Angus Graham

[Barnzy]

Good thread. Would read again.

 

[Tigerland]

I have asked this question before but no one seems to know.
Last week Lade was on AW and said last year he was Ruck/Stoppage coach and this year he is Midfield coach with a “small” involvement in the ruck.
Question is- If that’s the case, then who is responsible for the majority of our ruck coaching?

___________________________________

Not sure if you're talking about the same interview but I heard Lade before the game on 3aw. Only caught some of it but he certainly spoke like a ruck coach and was questioned about what he expected from Graham against the dogs. Laide replied that Graham should at least provide a contest and even beat Hudson.

As for him being dropped...

I'm glad that Browne gets his chance and I believe Angus had to step aside but there's not much joy in it.

After all I am a Richmond supporter and admire every player that puts on the jumper. I use the forum to vent frustration and some players cop it when they don't perform. (I doubt the players read too much of it, if any at all)

I hope Angus improves, I would rather he teared up the competition and showed signs he was going to be the number 1 choice every week - but with my limited knowledge of what I see on a TV screen from another state -I just can't see it happening.

Although I got it wrong with Nahas and to a lesser extent King.

I'd be glady proven wrong again.

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

He didn't really leave selectors much choice unfortunately.

 

[Bazzar]

___________________________________

Not sure if you're talking about the same interview but I heard Lade before the game on 3aw. Only caught some of it but he certainly spoke like a ruck coach and was questioned about what he expected from Graham against the dogs. Laide replied that Graham should at least provide a contest and even beat Hudson.

Yep, same interview. Thats what puzzled me when he said "he was Ruck/Stoppage coach and this year he is Midfield coach with a “small” involvement in the ruck." Strange.

 

[TOOs_Finest]

Good thread. Would read again.

All 22 pages?

 

[Dr Awkward]

*Sits back and awaits the avalanche of posts, saying its about time*

It's about freakin time. Very happy with our ins/outs this week.

Good luck Browne

 

[Azzleberry]

I'm willing to call it early...Browne is not the answer. Believe it or not he is more of an uncoordinated tall then Gus is... Let's see what he can dish up on saturday night.

 

[_RT_]

I'm willing to call it early...Browne is not the answer. Believe it or not he is more of an uncoordinated tall then Gus is... Let's see what he can dish up on saturday night.

Just like Gus I'm quite prepared to give Browne a good run before passing judgement or forming an opinion.

 

[peejay]

Just like Gus I'm quite prepared to give Browne a good run before passing judgement or forming an opinion.

I would be surprised if Browne makes it to 50 games. I have seen a bit of him in the two's and looks like a slow 70's style ruckman.

Having said that he is a good size and has to be on the list for at least two more years -seeing as we have put two years into him already.

 

[santa claws]

People are too harsh on this guy. Take a look at the AA ruckmen for the last decade or so, you'l see a trend. The trend being that the majority are 25+, with many getting AA as the later 26,27,28 year olds. Occasionally there has been a 24 year old. Perhaps once or twice a 23 year old.

Take Jamar for example, only really come into his own in the last year or two, at about 26 years old.

Graham will be considered a pretty good ruckman by the time he's that age.

why is this always thrown up when we talk about graham.

if anyone takes a look they will see jamar is very much an exception rather than a rule. hes the only one who has done little before his aa selection.

all australians
2000 - king 22yo
2001/2002 - primus - 26yo but won a b/f at age 21 at fitzroy and a r/u b/f at pa in 97
2003 - gardiner 24 yo and well and truly proven top notch before this.
2004 - white 27yo was r/u b/f as a 23yo.
2005 - cox 24yo 3rd b/f in 03 just his third season.
2006 - lade 30yo was a very good player for a long time.significant chunk of his career was played as a forward
2007 - cox/lade
2008 - cox/ sandilands 26 yo but was the dominant ruckman in the comp at age 24.
2009 - sandilands.
2010 - sandilands/ jamar 27 yo and the exception the only ruckman who had done little or lacked consistency over a period to get a gig.

what im saying is aa just does not happen most had shown plenty in previous seasons before getting a guernsey.these blokes didnt just suddenly click at 25 plus they proved themselves to be very good players before aa selection.

angus graham at age 24 has shown little unlike most of those mentioned who were winning club b/f or having exceptional seasons before the age of 24.
its a nonsense to even mention graham and all australian in the same breath.
at 24 hes struggling to keep his spot on the list. if we had just one other half decent ruckman in our system he would not get a game.

 

[Rayzorwire]

if we had just one other half decent ruckman in our system he would not get a game.

As an avid compiler of hilarious santa backflips, I feel obliged to point out that we must already have a "half decent ruckman" in our system, because santa told us all in no uncertain terms after the draft how much better than all three of Graham, Browne and Vickery a bloke by the name of Derickx was. Had watched him plenty of times in person, had all the tools, going to walk into the job.

So he's gone from our no.1 ruckman, to santa quickly adjusting his opinion following reports that Graham was beating him comfortably at training, and now we have another adjustment where he's not even a "half decent ruckman" anymore...all without santa actually seeing him play a game since he watched him live in the WAFL!

I think we're overdue for another 10,000 word, zero punctuation rundown of what an immensely talented, scrupulously honest judge of a player you are santa.

 

[TOOs_Finest]

As an avid compiler of hilarious santa backflips, I feel obliged to point out that we must already have a "half decent ruckman" in our system, because santa told us all in no uncertain terms after the draft how much better than all three of Graham, Browne and Vickery a bloke by the name of Derickx was. Had watched him plenty of times in person, had all the tools, going to walk into the job.

So he's gone from our no.1 ruckman, to santa quickly adjusting his opinion following reports that Graham was beating him comfortably at training, and now we have another adjustment where he's not even a "half decent ruckman" anymore...all without santa actually seeing him play a game since he watched him live in the WAFL!

I think we're overdue for another 10,000 word, zero punctuation rundown of what an immensely talented, scrupulously honest judge of a player you are santa.

In santa's defense, don't think I've seen so many full-stops and paragraphs in a santa post before

Good to see you back santa

If we are to beat the Bummers, I think we should get santa pished, and send him over to the their board for a good ol' gloating, and the ensuing red card

 

[santa claws]

As an avid compiler of hilarious santa backflips, I feel obliged to point out that we must already have a "half decent ruckman" in our system, because santa told us all in no uncertain terms after the draft how much better than all three of Graham, Browne and Vickery a bloke by the name of Derickx was. Had watched him plenty of times in person, had all the tools, going to walk into the job.

So he's gone from our no.1 ruckman, to santa quickly adjusting his opinion following reports that Graham was beating him comfortably at training, and now we have another adjustment where he's not even a "half decent ruckman" anymore...all without santa actually seeing him play a game since he watched him live in the WAFL!

I think we're overdue for another 10,000 word, zero punctuation rundown of what an immensely talented, scrupulously honest judge of a player you are santa.

keep having shots its funny you might just post something sensible one of these days something worth replying to.

just remember if you want to deal in false hoods and twist things to suit just expect the same in return if one can be bothered. now run along and annoy someone who gives a **** about what you have to say.

its clear you still cant stick to facts and still like to twist things to suit. most certainly not worth the time and effort to reply back to im annoyed that im, even posting this. nope ignoring nincompoops like you is the way to go something ive done recently to now.
anyway post away you have free reign as you have had for awhile. personally i cant be bothered with your dribble.

seems the club thinks graham hasnt been to flash hot like some of us here have said now that cant be too good for your ego proven wrong again. you keep backing em in rasor its a sure guide to who we should delist.

was derickx worth taking a punt on is he worth having a look at most certainly. dont believe ive said any different. is he an established afl player well even you can answer that one correctly.he can be no worse than that superstar of yours graham, but hey im not going to justify why i said we should look at derickx or take a punt on him people can look that up and judge for themselves.

 

[santa claws]

In santa's defense, don't think I've seen so many full-stops and paragraphs in a santa post before

Good to see you back santa

If we are to beat the Bummers, I think we should get santa pished, and send him over to the their board for a good ol' gloating, and the ensuing red card

nope not back at all. this post is in reply to you the one before just felt rasor has been takiing cheap shots forawhile now. just felt it was time to have a go back.

he knows ive been ignoring his posting so decides to have a go when theres no comeback.

will have the odd post here and there but in the main im not wanted around here by posters and mods alike. they only want to hear the feel good stuff and every player we have is a star. oh well cest la vie.
my original post on this thread was to give an alternative to what i percieve misconceptions about aa ruckmen.

 

[_RT_]

Can we stick to discussing the topic and leave the pot shots out of posts?

 

[DoItForCaptBlood]

It would seem all the people on here that have had 'concerns' on Graham and whether he is at the level or not would feel vindicated with his dropping. His shortfallings are obviously overlooked by his supporters.

As Tigers, we all want to see him come on and compete at an acceptable level. All the stats getting thrown around in here showing how he is in the league's better player's has obviously been overlooked by the coaching staff.

Certainly like all of the people in here who are expecting more, I hope he does go back to Coburg for a few weeks and improve in the areas he has deficiencies...and yes, he does have a few! Watching him and Hudson run around together must have been the wake up call for the selection panel...chalk and cheese!!

 

[richoatthedisco]

I would be surprised if Browne makes it to 50 games. I have seen a bit of him in the two's and looks like a slow 70's style ruckman.

Having said that he is a good size and has to be on the list for at least two more years -seeing as we have put two years into him already.

Browne's legs may be slow but his mind is quick. Footballer.

 

[Rayzorwire]

...just remember if you want to deal in false hoods...

...its clear you still cant stick to facts and still like to twist things to suit.

This old chestnut again santa? You still forget forums have a search function?

By way of example and seeing you're determined to once again question my honesty, let's take a look at your 'B team' for 2011:

B: Grimes * - Thursfield - Webberley.
HB: Batchelor * - Mcguane - Orielly*.
C: Nason - Contin* - Edwards*.
HF: Taylor* - Miller - Macdonald*.
F: Vickery* - Griffiths* - Helbig*.
R: Graham - Jackson - King.
Int: Rance* - White - Nahas ***** .

* denotes some games in seniors for experience.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=19731661&postcount=1

Ouch santa, just ouch.

Jackson, King, Nahas, White, Webberley and Graham to never play seniors in 2011. Derickx our first ruck - a 'ready to go replacement for Graham' as you go on to state later in the same thread. I could go on, but it speaks pretty loudly for itself really.

seems the club thinks graham hasnt been to flash hot like some of us here have said now that cant be too good for your ego proven wrong again.

The fact I've defended Graham for holding his own under very difficult circumstances and said at the beginning of the year he's our best ruck option puts me on the same page as the coaching staff - and you on another page altogether, as no better illustrated than in your side above and in mine and other people's suggestions to you that it might be a bit unrealistic to expect Derickx to walk into AFL as a senior ruckman.

If Browne can perform somewhere near as well as Graham has then he'll be doing an amazing job from a similarly low launching point and I'll be very interested to see how he's improved. At this point I think it's obvious to most that Graham's shown more and has clearly earned a spot on the list.

you keep backing em in rasor its a sure guide to who we should delist.

We've disagreed most over recent years about the respective abilities of Jackson, King, Vickery and Graham...suffice to say I'm 4-0 at this stage plus all the others in the past, so it might be a good idea to retire that tired old line?

 

[Bazzar]

A lot of good ol fashioned Angus trash talk here. Those who have the hatred for the bloke are rapt he is out and all “assume” he was dropped because of his last two weeks form. What I would ask them is, do they have 100% proof that was the case or are they just “making it up” Making it up is my guess. None of us know any details of the meticulous plan that was put in place for the year. We second guess everything.

Hardwick said 2 weeks back that the season is in blocks of four games, and this Essendon game is the start of the 3rd block. No wonder the main changes as in Browne and Tuck were bought in. Not drastic, but enough to change our structure.

Gus has been a tireless workhorse who for 8 games shouldered the load of 2 because of the new sub rule. No wonder he was given a spell. Im wondering if Browne will be given 4 or 8 games (if form warrants) and the Number 1 ruck will be decided for the remaining blocks of games.

 

[Azzleberry]

Just like Gus I'm quite prepared to give Browne a good run before passing judgement or forming an opinion.

I've seen a fair bit of him at Junior level and also VFL level (plus the few games in the AFL) and don't think he will ever be good enough. However, I am willing to give him time to develop and think he should be retained on the list for another year at least and set milestones for him to achieve for a new contract.

I would be surprised if Browne makes it to 50 games. I have seen a bit of him in the two's and looks like a slow 70's style ruckman.
Having said that he is a good size and has to be on the list for at least two more years -seeing as we have put two years into him already.

My thoughts exactly.. Looks like an old style lumbering rukman, not a mobile, agile new age ruckman. Good luck to him tomorrow night, will need it being up against 3 quality ruckman..

Browne's legs may be slow but his mind is quick. Footballer.

Don't see it personally.

Gus has been a tireless workhorse who for 8 games shouldered the load of 2 because of the new sub rule. No wonder he was given a spell. Im wondering if Browne will be given 4 or 8 games (if form warrants) and the Number 1 ruck will be decided for the remaining blocks of games.

No surprise that Browne's chance comes 2 games before the Bye. Will give Gussy a good rest after solid rucking in his first 8 games. We don't want him overworked and dieing towards the end of the season with full body cramps (like last year). Browne in for 2 games and then the Bye, gives Gus a 3 week break to recover and get ready for the second half of the year...

 

[_RT_]

I've seen a fair bit of him at Junior level and also VFL level (plus the few games in the AFL) and don't think he will ever be good enough. However, I am willing to give him time to develop and think he should be retained on the list for another year at least and set milestones for him to achieve for a new contract.

Wasn't having a go at you so please don't think that I was. Given his size easily worth keeping around for a year or 2 before we go making a call about him.

 

[Tigermad2011]

Gud unlucky to be dropped.

 

[Azzleberry]

Wasn't having a go at you so please don't think that I was. Given his size easily worth keeping around for a year or 2 before we go making a call about him.

Understand that you weren't having a crack at me, just two differing opinions, which is fine.
I honestly hope that Browne becomes a very good ruckman, however, I just can't see him ever getting ahead of Gus or Vicks..

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

...any truth in the rumour that graham got retired to the resies because of a foot injury that restricted him in his jumping against the doggies?!?!......

 

[Rustof]

Why would he be playing in the ressies if he's injured?