Coaching Staff Brendon Bolton - Senior Coach - Locked in until end of 2020 (23/5/18)

Michael Jezz

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As far as I am concerned, the clock starts ticking this season. You cannot judge a coach on performance when there is such a massive list turnover. We reached ground zero in 2018 when we had our most inexperienced list , and a shed load of injuries. The youngsters are not so young anymore and they have had 3 years to learn the game plan and start to develop the chemistry between them. Now all we need, is to stop having injuries to key players, and for those players to spend time together in the heat of the battle, to learn and trust each other.
Its still not going to come all together this year, but I expect a partial coming together. There has to be signs , and there has to be a building on processes already established. We simply cannot have another year like 2018 or there should be questions asked. I dont expect another year like '18 - I just cannot see it happening. I am not looking at '18 and looking for blood because I can see the mitigating circumstances. And I am not looking for finals in '19 either , but what I am looking for is tangible improvement. 6-10 wins is my prediction
Totally agree. We were never going to be able to judge Bolton until this season, when the draftees approach their 4th season. It is not beyond the realm of possibility, that Carltom arre competitive and win only 4 games. Personally I would even give him until 2021, that is 6 seasons, which means 3 draft years play at least 4 seasons
 

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Gethelred

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Lets look at some facts..or at least I think they are facts and it's why that new coach solution isnt one.

We came to the end of a second stint of David Parkin. It went too long and recruiting had gone backwards.

Wayne Brittain. Could he coach?...Parkin thought so but the president threw him under a bus with a live grenade. Which exploded when brown paper bags where in vogue.....Fail...though almost a hero somehow on the back of Mighty Kouta.

Denis Pagan.. Sucessful and renowned for being good with youth. Despite the draft restrictions he got some talent and a reasonable core group still....Fail

Brett Ratten.. Ex player much revered. A stack of talent. Poor decisions on personnel repeatedly and not the tactical nouse required.... Fail

Mick Malthouse.. Legend. Hard strict disciplinarian. Had a real good list if only they were made tougher. Fail and dragged a club backwards in the process

Brendon Bolton ... Negotiating a severely depleted and young group into a position ready to challenge. Somehow keeping them upbeat despite endless losses. Players re-signing wanting to be part of it. Fantastic industry best recruitment.

Meanwhile almost all premierships are won by coaches given long periods to succeed. The days of the mavericks like Barassi are long gone.
I'd argue that if you did a similar list from each club - with the exception of Hawthorn/Geelong - for their last 5 coaches, you'd have a similar sort of list. Ross Lyon's tenure at St Kilda would similarly be a fail grade, because the 'success' condition in the AFL is winning a grand final, not making them.

Success is an 18 in one chance, with variables too numerous to truly account for in full. Bolton could be a good coach or a poor one, but it's the combination of things which lead to success, not merely playing wheel of fortune with coaches.
 
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Blue and Blue

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I'd argue that if you did a similar list from each club - with the exception of Hawthorn/Geelong - for their last 5 coaches, you'd have a similar sort of list. Ross Lyon's tenure at St Kilda would similarly be a fail grade, because the 'success' condition in the AFL is winning a grand final, not making them.

Success is an 18 in one chance, with variables to numerous to truly account for in full. Bolton could be a good coach or a poor one, but it's the combination of things which lead to success, not merely playing wheel of fortune with coaches.
Yes and no. Its the ultimate yardstick but there are degrees below it.
My point is more that we have tried every different avenue and type of coach and got nowhere till now. And that the game has changed very much in two decades and you just got to back the coach in for long enough. Six years minimum. 40 years ago it was more like two seasons to do something or replaced.
 

Gethelred

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Yes and no. Its the ultimate yardstick but there are degrees below it.
My point is more that we have tried every different avenue and type of coach and got nowhere till now. And that the game has changed very much in two decades and you just got to back the coach in for long enough. Six years minimum. 40 years ago it was more like two seasons to do something or replaced.
Don't get me wrong, I don't disagree with you in any way at all. More, that evaluating a coach purely on that basis is not a good way to evaluate a good coach from a poor one.

But then, that's what you're saying anyway, not to put words in your mouth.
 

Arr0w

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Think the main component people might be forgetting in all this, is we have never had this quantity/quality of young talent in one squad in 2 decades.

If we continue to develop them accordingly any coach would have a reasoble level of success. What we all want is sustained success
 

Blue and Blue

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Don't get me wrong, I don't disagree with you in any way at all. More, that evaluating a coach purely on that basis is not a good way to evaluate a good coach from a poor one.

But then, that's what you're saying anyway, not to put words in your mouth.
No. I arent saying they were bad coaches. I am saying changing the coach didnt work for us despite trying every angle. Apologies if I dont make the real intent of my words clear. I arent that great with words and I hate typing to bits....:D
 

Monkey King

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Would you prefer 24 years in the wilderness and the 1 premiership OR 25 years sitting between 1st-10th but never getting 1.
Tough question. Would I give up 95’ to never have had Carlton dragged over the coals the way they have been this century? I almost would you know. I suppose it depends on what happens next.
 
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No. I arent saying they were bad coaches. I am saying changing the coach didnt work for us despite trying every angle. Apologies if I dont make the real intent of my words clear. I arent that great with words and I hate typing to bits....:D
I will. They were bloody poor appointments made by a shithouse board that refused to acknowledge the changes in direction of the game both on and off the field......and to some extent there are some on the current board that still haven't received that message.
 

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The way Trigg's dismissal was handled and failing to twig how that may have impacted Craig's decision to explore his options rather than renew his contract. That little fiasco meant we didn't have high performance manager last year.
Flying Shiel around in a private jet trying to impress him. Shiel makes enough money to organise a charter in a private jet to fly our board around in if he so chooses. Straight out of the 80s that one.
We are still so very amateurish in many ways.
 

Red Bull

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Maybe we where waiting for Russell to be out of contract...
Didnt Russell have a year to go on his contract ?
Maybe what was on offer at Carlton both talent wise and financially was to good to refuse.
images (37).jpeg

"Get the best , not the best available"
Maybe old habits die hard at Carlton ...
 

ESKIE

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COBALT BLUE

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As far as I am concerned, the clock starts ticking this season. You cannot judge a coach on performance when there is such a massive list turnover. We reached ground zero in 2018 when we had our most inexperienced list , and a shed load of injuries. The youngsters are not so young anymore and they have had 3 years to learn the game plan and start to develop the chemistry between them. Now all we need, is to stop having injuries to key players, and for those players to spend time together in the heat of the battle, to learn and trust each other.
Its still not going to come all together this year, but I expect a partial coming together. There has to be signs , and there has to be a building on processes already established. We simply cannot have another year like 2018 or there should be questions asked. I dont expect another year like '18 - I just cannot see it happening. I am not looking at '18 and looking for blood because I can see the mitigating circumstances. And I am not looking for finals in '19 either , but what I am looking for is tangible improvement. 6-10 wins is my prediction
yes 2018 ....was completed broken/lost his way......injuries/no list ....was not even good VFL
Bolton insured a number 18 finish by playing an awful lot of 'kids" and we had guys like Pickett out there collecting 8 disposals game and not looking like they wanted to be out there
In some ways it reminded me of Malthouses horror final year where the team just stopped playing....full stop
He have flogged the idea of playing kids.......i think we will see the same again to a certain extent depending on injuries
it has been unfortunate we did not have the balance to bring the kids on in a more productive environment with deeper senior list to cover them,we have thrown a lot of raw draftees at our list and and now expecting them to provide.....?...to a certain extent yes however
Make no mistake we need to hit Trade hard this year with the bit extra money available in the cap
 
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Alphonse_

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Russell is shit. Pretty sure.......
How dare you slag off our new fitness guru like that ? :)

In all seriousness, I am liking The Wallsy mentor appointment for Bolts more and more, you can accuse our Robert of many things, but being thin skinned ain't one of them, as an ex premiership winning coach and media personality, RW's advice to Bolts coping with supporter and media criticism will be invaluable (big Bolts fan but i could tell he was a bit overwhelmed with the events of last season, understandably so)

At any rate, there is no reason for us to change coach in the immediate future, our player retention rate is bonza after the Malthouse fallout, if you have the players singing to the same song, that's good enough for me.

Club bias aside, as a human being who is a self confessed SNAG, i really want Bolton to be a successful coach at AFL level, i honestly wanted to give him a hug seeing him crestfallen so many times last year. And no, I am not a weirdo (probably :D)
 

therubbernub

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Didnt Russell have a year to go on his contract ?
Maybe what was on offer at Carlton both talent wise and financially was to good to refuse. View attachment 628523
"Get the best , not the best available"
Maybe old habits die hard at Carlton ...
I hardly think two bags of sandwiches would influence him.
 

BigFrizz36

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The way Trigg's dismissal was handled and failing to twig how that may have impacted Craig's decision to explore his options rather than renew his contract. That little fiasco meant we didn't have high performance manager last year.
Flying Shiel around in a private jet trying to impress him. Shiel makes enough money to organise a charter in a private jet to fly our board around in if he so chooses. Straight out of the 80s that one.
We are still so very amateurish in many ways.
Tough critic. My memory was that craig stepped down a couple of months before trigg left. Could be wrong though. There cant be too many who dont believe that liddle is a step up on trigg surely.
 

Old navy

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One thing that Bolton has done really well and he hasn’t really gotten much credit for this, the playing group seem extremely close nit and the culture has changed dramatically, he may not be the best game day coach or tactician, but getting the playing group united and instilling a good culture and team standards is far more important for us at this stage.
Playing group moral seems sky high, you would never know we are coming off a 2 win season, I get the feeling the boys know they have a staggering amount of talent at the club and they know it’s not long till its party time.
 

gbatman

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I think we have the head coach part of the equation ticked off. High performance tick. Recruitment, we seem to be still building this and as picks become less lucrative this will be important. Probably our first elite recruitment department. Maybe we can even add further to it. We just need to keep upping the quality of people at Carlton and wait. It will happen.

End of the day we still don't have a mature list and we still have some building to do. When these boxes are ticked then we can start judging coaches further. The benefit we have with Bolton is that he's a highly qualified coach who is gaining in experience and because he's been there a while, knows his list very well.
 
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