Austin or Bower?

[gbatman]

Just thought I would ask a question, would you prefer Austin or Bower in the side assuming Jamison is not injured or O'hAilpin replaces Jamison nicely?

Bower I really rate but he's not very strong or very physical. He's a half back flanker who hopes to be a key position player one day and I think he will be but he's not there yet. He had a poor game against Brisbane, fumbled a lot then got moved onto Bradshaw who exploited him very well. Probably needs confidence which might be gained at VFL level where he will be able to get more posessions you would think.

One thing he does do wrong is play his opponent from behind. He must start playing them from in front and perhaps this is a confidence thing or something he needs to learn to do. With the hands in the back rule and the skill and pace of some key forwards it's necessary to try and be in front. He gets behind when the balls on the ground and gets beaten for it too often.

Austin I hear gets a lot of posessions for a defender in the VFL and rebounds well out of defence with great kicking, similar to the way Waite does for us I would imagine. He's bigger and stronger than Bower and probably a bit better kick, especially at low passing which is something Bower is not great at.
When ever we have given Austin a go in the seniors he's played on really good players like Roughead which is a bit tough for a beginner. Perhaps playing Bowers role (pocket/flank) Austin could be very good.
And if we did lose a key defender, which will remail likely when Jammo is playing, we would rater have Austin as the backup ahead of Bower as a key defender.

On the other hand Bower has done good jobs on big forwards before like Cloke so it's a tough one. Perhaps Bower can lift and improve his game. It's just tough now in the Carlton side, if players aren't playing good they might get dropped if someone is pushing hard for selection.

Any way I was just thinking of playing Austin instead of Bower on the Half back flank instead of throwing Austin to the wolves like we have.

Thoughts?

 

[diesel1]

Thought Bower was poor, as soon as I seen Jamo sitting on the bench I knew we were going to be in trouble with Bower sitting on Bradshaw. His body isn't up to it. Yes, he has put some upper strength but his bottom half are like match sticks. Players generate more power through the bottom half.

I'd like to see Austin given a go, since there has been a hint of improvement from last year. Sentanta should come in

Outs: Johnson, Bower, Jamo
Ins: Grigg, Stevens, Sentanta

 

[Bluebear]

Can anyone name me 4 players strong enough to go toe to toe with Bradshaw?

Bower was great until he got moved out of position. He isn't a full back. Neither is Aussie, to to base this discussion on "if Jammo is fine or Setanta goes well", but then to go on about how he got mauled by Bradshaw is a bit silly.

Bradshaw is one of the strongest forwards in the game and uses his upper body better than most. He has also just had his first uninterrupted pre-season for some time. With the rate the ball was coming in and the space he was given in the 3rd Q, even Jammo might have struggled to hold him goaless.

Its no coincidence that our defenders started to look bad when our midfield intensity dropped off and they got some easy ball into their forward line.

Anyway, Bower vs Austin. ATM Bower, but that's purely because Aussie hasn't has an extended run at it. Bower looked a lot like Aussie in his first half dozen games or so........LOST and incapable of playing at senior level.

Bower has progressed, and you need only reflect back to his job on Franklin in round 22 last year to know he is coming along fine.

This week will be a big test as he will have to play tall and small at different times througout the game.

 

[Blue since 72]

I've been waiting awhile now to see Austin regularly in the ones but it hasn't happened so I'm putting my faith in the match committee who I assume don't think he is ready for whatever reason (love to hear from anyone who might know why). Have time for Bower who does a good job generally (ie job on Frankland last season). Hopefully there is more development to come from him.

 

[gbatman]

well just wondering if Austin would be better at that half back flank/pocket role that Bower normally plays. I have nothing against the job Bower did on Bradshaw appart he positioned behind him all the time. It was Bower's fumbling and ball handling that worried me. You have to be so clean with the hands, especially in defence. Bower's a good kick but when he has to kick the ball low it's a problem.

He did do a job on Franklin last season. Just hope he can improve his skills from the round 2 game.

Just I hear Austin's skills are very good and he looks stronger than Bower.

 

[jonoman89]

Bower - he was played at full back on the weekend against a miss matched opponent. Don't read too much into it. He has a good spoil on him, good pace, and is great on the rebound. Potential CHB without a doubt, or a very good 3rd tall.

Austin seems like a pure stopper, a traditional CHB. Problem with that is you need to be very strong, and he doesn't have a big enough frame yet. It will come.

I would line up like this while Jamo is out:

FB: Joseph Thornton Armfield

HB: Waite Bower Johnson

Interchange defender: O'hAilpin

 

[BluesMan]

Id rather bower, but that is only a bias opinion because i havnt seen much of austin. Yet i think bower has good potenical and good run of the backline which helps us alot!

 

[Korn]

Between those two I would pick Bower based on more senior games experience, but both really have a lot of work to do in order to improve. Bower is very weak, he needs another 10kg of muscles.

 

[Dustyjackman]

I'm looking forward to seeing our new British full back Austin Bowers.

Oh, be-have.

 

[blue gunslinger]

All Austin needs is self confidence
All Bower needs is weights
Eventually both along with Jamo will rule our defence. All 3 pure quality!

 

[Silvagnis]

Both.

Austin can play forward and back.

 

[blue gunslinger]

General for a reason

 

[thylacine60]

I'm looking forward to seeing our new British full back Austin Bowers.

Oh, be-have.

Needs acknowledgement.

 

[The Grover]

I'm disappointed Bower hasn't put on any weight, I think he has been just average this season including NAb cup.

Real shame Bombers got Hurley, apparently we might have still taken Yarran (this would've been madness).

 

[gbatman]

Stone Cold Mark Austin I think will need some VFL form to stop Bower collecting Blues games. But is there room for the 2? Maby next year...

 

[Dustyjackman]

Needs acknowledgement.

Cheers.

 

[Beloved]

Definitely Paul Bower. He's shown that when in his most comfortable position, he's able to take advantage of the space and hit targets as well as throw in some good spoils.

I think that Aussie still has a bit to go.

 

[Jeremias]

Bower is a fair way in front of Austin at the moment and he is most definitely in our best 22.

Austin still has a fair way to go but we know that and will give him the time he needs to grow and develop.

I would have thought this week would have been a perfect opportunity to give Aussie some time in the seniors but unfortunately has been injured over the past few weeks and will need the run in the Bullants. If he was not injured I would think that he would have been selected to play against Essendon on Saturday night ahead of Setanta.

People need to remember last year when Austin was brilliant for a stretch of games in the Bullants and was really pushing for senior selection. He's not quite best 22 material just yet but we need to give him a few games in a row so that he can grow in confidence and self belief, to challenge himself to show us that he belongs in the senior team.

I am interested to see what plans the senior coaches have for Aussie. He has shown that he has ability to play at either end of the ground in key positions so could eventually be a very valuable player for us. I'd love to see him in the seniors for a few games as a tall forward.

 

[choo]

Bower is a fair way in front of Austin at the moment and he is most definitely in our best 22.

Austin still has a fair way to go but we know that and will give him the time he needs to grow and develop.quote]

Bower>>>>>>>>>Daylight>>>>>>>>>>Austin

2008 Bower v T Cloke remember

p.s. Bradshaw CAN play

 

[chimpreo]

theres absolutely no comparison. one is a first team regular while the other will definately struggle to get a game when the first team is up and firing.

bower is meant to play on the 3rd or 4th tall. no disrespect to austin but bower is a million miles ahead of him atm

 

[Blue since 72]

I'm looking forward to seeing our new British full back Austin Bowers.

Oh, be-have.

That is gold, thanks for the laugh.

 

[Big Red is back]

Just thought I would ask a question, would you prefer Austin or Bower in the side assuming Jamison is not injured or O'hAilpin replaces Jamison nicely?

Bower I really rate but he's not very strong or very physical. He's a half back flanker who hopes to be a key position player one day and I think he will be but he's not there yet. He had a poor game against Brisbane, fumbled a lot then got moved onto Bradshaw who exploited him very well. Probably needs confidence which might be gained at VFL level where he will be able to get more posessions you would think.

One thing he does do wrong is play his opponent from behind. He must start playing them from in front and perhaps this is a confidence thing or something he needs to learn to do. With the hands in the back rule and the skill and pace of some key forwards it's necessary to try and be in front. He gets behind when the balls on the ground and gets beaten for it too often.

Austin I hear gets a lot of posessions for a defender in the VFL and rebounds well out of defence with great kicking, similar to the way Waite does for us I would imagine. He's bigger and stronger than Bower and probably a bit better kick, especially at low passing which is something Bower is not great at.
When ever we have given Austin a go in the seniors he's played on really good players like Roughead which is a bit tough for a beginner. Perhaps playing Bowers role (pocket/flank) Austin could be very good.
And if we did lose a key defender, which will remail likely when Jammo is playing, we would rater have Austin as the backup ahead of Bower as a key defender.

On the other hand Bower has done good jobs on big forwards before like Cloke so it's a tough one. Perhaps Bower can lift and improve his game. It's just tough now in the Carlton side, if players aren't playing good they might get dropped if someone is pushing hard for selection.

Any way I was just thinking of playing Austin instead of Bower on the Half back flank instead of throwing Austin to the wolves like we have.

Thoughts?

It is not one or the other we need both. Bower must play every game

 

[Gezza125]

Agree Bower is ahead at the moment but I think he was a tad soft at the contest when put under pressure last week.

People say he needs to put on weight and muscle but he looks big enough to me. He's just not prepared or skilled enough to stand his ground in a contest. Or exploit his ability to run off a direct opponent like Waite does.

I don't think these are 100% but from the official player stats:

Bower: 192 cm 92kg
Jamison: 193 cm 93kg
Austin: 193 cm 93kg
Scarlett: 192 cm 94kg. (And he is the benchmark for full-backs)
There's almost nothing between them physically.

All I'm saying is that Bower has not improved significantly in the last 12 months IMHO... but still ahead of Austin.

 

[Seychelles]

why not both? either bower and austin or bower and ohailpin... id rather bower and ohailpin simply because ohailpin will be rareing to go after that incident in the pre-season. i expect a close match. on paper their team looks like crap but they always perform good against our attractive team on paper and on the field.

 

[Seychelles]

2008 Bower v T Cloke remember

p.s. Bradshaw CAN play

True that