Bluemour Discussion Thread XV - Facts Not Welcome

[AceAndy]

Dear Comp,

Get nervous, really nervous.

That is all.

I’m with you stand .


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Possibly 12 months early.

 

[jezza25]

Found his thrills on Strawberry Hills ...

Blueberry

 

[HARKER]

I just think it's time. I am very confident SPS Fisher Dow Walsh O'Brien Kennedy Stocker & Setterfield can all be midfield goal kickers. Almost the final piece in the puzzle for them. Once they start kicking goals you know they are comfortable at this level

I'm confident all those players you mentioned are capable of kicking goals. Even Stocker at this early stage because he's dual-sided.

You can't have everything unfortunately, but I can see us chasing a mid-sized player like Hayward (20y.o. kicked 50 goals in 40 games), Stephenson or Rozee.
We could really do with one of those types along with a Walters, Cameron type.

Easier said than done, but that almost completes us along with a running back and if a quality FA mid comes along.......

 

[ESKIE]

Possibly 12 months early.

Nope

 

[AceAndy]

Nope

Are you thinking we are further away ?

 

[Soapy V]

I'm confident all those players you mentioned are capable of kicking goals. Even Stocker at this early stage because he's dual-sided.

You can't have everything unfortunately, but I can see us chasing a mid-sized player like Hayward (20y.o. kicked 50 goals in 40 games), Stephenson or Rozee.
We could really do with one of those types along with a Walters, Cameron type.

Easier said than done, but that almost completes us along with a running back and if a quality FA mid comes along.......

If SOS can add 3-4 quality players to our list we are ready to step up.

A fit Doc Willo & Pickett would really make a big difference as well

I’m confident Cuningham Gibbons Garlett Polson & Lang can step up which is even better

 

[katmanblue]

I’m with you stand .


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Stand by Stand

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[katmanblue]

Possibly 12 months early.

Early just means you can go again.

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[katmanblue]

If SOS can add 3-4 quality players to our list we are ready to step up.

A fit Doc Willo & Pickett would really make a big difference as well

I’m confident Cuningham Gibbons Garlett Polson & Lang can step up which is even better

Anyone think Lang could be that crumbing forward we need?

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[thylacine60]

he'd wanna impact more on the game for that to occur - was a bit of a goal-kicker at geelong........

 

[The Bighouse]

Anyone think Lang could be that crumbing forward we need?

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Could be - 1st kick as a Blue was just that off memory.

Needs to get over the constant injury out first but has certainly dropped out of the talk as midfield help that we/he were hopeful of filling (but still time).

Living with Crippa & Zac so will feel a little on the outer should those to play to the expected levels this season (AFLX buddies too...). Lift Langy!!!

 

[therubbernub]

Is there anything in Gibbons or Polson that you've seen to suggest they'll be these types, though?
I don't see it but should it come about........it's just great being wrong.

Murphy makes for a clever and dangerous forward. We know that.
SPS is highly talented and could be anything and serve the function of adding pressure along with clever distribution.
I don't see Fisher as being that goal-kicking forward, but do see him as a goal-kicking mid. Obviously I have a very high regard for him.

I just can't buy into the 'if we create enough pressure we'll find a way to kick goals" thing.
I'd much sooner see our smalls leading into the ball and crumbing around the packs, than just chasing others simply to apply pressure.
Pressure is important. Goal-kickers are much more important and we just haven't got them yet.

i dont see why it has to be black and white. you can be a goal kicker but also apply defensive pressure. Kicking goals is more intuitive and innate whereas the pressure aspect can be taught and improved on - especially the fitness side. Thats why I have hopes that Fasolo works out. Weall know he is an intuitve goal kicker , and i am sure we are concentrating on his defensive and fitness aspect. Murphy can kick goals and with his run , can add a lot of defensive pressure, but I see him on the wing this year . Garlett is another possibility.

 

[therubbernub]

I'm confident all those players you mentioned are capable of kicking goals. Even Stocker at this early stage because he's dual-sided.

You can't have everything unfortunately, but I can see us chasing a mid-sized player like Hayward (20y.o. kicked 50 goals in 40 games), Stephenson or Rozee.
We could really do with one of those types along with a Walters, Cameron type.

Easier said than done, but that almost completes us along with a running back and if a quality FA mid comes along.......

Would love hayward

 

[The Bighouse]

Would love hayward

Think we/SOS did back on his draft night.

 

[BJuddy]

Anyone think Lang could be that crumbing forward we need?

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Yes. Kicked a few nice snags this year for us.

Just hope he can get his body right. Reckon he can come good

 

[therubbernub]

Think we/SOS did back on his draft night.

Good to know, i didnt realise. just another example to reinforce the idea of sos's ability to pick them

 

[The Bighouse]

Good to know, i didnt realise. just another example top reinforce the idea of sos's ability to pick them

A type that we’re really yet to pickup, though spoken about requiring hybrids/forwards.
Hoping Finbar can be a different type of forward but may be a little different than expected if he becomes more a KPF prospect vs mid sized marking player with tackling added & smooth skills.

 

[ODNBlue]

I’m with you stand .


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So... You stand by your stand?

 

[mediumsizered]

When we're talking about Polson & Gibbons as having a lot to offer in our forward 50, we may be relying on thinking of a wishful nature rather than of a practical one. Neither are particularly good kicks let alone classy finishers. Polson is also a poor mark for his size, unlike someone like Pickett.

No doubt both try hard and can apply forward pressure but will that 'skill' alone be enough? Can't see it.
All of Richmonds pressure-forwards average around a goal a game and if our pressure forwards can't show something similar, their use may be limited.

But did they always average a goal a game? Castagna certainly didn't in his 1st season, nor did Rioli.

Hoskin-Elliott kicked 18 goals from 22 games in 2017 for Collingwood, yet improved this to 42 goals from 26 games in 2018.

How many of us would have predicted prior to the 1995 season that Pearce was going to kick 52 goals? Or Clape 31 goals (the only season he averaged more than a goal per game)? Or Rice 21 goals (the only full season he averaged a goal per game)?

As generally happens in good teams, average players get lifted by the better players around them & their output can improve quite significantly. It would be interesting to see how Castagna, Rioli, Butler etc go if Richmond were to start descending the ladder.

 

[Arr0w]

But did they always average a goal a game? Castagna certainly didn't in his 1st season, nor did Rioli.

Hoskin-Elliott kicked 18 goals from 22 games in 2017 for Collingwood, yet improved this to 42 goals from 26 games in 2018.

How many of us would have predicted prior to the 1995 season that Pearce was going to kick 52 goals? Or Clape 31 goals (the only season he averaged more than a goal per game)? Or Rice 21 goals (the only full season he averaged a goal per game)?

As generally happens in good teams, average players get lifted by the better players around them & their output can improve quite significantly. It would be interesting to see how Castagna, Rioli, Butler etc go if Richmond were to start descending the ladder.

This

 

[HARKER]

But did they always average a goal a game? Castagna certainly didn't in his 1st season, nor did Rioli.

Hoskin-Elliott kicked 18 goals from 22 games in 2017 for Collingwood, yet improved this to 42 goals from 26 games in 2018.

How many of us would have predicted prior to the 1995 season that Pearce was going to kick 52 goals? Or Clape 31 goals (the only season he averaged more than a goal per game)? Or Rice 21 goals (the only full season he averaged a goal per game)?

As generally happens in good teams, average players get lifted by the better players around them & their output can improve quite significantly. It would be interesting to see how Castagna, Rioli, Butler etc go if Richmond were to start descending the ladder.

You're really missing the point here.

Pearce? Quick. A good mark. A good lead. A good kick.
Hoskin-Ellliot? Clape?

Tell me how you see the likes of Polson becoming a goal-kicker.
Tell me the tools you think he has that would allow him to become so.
I don't see them. Not in his kicking, not in his marking ability, not with his ball-handling, nor with his awareness.

Look at the players being spoken about here and build a case for them being capable of kicking goals.
I can build a case for SPS, for Fisher to a point and even Walsh this far out.....just struggling with Polson, ECurnow and even Gibbons, although to be fair I haven't watched that much of him.

Saying that all they need is time, amounts to little. One can say that about anyone and everyone.

 

[goreds]

Possibly 12 months early.

For the first time in a long time I really have no idea if we are going to improve or not!

Everything points to improvement but...

The problem is we are so conditioned to being ‘also rans’ that we can’t stop and think for a moment ‘hang on, we are good enough’...

With the addition of McGovern we are now a serious forward line because H will become our key this year. Good luck defenses covering 3 excellent marking options...

8th, 9th or 10th for me, I choose to believe!!! Gulp...

 

[goreds]

You're really missing the point here.

Pearce? Quick. A good mark. A good lead. A good kick.
Hoskin-Ellliot? Clape?

Tell me how you see the likes of Polson becoming a goal-kicker.
Tell me the tools you think he has that would allow him to become so.
I don't see them. Not in his kicking, not in his marking ability, not with his ball-handling, nor with his awareness.

Look at the players being spoken about here and build a case for them being capable of kicking goals.
I can build a case for SPS, for Fisher to a point and even Walsh this far out.....just struggling with Polson, ECurnow and even Gibbons, although to be fair I haven't watched that much of him.

Saying that all they need is time, amounts to little. One can say that about anyone and everyone.

Forget the ‘small forward’ West Coke proved that dominant tall forwards are the way to win games. We have 3 and we can get our resting mids around them. Can you see Cripps, Setters, Murf all resting forward at the same time??? Good luck getting that ball back....

 

[HARKER]

Forget the ‘small forward’ West Coke proved that dominant tall forwards are the way to win games. We have 3 and we can get our resting mids around them. Can you see Cripps, Setters, Murf all resting forward at the same time??? Good luck getting that ball back....

Forget the small forward and you bring up West Coast?
Have a look at the impact their two smalls forwards had this in their first years; Rioli & Ryan - 52 goals in 37 games, collectively.
183sm Cripps did OK also. 38 goals in 25 games.

That's not something to dismiss so lightly. May have even been a good reason for their climb up the ladder.

 

[goreds]

Forget the small forward and you bring up West Coast?
Have a look at the impact their two smalls forwards had this in their first years; Rioli & Ryan - 37 goals in 52 games collectively.
183sm Cripps did OK also. 38 goals in 25 games.

That's not something to dismiss so lightly. May have even been a good reason for their climb up the ladder.

This is all true.

The point I’m making is that gun tall/mid marking forwards make the job of small/above average forwards easier.

We only need to find 1 smallish forward and our forward line is complete... His name is Pickett...!