Are we clean now? Is everybody else?

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Okay Blues fans, take a look inside the dark recesses of your mind and tell us honestly, do you think Carlton have any more salary cap skeletons in their closet?

If you think there might be more, are we the only ones with something to hide or are there other clubs sweating on AFL inaction?

If you think we are now clean, do you think that because of our cleanout that we might very well be the only club with a clean slate in the competition?

Very interested in the 'gut feel' of the average Blues supporter. If you actually post your answer as well as using the poll, I will edit out the inevitable attempts by some visitors to sway the votes.

 

[James]

We are now the only clean club in the comp.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Are we clean now?.

Can anyone provide evidence Carlton is NOW clean?.

 

[Bee]

Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
Can anyone provide evidence Carlton is NOW clean?.

Can you provide evidence that Essendon are? Once, twice, four times a cheat, so why can't you be five times a cheat? Show us the proof that Essendon are clean skins!

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
Can anyone provide evidence Carlton is NOW clean?.

Last time I checked the AFL had to provide evidence that a club wasn't clean, not the other way around. As it stands on face value, everybody is clean until proven otherwise thus my call for a 'gut feeling' summation from Blues supporters. As you can tell, all eventualities have been allowed for. It is not binding, just a question. Relax and scoot off back to your own board.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
Last time I checked the AFL had to provide evidence that a club wasn't clean, not the other way around. As it stands on face value, everybody is clean until proven otherwise thus my call for a 'gut feeling' summation from Blues supporters. As you can tell, all eventualities have been allowed for. It is not binding, just a question. Relax and scoot off back to your own board.

ODN.
I was just asking a question seeking information from Carlton supporters about this subject.Last time i checked i'm ALLOWED to do that.
PS-Did any Carlton poster here see my REASONS for disliking Fevola and why i think he should have done Jail Time?.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by Bee
Can you provide evidence that Essendon are? Once, twice, four times a cheat, so why can't you be five times a cheat? Show us the proof that Essendon are clean skins!

For that you look in the Papers,NOBODY challenges our committee or administration about our payments to players like Whitnall or Fraser Brown. Well not in the last year or 2 anyway.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Re: Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
ODN.
I was just asking a question seeking information from Carlton supporters about this subject.Last time i checked i'm ALLOWED to do that.

You must have checked with the wrong person then!

Once again, how can anyone produce evidence that we are clean? If we say we are does that make it true? If you say we are not, does that make that true? Oh I know ..... 'mirror mirror on the wall, who's the cleanest club of all?' ................. 'Relax Blues fans, you know it's true, there's no cleaner club than you. Freo's gone and the Saints are sus, the Bombers accountant just caught a bus.'

Happy with that? No? Well what sort of proof do you want? Except for speculation, what sort of proof do you have that we aren't clean?

PS-Did any Carlton poster here see my REASONS for disliking Fevola and why i think he should have done Jail Time?.

Umm ... no ... relevance?

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Re: Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
For that you look in the Papers,NOBODY challenges our committee or administration about our payments to players like Whitnall or Fraser Brown. Well not in the last year or 2 anyway.

Of course nobody challenges you about that ... Whitnall and Brown don't play for the Bombers!!!!

So in essence you are saying that if the media speculate, then it is true? You believe everything you read in the papers? Can we expect that next time the papers print something bad about Essendon, you will take it as gospel and phone the club to express your anger?

btw What is the Whitnall speculation? Is there any? Don't read the Melbourne papers so maybe somebody can enlighten me.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Are we Clean?

ODN.
1-On what basis do u assert i'm NOT allowed to ask Carlton Supporters for Information on claims they make?.I m sure u ask posters in other boards questionis.
2-Is it just speculation that u are asserting Carlton is "clean"?.
3- No direct relevance,i was just asking.Mainly because i suspect it may have been removed,i got a little Emotional typing it.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
Of course nobody challenges you about that ... Whitnall and Brown don't play for the Bombers!!!!

So in essence you are saying that if the media speculate, then it is true? You believe everything you read in the papers? Can we expect that next time the papers print something bad about Essendon, you will take it as gospel and phone the club to express your anger?

btw What is the Whitnall speculation? Is there any? Don't read the Melbourne papers so maybe somebody can enlighten me.

1- NO,i Meant that people dont challenge the'Dons committee on payments to Hird or Alesio[not there is speculation on that].BUt the Carlton administration is questioned on those matters.
2-Not at all.
3-No Whitnall speculaton,perhaps i meant Silvagni or other players.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Re: Are we Clean?

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
ODN.
1-On what basis do u assert i'm NOT allowed to ask Carlton Supporters for Information on claims they make?.I m sure u ask posters in other boards questionis.

On the basis that I asked Blues supporters for their thoughts on a Blues forum and you asked a stupid question. I rarely go on to team boards and resist the temptation to make a mockery out of their fans thoughts when I do. After all, that is what the main board is for.

2-Is it just speculation that u are asserting Carlton is "clean"?.

Absolutely, which would account for me asking for people's 'thoughts' and being interested in their 'gut feeling' on the subject instead of asking for facts or evidence. Must read the opening post to get the intent of the thread.

3- No direct relevance,i was just asking.Mainly because i suspect it may have been removed,i got a little Emotional typing it.

Can't remember to tell the truth. I have removed a few things here and there. Post it again and if I don't like it, I will remove it and you will have your answer!!

 

[hotpie]

Where's the option for

"We have cleaned our act up. We should concentrate on our own issues not those of other clubs, and move on from this episode, and not waste time on what we cannot control"

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
1- NO,i Meant that people dont challenge the'Dons committee on payments to Hird or Alesio[not there is speculation on that].BUt the Carlton administration is questioned on those matters.

Yes ... I knew what you meant. People challenged Essendon about the proposed 100k payment to Lloyd for his domain name though. Of course it is all speculation but does than make it true? Your call.

2-Not at all.

Yet you contend that we are not as clean as Essendon because the media speculate? In this case you are taking the media speculation as being accurate because it is not your own team they are talking about. We are just flavour of the month/year at the moment.

3-No Whitnall speculaton,perhaps i meant Silvagni or other players.

Perhaps ... but a good example of how speculation gets started. Silvagni's case has been dealt with and we have been penalised. We have been cleared of any breach involving Brown. We have also been penalised for Bradley, O'Reilly and Allan. All issues that have been speculated by the all knowing media have been addressed and seen through to their completion as far as the Carlton Football Club's involvement is concerned. If those media speculations are all you are going on and ALL have been addressed, then we are in fact by your own criteria ... clean.

Thanks for coming. If nothing else you have provided this board with some much needed activity. Much appreciated.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Originally posted by hotpie
Where's the option for

"We have cleaned our act up. We should concentrate on our own issues not those of other clubs, and move on from this episode, and not waste time on what we cannot control"

LOL, ooh I know this one.

It was right underneath the option "I really should concentrate on my own clubs issues instead of being concerned whether Carlton fans are moving on or not."

Really hotpie, next time you speculate on which position a Magpie player should be playing in, are you guilty on wasting time on something you can not control? Maybe everybody on here should only talk about whether they are going to the game or not and how they will get there as that is probably the only aspect of the day that they have control over?

Discussion about salary cap breaches is as relevant now as it was in November. There is still speculation on the main board from opposition players. Every time somebody answers a valid Carlton thread with an accusation about what we may have paid Kernahan or Williams, the issue remains current. Why is it that Carlton fans are the only ones not allowed to discuss salary cap breaches for fear of being accused of not moving on? How is it that we are not moving on? We are talking about new players, positions, game plans, practice matches, how many games we expect to win .. etc etc ..... feels like moving on to me!

It's all a mute point anyway as this thread wasn't done with the intention of building a case against other teams, it is merely to gauge where the thinking of Blues fans is on the issue as the storm front has appeared to have gone and all of the possible options are there. The question was not slanted to stir up any sour grapes.

 

[Bee]

Re: Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
For that you look in the Papers,NOBODY challenges our committee or administration about our payments to players like Whitnall or Fraser Brown. Well not in the last year or 2 anyway.

Not yet they haven't. But you have the runs on the board, don't you? Been there, done that haven't you? So why should anyone believe you are now clean, huh? Once a cheat always cheat, or is that only applicable to Carlton?
BTW they can 'challenge', as you call it, all they like they still have no proof of any payments to Fraser. Speculation and nothing more! Now run along.

 

[HBF]

My gut feeling is that Carlton is clean, and should not have anymore problems with Salary Cap breaches.

Can't wait for 2003 season proper to start

Go Blues...

 

[Bombers 2003]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Are we clean now?.

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
Yes ... I knew what you meant. People challenged Essendon about the proposed 100k payment to Lloyd for his domain name though. Of course it is all speculation but does than make it true? Your call.

Yet you contend that we are not as clean as Essendon because the media speculate? In this case you are taking the media speculation as being accurate because it is not your own team they are talking about. We are just flavour of the month/year at the moment.

Perhaps ... but a good example of how speculation gets started. Silvagni's case has been dealt with and we have been penalised. We have been cleared of any breach involving Brown. We have also been penalised for Bradley, O'Reilly and Allan. All issues that have been speculated by the all knowing media have been addressed and seen through to their completion as far as the Carlton Football Club's involvement is concerned. If those media speculations are all you are going on and ALL have been addressed, then we are in fact by your own criteria ... clean.

Thanks for coming. If nothing else you have provided this board with some much needed activity. Much appreciated.

3-On the statement on Speculation,i agree 100%.I'm not really aware of what u say on Bradley,O'Reilly or Allan has having been finished with.I assume the Allan matter STILL has to be dealt with by the AFL "Investigator".or has it been dealt with?.And isnt there matters to be dealt with concerning the JDE board before the courts?.I'm not talking about the AWB matter,which isnt concerned with JDE's football activities.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Carlton have received a 50k suspended fine for the Allan case and Allan has received a 10k fine and a suspension for a month. It is complete as are the others.

Any enquiry into the Elliott board is news to me but if so, it no longer involves the Carlton Football Club.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
Carlton have received a 50k suspended fine for the Allan case and Allan has received a 10k fine and a suspension for a month. It is complete as are the others.

Any enquiry into the Elliott board is news to me but if so, it no longer involves the Carlton Football Club.

Thanks for the Information.

 

[Marissa16]

I am not going to answer the poll, but I just wanna voice my opinion and that is... Just because of what a few people behind Carlton, eg John Elliot... Doesn't mean we are all cheats. Everybody at my website say that Carlton are now their most hated club, because of this and cos they are all cheats, which is bull****, the supporters and the majority of players had nothing to do with it. John Elliot was the one behind it and I agree he is a tool.

 

[Bee]

Originally posted by Marissa16
Everybody at my website say that Carlton are now their most hated club, because of this and cos they are all cheats,

That's nothing new. We've always been the most hated club, long before we became 'cheats'. Who cares if they hate us?

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

The level of hate is incredible though Bee. Goes to show how many were afraid to show that hate when we were a power as they knew we would probably humiliate them in response. Doesn't take a hero to have a kick once you are already bound and gagged does it?

 

[BlueMark]

Carlton are currently clean of any salary cap breaches. We await the outcome of the audits into the other clubs. Although the line the AFL will take is borne out by the fact the AFL dropped the Freo Fabian Francis case like a hot rock. Re other matters before the courts, Adrain Whitehead and last years fitness adviser have stated an intent to sue for negligence re injury and wrongful dismissalrespectively. Both should be settled out of court. Any creditor issues have been resolved in a manner that all parties are happy with. The Carlton Football Club maybe down but are far from out. So those who wish to put the boots in, do so at thier peril.

Cheers
BM