Bluemour Discussion Thread IX

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

huh?

It's fair enough that SOS wants to fully bottom out and get access to top end talent but it's a cop out to pretend there was not alternative if we want success.

 

[thylacine60]

we tried plenty of alternatives

 

[The Bighouse]

Yeh I don't get that. That's a massive cop out for me. People thought Richmond had done exactly that.
All he is doing is justifying fully bottoming out because it is his theory of how to rebuild, which is fair enough but it's obviously not the only way

Not really, I assume it’s related to bringing in different types of players whilst not giving up others. We’d be a different team with e.g. Henderson, Gibbs & Tuohy still floating about and some middle tier players brought in vs a longer term view for (hopeful) sustained success.

We wish to push further than our last assembled finals team (as good as the Elim Final was) and be continual finals players.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

we tried plenty of alternatives

For me no teams plan is wrong, it simply comes down to execution. Although I'm fully supportive of our plan and actually fully agree with it, it does worry me when you look at the bottom 4 sides. All have been doing the same thing, some just longer than others.
The Saints I find the most interesting because they were up there with the Hawthorns, Geelongs, Sydneys but took the path of a longer rebuild, no doubt for sustained success.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Not really, I assume it’s related to bringing in different types of players whilst not giving up others. We’d be a different team with e.g. Henderson, Gibbs & Tuohy still floating about and some middle tier players brought in vs a longer term view for (hopeful) sustained success.

We wish to push further than our last assembled finals team (as good as the Elim Final was) and be continual finals players.

In theory i agree 100% but I think teams are showing that maybe you don't have to.

 

[PrinceCharles]

For me no teams plan is wrong, it simply comes down to execution. Although I'm fully supportive of our plan and actually fully agree with it, it does worry me when you look at the bottom 4 sides. All have been doing the same thing, some just longer than others.
The Saints I find the most interesting because they were up there with the Hawthorns, Geelongs, Sydneys but took the path of a longer rebuild, no doubt for sustained success.

The Saints forgot to hire licensed builders for their rebuild.

 

[The Bighouse]

For me no teams plan is wrong, it simply comes down to execution. Although I'm fully supportive of our plan and actually fully agree with it, it does worry me when you look at the bottom 4 sides. All have been doing the same thing, some just longer than others.
The Saints I find the most interesting because they were up there with the Hawthorns, Geelongs, Sydneys but took the path of a longer rebuild, no doubt for sustained success.

STK were ruined by Ross the Boss (see above re: middle tier players and a penchant for playing mature players). At the crossroads again with the players recruited under the rebuild.

Brisbane have been re-loading for a while and are on the right path you’d think. Have got the camaraderie right and a couple of coaches to the wayside to see the light. Academy is helping them out too.

GCFC are just being pillaged with their better cattle and trying to take stock with higher picks but have faltered under the stewardship of Clayton, who has now been replaced along with a clean out of off-field staff. A lot of mistakes up north and too many exits.

It’s been said that the build up is too slow, and further assistance is needed to the bottom clubs to rise again, which I reckon is required to boost the competition’s cellar dwellers.

Common theme with us, GCFC & BL sitting on the bottom rungs.

 

[therubbernub]

The Saints forgot to hire licensed builders for their rebuild.

Doesnt matter HIH will save ya!

 

[bmaurizio]

STK were ruined by Ross the Boss (see above re: middle tier players and a penchant for playing mature players). At the crossroads again with the players recruited under the rebuild.

Brisbane have been re-loading for a while and are on the right path you’d think. Have got the camaraderie right and a couple of coaches to the wayside to see the light. Academy is helping them out too.

GCFC are just being pillaged with their better cattle and trying to take stock with higher picks but have faltered under the stewardship of Clayton, who has now been replaced along with a clean out of off-field staff. A lot of mistakes up north and too many exits.

It’s been said that the build up is too slow, and further assistance is needed to the bottom clubs to rise again, which I reckon is required to boost the competition’s cellar dwellers.

Common theme with us, GCFC & BL sitting on the bottom rungs.

Agree with you, the AFL need to be proactive and develop an active assistance scheme for all bottom teams last 3 or 4 worest will struggle for quite a few years without their input.

 

[The Flying Doormat]

Doesnt matter HIH will save ya!

Rodney Adler says hello.

 

[MitchRobinson12]

Perryman and Setterfield for dogs second rounder *drools*

 

[Wickzki]

Lets hope they have a blues interstate membership also.

Have retained my captains club for all but the one year in which I held an interstate level. Felt wrong giving the Blues less.

 

[Lawrence Angwin]

Yeh I don't get that. That's a massive cop out for me. People thought Richmond had done exactly that.
All he is doing is justifying fully bottoming out because it is his theory of how to rebuild, which is fair enough but it's obviously not the only way

It's not the only way for others, but it was for us. We were so completely devoid of talent 3 years ago. SOS has been outstanding.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Don’t pay the perryman......great song of the 80’s......wait hang on.

Have a mate who’s last name is Derriman, that song gets a run on golf trips a bit...great song to sing a long to

 

[teagueyubeauty]

For me no teams plan is wrong, it simply comes down to execution. Although I'm fully supportive of our plan and actually fully agree with it, it does worry me when you look at the bottom 4 sides. All have been doing the same thing, some just longer than others.
The Saints I find the most interesting because they were up there with the Hawthorns, Geelongs, Sydneys but took the path of a longer rebuild, no doubt for sustained success.

Problem for St.kilda though is they had just as many misses as our own Wayne Hughes with their top 3 round draft choices there was just zero talent coming through...does that ring a bell.

So yes, there are many ways to skin a cat in this game but when you have no underbelly then you need to take drastic action which is what SOS did.

It pains me that Hughes was with us for so long ****ing up draft after draft after draft, and then we went and replaced him with Rogers who at least picked one gem out of the whole debacle.

Richmond used to do the same thing, now they get hits on most first and second rounders when they couldn’t hit the side of a barn door on a selection 10 years ago and before.

Geelong/Hawthorn/Sydney et al find talent in just about every draft so when they take a slide they can top up with free agents and give them time to bring through young talent hence their mini rebuilds are different.

We had a massive opportunity pre GC and GWS coming in and diluting the talent after we’d taken cream for 5 of the preceding 8 years. Completely ****ed it up!!

And then free agency came in and made this rebuild harder than its ever been to get back to the top.

We certainly have cut ourselves off at the knees in more ways than one.

 

[StandByyourMan]

Let's get Perryman too

Saw him at a beach in Sydney about 3 months ago. Huge CFC towel. Possible..

 

[slashin_velvet]

Saw him at a beach in Sydney about 3 months ago. Huge CFC towel. Possible..

I wanted both him and Setterfield in their draft.

Setterfield should be relatively cheap given the Ahern precedent (albeit only one acl, not two). Pick 69 feels like unders for Setterfield. Maybe a future 3rd could get it done?

Perryman deal should match the Kennedy deal. Former pick 14 (Kennedy was 13). Perryman will have been with the Giants for the same amount of time Kennedy was last season. Pick 28 got Kennedy, so Adelaide's 2nd should get it done.

 

[gandaal]

Perryman was the youngest player in his draft. A lot of his peers are running around currently in their first year on a list.

 

[Blue and Blue]

STK were ruined by Ross the Boss (see above re: middle tier players and a penchant for playing mature players). At the crossroads again with the players recruited under the rebuild.

Within a point of the football holy grail is being ruined? and beaten by a team that took even longer after disassembling a grand final side. The way I see it is that they did as good as they could with a list of good recruits and actually that was a slow process of rebuilding in a reasonably similar fashion to us. One big difference is we have a coach that has an attacking ethos (this will become more obvious in the next two seasons I am certain despite the fact they have been learning defence first), wheras Lyon was and is ultra defensive as be all and end all. Hawthorn Geelong Richmond also took a long time to build from low bases. People soon forget or arent aware of the realities of what really happens in the past it seems.

 

[bluebunz]

From his draft bio

Perryman:

Damaging all over the ground.

Elite kick on both sides.

Good decision maker under pressure.

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

The Saints problem is similar to ours. Compromised drafts overplayed with incompetent drafting

 

[harrisendblue]

Have retained my captains club for all but the one year in which I held an interstate level. Felt wrong giving the Blues less.

Now that's what im talking about!
Great effort Wick.

 

[Arr0w]

Within a point of the football holy grail is being ruined? and beaten by a team that took even longer after disassembling a grand final side. The way I see it is that they did as good as they could with a list of good recruits and actually that was a slow process of rebuilding in a reasonably similar fashion to us. One big difference is we have a coach that has an attacking ethos (this will become more obvious in the next two seasons I am certain despite the fact they have been learning defence first), wheras Lyon was and is ultra defensive as be all and end all. Hawthorn Geelong Richmond also took a long time to build from low bases. People soon forget or arent aware of the realities of what really happens in the past it seems.

Yes within a point of the holy grail, yet so focused on that one flag, by bring in a host of players from 2007 that under his watch, decimated the list and still struggling to this day

 

[slashin_velvet]

Yes within a point of the holy grail, yet so focused on that one flag, by bring in a host of players from 2007 that under his watch, decimated the list and still struggling to this day

If it works, he's a hero who brings the saints their first flag in my lifetime.

 

[Blue and Blue]

Yes within a point of the holy grail, yet so focused on that one flag, by bring in a host of players from 2007 that under his watch, decimated the list and still struggling to this day

Not the first coach to be obsessed with winning a flag. Some might say what else is there but yes I agree with what you say in that respect. I hardly think Lyon was a lone hand in what went on though.