Biggest trading/drafting stuffups

[BOND 007]

Was debating recently about which club f***ed their trade/draft up the most. It seems to have come down to the Freo in 2001 or the Kangaroos in 2005. Here's a summary.

In 2001, Freo traded picks 1, 20 and 36 to Hawthorn for Croad and McPharlin. Hawthorn used these picks on Hodge, Elstone ? , and Mitchell respectively.
Freo then traded Heath Black to the Saints for pick 17 which they ontraded to Melb for Farmer. After passing through more hands - pick 17 landed with Geelong who took James Kelly.
This left Freo with a solitary pick in the 2001 draft #56 in which they took Medhurst.

Apart from McPharlin, none of the players are left at Freo, and everybody is aware of the exploits of Hodge, Mitchell, Kelly and Medhurst (at pies)


In 2005, Kanga's traded picks 13 and 29 to West Coast for McConnell and pick 18. WC used those picks to select Hurn and McKinley.
Pick 18 was subsequently sent to the Hawks for Hay.
Daniel Motlop went to Port for picks 28 and 46 with pick 28 used by Kanga's on Riggio, whilst pick 46 went to WB to snare Jade Rawlings who also came with pick 43 (used on Swallow)
Pick 45 was used to get the ex Eagle Kasey Green.

Of those only Swallow remains at the club.

Notable players available to Kangas between 18 and their selection of Riggio (#28) include Addison (WB), Ibbotson (Freo) and Bower (Carlton)
whilst players taken between Riggio and Swallow include : Bernie Vince, John Anthony and Robbie Warnock with Alipate Carlisle was taken at #44.

IMO Kanga's "win" and whoever was in charge of recruiting at NMFC must now be wondering "WTF happened".

Is there any other team debacles that are worse than the above examples ?.

 

[jono25]

Richmond passing on Buddy Franklin twice. Richmond's recruiting during the "Wallace Era".

End thread.

 

[coryne]

How about when Unlisted traded Generic Player for Generic 1st rd pick .................




Show who your team is before you have a go at other club's picks ...........

 

[Vader]

This left Freo with a solitary pick in the 2001 draft #56 in which they took Medhurst.

Umm... no. Clubs are required to take a minimum of 3 players in the ND every year, though they recently (as of 2009) changed the rules to allow rookie upgrades to count as draft selections.

In 2001 Freo took 3 players in the ND and passed on one selection (so they could use it in the PSD):
4 - Graham Polak (traded to Richmond, currently delisted but expected to be re-drafted by Richmond in the RD)
52 - Andrew Browne (retired this year)
56 - Paul Medhurst (traded to Collingwood)

 

[JungleMuffin]

Mate, this thread is owned by Fremantle. 1st 2nd and 3rd.

The Des headland deal?
The Chris Tarrant deal?
The Trent Croad deal?
The Andrew McCloud deal?

Somewhere along the line weve managed to Get David Hynes for a 1st rounder? Brendan Fewster for fk knows what.... i mean, seriously, it just doesnt end.

We managed to throw away Jimmy Clement, Peter Bell, Jess Sinclair + god knows how many other pics and players.

In every facet of list management, we have b0rked ourselves over so badly, its beyond belief. Awesomeness Personified.

 

[lyall]

Carlton trading for Stephen O'Reilly

 

[Slattery_20]

A certain coach taking Daniel McAlister at pick 5 over Hudghton would be right up there. Despite a certain coach being assured by all and sundry said player would be there for our 2nd, 3rd and probably 4th round picks.
Said coach being rather keen on the media attention to be gained by coaching the AFL's first Maori. And rather headstrong to boot.

 

[WattsGoodForYou]

The Veale deal.

 

[Hummer]

Freo would be the worst screw up, and hawthorn would be still licking there lips, with the deal they got a premership captain, are norm smith medallist and only to get Croad back for basically nothing and Freo were paying bits of his contract when he did return to the hawks, in all I don’t believe the Hawks would have won last years grand final if this trade was not done so good thinking by the hawks and they should be thanking Freo for helping them out ha

 

[UpTheGuts]

Carlton trading for Stephen O'Reilly

This wins.

Though trading/ drafting for McKernan, Teague, Clarke, Harford, Johnson, Morrell, Mansfield (for the pick used to draft Paul Chapman!!!), Mick Martyn and Callum Chambers also makes my sides hurt!!!

 

[UpTheGuts]

Richmond passing on Buddy Franklin twice. Richmond's recruiting during the "Wallace Era".

End thread.

Should we just forget the Pagan at Carlton era?

Geez he did some doozies...

 

[nurries]

Richmond taking Fiora before Pav

 

[sabre_ac]

Mate, this thread is owned by Fremantle. 1st 2nd and 3rd.

The Des headland deal?
The Chris Tarrant deal?
The Trent Croad deal?
The Andrew McCloud deal?

Somewhere along the line weve managed to Get David Hynes for a 1st rounder? Brendan Fewster for fk knows what.... i mean, seriously, it just doesnt end.

We managed to throw away Jimmy Clement, Peter Bell, Jess Sinclair + god knows how many other pics and players.

In every facet of list management, we have b0rked ourselves over so badly, its beyond belief. Awesomeness Personified.

You have to decide where you sit before you comment...

In terms of the Tarrant/Croad/Headland/J Carr deal's either evaluate them on the draft picks we traded for them OR the players subsequently picked up.

As far as actual value of the draft picks goes...Who we would have taken with that draft pick is up for debate and not necessarily the who was actually taken. However in terms of pure value of the pick number I think we overpaid to some degree in all instances...That said...One look at who the Pies and Port picked up with those draft picks highlights how much of a gamble the whole drafting system is.

Croad deal was an out and out blunder, no doubt about it..Pick 1 should never have been on the table...Hawks good drafting with Mitchell was completely out of our control

J Carr in terms of pick value we overpaid...The fact the power squandered those pick's helps a littler but...But for a slow poor kicking tagger, way too high a price..

Headland was a game breaker we needed, fact he never carried that on at Freo is disapointing but doesn't detract away from why we chased him initially...As far as what we paid I think it was fair.

Tarrant for the draft picks we overpaid after year 1...Currently its certainly evening up.

Overall I wouldn't say our recent track record isn't as bad people make out, draft is allot about chance...Had we kept our picks and drafted well..who knows...

Tambling over Franklin
Fiora over Pavlich

Is allot worse

 

[Silvagnis]

This wins.

Though trading/ drafting for McKernan, Teague, Clarke, Harford, Johnson, Morrell, Mansfield (for the pick used to draft Paul Chapman!!!), Mick Martyn and Callum Chambers also makes my sides hurt!!!

Have you looked in your own backyard?

Specifically the Johnson and Ottens trades.

Why were McKernan, Teague, Clarke, Harford, Johnson, Morrell, Martyn and Chambers bad recruits?

They didn't cost Carlton a good player or a good pick.

The players Carlton traded for them achieved nothing.

 

[Vader]

Though trading/ drafting for McKernan, Teague, Clarke, Harford, Johnson, Morrell, Mansfield (for the pick used to draft Paul Chapman!!!), Mick Martyn and Callum Chambers also makes my sides hurt!!!

Many of those were more or less forced on Carlton, who weren't able to access the deep end of the draft pool at the time due to the salary cap related draft penalties.

They had a lot of older players retiring (the heroes of '99) who had to be replaced. In the end Pagan decided to go down the trading route, given that the draft was more or less closed to him. He was caught between a rock & a hard place.

 

[Monkey King]

Should we just forget the Pagan at Carlton era?

Geez he did some doozies...

A little bit different, with most of these guys being drafted very late and coming cheaply, but hard to disagree in essence. Pagan's renew the list with retreads, while maligning existing players into retirements or trades was one of the reasons we were so shit for so long. A quick look back... Bowyer Martyn McGrath Chambers McCormick Clarke Deluca Harford Ackland Johnson Gallagher McLaren Longmuir Morrell...

Oh my head hurts!

 

[giantsully]

Croad deal was an out and out blunder, no doubt about it..Pick 1 should never have been on the table...Hawks good drafting with Mitchell was completely out of our control

Disagree. Croad and McPharlin have shown themselves to be high quality tall utilities, one of the rarest birds in AFL. All other things being equal (injuries, propensity to fly home etc ignored), most AFL clubs would seriously consider trading pick 1 for two quality versatile talls. Now, in the real world, Freo's magical "anti-Midas" touch ensured it didn't turn out that way, but on the face of it this isn't as bad a deal as everyone makes out.

 

[prattsta]

Disagree. Croad and McPharlin have shown themselves to be high quality tall utilities, one of the rarest birds in AFL. All other things being equal (injuries, propensity to fly home etc ignored), most AFL clubs would seriously consider trading pick 1 for two quality versatile talls. Now, in the real world, Freo's magical "anti-Midas" touch ensured it didn't turn out that way, but on the face of it this isn't as bad a deal as everyone makes out.

If we'd kept Croad, and he'd developed along similar lines it'd look a hell of a lot better. It's the return trade, in which we ended up with Ryley Dunn that makes it an out-and-out disaster. As you say though, initially it wasn't THAT bad.

We were clearly chasing talls in 2001 - highlighted by the Polak selction at #4 to go along with McPharlin and Croad. Those 3, combined with Pavlich and Brown (who was looking promising enough at that point in time) would've secured our spine for the next 8-10 years.

What would it cost to get the equivalent of Croad and McPharlin back then, today?

 

[Moo]

Let's just start this by declaring I am sure if we (Freo) are not the # 1 in trading stuff ups we would have at least 2 in the top 5.

However it all comes down to how you judge these ...we always judge by who is taken by the picks traded - however in reality we never quite know who would of been taken.

Evryone throws up Hodge and Mitchell and says you lost - however popular belief is Freo were strongly considering targeting Polak anyway and felt confident they could effectively still get him at 4.

Also the chances of Sam Mitchell being taken at Freo with such a late pick was highly improbable. I like a lot of other Freo supporters to consider McPharlin as part of that package and he ahs been a very good player for us.

So if we had not traded - who is to say we would not of taken Polak at 1 and Sampi at 4 (we were keen on Samps) ...it helps me sleep at night knowing WC may have got Judd and Del Santo or Bartel if we ahd gone Polly/Sampi .

So in reality unless Freo were taking Judd or Hodge - the cost is low.

In the same manner we get off relatively lightly from opposition supporters with Josh Carr as Port did very little with the draft picks traded ....2004 was a dud year though.

Anyway back on topic worst draft miss is Pavlich by C/Wood-Richmond ...worst trade I'd say Croad simply because trading pick 1 in a strong draft is never a good idea - though I don't think it cost us nearly as much as the BF legend indicates.

It was a gamble and one that did not pay off ...hey at least we still got McPharlin.

 

[UpTheGuts]

A little bit different, with most of these guys being drafted very late and coming cheaply, but hard to disagree in essence. Pagan's renew the list with retreads, while maligning existing players into retirements or trades was one of the reasons we were so shit for so long. A quick look back... Bowyer Martyn McGrath Chambers McCormick Clarke Deluca Harford Ackland Johnson Gallagher McLaren Longmuir Morrell...

Oh my head hurts!

You and I should go to a lunch at a pub.

Take it in turns. 1 beer for each bad drafting choice from our respective clubs in the last decade.

I doubt we'll make it to dinner.

 

[UpTheGuts]

Richmond taking Fiora before Pav

Freo would have done precisely the same.

But, we did, so I guess we wear it

 

[Monkey King]

You and I should go to a lunch at a pub.

Take it in turns. 1 beer for each bad drafting choice from our respective clubs in the last decade.

I doubt we'll make it to dinner.

If we downed each glass successively I reckon we'd be on the tram home before the kids broke from school

 

[Monkey King]

however popular belief is Freo were strongly considering targeting Polak anyway and felt confident they could effectively still get him at 4.

If that's for real then all it does is confirm your club as the worst drafters in history. Still, it doesn't make much sense in the way your terming it. If they were that confident of getting their man at #4, then why wouldn't Freo just get the pick of mids with their first selection anyway and then let Polak fall as anticipated?

 

[Wizard]

Freo would have done precisely the same.

But, we did, so I guess we wear it

No we wouldn't have, we got our midfielder at pick 2.
If we were so desperate for a mid we would have taken one at pick 5 instead of Brown.

 

[Wizard]

If that's for real then all it does is confirm your club as the worst drafters in history. Still, it doesn't make much sense in the way your terming it. If they were that confident of getting their man at #4, then why wouldn't Freo just get the pick of mids with their first selection anyway and then let Polak fall as anticipated?

Word is we wanted Luke Ball at 1 but knew he was going to stay in Vic so then decided to deal pick 1.