they’re competitive but fall short of genuinely contending

•Melbourne
In - Langdon, Tomlinson plus picks 8,2020 2nd (Haw) & 4th (Freo)
Out - Frost plus picks 22,42,61,79,2020 1st, 2nd & 4th
Draft - 3,8
Get a couple of handy mids, another top 10 pick to go with pick 3 but then walk away from anything else meaningful in the draft as well as trading out their future first. If you take the view that Melbourne are a good side that had a poor 2019 then they’ve positioned themselves pretty well to top up their list. However, if you think that 2018 was the aberration and their list needs serious work then the two inclusions won’t make a huge difference and they’ll need to absolutely nail those two picks because they don’t get another crack until Fremantles 2020 2nd rounder

•North Melbourne
In - Bonar plus picks 26,50,2020 1st & 4th(Melb)
Out - Picks 8, 2020 3rd
Draft - 26,27,47,50,73,84
Fair to say they don’t rate the top end of this draft preferring to trade out their first pick (8) for Melbourne future 1st plus a 2nd & 3rd round this year. Got a Bonar for the equivalent of a second hand playboy mag which may prove a steal. Will be joining HoneyBadger35 as he death rides the demons in 2020

•Port Adelaide
In - 12,18,2020 3rd (StK), 4th(GWS)
Out - Howard, Ryder, Frampton plus picks 10,2020 4th
Draft - 12,18,29,66,67,68,71,86
Split 10 into 12 and 18 which is good business until you consider that they also traded out Howard and Ryder along with it. Now Ryder is kinda cooked but Howard has shown a fair bit so understandably Port fans are livid. Another club in limbo - haven’t improved their list and traded away a good talent for marginal draft gains

•Richmond
In - Picks 39,56
Out - Ellis, Butler
Draft - 19,38,39,41,56,75,77,95
Lost a bit of depth but when you have arguably the deepest list in the comp it doesn’t really hurt especially when players like Stack and Pickett were brought in last year for less than nothing. Get a couple of half decent cracks in the draft to roll the dice. Sometimes less is more and Richmond didn’t need to do anything other than keep the gang together which by and large they have

•St Kilda
In - Hill, Jones, Howard, Ryder, Butler plus picks 51,2020 4ths (PA and Syd)
Out - Steven, Acres, Bruce plus picks 6,59,76, 2020 2nd, 3rd & 4th
Draft - 51,76,82
The busiest club this trade period and most popular pick as the winner of trade week. Fair play to the Saints - they identified players to target and (eventually) got the deals done including the tricky task of prying a contracted Hill away from a reluctant Fremantle. Hill is a star, Jones a more than handy outside runner to pair him with, Howard an exciting KPP talent and Butler a capable small forward. Ryder might be useful but he struggled at Port. All in all a decent haul and somewhat easy to see why they’ve been handed the ubiquitous title of trade week champions, until you look at the other side of the ledger. Pick 6 is gone and they’re the last club to enter this years draft with pick 51, they do have their 2020 first in tact but then skip to a pair of fourth rounders attached to port and Sydney. Also departing is Bruce who I rate as a more than capable 2nd tall forward who can take a grab and an under utilised Acres. Then we come to the subject of Jack Steven. He was a non-event in 2019 due to his mental health issues but prior to that he was a gun - Victorian draft commentary has lauded Wells as a genius for replacing Kelly with Steven on the cheap which may be true, but if it is you then have to mark down the Saints for allowing him to walk for virtually nothing. Like us St Kilda have traded out of this years draft and a sizeable chunk of next years. Unlike us they haven’t been able to retain players which negates the value of those they’ve acquired. In my opinion they’ve had the most over rated trade week

•Sydney
In - Taylor plus picks 32,76,2020 3rd(Freo)
Out - Jones, Cameron plus picks 54,62,63,2020 4th
Draft - 5,25,32,44,81
Widely criticised for not landing Daniher which to my mind is unfair. Essendon, as is their wont, attached a hefty price to their contracted player and in reality Sydney were right to walk away. Pick 5 & 9 had they got that pick from Carlton for Papley was overs for a injury prone forward regardless of his undoubted talent, as were the players Essendon were asking for in lieu of draft picks. And if you’re going to pat Essendon on the back for refusing to trade Joe then you need to do the same to Sydney for retaining Papley. Jones is a loss partly offset by the acquisition of Taylor but they go to the draft with 3 picks inside 32 so this trade period isn’t the disaster for Sydney some would have you believe

•Bulldogs
In - Bruce, Keath plus pick 2020 3rd(Adel)
Out - 32,45,51,2020 2nd
Draft - 13,53,89
My choice as winner of trade week for what it’s worth. Brought in a couple of solid KPPs to bookend one of the best midfields in the comp. Addressed a weakness whilst retaining their first round pick this year and next, instead giving up a handful of mid-range draft picks for two mature bodied players that are instantly best 22. Very tidy work from the bullies that could set them up for a real crack next year

I did warn you that it was a long post and if you’ve skipped to the end then

TLDR - we bossed trade week and the rest sucked.

Up the bloody coasters

I don’t mind the Adelaide trades those players won’t impact on the best 22 and are just role fillers when required .. Good opportunity for Adelaide to rejuvenate the list under a new coach..


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[mattyc75]

The question mark for the Cats is do their older players still have what it takes or will age catch up to them
Stanley 30
Touhey 31
Ablett 36
Taylor 34
Jenkins 31
Steven 30
Selwood 32
Duncan 29
Rohan 29
Henderson 31
Hawkins 32
Dangerfield 30
Blicavs 29

With the exception of Henderson you are looking at 12 of your best 22 being 29+ next year. Time's running out very quickly for them IMO

Yep i understand that,thats why the draft picks are important.and they didnt have to use much to get steven. Sure they lost kelly,a huge loss but he was only going to help for the next 2 years while all their oldies are still there ,but theyd be hoping to make those extra picks count

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[bl4ke]

Started AFL 9's at Cockburn ARC last night. I don't know what's worse, AFL 9's or having to go to Cockburn FC to play. Both suck pretty damn bad.

 

[Spange]

I'm probably in the minority but i dont think geelong have lost too much for next year. Steven will go some way to filling the gap left by kelly and jenkins will split time between the forward line and ruck,both needs for the cats.
They also really strengthened their draft hand for the next 2 drafts which will help rejuvenate their aging list

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Good to have the two talls in the forward line as well in Josh and that other big lug who pushes people in the back all the time and has funny cat eyes.

They will stretch some defences with that combo

 

[Spange]

Do think Adelaide and Port both offloaded their ruck division to have a fair crack at Grundy.
Would be great to see Grundy at the Crows but I can't see Eddie everywhere letting him go. I reckon he will bust a nut to try and keep him at the pies on long term deal.

 

[Obeanie1]

Can’t see those draftees lasting to mid 30’s , Sharp was a AA this year ..


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I was thinking the Hawks pick 30. They will lose this on their FS bid anyway so may chase points.

We the Cats 2020 3rd to get a 2019 3rd. Pick 46 plus another 3rd to the Hawks for pick 30.

It would take a lot of luck but one of Rivers or Sharp slides to 30.

Pick 30 worth 629 pooints.

Pick 46 is 331.

So we need to get a 3rd around 43 to 52 to make it worth while for the Hawks. The Cats 2020 3rd may be enough depending on what NGA kids they have next year.

We won't be the only club chasing the Hawks pick 30.

 

[Keys]

Not a lot we didn’t know - Kelly’s a gun and was virtually our sole priority in the trade period, wanted to improve our draft position a little with the move to pick 46, expect pick 91 to move up 15 or 20 places as other clubs pass on picks late in the draft

Did refer to 91 being our last pick which indicates us going into the draft with only 2 live picks and I assume Watson being upgraded as our mandatory 3rd draft pick. Means at least 2 of Mallen, Mutimer and Brayshaw need to be moved on

What caught my attention was at 1.38, Vozzo referred to multiple rookie draft selections which doesn’t bode well for Brooksby and Smith

 

[Scotland]

Isn't Smith already on the main list?

 

[Obeanie1]

The question mark for the Cats is do their older players still have what it takes or will age catch up to them
Stanley 30
Touhey 31
Ablett 36
Taylor 34
Jenkins 31
Steven 30
Selwood 32
Duncan 29
Rohan 29
Henderson 31
Hawkins 32
Dangerfield 30
Blicavs 29

With the exception of Henderson you are looking at 12 of your best 22 being 29+ next year. Time's running out very quickly for them IMO

Image of the Cats next Mad Monday after going out in 1st week of finals 2020.

 

[Keys]

I'm probably in the minority but i dont think geelong have lost too much for next year. Steven will go some way to filling the gap left by kelly and jenkins will split time between the forward line and ruck,both needs for the cats.
They also really strengthened their draft hand for the next 2 drafts which will help rejuvenate their aging list

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Depends entirely on which Jack Steven rocks up - the four time B&F winner or the overweight headcase

If it’s the former then it’s a big win for Geelong given the draft bounty they received but the latter leaves them exposed having lost a line breaking mid that hit the scoreboard consistently

I quite like Steven as a player so for his sake I hope he does well but that is at odds with my want to see Geelong suck

 

[Keys]

Isn't Smith already on the main list?

Nope. Rookie list on a one year deal