Education & Reference Becoming a University Lecturer

[perthblue]

Academics of BigFooty,

I have a question.
Let's say you have a Bach degree in Engineering, and want to eventually end up as a lecturer at a tertiary institution. What is the pathway here? My 10 minutes of Google research has yielded conflicting results.

Is it best to do masters --> doctoral degree ASAP and try and get whichever position at Uni you can?
Or go out and get a lot of varied experience in the industry and then return to Uni to try and be a lecturer?
is a Phd the minimum you need to be a lecturer?
professors, associate professors, what do these terms mean?
is one of those post-grad 'tertiary education teaching' diplomas even necessary?

Thanks,

Yours In Good Faith,
Perthbluey xoxox

 

[Gough]

http://www.instantdegrees.com/

 

[perthblue]

http://www.instantdegrees.com/

I was a bit iffy about it, but then I saw it said '100% legal' and a wave of relief washed over me

 

[Gough]

I was a bit iffy about it, but then I saw it said '100% legal' and a wave of relief washed over me

I actually don't think anything could possibly go wrong if you went down that path. You may as well start sowing those elbow patches on your cardigans now.

 

[Plugger35]

Grow a beard and buy one of those tweed jackets with leather elbow patches, maybe throw in a tobacco pipe for good measure.

Being eccentric should help your chances as well.

 

[Gough]

 

[perthblue]

I assume the academics are busy marking assignments or writing their phd theses.
I will wait patiently.

 

[Gough]

I assume the academics are busy marking assignments or writing their phd theses.
I will wait patiently.

They might be boning the honours student they're supervising.

 

[perthblue]

They might be boning the honours student they're supervising.

that's a perk thats not really enjoyed in Engineering

on second thoughts, maybe those gender quotas ARE a good idea....

 

[Demosthenes]

I am not an academic but I work with / know quite a few (mostly health and hard sciences). I will answer the questions as best I can until someone else shows up.

Is it best to do masters --> doctoral degree ASAP and try and get whichever position at Uni you can?
Or go out and get a lot of varied experience in the industry and then return to Uni to try and be a lecturer?

If you want to progress as an academic, all anyone really cares about is how much grant money you can bring in, which means your research success, which means how much you publish and who you've published with. So the earlier you start the better.

If you just want to teach and don't care much about climbing the greasy pole, then I'm not sure. I know a lot of universities put a higher value on industry experience for vocational courses, so it might actually help you get an entry level job, but it's not something I know much about. Everyone I know did the traditional path.

is a Phd the minimum you need to be a lecturer?

It really depends on the course and what you mean by lecturer. To get a permanent job on the teaching staff at a good uni, yeah, you pretty much need a PhD. However there are things like Postgraduate Fellowships which might involve teaching under supervision of a lecturer whilst completing your thesis. Heck, you can be a tutor for some courses with just an undergraduate degree.

professors, associate professors, what do these terms mean?

They're just employment grades. You start off at assistant lecturer, then lecturer, senior lecturer, associate professor and professor. Generally the higher up the tree you get, the less teaching you actually do - full professors tend to be departmental heads and stuff.

In the health sciences you tend to see a lot of adjunct or cojoint professors who aren't employed by the university. They tend to be prominent professionals who might deliver special lectures or do a bit of specialised teaching on the side. Not sure how common they are in other fields.

is one of those post-grad 'tertiary education teaching' diplomas even necessary?

Nope. None of the academics I know have them. Maybe they'd help if you wanted to do lower-level teaching without doing extensive postgrad study.

 

[perthblue]

I am not an academic but I work with / know quite a few (mostly health and hard sciences). I will answer the questions as best I can until someone else shows up.


If you want to progress as an academic, all anyone really cares about is how much grant money you can bring in, which means your research success, which means how much you publish and who you've published with. So the earlier you start the better.

If you just want to teach and don't care much about climbing the greasy pole, then I'm not sure. I know a lot of universities put a higher value on industry experience for vocational courses, so it might actually help you get an entry level job, but it's not something I know much about. Everyone I know did the traditional path.


It really depends on the course and what you mean by lecturer. To get a permanent job on the teaching staff at a good uni, yeah, you pretty much need a PhD. However there are things like Postgraduate Fellowships which might involve teaching under supervision of a lecturer whilst completing your thesis. Heck, you can be a tutor for some courses with just an undergraduate degree.


They're just employment grades. You start off at assistant lecturer, then lecturer, senior lecturer, associate professor and professor. Generally the higher up the tree you get, the less teaching you actually do - full professors tend to be departmental heads and stuff.

In the health sciences you tend to see a lot of adjunct or cojoint professors who aren't employed by the university. They tend to be prominent professionals who might deliver special lectures or do a bit of specialised teaching on the side. Not sure how common they are in other fields.


Nope. None of the academics I know have them. Maybe they'd help if you wanted to do lower-level teaching without doing extensive postgrad study.

Thanks very much for your informative reply! do people generally jump straight into their postgrad or do they take time off/work for some time before going back to studies?

 

[Demosthenes]

Thanks very much for your informative reply! do people generally jump straight into their postgrad or do they take time off/work for some time before going back to studies?

The friends I've known have generally rolled straight on, mostly because the networking was advantageous. e.g. lecturers give better references when they remember you from last semester's class, if you start your Ph.D after Christmas you can get that part time research assistant job that your honours supervisor has going, that sort of thing.

No idea if that's the norm or not.

 

[mad_monkey_j]

You're going to be doing research for years and even then you'll only get hired based on your publications. I thought about doing it awhile back, but was told "good luck".

professors, associate professors, what do these terms mean?

Those titles are based on the number of articles you have written. Not sure if it's first author or just being listed as an author.

 

[raskolnikov]

I did my Master's thesis with the intention of going into academia but then realised academia isn't all it's cracked up to be so went into school teaching instead. Haven't regretted it at all, though sometimes I'm tempted to do my PhD just for the hell of it.

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

My bro is a PHD student and was a uni tutor for a while, planning to become a lecturer, but took some side steps and now has a killer job editing and submitting grant applications on behalf of professors. $$$$$
I think the key to academia is getting your foot in that PHD door.

 

[Spongebob]

Professor Spongebob is a retired academic. Quite a bit of applied experience before I pursued my PhD.

When I was head of department, I would not allow anyone to be interviewed for a lecturing position if they did not have their PhD. This would allow the staff to supervise research students and apply for a whole range of competitive grants. Some professional areas with external accreditation require a high percentage of the academic staff to have their doctorates.

To get beyond the basic lecturer levels (A, B), most universities will not consider someone without a PhD.

Is experience necessary? Depends on the discipline and the specific area. For engineering, it would be a positive in many lecturing roles. However, if you were in a theoretical area, applied work can be less relevant.

The various levels, associate lecturer (A), lecturer (B), senior lecturer (C), Associate professor (D), professor (E) reflect a variety of achievements, current activities and responsibilities. So, qualifications, experience, course development and management, successful supervision of research students theses, publications, grants, contributions to university/department management, professional engagement, etc.

 

[Rod Stroker]

Let's say you have a Bach degree in Engineering, and want to eventually end up as a lecturer at a tertiary institution.

So you want to live just above the poverty line? A lot of hours to put in on the job for not a commensurate wage.

Sure there's more to life and career than money, but have you considered the financial implications?

 

[Bomberboyokay]

Roll the dean up in a carpet and throw him off a bridge.

 

[perthblue]

Professor Spongebob is a retired academic. Quite a bit of applied experience before I pursued my PhD.

When I was head of department, I would not allow anyone to be interviewed for a lecturing position if they did not have their PhD. This would allow the staff to supervise research students and apply for a whole range of competitive grants. Some professional areas with external accreditation require a high percentage of the academic staff to have their doctorates.

To get beyond the basic lecturer levels (A, B), most universities will not consider someone without a PhD.

Is experience necessary? Depends on the discipline and the specific area. For engineering, it would be a positive in many lecturing roles. However, if you were in a theoretical area, applied work can be less relevant.

The various levels, associate lecturer (A), lecturer (B), senior lecturer (C), Associate professor (D), professor (E) reflect a variety of achievements, current activities and responsibilities. So, qualifications, experience, course development and management, successful supervision of research students theses, publications, grants, contributions to university/department management, professional engagement, etc.

I appreciate this reply, thank you professor! may I ask what field you were in?

 

[perthblue]

So you want to live just above the poverty line? A lot of hours to put in on the job for not a commensurate wage.

Sure there's more to life and career than money, but have you considered the financial implications?

based on just the payscale of this one Uni (http://www.uq.edu.au/current-staff/academic-staff-salaries-1-january-2017) its pretty clear that you have to rise up the ladder a fair bit before you're earning above the average wage. I'm not against being underpaid/overworked for a period of time, I was interested in how realistic/challenging it was to climb the ladder and what you need to do in order to circumcise the time you spend at the bottom.

 

[FootyJunkie]

Grow a beard and buy one of those tweed jackets with leather elbow patches, maybe throw in a tobacco pipe for good measure.

Being eccentric should help your chances as well.

something wrong with his medulla oblongata

 

[sprockets]

My brother was a civil engineering senior lecturer (not sure if he went higher) at UTAS for a decade or so up until deciding to take some time off from the workforce to move to QLD and play drums in a jazz band. He'd previously worked in private business for another decade or so and had tutored and lectured at Monash uni. Yes he had a beard and had smoked a pipe at one stage (dunno about the tweed jacket). He lectured for 10 hours or so a week and did some private stuff on the side (BIG money as an expert witness). From what I can gather, his favourite bit was the overseas jaunts to places like Vietnam recruiting students for his uni. There's big money to be made but the lifestyle can be rewarding so AFAIK he didn't pursue higher qualifications.

 

[Run n Spread]

Academics of BigFooty,

I have a question.
Let's say you have a Bach degree in Engineering, and want to eventually end up as a lecturer at a tertiary institution. What is the pathway here? My 10 minutes of Google research has yielded conflicting results.

Is it best to do masters --> doctoral degree ASAP and try and get whichever position at Uni you can?
Or go out and get a lot of varied experience in the industry and then return to Uni to try and be a lecturer?
is a Phd the minimum you need to be a lecturer?
professors, associate professors, what do these terms mean?
is one of those post-grad 'tertiary education teaching' diplomas even necessary?

Thanks,

Yours In Good Faith,
Perthbluey xoxox

Be a Big Footy Poster but just stand in a room and talk shit instead of posting your wild home spun theories.

In actual fact an academic career is needed. Universities are about research and discovery. So a PHD would be minimum and within your Under Graduate Degreee, Honours or further study you would need to have discovered something significant.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Had a university lecturer who would play pretty bad songs as 'walk-on music' to try and get us prepared like we were just about to see Oasis at Knebworth or something but he'd just go up and try and crack jokes. Would routinely send emails pledging us all to go to the Oxford Scholar to 'meet one another.' At the end of a semester he sent a message saying he'd been terminated and had a go at the uni. Few weeks later when classes resumed I was talking to this girl who was saying how he once sent a private gmail link to a few girls in her class that basically told them his address and an invite to come around for wine and readings... some other chick overheard and asked if it was indeed who we were talking about and she proceeded to tell us how he used to ask bizarre questions to her about her favourite way to relax and her longest relationships.

Anyway one lesson he tried telling us all how tough it was being a lecturer and proceeded to say how he only got four afternoons off a week this year and his pay packet went down to $100,000. Yeah tough gig.

 

[Scotland]

From my experience uni lecturers fell into 3 categories:
- those whose field had no relevance outside academia
- those whose field was relevant but research focus/area of expertise was so narrow and specific they became savants
- those who weren't any good in their chosen field and fell into 'those who can't, teach' careers