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fatoomsch said:
Ouch!
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Just some verbal fencing mate - but I do believe your assessment is as simplistic as you would label mine.

I'm very confident you put Truck back into that backline and it stops looking as fragile as it has at times over the last few weeks.
 
Allefgib said:
Just some verbal fencing mate - but I do believe your assessment is as simplistic as you would label mine.

I'm very confident you put Truck back into that backline and it stops looking as fragile as it has at times over the last few weeks.
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This

The man is a rock. Others get stronger from seeing him there. They walk taller
 
Glenno23 said:
This

The man is a rock. Others get stronger from seeing him there. They walk taller
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Today we saw what happens when Truck aint there. Yep only a scratchie, but his leadership and defensive efforts were not there and our other KPDs struggled a bit.
 
Geoffa32 said:
Today we saw what happens when Truck aint there. Yep only a scratchie, but his leadership and defensive efforts were not there and our other KPDs struggled a bit.
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Did he play last week? I can't remember. We were pretty woeful down back last week too. especially against the Saints
 

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Geoffa32 said:
Today we saw what happens when Truck aint there. Yep only a scratchie, but his leadership and defensive efforts were not there and our other KPDs struggled a bit.
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Once again reinforcing why I rate him as our 2nd most important player - behind Jacobs, but ahead of Thommo, Danger & Walker.
 
Vader said:
Once again reinforcing why I rate him as our 2nd most important player - behind Jacobs, but ahead of Thommo, Danger & Walker.
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Yeah but na.

Ben Rutten is a very important part of our team, only blind Freddy would argue against that. We all saw how vulnerable Ben Rutten (defenders) was as a defender during the 2010 and 2011 season when the midfield isn't as productive as it should. If the ball is coming in real quick, the defender doesn't really stand a chance.

It's also no coincident that Darren Glass had a poor year the year the West Coast bombed out and rebuilt their midfield in 2010

IIRC, the 2010 and 2011, he didn't have the greatest season because we didn't have a very productive or defensively accountable midfield. If the half forward line and the midfield is up and above, applying pressure to how the ball is moved out of our forward line and through the midfield, that will make a defenders job much easier.

IMO the importance of players towards teams success starts with the midfield, then the ruck and then it moves onto either end (forwards and defenders are equally important) of the field.

Therefore, Danger, Thompson and Sloane >> Jacobs >>> Rutten/Talia and Walker/Jenkins. Then the rest will fit in somewhere around that.
 
Truck will be the Rock again this year and the next, then, and only if he wants too, he'll think about hangin' up the boots. Tahlia is heir apparent but not ready by a long shot as shown in the NAB against the saints. If we lose those 2 you can kiss at shot a the title goodbye. Can't understand the lack of love for the big fella, everybody's entitled to have their colors lowered some times, Trucks are lowered less than most!
 
alex_is_on_fire said:
Yeah but na.

Ben Rutten is a very important part of our team, only blind Freddy would argue against that. We all saw how vulnerable Ben Rutten (defenders) was as a defender during the 2010 and 2011 season when the midfield isn't as productive as it should. If the ball is coming in real quick, the defender doesn't really stand a chance.

It's also no coincident that Darren Glass had a poor year the year the West Coast bombed out and rebuilt their midfield in 2010

IIRC, the 2010 and 2011, he didn't have the greatest season because we didn't have a very productive or defensively accountable midfield. If the half forward line and the midfield is up and above, applying pressure to how the ball is moved out of our forward line and through the midfield, that will make a defenders job much easier.

IMO the importance of players towards teams success starts with the midfield, then the ruck and then it moves onto either end (forwards and defenders are equally important) of the field.

Therefore, Danger, Thompson and Sloane >> Jacobs >>> Rutten/Talia and Walker/Jenkins. Then the rest will fit in somewhere around that.
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This is spot on.

Truck is the last line of defence, and you need a good one. But not as much as you need to stem the tide beforehand.
 
Truck25 said:
Truck will be the Rock again this year and the next, then, and only if he wants too, he'll think about hangin' up the boots. Tahlia is heir apparent but not ready by a long shot as shown in the NAB against the saints. If we lose those 2 you can kiss at shot a the title goodbye. Can't understand the lack of love for the big fella, everybody's entitled to have their colors lowered some times, Trucks are lowered less than most!
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I think the last sentence is severely under appreciated.

No defender wins every week; most teams would kill for someone like Rutten - he gets beaten maybe 4 times a year; and when he does get beaten, people act like that's the end of him.
 
I really like Hartigan in the first two NAB and triaql games this year. Has size is relatively quick and is quite football smart. I think will be great defender for us. Will go well against the big guys like Buddy etc. Great pick up for us and in my opinion will be better footballer than Talia already . Has more size, speed and a better kick. Also is not afraid to provide some run
 
Vader said:
Once again reinforcing why I rate him as our 2nd most important player - behind Jacobs, but ahead of Thommo, Danger & Walker.
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This is unpopular but correct.

Rutten is irreplaceable at the minute. One of the top two players we can ill afford to lose, the other being, as you rightly point out, Jacobs.

Rutten's Fremantle and Hawthorn games in last year's finals series were out of this world.
 

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Slippery Pete said:
This is unpopular but correct.

Rutten is irreplaceable at the minute. One of the top two players we can ill afford to lose, the other being, as you rightly point out, Jacobs.

Rutten's Fremantle and Hawthorn games in last year's finals series were out of this world.
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Yeah the Truck dominated the end of season, there was a lot of poor efforts around him.
Not really sure how the OP missed the last half of the seasons form.
 
Slippery Pete said:
This is unpopular but correct.

Rutten is irreplaceable at the minute. One of the top two players we can ill afford to lose, the other being, as you rightly point out, Jacobs.

Rutten's Fremantle and Hawthorn games in last year's finals series were out of this world.
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Hold the papers.. can anyone remember the last time SP and I actually agreed on something? :D

It's not just his ability as a player (though this is important in itself), it's the leadership he provides which is so vital. The last two weeks have shown what our back half looks like without him providing guidance - and the results haven't been pretty.
 
Vader said:
Hold the papers.. can anyone remember the last time SP and I actually agreed on something? :D

It's not just his ability as a player (though this is important in itself), it's the leadership he provides which is so vital. The last two weeks have shown what our back half looks like without him providing guidance - and the results haven't been pretty.
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I liked this post, then retracted it, as it would have made too many people throw up.

We'll have to go back to arguing soon.
 
Vader said:
Hold the papers.. can anyone remember the last time SP and I actually agreed on something? :D

It's not just his ability as a player (though this is important in itself), it's the leadership he provides which is so vital. The last two weeks have shown what our back half looks like without him providing guidance - and the results haven't been pretty.
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Ben Rutten is a very valuable players to us and I'd rather he play for us than against us but the results or the structure of the back half over the past 2 weeks would not have been very different had he played.

I'll repeat it, with our A grade midfield playing, the structure of our defensive unit would have been able to obtain the same sort of result.
 
alex_is_on_fire said:
Ben Rutten is a very valuable players to us and I'd rather he play for us than against us but the results or the structure of the back half over the past 2 weeks would not have been very different had he played.

I'll repeat it, with our A grade midfield playing, the structure of our defensive unit would have been able to obtain the same sort of result.
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It's also worth noting that we weren't the only team playing it's B-grade midfield. With both teams playing their A-teams, our defensive outcome would probably have been similar without Truck's presence.
 
alex_is_on_fire said:
Ben Rutten is a very valuable players to us and I'd rather he play for us than against us but the results or the structure of the back half over the past 2 weeks would not have been very different had he played.

I'll repeat it, with our A grade midfield playing, the structure of our defensive unit would have been able to obtain the same sort of result.
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It's a fair point, but there are days when defensive structure gets broken down, and the result truly comes down to a concentration of one-on-one contests.

Few players in the competition are better defensively in that situation than Rutten.
 

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But that's where you back your A Grade midfield in to win the ball first and then control the tempo of the game.

If our defensive unit was missing a player of Ben Ruttens ability, you would instruct a winger (or player without a half forward) to drop back and help clog up space.

Don't get me wrong, Rutten is a very good player and I rate him very high but I don't feel he is as important as your making out.
 
At this point is probably worth reiterating that the OP wasn't questioning the value of a fully functional Truck for our club (so to speak).

Almost everyone would be in agreement on that.

The question mark is over whether he can play to that level this year.

(ps - welcome back SP)
 
alex_is_on_fire said:
Yeah but na.

Ben Rutten is a very important part of our team, only blind Freddy would argue against that. We all saw how vulnerable Ben Rutten (defenders) was as a defender during the 2010 and 2011 season when the midfield isn't as productive as it should. If the ball is coming in real quick, the defender doesn't really stand a chance.

It's also no coincident that Darren Glass had a poor year the year the West Coast bombed out and rebuilt their midfield in 2010

IIRC, the 2010 and 2011, he didn't have the greatest season because we didn't have a very productive or defensively accountable midfield. If the half forward line and the midfield is up and above, applying pressure to how the ball is moved out of our forward line and through the midfield, that will make a defenders job much easier.

IMO the importance of players towards teams success starts with the midfield, then the ruck and then it moves onto either end (forwards and defenders are equally important) of the field.

Therefore, Danger, Thompson and Sloane >> Jacobs >>> Rutten/Talia and Walker/Jenkins. Then the rest will fit in somewhere around that.
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Terrific post.

Only thing I would argue with is in bold. I think Jacobs as an individual is far more important to us than Danger / Thommo / Sloane. I agree that Midfield is the most important position but looking at our squad - If Jacobs goes down we are f*cked.

We have only 2 fulltime ruckman on our list and Graham cannot hold a candle to Sauce. Next in line are McKernan / Jenkins and then rookie listed Dowdell / Osborn.

If we lose a top tier midfielder - we have far more depth to be able to cover the loss.
 

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