Society/Culture Amazon is evil

[Dry Rot]

4 Corners

Series 2020 Amazon: What They Know About Us
Amazon is a corporate colossus that dominates the global retail landscape, but it also collects a staggering amount of personal data about its customers. Former high-level insiders reveal how the company achieved its success.

Four Corners

Four Corners is the home of Australian investigative journalism. These fearless and forensic documentaries expose scandals, trigger inquiries, fire debate and confront taboos.

iview.abc.net.au

**** knows why you would allow an Alexa in your home

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

**** knows why you would allow an Alexa in your home

This is why.

 

[Seeds]

4 Corners

Series 2020 Amazon: What They Know About Us
Amazon is a corporate colossus that dominates the global retail landscape, but it also collects a staggering amount of personal data about its customers. Former high-level insiders reveal how the company achieved its success.

Four Corners

Four Corners is the home of Australian investigative journalism. These fearless and forensic documentaries expose scandals, trigger inquiries, fire debate and confront taboos.

iview.abc.net.au

**** knows why you would allow an Alexa in your home

If you dont have plans to be a criminal then why would you care about having alexa in your home? What is the downside? Well targetted advertising is a good thing for the consumer.

 

[Dry Rot]

If you dont have plans to be a criminal then why would you care about having alexa in your home? What is the downside? Well targetted advertising is a good thing for the consumer.

So you have no cares about your privacy?

And such data is never misused or requested by govts?

 

[ShanDog]

Can't remember where I saw it, but someone summed up the quandary associated with data collection, online services and advertising really well. I wouldn't be doing it justice, but basically they said we all want our cheap services and/or free streaming, so we reluctantly accept advertising. But the advertising is annoying and ineffective unless it's targeted which requires data collection. We want privacy, but faced with the alternatives of paying more for services or randomised advertising, we'd rather they collect data. Then when we find out how much is collected we get mad, until someone points out what would happen if it was banned.

 

[its free real estate]

Can't remember where I saw it, but someone summed up the quandary associated with data collection, online services and advertising really well. I wouldn't be doing it justice, but basically they said we all want our cheap services and/or free streaming, so we reluctantly accept advertising. But the advertising is annoying and ineffective unless it's targeted which requires data collection. We want privacy, but faced with the alternatives of paying more for services or randomised advertising, we'd rather they collect data. Then when we find out how much is collected we get mad, until someone points out what would happen if it was banned.

This justification is bullshit. The reason they use targeted advertising is it has higher conversion rates. But it is still annoying to see dozens of ads for the thing you’ve already bought.

 

[ShanDog]

This justification is bullshit. The reason they use targeted advertising is it has higher conversion rates. But it is still annoying to see dozens of ads for the thing you’ve already bought.

It's not really bullshit. If the ads weren't able to be targeted, the advertisers wouldn't get their return on investment as you've mentioned. If that's the case, they won't invest as much and content creators etc wouldn't have that revenue stream, so it would flow on to the consumer.

 

[Gethelred]

Can't remember where I saw it, but someone summed up the quandary associated with data collection, online services and advertising really well. I wouldn't be doing it justice, but basically they said we all want our cheap services and/or free streaming, so we reluctantly accept advertising. But the advertising is annoying and ineffective unless it's targeted which requires data collection. We want privacy, but faced with the alternatives of paying more for services or randomised advertising, we'd rather they collect data. Then when we find out how much is collected we get mad, until someone points out what would happen if it was banned.

Or, we're not offered the content we wish to see without the ads which are ubiquitous now, and thus we don't get the option to reject both the ads and the spying if we want to see the content.

Let me put it this way; I watch a channel on Youtube, Geek and Sundry. I have never signed up to Youtube, and were there viable options other than Youtube that this channel posted on - ones that, for example, I had to pay a subscription for to keep them from collecting information about me and/or didn't force me to watch ads before the video - I would watch that content on that other format. I do not like Youtube, because they collect data for advertising companies, and they inundate the videos from this channel - which go for a period of hours - with ads littered at strategic spots throughout.

I suppose you could then respond that without the low entry cost of something like Youtube for producers, niche interests (like the one I'm discussing) would never have been produced or distributed. But with the internet being the way it is, that is not a viable argument.

It's usually the marketers who try to justify stealing the information people don't try to hide. Just because I left my mail in the letterbox doesn't mean I want you looking at it.

 

[its free real estate]

It's not really bullshit. If the ads weren't able to be targeted, the advertisers wouldn't get their return on investment as you've mentioned. If that's the case, they won't invest as much and content creators etc wouldn't have that revenue stream, so it would flow on to the consumer.

It’s not because we choose services with targeted ads and find randomised ads any more annoying. The metrics gathered are used to fuel marketing campaigns and display ads on other platforms. Eg Google might know I visit Bigfooty and then display ads on another site to do with footy related products. At no point am I choosing to use either website on the basis of the ads I am shown.

 

[Seeds]

So you have no cares about your privacy?

And such data is never misused or requested by govts?

How would it be misused by government in a way that I would care about if I dont plan on being a criminal?

i like targeted advertising. Its much more useful and less annoying than randomised advertising. As a former public servant the greatest impediment to making good policy is poor data. Things like alexa and satellites are game changes in terms of collecting data that can help society.

 

[Ok Boomer]

I think this issue is well done this list for reasons why Amazon is evil, but it is still a good point nonetheless.

 

[Seeds]

Its ironic that we are claiming amazon may be evil for alexa when our government is openly considering something worse. Mandatory tracking devices that can be used to penalise us for accidently breaking ridiculous unclear social distancing laws. Alexa can be turned off when we want. Mandatory tracking laws cant.

 

[Dry Rot]

How would it be misused by government in a way that I would care about if I dont plan on being a criminal?

i like targeted advertising. Its much more useful and less annoying than randomised advertising. As a former public servant the greatest impediment to making good policy is poor data. Things like alexa and satellites are game changes in terms of collecting data that can help society.

Do you work for the Chinese Communist Party govt? Sounds like you are a Social Credit kind of guy.

 

[Seeds]

Do you work for the Chinese Communist Party govt? Sounds like you are a Social Credit kind of guy.

Nope i despise the social credit system. Its everything im against. Now can you answer the question? You started this thread. Surely you actually have a reason for it.

 

[Dry Rot]

Nope i despise the social credit system. Its everything im against. Now can you answer the question? You started this thread. Surely you actually have a reason for it.

You mean this question? How would it be misused by government in a way that I would care about if I dont plan on being a criminal?

One example - check out what happened with the UK version of MyHealth.

Another - check out what happened with the Dutch census, I don't trust that govt tomorrow will be like govt today.

And frankly, whatever I do is nobody else's business, unless I break the law.

 

[Dry Rot]

Looks like you missed bit of of news about Facebook and Cambridge Analytica.

 

[Seeds]

You mean this question? How would it be misused by government in a way that I would care about if I dont plan on being a criminal?

One example - check out what happened with the UK version of MyHealth.

Another - check out what happened with the Dutch census, I don't trust that govt tomorrow will be like govt today.

And frankly, whatever I do is nobody else's business, unless I break the law.

Ok i googled both those things and got nothing. Can you tell me what happened?

 

[Leeda]

scam.. scam... scam... they are all crawling over me.. I can't get out from under them.. shush because they might hear me..

don't let them trap me... god you are all missing the point.. I do all the time... but then I get the point... yay for me..

 

[Seeds]

Looks like you missed bit of of news about Facebook and Cambridge Analytica.

hardly concerning. my facebook is flooded with russian propoganda from all the baby boomers I know anyway.

 

[Seeds]

The greatest risks on the internet is someone stealing your money, tracking where you are all the time and someone stealing your identity.

using automated processes to target advertising and propoganda is not high on the list.

 

[Dry Rot]

Ok i googled both those things and got nothing. Can you tell me what happened?

My Health Record privacy framework 'identical' to failed UK scheme, expert says
Naaman ZhouSun 22 Jul 2018 06.00 AEST

Care.data was cancelled because drug and insurance companies were able to buy patient data

My Health Record privacy framework 'identical' to failed UK scheme, expert says

Care.data was cancelled because drug and insurance companies were able to buy patient data

www.theguardian.com

The dark side of census collections

The dark side of census collections - ABC listen

This year may have been a disaster for the reputation of the Australian census, but this kind of population survey has a long history of controversy. Rear Vision looks back on how censuses have been used and misused in modern times.

www.abc.net.au

Podcast:

https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/rearvision/the-misuse-of-census-data/7785358

 

[Gigantic]

I have nothing to hide is a stupid argument.

Why even have curtains on your windows to your bathroom if you've got nothing to hide?

Alexa could be listening to a whole raft of things. Imagine "them" listening in on you quarreling with your spouse about financial difficulties? Then all of a sudden you're being pinged higher interest rates or mortgage broker isn't willing to offer you a lower rate... or your health insurance company starts charging you a higher premium. Third party selling of data is common practice for monopolies and it'd be idiotic to think that Amazon, of all companies, wouldn't be doing it.

Can't remember where I saw it, but someone summed up the quandary associated with data collection, online services and advertising really well. I wouldn't be doing it justice, but basically they said we all want our cheap services and/or free streaming, so we reluctantly accept advertising. But the advertising is annoying and ineffective unless it's targeted which requires data collection. We want privacy, but faced with the alternatives of paying more for services or randomised advertising, we'd rather they collect data. Then when we find out how much is collected we get mad, until someone points out what would happen if it was banned.

The privacy paradox. We care about privacy and are against giving away our data... but oh look, 20% discount if we hand over our email address, DOB and post code. Sign me up!

 

[Gigantic]

How would it be misused by government in a way that I would care about if I dont plan on being a criminal?

i like targeted advertising. Its much more useful and less annoying than randomised advertising. As a former public servant the greatest impediment to making good policy is poor data. Things like alexa and satellites are game changes in terms of collecting data that can help society.

It could also be mishandled, where they aren't doing enough to properly protect our data.

See this:

Two data points enough to spot you in open transport records

University of Melbourne researchers have re-identified themselves and others in supposedly anonymous Myki datasets - highlighting a risk to privacy and safety.

pursuit.unimelb.edu.au

The did not apply adequate de-identification to the data and as a result it became easier for re-identification of individuals. Now imagine that the wrong person was able to re-identify someone's whereabouts, location, the station they get off...

 

[Andre]

Can't remember where I saw it, but someone summed up the quandary associated with data collection, online services and advertising really well. I wouldn't be doing it justice, but basically they said we all want our cheap services and/or free streaming, so we reluctantly accept advertising. But the advertising is annoying and ineffective unless it's targeted which requires data collection. We want privacy, but faced with the alternatives of paying more for services or randomised advertising, we'd rather they collect data. Then when we find out how much is collected we get mad, until someone points out what would happen if it was banned.

It's the implicit bargain of free services like Facebook, Google, Youtube (if not subscribed) etc. You get it for no upfront cost, you pay for it by information about you. The only issue IMO is people need to have it more clearly stated when joining this is the bargain. Then if you don't want your information collated then don't use the services. Saying 'I want it free! But no sharing either!' is wishful thinking. Pick your poison, share or don't use. Just don't whinge excessively those are the only two options, nothing is free.

 

[its free real estate]

It's the implicit bargain of free services like Facebook, Google, Youtube (if not subscribed) etc. You get it for no upfront cost, you pay for it by information about you. The only issue IMO is people need to have it more clearly stated when joining this is the bargain. Then if you don't want your information collated then don't use the services. Saying 'I want it free! But no sharing either!' is wishful thinking. Pick your poison, share or don't use. Just don't whinge excessively those are the only two options, nothing is free.

These services track you even if you never use them.