Club History Before the Crows, there was the Redlegs

[GremioPower]

Reading about Port's History, SANFL was dominated by two teams: Port and Norwood. What has happened to the Redlegs? Do they have a strong fan base? Did they lose the train of History or they could become a third SA's AFL team? Can Adelaide support three AFL teams?

Norwood's History intrigued me...

 

[edgie]

Reading about Port's History, SANFL was dominated by two teams: Port and Norwood. What has happened to the Redlegs? Do they have a strong fan base? Did they lose the train of History or they could become a third SA's AFL team? Can Adelaide support three AFL teams?

Norwood's History intrigued me...

Offered to join the VFL with us, some say before us. They didn't take the opportunity. Made a joint bid for the second AFL license in the 90s with Sturt. Was never gonna happen.

Forever SANFULL.

On paper they look like our rivals but reality is most of their success was achieved when Armies still had cavalry divisions.

 

[Andre]

Short version. When Port saw the writing on the wall of the SA based competition and looked to join the expanded Victorian Football League (now AFL), Norwood were our biggest rival. They also had been making enquiries to join, but when our talks leaked, instead of saying they'd support our bid in return for us supporting them as the second SA side, they joined the other SA clubs taking legal action (leading to Adelaide in 1990 instead of us, with us having to wait for 1997).

Their reward for jealousy and cowardice is now they are a dying local only club with bugger all supporters, instead of our SA rival in the AFL. Most of their supporters went to following Adelaide and wouldn't come back. SA can't support three AFL sides, certainly not a Norwood whose supporter demographics overlaps much more with the Crows then Ports. They certainly have gotten everything they deserved.

 

[Steve Dore]

Reading about Port's History, SANFL was dominated by two teams: Port and Norwood. What has happened to the Redlegs? Do they have a strong fan base? Did they lose the train of History or they could become a third SA's AFL team? Can Adelaide support three AFL teams?

Norwood's History intrigued me...

Norwood were approached to join they VFL but whimped out. Ports took up the offer and were blocked by the other SNAFL clubs, including Norwood, which led to the creation of the Crows. Norwood put in a joint bid with some equally irrelevant SNAFL club for the second SA based AFL licence but lost out to Ports so are now destined to be another irrelevant SNAFL club until they eventually fold.

Ports having the first AFL licence and Norwood having the second would have been great but they made their own bed and now are forced to lie in it.

 

[Trewth]

This should be fun

 

[GremioPower]

Offered to join the VFL with us, some say before us. They didn't take the opportunity. Made a joint bid for the second AFL license in the 90s with Sturt. Was never gonna happen.

Forever SANFULL.

On paper they look like our rivals but reality is most of their success was achieved when Armies still had cavalry divisions.

Armies still have Cavalry divisions...
(From a proud Brazilian-Army-Reserve Cavalry Officer :-D )

 

[Steve Dore]

Armies still have Cavalry divisions...
(From a proud Brazilian-Reserve-Army Cavalry Officer :-D )

If the Brazilian Cavalry is like the Australian version you haven't used horses since WWI.

 

[GremioPower]

This should be fun

The answers have been great so far!

 

[GremioPower]

If the Brazilian Cavalry is like the Australian version you haven't used horses since WWI.

View attachment 389312

We still have three horseback Army bases (Brasília, Rio de Janeiro, and Porto Alegre), but they are ceremonial.

 

[SgtSchulz]

Norwood were intent on entering the VFL arguably making more approaches to the league than ourselves. Cowardice when the SA media and establishment twisted the knife in 1990 scared them off.

If they supported our bid in 1990 they would be in. Simples.

Alas now they're just a bunch of fuddie duddies.

 

[Coobk001]

What has happened to the Redlegs?

Hahahahahahahaha I LOVE THIS!

In short - they got what they deserved. They're now irrelevant.

You won't understand why it is funny, but it has to do with our several points of our whole 1990 push to the AFL, the SANFL's rejection of the push, the abandonment of Norwood from our bid to join the AFL, the fact they were our greatest rival pre-91, the initial Crow 91-96 years pre-port, the Redlegs-Sturt bid for the 2nd Adelaide licence in '94/'95, the denial of our history by all Crows fans (particularly Norwood fans), and the on-going SANFL anti-Port sentiment in this state.

 

[GremioPower]

Short version. When Port saw the writing on the wall of the SA based competition and looked to join the expanded Victorian Football League (now AFL), Norwood were our biggest rival. They also had been making enquiries to join, but when our talks leaked, instead of saying they'd support our bid in return for us supporting them as the second SA side, they joined the other SA clubs taking legal action (leading to Adelaide in 1990 instead of us, with us having to wait for 1997).

Their reward for jealousy and cowardice is now they are a dying local only club with bugger all supporters, instead of our SA rival in the AFL. Most of their supporters went to following Adelaide and wouldn't come back. SA can't support three AFL sides, certainly not a Norwood whose supporter demographics overlaps much more with the Crows then Ports. They certainly have gotten everything they deserved.

This is something I don't understand. Clubs didn't want Port to enter VFL, but accepted Crows.

In practice, the result for the SANFL clubs would be the same, whether Adelaide or Port joined VFL: SANFL would become secondary in its own market. By creating a new club from scratch, SANFL teams actually ended up closing the door for them to join the league.

Port eventually got in, but now no other can! Is that right?!

 

[Trewth]

This is something I don't understand. Clubs didn't want Port to enter VFL, but accepted Crows.

In practice, the result for the SANFL clubs would be the same, whether Adelaide or Port joined VFL: SANFL would become secondary in its own market. By creating a new club from scratch, SANFL teams actually ended up closing the door for them to join the league.

Port eventually got in, but now no other can! Is that right?!

You catch on quick. I know lifelong SANFL/Crows supporters who still don't get it haha

 

[Zakk Wylde]

 

[Magpiespower]

 

[1954]

Port Adelaide should have been the first S.A. club to join the AFL and the deadlegs the 2nd , but they blew it by deciding to challenge our bid, and in doing that they condemned themselves to an existence in a feeder league, which is now closer to being a 3rd division competition than the genuinely strong 2nd division it once was.

In my opinion there is no chance of a 3rd AFL club in S.A. at any time in the first half of this century, and there probably isn't much chance of it happening in the 2nd half of it either!

 

[GremioPower]

You catch on quick. I know lifelong SANFL/Crows supporters who still don't get it haha

Then, basically, Adelaide represents SANFL and Port represents itself in the AFL. A third SA team would need to come from scratch, and/or representing a part of Adelaide with strong local identity — if such a place actually exists. Otherwise, AFL cannot expand in SA.

 

[Steve Dore]

We still have three horseback Army bases (Brasília, Rio de Janeiro, and Porto Alegre), but they are ceremonial.

To my knowledge the Australian Defence Force doesn't even have horses for ceremonial purposes. There are mounted people dressed as WWI Light Horsemen at ANZAC day commemorations but I don't believe these are the ADF's horses.



This October it will be the 100th anniversary of what is considered to be the last "great" cavalry charge in history. This was undertaken by Australian Light Horse brigades at the Battle of Beersheba.

Far more interesting that the history of the Norwood Football Club.

 

[Zakk Wylde]

LOL Nord

 

[tribey]

 

[GremioPower]

We still have three horseback Army bases (Brasília, Rio de Janeiro, and Porto Alegre), but they are ceremonial.

To my knowledge the Australian Defence Force doesn't even have horses for ceremonial purposes. There are mounted people dressed as WWI Light Horsemen at ANZAC day commemorations but I don't believe these are the ADF's horses.

View attachment 389325

This October it will be the 100th anniversary of what is considered to be the last "great" cavalry charge in history. This was undertaken by Australian Light Horse brigades at the Battle of Beersheba.

Far more interesting that the history of the Norwood Football Club.

My home state has half of all Brazilian Cavalry bases. Every year, there is a celebration on the first Sunday after the National Cavalry Day (May 10th). Here a pic of the charge (it always gives me goosebumps):

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

GremioPower do Gremio have a team in the national Seire A league and one in the state league of Rio Grande do Sul and/or in the city based league in Porto Alegre?

If they have another team in the state and/or city league, how does that work with respect to movement of players and player contracts? Are the players independent of the national league squad or is it a mix or is it all one club and players can progress thru all grade and teams.

Also if you have teams in state and/or city leagues are their jealousies from those state and/or city league teams that national league players who are paid full time wages play and dont play in the national league team play against part time footballers who get paid smaller wages or almost nothing. Never got my head completely around Brasilian football structure.

 

[Eddie Dingle]

We still have three horseback Army bases (Brasília, Rio de Janeiro, and Porto Alegre), but they are ceremonial.

Much like Norwood FC.

 

[Steve Dore]

This is something I don't understand. Clubs didn't want Port to enter VFL, but accepted Crows.

In practice, the result for the SANFL clubs would be the same, whether Adelaide or Port joined VFL: SANFL would become secondary in its own market. By creating a new club from scratch, SANFL teams actually ended up closing the door for them to join the league.

Port eventually got in, but now no other can! Is that right?!

Arguably if Ports had gone into the AFL in 1991 the effect on the other SNAFL clubs would have been a lot less. Supporters of other SNAFL clubs would not have abandoned their clubs to follow the "state team". The formation of the Crows resulted in the immediate merger of West Torrens and Woodville.

Max Basheer and his cronies formed the Adelaide Football Club in 1986 to enable them to trade in the VFL, later AFL, market place. They intended to enter a state based team but the VFL would not agree to the terms they wanted. Ports' pending entry forced their hand and so as not to miss out of the opportunity to generate revenue from competing in the national competition they entered a team. As part of the deal they had the second SA licence shackled to them and this arrangement almost send the PAFC to the wall.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

GremioPower Norwood are basically the anti-Port. I'm sure you have equivalents in the round ball code you follow. Silvertails vs fibros in the language of NSW rugby league.

This is a historical perspective but basically Norwood represent the privileged of society, the doctors and lawyers of Adelaide. They are based in Adelaide's leafy eastern suburbs where the socio-economic ranking is high and all the attendant benefits of society accrue. Their children all go to college and build their advantage by knowing other members of society's elite.

Port Adelaide on the other hand is the working class embodiment, the blue singlet wearing navvies and the labourers of the docksides who fight and scrap for any advantage.

As you can imagine, these are very basic generalisations and now many children of the Port attend private schools and there are areas of some relative advantage while the Norwood zone has public schools and many troglodytes living in its foothills.

Still, this has always been the historical basis of any discussion of the relative standing of the clubs. Norwood have a rich history of premierships but most of these were won before the 1950s. Before Port's AFL entry and since 1950 Norwood won premierships in 1975, 1978, 1982, 1984. Port during the same time won premierships in 1951 1954, 1955, 1956, 1957, 1958, 1959, 1962, 1963, 1965, 1977, 1979, 1980, 1981, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1992, 1994, 1995 and 1996.

As you can see, Norwood's ongoing claim to be the greatest rival to Port Adelaide is built on shaky foundations. They are certainly Port's most traditional rival both over time and on class basis. But during the 1960s, 70s and 80s they were no more threatening than Sturt, Glenelg and even North Adelaide in patches.

SA football in this period was characterised by a Big 4 (Port, Norwood, Sturt and Glenelg) teams that were consistently in the finals. Port Adelaide experienced the 12 year drought from 1965-77 when the introduction of Woodville and Central District into the sanfl diluted Port's dominance and evened up the distribution of premierships. However, Port Adelaide - as it does - found a way to overcome this disadvantage and built itself back into the fearsome monster that haunted the dreams of all sanfl administrators in 1950s-60s.