Bluemour 'Silly Season' In Full Swing XXXV

[BigFrizz36]

Maybe he wants to stay in Victoria.

He's from Swan Hill so shouldn't matter too much to him.

Probably has made a life and friends etc in Melbourne so that would be understandable.

If both offers were the same you'd think that the swans would be the more attractive purely on a football basis.

 

[BigFrizz36]

Im still not seeing which part is luck, what relevance does being close to the siren have? A quarter goes for a period of time, you take your kicks and hit your targets as they present, I’m struggling to see the difference of good ball movement leading to a shot on goal in the first minute, compared to the last minute.

I just see these as having good skill and being confident enough to execute.

As the other poster said, luck is totally subjective.

Agree. It seems that well drilled teams are more likely to win close games. Lot of factors involved, skill, confidence, belief etc. Luck is very much a factor but a minor one.

 

[Stamos]

Im still not seeing which part is luck, what relevance does being close to the siren have? A quarter goes for a period of time, you take your kicks and hit your targets as they present, I’m struggling to see the difference of good ball movement leading to a shot on goal in the first minute, compared to the last minute.

I just see these as having good skill and being confident enough to execute.

As the other poster said, luck is totally subjective.

The siren could have gone 20 seconds earlier.

Not very many goals get kicked after the siren in a year. They got 2 in a game.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Really hope the coaching group can build on our foundation in the pre-season and extract more goals from our forward group...
We were 9th for PF this season and we can't rely on Charlie or Harry winning the Coleman every year...

we were 9th in PF because we had a shocking patch of 8 or so games mid season where we played like a local U9s team.

Extract that poor patch and our scores were top level.

 

[Coops93]

IMHO one of the great benefits of Casboult on the list was he was a capable backup for 3 positions.

Also that he was basically always available.

Availability is an ability, and he was always available. Even when not fit he could play and play a solid role.

 

[Red_man2008]

If Dow chooses the saints. And they also get Shiel. We will probably see him playing v the Carlton vfl list anyway just like stocker.

 

[The Bighouse]

Was that we are a NO to Billings???

& we may have cooled the jets on E.Hollands…

 

[TerryWallet]

A proper football club or a footy graveyard.
Whichever club Dow chooses, he’ll get what he deserves …

He might not get the choice in the end. If Adams has become available to the Swans with his best mate Grundy, it might have to be Moorabbin for Paddy.

 

[bmaurizio]

Agree durability is a vital, integral asset in footy just as IQ and skill set kicking marking ball distribution etc, they can’t be taught or developed
one has them innately or just doesn’t,
Drafting astutely has become so very important as the competition is tightening continuousl.

 

[Coops93]

If Dow chooses the saints. And they also get Shiel. We will probably see him playing v the Carlton vfl list anyway just like stocker.

Sounds like SOS is getting all his old Carlton project players like he did with us chasing all GWS' project players.

He seems to really like proving he was right by choosing certain players, even trying to do so at his next club.

 

[HarryFlashman]

He might not get the choice in the end. If Adams has become available to the Swans with his best mate Grundy, it might have to be Moorabbin for Paddy.

Swans are currently doing a power of work to benefit us.
Naughton was a master stroke, got the doggies to pay an absolute fortune & massive risk profile.
They will continue to hunt players and get the opposition to pay max value to retain players.
You really think that a 30yr old Adams is a key piece for them? I don’t, he would be a useful stop gap, but pies coughing up $ & yrs helps everyone.
Hope they continue to ask uncomfortable questions, history shows they get what they want, u just don’t hear about it until it’s done.

 

[Benaly28]

Swans are successful for a reason.Very well run football club.They do things for a reason always looking to improve.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[El Topo]

Sounds like SOS is getting all his old Carlton project players like he did with us chasing all GWS' project players.

He seems to really like proving he was right by choosing certain players, even trying to do so at his next club.

The next inside mid who can't run is bound to be a winner, just gotta keep picking them

 

[myblueroan]

There is a lot in that post to think about battler. I do like that you post with the mongrel factor - something you can take great pride in. Definitely an inside mid here on bigfooty posting. I also like that you venture out into the land of the cretins (main board) and represent us there. I thank you and Arrow for that time well spent. I really think you made great inroads with your discussions with Fadge and the others.



It does sound silly on 'the surface doesn't it'. A stupid idea to question the club. But i suppose some people think back over the last 20 years and review that default yearly improvement that never eventuated until only this year (maybe last year). Blind faith is for the stupid.



You were very strong in your position on Voss and very generous in your view on people who had an opposing view. Absolute black and white for yourself. Let me summarise because it really is easy to do. 'Players pulled their finger out' and by association, nothing to do with Voss. Done. For me, it is either your explanation on Carlton's turnaround or Boris Johnson's right hand man with his pandemic slogan of 'Hands', 'Face', 'Space' that is the ultimate in insight.

On the actual topic, there has been no back peddling on the points of arguments with Voss by most of the posters involved; just a happiness that Carlton started to perform so posters moved on in relief. We lost this year IMO due to finishing 5th instead of top 4 and getting the break. Us with an extra week's break and potentially playing Brissy in Melbourne probably sees the result flipped. This is an important context to the debate. You pin the early season bad form on the players costing us top 4. I pin it on the players and the coach. I def think you lack understanding on responsibility and accountability at the very least.



The modern footy quote is worth quoting. I know you have mentioned before that the players just go out and play and gameday strategy is non existent. Fantasy stuff you say. Everything, even in the public domain screams footy has changed from the 90s to now. When Carlton do not have the ball they spread and set up zones to slow the opposition down. That has evolved and is 'modern footy' and is strategic. Clubs are looking for role players more and more like Acres, Langdon on the wing instead of just a good midfielder shows modern footy has really changed. Players learning their craft of their roles like durdin and Owies scream modern footy, tactics and transition.

Everything you say hurts my ears and the strength of conviction hurts.

'Lucky to win games'. This must be just a definition of terms. Hawks beat Pies. Pies werent focused that week so Hawks were lucky. No way Hawks can beat Pies right now in a final. And even keep your statement simpler, Sydney beat North due to a sub error...that is the definition of luck. So there is a concept of being lucky and it does apply to AFL matches, including Carlton games.

JOT. I've enjoyed reading your posts. I like not existing in an echo chamber.
I don't like people being run down for offering different opinions about our club. No-one has changed their opinions, and also no one has been proven right or wrong. I think it's naive to assume Voss made no change and it was all on the players.
But I'll respond directly to JAB instead of here.

 

[Robertio]

One of my biggest pet peeves is when people say teams are 'lucky' because the other team kicked more behind that goals. Often ignoring the fact that:

1. Goal kicking is a critical skill and is why players like Curnow and Cameron are better than Aaron Naughton or Eric Hipwood.
2. Good defenses lead to players being in harder positions to kick goals further out from goal or deeper in the pockets.
3. Score board pressure and intensity of the game adds pressure on opposition forwards kicking goals.
4. A lot of the behinds you read in a score sheet may be rushed behinds or touched ball that are caused by our defensive efforts and were never possible shots on goals.

Any one who says Melbourne played better than us because they scored more points is a moron as far as i'm concerned.

They were in front mate, that last play of Weitering to Hollands to Doc to Acres won the game, simple.

 

[myblueroan]

I think Vossy and his contested game plan has pretty much sorted the wheat from the chaff.

I'm totally relaxed about the direction of the Club and have been since Voss was appointed. I no longer have to talk about mongrel factor - the coach won't play slackers and half steppers and bludgers - I like that.

In fact so relaxed and confident, I stuck fat with the coach when the lynch mob was out - enjoyed the back peddling, laughed at the attempts to suggest that VOSS HAD LEARNED HIS LESSON AND SIMPLIFIED FINGS...

and now I am enjoying reading the sly backhanders and white-anting of the progress of the CLub by the same bunch of sad sacks - hiding behind terms like 'modern football' - because you know they understand 'football' better than the coach and coaches- or suggesting that the team fluked finals and was lucky to win matches .....

LOL worthy fantasy land stuff right there.

Now the latest (implicit) criticism of Voss ....

"his contested game plan is too hard on the players"

LOL

That is my context.

but to get specifically back to the point I asked:


I can't think of anyone who has ever suggested that the Club shouldn't be looking to improve the list - can you? What a nonsensical notion to put- - as anyone would think that The Club isn't in the business of improvement? Is it purposefully sitting on its hands?

The silly season indeed.

Hiya JAb.
I'm not sure what exactly you are celebrating or ( gloating) about?
Nothing has changed. Your stance is neither proved or unproved.
It's merely your ( staunchly held) opinion. As are others that Voss indeed changed his plan and that the miracle at Camp Curnow was a good get together but not a magical solution.
You blamed our players but others don't go on and on about that..or try to laud it over you repeatedly that you were wrong, or an idiot for saying that our team couldn't run down the guts or weren't talented enough.
No. Most of us...(yes, there are a few joyless negative posters around who are never happy) but most wanted Voss to get help and stop with the dour horrible style that made us lose over and over.
Some think we HAD to go through that to forge ahead.
I have no clue if that's right..but I saw change. ( you'll say we simply got back Martin etc and I'll disagree) And I don't care if you think I'm dumb, but my opinion and others too are equally as valid as yours even if you YELL LOUDER!!!!!

Why are we trying to drive away people who have different views?
Why?
Most here love our club.
Are passionate.
All of us.
'Stronger together'. Not, 'I'm better than you so shutup!!' Last time I looked.
I decided to speak up today because I miss seeing certain posters stay awY for being bullied in a million little ways.
I don't agree with everything some poster say but I respect their right to say it.
I respect you JAB. But I sure wish you'd tone it down a bit.
Cheers.

 

[thylacine60]

Skills like that are worth a future first. I bet the campo twins can’t get a jug down like that.

if it's not part of the club interview process already, people need to be held accountable..........

 

[thylacine60]

One of my biggest pet peeves is when people say teams are 'lucky' because the other team kicked more behind that goals. Often ignoring the fact that:

1. Goal kicking is a critical skill and is why players like Curnow and Cameron are better than Aaron Naughton or Eric Hipwood.
2. Good defenses lead to players being in harder positions to kick goals further out from goal or deeper in the pockets.
3. Score board pressure and intensity of the game adds pressure on opposition forwards kicking goals.
4. A lot of the behinds you read in a score sheet may be rushed behinds or touched ball that are caused by our defensive efforts and were never possible shots on goals.

Any one who says Melbourne played better than us because they scored more points is a moron as far as i'm concerned.

+ perceived pressure..........

 

[branedotorg]

I will reiterate, we made a prelim from 5th, and lost to a side that has not lost all year at home, even beating the flag winners

We have established ourselves as a genuine top 4 side, with a list that only has 1 player 30+ for the whole of next year

Just let that sink in for a little while

agree with all that for 2023

i do have some trepidation about how 2024 will go, this has been a team that performs well without pressure, been that way for a generation.

the second half of the year and the finals performances give me some hope but there's no doubt the members, fans, media and the club have expectations for 2024,

 

[BlueJet]

myblueroan +1 to your recent posts.
We all may see things a little differently but no doubt we all want the same thing, to see our club succeed - so let's shelve the bravado & discuss things like adults.

 

[Beer n Skittles]

I don't understand Dow to Sydney, isn't he just a much worse Chad Warner

1

Chad Warner

Age

22

Ht

185cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

3star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

1star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

2star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

4star

CL

0.0

1star

? How would you play those two in the same midfield?

They'll end up looking like superstars against lesser teams and getting smashed by stronger teams.

 

[Arr0w]

agree with all that for 2023

i do have some trepidation about how 2024 will go, this has been a team that performs well without pressure, been that way for a generation.

the second half of the year and the finals performances give me some hope but there's no doubt the members, fans, media and the club have expectations for 2024,

I don't care about the external noise, especially the media and it seems the club completely ignored the rhetoric before our run started

I think I am reasonably balanced when it comes to assessing our team, it's progress, what it can achieve and I believe we have taken the next step in consistency

Most clubs will have renewed expectations going into next year, either maintaining or improving their output

Until lists are finalised and assessing the health of each team just before the start of next season, draw, etc, right now I believe we can push out enough wins to finish in and around 4th to 6th as a minimum

 

[spry]

I don't understand Dow to Sydney, isn't he just a much worse Chad Warner

1

Chad Warner

Age

22

Ht

185cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

3star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

1star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

2star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

4star

CL

0.0

1star

? How would you play those two in the same midfield?

They'll end up looking like superstars against lesser teams and getting smashed by stronger teams.

Dow to gulden in space - quality inside 50. Repeat.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[ferrisb]

If Dow chooses the saints. And they also get Shiel. We will probably see him playing v the Carlton vfl list anyway just like stocker.

If the Saints get Shiel and Dow, they will probably set a new record for turnovers...

 

[Funk]

Also rans V premiers. Depends where you would like us to finish. Our midfield lacks leg speed. Could not be more obvious after watching GWS, Collingwood and Brisbane this finals series. Problem became worse with Cerra being underdone and Dow out. As good as Walsh was he was our token quick guy and he is just one player.

Thought we were ordinary in finals. Lucked two wins, good enough to get them but very very lucky. Thought Brisbane, Collingwood and GWS would have accounted for us comfortable. Brisbane did.

We're too slow in the middle. We also lack two way run and quality rotations. Still quite some ways to go to beating those better teams when it counts.

Re “Lucked two wins, good enough to get them but very very lucky.”

FWIW - You could say exactly the same thing about Pies.

Winning margins of 7, 1 & 4 in 3 x finals AND THEY WON THE FLAG!!!

Pies were kissed on the d*** by umps - they did as much as they needed to to get over the line.

Partly agree with your point - we need more internal improvement and maybe 2 additional players with speed & skill.

Only one player in Prelim was over 30 (Newman) - now is the time!!!!!