Big Cox

[mike123]

So a Chinese table tennis player can be included? Please.

How many ex Chinese table tennis players there on an AFL list?

The point was that he was being compared to Stynes and Pyke.

And?

There maybe some that didn't make. I think we may have had one?

Of course there are ones don't make it, my point was that there are also some that do make it so ruling them out because it is wrong.

 

[Maggie5]

How many ex Chinese table tennis players there on an AFL list?



And?



Of course there are ones don't make it, my point was that there are also some that do make it so ruling them out because it is wrong.

And all I said was that it is too soon to get excited, thats all, then came examples of other international payers that have, which IMO proves little. End.

 

[StillWaiting5689]

anyone who can get white out of the team is worth considering and putting time into. white is a crab who will take us nowhere

 

[pablo disco bar]

Im gonna surprise a few people here..





JUST PLAY HIM

 

[pablo disco bar]

Im gonna surprise a few people here..





JUST PLAY HIM

 

[Obese Arachnid]

The biggest challenge for him is learning to read the play.
Plenty of players who have played the game for their entire life still don't read the play like the naturally gifted do.
Because of this challenge I really cannot see him making a career out of AFL football.
I wish him the best, but Premierships are not built on new to the game athletes.

What is this formula you talk about?

How many flags did teams win before one involved an indigenous player?
How many were won with a high percentage of left footers?
How have you not heard of Jimmy Stynes & Taigh Kenneally or Mike Pyke?
How have you not heard about progress?

History has you in stasis.

EDIT: Use less starch in your shorts.

 

[mike123]

Im gonna surprise a few people here..





JUST PLAY HIM

 

[Jelly Bean]

I like Mason's chances of going past White.

I'd be willing from round one to play Cox ahead of White. He'll put in the work over the Summer and continue his rapid improvement. And both through the ruck and up forward, there are enough signs that I'd be willing to give him games at the appropriate time.

Playing him round 1 in front of White (assuming White has a spot, which I expect he does) would cost us wins.

He is not ready. I think he will be a better player than White in the long run - and hopefully by end of year - but right now he is a long way behind, and he still has development he can get at VFL level before needing him to be dumped straight into AFL.

Patience.

 

[Black_White]

Jim Stynes would say hello.

At the end, it's his challenge, maybe he gets there maybe not.
Because he so tall, he has that one major advantage of specialty.
But like every player, he will he have to go and earn it.

Him Stynes came from a game that has similar attributes to ours. That's why we play the Irish internationally.
Plus he was a lot younger.
I'm sure Cox could be a player in a team without Premiership aspirations. Just like Jim.

 

[1892]

I would have given him a game at the end of last year, but think we need to see how he goes in the nab challenge before considering him for round 1, the 40th list spot or the one opened with Scharenberg's knee.

The preseason games will give him a taste, without gifting a game. If he shows he can handle the step up I'd have first in line for one if the rookie promotions.

 

[Big Bryza]

Who doesn't love a big Cox?

 

[Hva sher a]

I like Mason's chances of going past White.

I'd be willing from round one to play Cox ahead of White. He'll put in the work over the Summer and continue his rapid improvement. And both through the ruck and up forward, there are enough signs that I'd be willing to give him games at the appropriate time.

I presume you're also suggesting that there is only one spot for Grundy or Witts? Am ok with that as the interchange rules will place a greater premium on endurance and mobility around the ground - we certainly can't carry 3 rucks.

Side question - does anyone know Cox's fitness/endurance levels?

 

[Knightmare]

I presume you're also suggesting that there is only one spot for Grundy or Witts? Am ok with that as the interchange rules will place a greater premium on endurance and mobility around the ground - we certainly can't carry 3 rucks.

Side question - does anyone know Cox's fitness/endurance levels?

My hope is Grundy is the lead ruckman with Witts, Cox and Moore fighting it out for that second ruck position. Within that dynamic I'd leave the door open for Moore to be either a pure key forward or a relief ruckman depending on form/team balance/injuries.

My position overall is I see Cox as one of those genuine contenders for a regular senior spot this year the way he is working.

Cox's fitness last season appeared adequate and probably on par with Witts, so fine for AFL play but ideally would be on a higher level. Given the work he is sure to be putting in based on everything we've heard I anticipate Cox will experience substantial growth in his overall game and endurance but it's something next year we'll need to assess, as it's hard to guess exactly how much progress he will make over the offseason without seeing him take the field.

 

[Jelly Bean]

I think Cox will go past Witts by end of this year.

It is a shame we didn't pull the trigger on a Witts trade this year for a first rounder (and then taking Kruezer as FA for that relief ruck role) as I think his value was at the highest at end of year. I think this year he will continue to be the VFL ruckman unless Grundy is injured or rested, and therefore his trade value will drop a bit.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

I think Cox will go past Witts by end of this year.

It is a shame we didn't pull the trigger on a Witts trade this year for a first rounder (and then taking Kruezer as FA for that relief ruck role) as I think his value was at the highest at end of year. I think this year he will continue to be the VFL ruckman unless Grundy is injured or rested, and therefore his trade value will drop a bit.

Krueger would have been a regifted daisy

 

[Apex36]

So a Chinese table tennis player can be included? Please.
The point was that he was being compared to Stynes and Pyke.

You're going off on a Dave-like tangent with the table tennis player bit, and you're better than that, so can we please keep it rational?
Stynes an Pike are both good comparisons. They come from different codes, Pyke in particular had to start from scratch coming from a rugby background, and they both became very good or in Stynes' case, elite players in their own right.
Cox has come from a basketball background, but before playing college ball he grew up playing high grade soccer, similar to Keeffe. Both sports require good special awareness and a natural ability to read the play to play at top levels. Cox's development in the space of 12 months has been astounding. If his rate of development continues I can absolutely see him getting games.

There maybe some that didn't make. I think we may have had one?

Shae Mac?

There are plenty of international recruits who haven't made it, but there also are plenty who have. Cox looks increasingly likely to be in the latter category imo.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Has height.
That is so much an advantage.
And I mean height, he's a giant.
He seems by all accounts to gave great aptitude, work ethic, dedication.
If he goes well we will all benefit greatly.
Exciting to have him

Grundy, Witts, Cox that's some ruck stocks

 

[didaksrightfoot]

I like Mason's chances of going past White.

I'd be willing from round one to play Cox ahead of White. He'll put in the work over the Summer and continue his rapid improvement. And both through the ruck and up forward, there are enough signs that I'd be willing to give him games at the appropriate time.

Round 1?
I think you are seriously underating White and overating Cox.

Cox should be good for some games later in the year, but, from the VFL clips ive seen, (which i admit is limited) no way is he ready now, and no way is he ahead of White in the pecking order.
If Reid is in the backline, then White is the only person i have confidence in to be a consistent contributor in that 2nd tall forward position (even given his limitations). Howe might be able to do it if he plays big for his size, and Moore will hopefully start getting there by the 2nd half of the year - but right now if we want to win games: that spot belongs to White until someone overtakes him... And i dont think Cox will be that guy.
And if we want to use Cox because he's better as the 2nd ruck - then surely Witts trumps him there?

 

[1892]

I think Cox will go past Witts by end of this year.

It is a shame we didn't pull the trigger on a Witts trade this year for a first rounder (and then taking Kruezer as FA for that relief ruck role) as I think his value was at the highest at end of year. I think this year he will continue to be the VFL ruckman unless Grundy is injured or rested, and therefore his trade value will drop a bit.

As a tall Witts' trade value won't drop much, but it could rise significantly. With his height worse case he'll have a good vfl year and we'll also be better placed to see how much he can develop.

Kruezer may have been ok at the right price, but we would have had to pay too much and he'd either take games/development away from Grundy or he'd be a highly paid vfl player.

 

[Jelly Bean]

As a tall Witts' trade value won't drop much, but it could rise significantly. With his height worse case he'll have a good vfl year and we'll also be better placed to see how much he can develop.

Kruezer may have been ok at the right price, but we would have had to pay too much and he'd either take games/development away from Grundy or he'd be a highly paid vfl player.

If he'd be the third tall and relief ruck that would see white banished to the vfl

 

[1892]

Round 1?
I think you are seriously underating White and overating Cox.

Cox should be good for some games later in the year, but, from the VFL clips ive seen, (which i admit is limited) no way is he ready now, and no way is he ahead of White in the pecking order.
If Reid is in the backline, then White is the only person i have confidence in to be a consistent contributor in that 2nd tall forward position (even given his limitations). Howe might be able to do it if he plays big for his size, and Moore will hopefully start getting there by the 2nd half of the year - but right now if we want to win games: that spot belongs to White until someone overtakes him... And i dont think Cox will be that guy.
And if we want to use Cox because he's better as the 2nd ruck - then surely Witts trumps him there?

I'd have Moore as the second tall forward, with very little ruck minutes and not really in the conversation.

The third tall forward/second ruck comes down White, Witts, Cox and Gault.

White vs Witts comes down to whether we want someone who's predominantly forward or someone predominantly ruck.

Cox potentially can fill both roles to a good standard. Currently he looks a better forward than Witts and a better ruck than White. While both are better in their preferred roles I don't think Cox is that far behind and the gap is closing quickly.

It just remains to be seen if he can produce to the same level in the seniors. The preseason games will be a good indicator.

 

[1892]

If he'd be the third tall and relief ruck that would see white banished to the vfl

I see Kruezer more as a number one ruck, someone who plays his best footy spending 80% of the game in the middle.

It's also the same issue with Grundy and Witts and playing them together didn't work last year.

 

[mike123]

And all I said was that it is too soon to get excited, thats all, then came examples of other international payers that have, which IMO proves little. End.

It proves you can't rule him out just yet

 

[didaksrightfoot]

I'd have Moore as the second tall forward, with very little ruck minutes and not really in the conversation.

I agree with Moore not having ruck minutes, but dont agree with him as 2nd tall - because last year showed hes clearly not ready for that yet- which is why I am still convinced that that spot belongs to White (unless Reid is used up forward) until someone steps up to show they are a better option (maybe Howe playing big, maybe Moore in 6 months time).

My forward line would have White as 2nd KPF/2nd ruck, with Moore as 3rd tall F. If Moore is ready to take more responsibility up forward, or if Witts (maybe Cox) becomes a decent combo-Fwd option, then I would drop White - but I dont see either option being better than White at this stage.

 

[1892]

I agree with Moore not having ruck minutes, but dont agree with him as 2nd tall - because last year showed hes clearly not ready for that yet- which is why I am still convinced that that spot belongs to White (unless Reid is used up forward) until someone steps up to show they are a better option (maybe Howe playing big, maybe Moore in 6 months time).

My forward line would have White as 2nd KPF/2nd ruck, with Moore as 3rd tall F. If Moore is ready to take more responsibility up forward, or if Witts (maybe Cox) becomes a decent combo-Fwd option, then I would drop White - but I dont see either option being better than White at this stage.

White certainly has his critics, but his numbers as a fwd/ruck stack up well.

I think some of the criticism is a bit unfair and comes down to a mix of expectation given his athleticism plus team balance and frustration with overhead marking.

With another tall forward in the side and an acceptance that he'll never be a star he wouldn't cop as much flack.

As you say he's in the 22 until someone forces him out.